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Lovie Smith Supports Vick's Return

Those Bears fans clamoring for a new quarterback could eventually get one.
But not one that many of them would actually want any more than one Bears fan doesn’t want Josh Bullocks.
Coach Lovie Smith recently said that Vick deserves a clean slate when he gets out of federal custody — and Smith didn’t close the door on adding Vick to the team.
“I would look at Michael like I look at every other prospect that’s available:  He goes back into the pool,” Smith told USA Today, via David Haugh of the Chicago Tribune.  “That’s what everyone in society does.  Mike made a mistake, and he’s paying the price for that mistake.  Once you’ve paid your debt to society, you have to say, ‘OK, let’s go on from there.'”
We feel like a broken record (and we’re now old enough to realize that more than half of you likely wonder what being annoyingly repetitive has to do with a new level of statistical achievement in sport), but we need to say it again.
Mike Vick didn’t make a mistake.  He engaged in a lifestyle for a period of years and changed that lifestyle only because he got caught.
A “mistake” is adhering so literally to the commands of a navigation system that you drive your car into a lake.  Vick lived a life that revolved around an abomination — raising dogs for the purposes of pitting them against each other for sport and for money, and killing the dogs that weren’t deemed fit to die while fighting other dogs.
He felt so strongly about this lifestyle that he bought a house and surrounding land at which the lifestyle unfolded.
Though some readers have suggested that the conduct of men like Leonard Little (who killed a woman while driving drunk) and Donte’ Stallworth (who might have been drunk while driving a car that killed a man) is more despicable than Vick’s behavior, we disagree.
Little (and possibly Stallworth) engaged in criminally reckless actions.  They didn’t intend to harm anyone.  Little’s crime (and possibly Stallworth’s) was to drink to excess under circumstances that did not prevent him from exercising impaired judgment by getting behind the wheel of a 2,000-pound sculpted block of rolling steel.
Vick intentionally, deliberately, and soberly embarked on a hobby that violated multiple federal and state laws, and that was premised on the cold-blooded torture and killing of dogs.
And then he lied about his conduct, to anyone who wanted to know the truth.  He even tried to deceive about the killing of underperforming dogs after pleading guilty, and while strapped to a polygraph.
If it were up to us, Vick wouldn’t play for the Bears or any other NFL team.  Ever.
Commissioner Goodell has said that it is a privilege to play in the National Football League.  If any man has squandered that privilege, that man is Michael Vick.

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149 Responses to “Lovie Smith Supports Vick's Return”
  1. CaptainFantastik says: Mar 28, 2009 6:26 PM

    Ever stop to consider how he might have been raised? He was likely a product of his environment, and Newport News isn’t the most wholesome of environments by any means. It’s no different than racist parents who bring up their kids to believe as they do by constantly surrounding them with that culture in their formative years.
    What Vick did was terrible, but he’s paid his debt thus far as deemed by a court of law. That should be enough for you, Florio.

  2. jmclarkent says: Mar 28, 2009 6:26 PM

    All of a sudden, Kyle Orton is looking might attractive…

  3. nerdmann says: Mar 28, 2009 6:30 PM

    These dogs were Vick’s property, and as much as I am against harming animals of any kind, I don’t think government has any place telling Vick how he can and cannot dispose of them.
    I personally am more troubled by the lying and also by the association with GAMBLING.
    You want your QB to be associated with thugs who might want him to shave a few points here and there? No way.
    Now go ahead and blast me with arguments about what a bad person I am because I think torturing animals is cool.

  4. virtualplague says: Mar 28, 2009 6:38 PM

    Wow you’re really putting two murderers over a guy who killed dogs?
    Yeah, dog killing is bad. But there’s no way in hell that driving while under the influence and killing a HUMAN BEING is somehow more acceptable than killing an animal.
    Of course they didn’t intend to run the people over, but they made the mistake of driving the car while drunk. End of story.

  5. phillyburdzfan says: Mar 28, 2009 6:38 PM

    Don’t be so neutral, Mike. Pick a side!
    /sarcasm

  6. bonerNsweatpants says: Mar 28, 2009 6:40 PM

    Everyone makes mistakes and the way he was raised and the mind set that his family obviously has he didn’t think he was doing any thing wrong. Although he was doing wrong no one told him different until it was too late.

  7. dustindmw says: Mar 28, 2009 6:41 PM

    “Mike Vick didn’t make a mistake. He engaged in a lifestyle for a period of years and changed that lifestyle only because he got caught.”
    And how is that any different from things that most NFL players in trouble with the law do? How is that any different from what most athletes do? Baseball players illegally use steroids, NFL players abuse drugs and alcohol, beat their wives, Basketball players fornicate like crazy and turn out to be deadbeat dads. The only variable here is that one of these circumstances deals with cute furry animals.
    He paid his debt to society, I realize that you are kind of handcuffed in what you write for fear of backlash from peta and other hippie groups like that, but come on, have some conviction.

  8. LiveNBreath Football says: Mar 28, 2009 6:41 PM

    Thank you Florio for laying it out so well.

  9. EaglesRule says: Mar 28, 2009 6:50 PM

    “Ever stop to consider how he might have been raised? He was likely a product of his environment, and Newport News isn’t the most wholesome of environments by any means.
    What Vick did was terrible, but he’s paid his debt thus far as deemed by a court of law. That should be enough for you, Florio. ”
    All that product of your environment crap should go out the door when someone is giving you millions of dollars to play a game. Every man woman and child knows right from wrong but they still sometimes do stupid things to push the limits of the law. I dont care that vick fought dogs my thing with him is that he stooped down to the level of others. If i win the powerball tomorrow i am not going to continue to play a 20 dollar football pool in my barbershop weekly. If Vick wanted to fight dogs i dont agree but so be it if you want to challenge my dog come see me when you have 100 grand we not doing this for chump change. A wise man once told me never cheat on your wife if the person you are cheating with dont have as much to lose as you do.

  10. tenakeytyrant says: Mar 28, 2009 6:53 PM

    i agree with florio 100%

  11. D22G says: Mar 28, 2009 6:54 PM

    Are you really saying killing two humans by drunk driving isn’t worst than dogfighting?

  12. vikinghooper says: Mar 28, 2009 6:55 PM

    Right Florio. George Bush and the rest of corporate American society willfully create a false image of the world which ultimately leads to hundreds of thousands of deaths of subhuman middle easterners and quite a few poor American soldiers also, and leave office to reap even more profits.
    Mike Vick engages in dogfighting ( I actually hate the idea of dogs fighting ), and is incarcerated in the prime of his life, and now is systematically being inhibited by outraged partisans from making money in the best way he can.
    I just don’t see how you can live lambasting an obviously undereducated black man, while examples of far greater crimes being committed right in front of everyone are ignored. Irony and lack of application of the law of universality.

  13. zbate says: Mar 28, 2009 6:58 PM

    Tell us how you really feel, one more time please? Dogfighting is no different than any other animal related violence. Bullfighting, chicken fighting, horse racing, greyhound tracks etc. Animals used in the colliseum for centuries. Most of the animals are killed at the end. Same with steaks and chicken breast which I bet you have eaten mike florio. Perhaps its more grotesque but the bottom line is that is still an animal and vick is from a rural area where this type of thing is more of a culturally accepted thing. You’re just a doglover as most of us are apparently, which is fine but that doesnt make mike vick incapable of being a good human being to other human beings. The mistake is that so much time and energy(tax dollars) goes to pursuing something like this bc he’s famous. Also, pit bulls aren’t exactly labradores. They’re vicious by nature. I nearly had my hand snapped off by one that was a house pet. No one would be that upset if mike vick had a lion fighting ranch, they would just think it was unusual. We just really like dogs as a society. Mike didn’t like dogs that much, but you’re right we should totally destroy his life because of this. Then reinstate pacman jones 80 times who is basically a gangster and a repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat offender and not even that good of a football player.

  14. tiktokdok says: Mar 28, 2009 7:00 PM

    Vick is a scumbag, he kills dogs, steals pension fund monies and you want him back in the NFL Lovie?
    You’re a bigger fool than I thought you were!

  15. PakMan says: Mar 28, 2009 7:00 PM

    First off, I never comment to these articles, and I had to register just so I could comment on this. I generally enjoy the site, although recently I feel like Mike Florio has felt the need to inject his opinions more and more to try to influence what actually happens in the NFL. Get over yourself, Florio.
    Anyway, Mike Vick NEVER should have been incarcerated for dogfighting/killing dogs. This sentimentality that Americans have for dogs has deprived a sovereign American man of his primary wage-earning years. This is the real crime here. I don’t agree that killing animals is right, whether dogs or butterflies, but taking a man’s freedom for it?? That’s injustice. Its not surprising that Florio is a product of this injustice system.
    Saying that the crimes committed by Leonard Little or (potentially) Donte Stallworth – causing loss of human life – are less severe than killing dogs is beyond asinine. You are not held accountable for your intentions, but for your actions. The bottom line is they killed people, whereas Vick killed animals. (White) America’s infatuation with dogs is the only reason Vick’s freedom was taken in the first place. People, stop thinking with your heart, and start using your brains.

  16. Priest says: Mar 28, 2009 7:01 PM

    The severity of Vick’s crimes all hinges on your opinion on dogs… which makes for a lot of different views. We live in a country where a countless number of animals are killed each year for sport. A country gets outraged by dog fighting then goes and shoots deer for fun. With that perspective, dog fighting doesn’t seem like such a horrible crime, certainly not as bad as recklessly taking the life of another human being. I think most people get upset because pet dogs are a part of american life. If Vick was participating in cock fights, there wouldn’t be the uproar.
    I’m not condoning Vick’s actions in any way, but he’s done his time.

  17. Dukekit says: Mar 28, 2009 7:03 PM

    Do any NFL cities have low dog populations so that we can ease him into back into the league???

  18. pucems says: Mar 28, 2009 7:05 PM

    umm… Also, Michael Vick killed dogs, not PEOPLE. That has to at least be considered, right?? I feel like I’m taking craaazy pills! Even if it was intentional…Little and Stallworth took the most precious thing on earth… a human life. Spin it however you want–it’s not the same. Even if Michael Vick killed 1000 dogs, it’s not the same as one human life.

  19. Facts Domino says: Mar 28, 2009 7:07 PM

    Screw vick and everyone who supports him. it’s that simple.

  20. Southernboi727 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:09 PM

    He fought dogs. What is the big deal? He participated in an act that didn’t hurt anyone. He did it on his own property on his own time with his own dogs. I really don’t see what the big deal is. In any other country its no big deal. If he wasn’t doing it across state lines he would already be at a teams voluntary workouts. STOP HATING ON VICK FLORIO! What the hell is your vendetta against this guy. A lot of people drink and drive and don’t get caught. Its the same with Vick except you replace drinking and driving with dogfighting.

  21. vegas42 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:10 PM

    If he “didn’t know it was wrong” then why did he repeatedly lie about it? Didn’t know it was wrong my ass.

  22. jonesboy226 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:10 PM

    What a bunch of idiots. How can anyone stand up for someone as despicable as Vick. And to the dumb sob that stated, “I don’t think government has any place telling Vick how he can and cannot dispose of them.” These are living beings that he was killing, inhumanely. He wasn’t putting down sick animals. As a matter of fact, he is the sick animal that should be put down. What the hell does how he was raised have to do with what he did? He is an adult. Is he mentally retarded? Unless he is, I believe he should know the difference between right and wrong. I hope he enjoyed his time with Bubba in the slammer. He deserved it.

  23. raidereric420 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:17 PM

    I think Vick should get another shot once he’s out, he’s paid his debt to society. But on the same hand, you’d have to make sure he’s truly rehabilitated. Being sorry is not enough, I think he should do some PSA’s (not with PETA, insane douchebags that they are) condemning Dogfighting.

  24. jharmon64 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:19 PM

    if he’d beat his wife or assaulted a woman, he’d never have even gone to jail. but he killed a dog. as bad as that is (and it IS very bad) it’s gotten more attention than it needed. like any human, he deserves a second chance. and i don’t even like the guy.

  25. Patscantcheatkharmabitches says: Mar 28, 2009 7:20 PM

    I agree with you 100%. You better watch it there Flo, your beginning to sound less and less like a defense attorney(Democrat) and more and more like a conservative who believes people ought to be responsible for their actions. I am not so sure he is. The BS he pulled with PETA is chicken shit at best (Even though PETA is a bunch of psycho’s). If he weren’t a celebrity athlete and he was just a normal person, he would never hold a licensed job again and would probably have a hard time getting a job flipping burgers.
    For all of you supporters, he has made more money in his few years as a QB than all of you combined will ever make. And he says to us, no matter what he does, everyone is gonna love Mike Vick. He pissed away willingly a life that was charmed and he did it knowing all of the consequences. We are worried about taking care of our families and he is worried if they got the fence the right color of black. He basically pissed on all of his fans and he did it not out of necessity but out of a sick enjoyment of watching dogs die. This was not a drug dealer with nothing to lose. And he would not walk across the street to pee on your little ass if you were on fire. SO I do not get all of the BS support for that piece of crap.

  26. PackerFanTastic says: Mar 28, 2009 7:20 PM

    Michael Vick is an unrepentant puke and his “paying his debt to society” is in no way related to his playing in the NFL again. He is a disgrace and I agree with the writer who said he’s more concerned with the gambling. Allowing Vick to play again would put the ntegrity of the league in question.

  27. kingj228 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:20 PM

    A chief turd herder floating a big turd a lifeline. There’s a surprise!

  28. Slow Joe says: Mar 28, 2009 7:24 PM

    A pretty good argument, Florio.
    But I think that when a man has paid his debt to society, he’s paid his debt to society. What more can he do?
    He still needs to make a living.

  29. Iwant_my2dollars says: Mar 28, 2009 7:26 PM

    Playing in the NFL is a privilege? For Vick, breathing is a privilege. If it were still an ‘eye for an eye’ kind of world, he would be slammed to the ground, electrocuted with a probe up the ‘chute and thrown in a pool to drown.
    Killing, human being or otherwise, is killing. Personally, I could care less what if he carries a football ever again. All I know is that I will do the only thing I can do if he does ever get back to the NFL… Not watch.

  30. ahstoosu82 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:29 PM

    If you want non-biased, opinion free reporting, go to yahoo sports or nbc sports. This is a blog service and with it comes editorial comments.
    Robert Edwards grow up. You keep saying the same thing over and over and its just tired jargon at this point. If you don’t agree with Florio being critical of people who operate in the public eye, in this case NFL players, then don’t put money in his pocket by visiting his website.

  31. philwauke says: Mar 28, 2009 7:36 PM

    He also thinks Josh Bullocks deserves another chance.

  32. Dtronic says: Mar 28, 2009 7:38 PM

    Agree 100% with you Florio. There is a difference between criminal intent and just being stupid.

  33. nazzdogg says: Mar 28, 2009 7:40 PM

    Florio,
    do you have the same criteria for every criminal who has engaged in criminal activities over a period of time? so for you, every person who is released from prison shouldn’t be allowed to engage in their profession? & don’t give me that sports is a priviledge bull. It a profession where the best are rewarded just like in any other profession. & unlike the white collar criminals, vick didn’t ruin the lives of other humans. ROBERT EDWARDS SAID IT BEST in his last line about you so I don’t need repeat it so I’ll just say this enough with the self-righteous jerkyness it doesn’t play well for skip bayless & we damn sure don’t need another one of him.

  34. purpleguy says: Mar 28, 2009 7:41 PM

    Hey Mike, didn’t Little get busted again for DUI after he killed someone while driving drunk? Isn’t that a conscious and repeated choice even worse than dog fighting? To kill someone by driving drunk, and then to drive drunk again and endanger people (not frigging dogs)after getting caught and supposedly learning a lesson, is ten times worse. This post shows complete lack of objectivity, something expected more from a Packer fan.

  35. deymond says: Mar 28, 2009 7:41 PM

    I love dogs, but seriously, dogfighting is finally the unforgiveable sin? Is that really more harmful to American society than say, Travis Henry’s procreation and child support habits (a moot point now, but something the league found uninteresting while he was in the league)?

  36. MJA says: Mar 28, 2009 7:42 PM

    Yes fighting, gambling and murdering dogs is not a mistake, but is it something that you are ready to ruin someone’s life over? Unlike a lot of celebrity’s, Mike Vick actually served a somewhat fair jail sentence. So far I have seen zero reports indicating that he was a bad inmate, but I haven’t heard any saying he was good either. Other then football, what other job could Mike Vick possibly get that would allow him to pay off his millions of dollars worth of debt? Without football Vick will never have an opportunity to redeem himself. Who the hell would ever hire him due to the horrible backlash that people like Florio and other writers would give the company? If he messes up this opportunity again than feel free to take away his right to play in the NFL, but if you take that right away now what does Vick have to live for?
    Also what Little and Stallworth did was 100 times worse, sorry but human being > 200 dogs.

  37. dlmcc0505 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:45 PM

    I agree with everything Florio stated. Vick should never play in the NFL again. I personally would stop rooting for my team if this loser was signed.
    I dont know what robert edwards is talking about. Vick was never a good QB even before the legal troubles. the guy may run fast but he can’t throw accurately. Vick is a bust in every sense of the word

  38. blackglass3 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:46 PM

    Lovie Smith is just saying this so he gets a crack at Vick, who even after prison would be a better QB than the jokers they have now.
    Now, with Vick (and most other things), the cover up was much worse than the crime. Yes, dog fighting is bad to alot of people, but for others they were raised with it being just a way of life. If Vick hadn’t lied repeatedly to Arthur Blank, Roger Goodell, the media, and the police, he probably wouldn’t have been as persecuted and just given a slap on the wrist.

  39. Matt Hoover says: Mar 28, 2009 7:47 PM

    Florio is right on point. Those of you disagreeing with him on this one have SERIOUS morality issues.

  40. ACDC84 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:47 PM

    “Ever stop to consider how he might have been raised? He was likely a product of his environment, and Newport News isn’t the most wholesome of environments by any means. It’s no different than racist parents who bring up their kids to believe as they do by constantly surrounding them with that culture in their formative years.”
    Boo freaking hoo. He knew what he was doing. You can’t blame a half-decade of illegal activity on a less-than-ideal upbringing. That’s just a poor excuse.

  41. TheDPR says: Mar 28, 2009 7:48 PM

    I wish I was shocked by the ignorance of the Vick supporter comments here but I’m not.
    Mike Vick is a piece of crap. He’s a thug and a gangster who ran a gambling ring and forfeited his free ride.
    He has no business in professional sports again. Ever.
    Unlike Florio, I think the crime of running a gambling ring while being a professional athlete outweighs the dog-killing, which was also atrocious – merely slightly less so.

  42. VBG says: Mar 28, 2009 7:54 PM

    How is this not tampering? Vick is still the property of the Atlanta Falcons.

  43. KBall7326 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:56 PM

    I see the ignorent dipshits are out in full force today… as usual. This is Florio’s site and he can say whatever he wants, whether you agree with him or not. It’s not like you pay for this.

  44. evedder12 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:57 PM

    I assume that most of these individuals commenting have driven after drinking. If they would have hit someone would they consider themself worse than Vick? I think not. For the most part the elderly, children and animals are helpless, that is why people get up in arms about harming them. There are people that grow up in much worse environments than Vick and they don’t kill dogs. They worry about living. Besides, Vick is just a glamorized Kordell without the marks on his face.

  45. Roachk1lla says: Mar 28, 2009 7:57 PM

    Hey Rob Edwards take a tissue and wipe the sand out of your vagina, no one wants to read or see your story of a post.

  46. bondem777 says: Mar 28, 2009 7:58 PM

    However you feel about it, Vick received a sentence for his deeds, which he is serving. When that is complete, he has a right to try out for a team and try to earn a living. You can’t impose your own sentence on him, Florio.

  47. raiders117 says: Mar 28, 2009 8:01 PM

    Nice reference to “the Office”

  48. tyjones52 says: Mar 28, 2009 8:01 PM

    Get for real this behavior you speak of Florio is a lifestyle in the deep south. Dog fighting and cock fighting in the rural south is normal to everyday life as cutting one’s lawn. Mike’s issue is that he could not break away from the traps of his old lifestyle. But don’t make it like he was raping 10 year old little boys who ask for his autograph.

  49. Salty Riddums says: Mar 28, 2009 8:03 PM

    Have to completely agree with Florio, disagree with the clown above. First, this topic (Vick/dogs) isn’t dirty laundry. It isn’t someone maybe cheating on their wife, or something personal to the athlete. A franchise invests in these guys. Vick’s actions completely screwed over the Falcons. My point is, it needs to part of the conversation, or at least allowed to be. Secondly, our society is only as good as we hold ourselves up to be. A guy like Vick has had and will continue to have a horrible impact on society as a shallow and corrupt example to our youth. It matters. If we don’t establish at least some semblance of a standard we’re just consumer whores diving to the lowest common denominator instead of fans of the great American pastime……….
    Also, ANYBODY can type tough robert edward. Why don’t you grow a pair and take a hard look at yourself in the mirror. Seems like you have some serious soul-sucking hatemuck cramming up your brain. Big bully behind a computer screen…..

  50. upearly says: Mar 28, 2009 8:04 PM

    BAN HIM FOR LIFE ..NO SECOND CHANCES FOR THIS SCUM. HE TORTURED THESE ANIMALS.. KEEP STATING THE CASE FLORIO !

  51. truefan says: Mar 28, 2009 8:05 PM

    You know “robert edwards” it always cracks me up when folks like you get on a site that is run and funded by someone and you tell them to shut up. Get you own freakin’ blog if you don’t like what the owner/moderator has to say. Really. Or stay away from this one. Florio (right or wrong) can express whatever he chooses here. And he has built a site that is successful. I don’t by ANY means agree with everything he says, but you really can choose to stay off this site if you don’t like what he says. Grow up and go back to Facebook with all your junior high friends.

  52. nordicnightmare says: Mar 28, 2009 8:05 PM

    Is this really a suprise to anyone? Did anyone think Lovie would say any different?
    It’s like clockwork.

  53. myusernamestinks says: Mar 28, 2009 8:07 PM

    Dog killers and people killers do compare, at least as far as the law is concerned. Once they’ve paid their debt to society they have a right to go out and make a living. It doesn’t matter how disgusted we are with the crime.

  54. Pea Tear Griffin says: Mar 28, 2009 8:07 PM

    Good piece Mike. I couldn’t agree more.
    By the way, the Michael Vick stuff is the best work you’ve ever done. That’s something to hang your journalist hat on.

  55. bloodydrunk says: Mar 28, 2009 8:07 PM

    If this (relatively old) quote surprises you, Florio, then you don’t know Lovie Smith. He speaks in ambiguity to the point of pain (for us faithful).
    This quote has literally nothing to do with Vick. It has everything to do with the fact that, when Lovie doesn’t know what he’s talking about, he gets as ambiguous as possible. If he doesn’t have direction from somewhere higher about a position, he gets really ambiguous. Period.

  56. PFTisgreat says: Mar 28, 2009 8:08 PM

    Once again, Idiot posters that defend a fool like Vick, If you don’t like what this site stands for, take your ridiculously ignorant posts elsewhere and stop wasting your and my time.
    I get so tired of you morons who bash Florio constantly for his opinion. Here’s my opinion, SHUT UP!

  57. FLORIOLEADSWITNESSES says: Mar 28, 2009 8:11 PM

    HUMANS>DOGS>FLORIO

  58. Ralph GreNader says: Mar 28, 2009 8:13 PM

    I guess for Vicks sake its a good thing nobody asked you.
    Not like I’m being repetitive

  59. FUTURELEGEND says: Mar 28, 2009 8:14 PM

    Mike Vick deserves a second chance. I got one.
    -O.J.

  60. ActionJackson says: Mar 28, 2009 8:14 PM

    People have been involved in blood sports for ever, I bet u watched gladiator movies and didnt say thats terrible, and people have always compared football players to gladiators, so now people are shocked that these so called gladiators act like gladiators? Vicks problem was he didnt know when to stop. I don’t agree with dog fighting but football is the same thing. Its a bunch of guys trying to knock each other out in the most violent ways possible, and don’t say its about game plan and scoring and all that, if it was we would all watch soccer, listen to how the players have reacted to the new safety rules they hate it. They want the violence they want to see that hard take the guys head off hit. What did JonesDrew say? If you didnt want to get hurt u shouldnt play football.

  61. Somnambulus says: Mar 28, 2009 8:16 PM

    robert edwards says:
    March 28th, 2009 at 6:46 pm
    Like I said before stop with the editorial comments
    ——————–
    Do you understand what, precisely, a blog is? Are you aware that it is a genre (loosely defined) unlike newspaper journalism? Perhaps you’ve heard the longer form of the term blog: web log, as in a web based journal of sorts.
    The “hey man, keep your opinions to yourself” comments are in fact antithetical to the format.
    That said, the blog entry reads like a closing argument. Well written and well reasoned, which is more than I can say for the comment cited above.
    And if growing a set means killing smaller, weaker animals, then your conception of masculinity is, well, odd.

  62. da mad greek says: Mar 28, 2009 8:17 PM

    i dont want him anywhere near my bears (Lovie the redeemer)…hell of a talent, no character. Let him go to the cowboys.
    I understand what yur saying with the drunk driving and the intent of the crime. And vick’s intent was cruel and inhumane for a looooong period of time. Not to mention the gambling aspect (which should preclude him from playing ever again by its self). He meant to profit from it.
    But killing people while driving drunk is a tough thing to compare even though the intent is lacking, the result is a difficult one to overlook…couldn’t ya have used the countless other crimes nfl players are accused of?
    how bout a good wife beating or a shooting of your own leg or getting a tattoo of your qb coach on your ankle?

  63. DynastyDriven77 says: Mar 28, 2009 8:17 PM

    He has paid his debt and then some. I know Mr.Florio has grown to be Mr. More holier then thou the more hits he gets on his site but give me a break. The league is full of scum bags alot of which has never made the press.

  64. Jmoney7 says: Mar 28, 2009 8:19 PM

    Florio, you’re saying that it wasn’t a mistake for Mike Vick to choose Dog Fighting as a hobby?? What’s that supposed to mean? You support dog fighting??

  65. ActionJackson says: Mar 28, 2009 8:20 PM

    i would personally kill every one of those dogs that vick killed if it meant that the people daunte stallworth and leonard little killed would still be alive.

  66. NFLed says: Mar 28, 2009 8:21 PM

    Keep Vick out of the league forever please. If he returns and becomes a starter again it would be a true black mark on the sport. This isn’t someone who made a mistake and it isn’t someone who is paying for his crimes (a couple of years in jail doesn’t pay for what he did).

  67. CRLchris says: Mar 28, 2009 8:22 PM

    Those dogs were his property? Not all of them . Everytime Florio posts anything someone shows up with the “they were his property” argument. And someone chimes in with the “he paid his debt/went to jail line.
    Please listen and try to understand this.
    Vick and his pal stole animals from families in the surrounding areas. Dogs and cats untrained in fighting. Family pets. They took these animals and threw them into the pits with their trained ferocious killers to be destroyed with no chance at life. These loved and treasured animals died as training fodder and their owners, their families were left without a valued pet. Vick and company have never… lets use that word again… never… apologized or made any restitution to those families. Nor were they charged for those crimes by the Virgina DA.
    They stole defenseless animals and fed them to the trained killer dogs. There is no defense for that. Anyone who would toss a kitten into a ring with a 200 pound Rotty and watch it get torn to pieces for sport has… nothing. No conscience, no morals, not even basic empathy. That is sheer cruelty and torture. That is the kind of actions that future serial killers display (note: I am not saying Vick is a serial killer, I am saying that serial killers profile’s begin with torture and killing of small animals and family pets)
    He went to prison for violating federal law. Not for state laws. Not for killing his dogs. Not for killing those family pets. And he has never apologized for it. Never made any attempt to reach out to those families.
    Yes these are animals. But their families loved them. The children who owned them loved them. And they were robbed of that so Mike Vick, NFL millionare, could make some money and have fun.

  68. Trey says: Mar 28, 2009 8:25 PM

    Vick has paid for his mistake or as you want to call it “lifestyle”. If the NFL wants to further punish him that is their right as a private business. He has/will continue to pay for is illicit behavior as he will always be a convicted felon.

  69. tiktokdok says: Mar 28, 2009 8:26 PM

    dlmcc0505 says: “Vick is a bust in every sense of the word”
    Hey, let’s not give them there boobs a bad name!

  70. Swervinmervin says: Mar 28, 2009 8:27 PM

    Florio – you really are as dumb as you look.
    Drunk driving, drunk walking, sleep walking, sleep driving, riding a bike, whatever… KILLING ONE human being is WORSE than killing a thousand dogs!
    I know over in West Virginia you guys tend to sleep with your pets, but in the rest of the civilized world, we put human life ahead of animals.
    Vick was an idiot. He served his time. There are bigger idiots in the NFL who have done worse things than kill some dogs (wife abusers, drug dealers, murderers, etc…). He should be allowed back in. Simple as that.

  71. DallasSucks says: Mar 28, 2009 8:29 PM

    Screw Mike Vick!
    He should get another shot all right – right between the eyes.

  72. Condor75 says: Mar 28, 2009 8:34 PM

    I love this site and you guess are informative, insightful and funny, I however seriously disagree with you on this one. I don’t particularly care any more about Vick than I do anyone else that I have never met, but what else do you want him to do?He is in prison, has lost all of his wealth, his career is basically lost or certainly will never be the same. What he did was reprehensible no doubt but to say the death of two human being was a lesser offense is baffling. When people drive drunk and kill someone, that is not an accident, they know they are drunk and they know what could happen, but they do it any way. Ask the families of those killed by drunken drivers if they think it is as bad as killing a dog. Just one more thing, I do not know about you guys, but I haven’t seen much outrage about dog fighting lately. Did it all end when Vick went to jail? I doubt it.

  73. kjlasch says: Mar 28, 2009 8:35 PM

    Florio… are you kidding me??? I couldn’t disagree with you more on this.
    Do you really think that fighting dogs is worse than drinking your a$$ off and then driving a car!?!

  74. ralphthedog says: Mar 28, 2009 8:37 PM

    Plain and simple: Vick doesn’t deserve the honor of straping on the pads again. Neither do the others who have broken the “faith”.
    You kill a person, you should be done. You drive drunk, you should sit for a year. you take ‘roids you sit.. hold players to a higher standard.
    Florio–Great piece.

  75. mocollins says: Mar 28, 2009 8:40 PM

    Amen, Mike. Vick should never play again. Let him go scoop dog poop for the Humane Society. Vick was sure fun to watch before this whole story broke, but I will never watch him play again. If he ends up a Raider I will have to take all of my Silver and Black items to Goodwill. Vick sucks. Stay after him.

  76. bishop23 says: Mar 28, 2009 8:44 PM

    i think this is a great and informative site. you do great work. but in my opinion i think your assessment of the vick situation is flawed. so many athletes like michael pittman and even larry fitzgerald abuse and harm women and do no time and in the court of public opinion they get off scott free. There are no protests or advocate groups asking these men to get brainscans showing there remorse. Yet for vick he is viewed as if he killed somebody and in your thinking those that take human life deserve more leniency than a a man that killed dogs. I suggest you look the mother of the man Stallworth killed in the eye and tell her it was worse for vick to kill a dog than for stallworth to kill her son. Ask her whose life they she would rather preserve her sons or the family pet. A lot of the negativity towards vick stems from jealousy over the talent he has and the money he makes. which he lost!..I think people should value the lives of humans more, and be more conscious and concerned about domestic abuse than dogfighting. Thats my humble and very un-eloquent 2 cents. and yes i know un-eloquent is not a word

  77. AFL1960 says: Mar 28, 2009 8:47 PM

    Why are we looking at dogs like they’re humans!? Dog fighting is no different than a cock fight! And Florio, you think Vick’s actions are worse than man slaughter!? We’re talking about the difference between humans and animals; not the intention of people’s actions.
    And as for Goodell, he said that Vick has to show remorse before he comes back!? What remorse is there to show!? He just served a two year sentence, how much more sorry can a man be? And how will you ever know whether or not he is truly sorry?
    Lovie Smith is right. Vick has served his time and deserves a clean slate. Let Vick back without any trouble!!!

  78. Philtration says: Mar 28, 2009 8:50 PM

    Lovie Smith is a total idiot.
    But we already knew that here in Chicago.

  79. BradyGazelle says: Mar 28, 2009 8:55 PM

    Wow. What a surprise. This is the kind of crap that will turn the NFL into a thug league like the NBA became and football will become an afterthought to the American sports fan.
    Thanks, Lovie. Hope you enjoy biting the hand that feeds you.
    I hope the Bears go 0-16 now.

  80. Gerald Keefer says: Mar 28, 2009 9:03 PM

    Great article Mike. Though I do have to disagree that Vick should be banned for life. He certainly deserves a suspension and has to show legitimate remorse before he should be allowed to play again. If he shows that he deserves another chance.
    Stupid, stupid Lovie…this reminds why I can’t wait until you get shown the door in Chicago. Maybe you can go sign Josh “Runaway Train” Bullocks to an extension while you’re at it. You and Jerry deserve each other.

  81. BlogHog says: Mar 28, 2009 9:04 PM

    STOP IT !
    This isn’t like he raped or murdered someone or molested a child.
    Once the man pays his debt to society he should be given every chance to redeem himself.
    He is not only bankrupt, he’s in debt which means he lost more then everything.
    I’m done putting this guy through the meat grinder.
    The harder you judge people the harder God will judge you.
    If someone wants to keep hammering him just because he’s an easy target, so be it.
    I’m not saying I’m going out and buy a Vick jersey any time soon…. but I have moved on and if you haven’t, contact your congressman and change the laws…. just stop crying and banging on Vick.
    The man deserves to rebuild his life.

  82. iver74 says: Mar 28, 2009 9:04 PM

    I’m not certain you can say he did it soberly. Didn’t he enter jail high?
    He wasn’t trying to lye or deceive, he just plain forgot, and needed to be reminded of the charges.

  83. Shamrock says: Mar 28, 2009 9:08 PM

    Lovie Smith is one more underachieving season away from getting ashcanned.
    Why would he stick his nose into the Vick mess? He’s creating a distraction and possible public relations media mess, when none existed before he opened his mouth.
    Moron.

  84. erikthomas2000 says: Mar 28, 2009 9:09 PM

    WOW LOVIE SMITH SHOULD BE REINCARNATED AS A DOG AND TAKE A VACATION AT THE “BAD NEWZ KENNELS” AND BE THROWN ON THE SHIT PILE OF COACHES

  85. Facts Domino says: Mar 28, 2009 9:09 PM

    His 2nd chance is walking his ignorant ass out of prison.
    He doesn’t deserve another down in the NFL.

  86. escobacker says: Mar 28, 2009 9:15 PM

    The funny thing about all of this is Florio and the rest can continue to harshly attack Vick as aggressively as you please and it’s not going to change the fact that he’s a great athlete and he is coming back to the NFL. It’s become increasingly more apparrent by Goodell’s statements that Mike Vick will be reinstated.
    To add to that. Mike Florio is damn right when he says Mike Vick engaged in a lifestyle but it wasn’t by his own choice. That’s the way he was raised. You people saying he should know the difference between right and wrong don’t understand human psychology and the impact of the environment in which one is raised. People don’t “just know” the difference between right and wrong. This country had slaves for over 200 years, slaughtered millions of Natives, and put the Japanese in internment camps and at the time these things were happening nobody said it was wrong till after the fact. Get grip people this is a man’s entire life we are talking about. He DESERVES a second chance just like anyone else.

  87. WorldChampionBears2008 says: Mar 28, 2009 9:15 PM

    First off, killing another human being is FAR worse than fighting/killing dogs.
    When you kill a person their families are affected for YEARS to come. Not to mention the financial impact. What about that person they coulda been somebody important and who are you to take that away.
    A dog is a dog! You kill a dog, they don’t have families (dog families, human families can just go buy another one).
    Secondly, is there some kind of Chicago curse? That every team is curses to just SUCK! ‘cept the Bulls and ChiSox. Cuz every other team is content to BLOW!! badly might I add. This team for years since that 85 championship has been content with average. What happens when they “accidentally” go to the SB they throw it!!

  88. kms_1105 says: Mar 28, 2009 9:28 PM

    His debt to society is paid in full and yet people still criticize him for his crimes.Forgive and forget and then move on,it’s as simple as that.We have past things in our life time we have done regardless of the severity and limits of it.Let he who is without sin cast the First stone and then you can crticize Vick……

  89. A_Big@ssWTF says: Mar 28, 2009 9:48 PM

    I think incest and marrying your sister is worst than fighting dogs. You’re from West Virginia, you should know something bout that. I think if Vick played college ball for your beloved Mountaineers we wouldn’t have this discussion. Virginians fight dogs, West Virginians screw siblings? I digress.

  90. qckappa says: Mar 28, 2009 9:48 PM

    Once a person has paid their debt to society they should have all the all the reason able opportunities available to them that were available before. That is the way our judicial and correctional system was set up to be. No matter how he lived as long as he does not engage in that type of behavior any longer and does nothing related to what he did before he should have a chance to perform what he desires. Is it because he will make more money than the people that are against him having this opportunity, if that is the case, then choose a higher paying profession so that you can be happy with yourself. He killed dogs, inhumane to animals, definitely no worse than someone who drinks and drives in my book and takes the chance of killing a another human being. Matter of fact I don’t think what he did should be a felony. Has anyone other than a Black person been charged with those charges as felonies?

  91. jgrange says: Mar 28, 2009 10:07 PM

    I fail to see how you can say Leonard Little and Stallworth aren’t living a reckless lifestyle either. They murdered somebody with their car from drunk driving. Chances are, those incidents weren’t the first time they’ve driven drunk. A lot of people drive buzzed every day and don’t consider it a crime until they get caught, accept their mistake, do what they gotta do to repay their debt to society, and hopefully make a change. If they’ve been driving drunk more than once in their life and were doing it regularly then they’ve been living a dangerous lifestyle as well.
    That’s what the justice system is supposed to be about. Helping people see the error of their ways and changing their life for the better. It rarely happens but if Mike Vick changed his lifestyle since getting caught then that should be a good thing. I don’t see why you’re quick to criticize him.

  92. DallasSucks says: Mar 28, 2009 10:28 PM

    Reading some of these comments reminds me of why I prefer animals to people. Vick should be locked in a cell with Rae Carruth and forced to fight to the death. With any luck, neither would emerge alive.
    Screw Mike Vick, and anyone who defends him!

  93. ahstoosu82 says: Mar 28, 2009 10:33 PM

    The truth is this stigma will never leave him. The NFL is an entertainment industry and entertainment industries depend heavily on PR. What type of PR move would it be for Vick to be fully reinstated and signed by a team to be the QB, the default leader of any team?
    There’s a reason ex-convicts have trouble finding good jobs after serving their sentence. There is a reason you have to list prior convictions on an application. Fair or not this is the way of the world and even if Vick is reinstated, I severely doubt any team will take the PR risk of signing him.
    Those of you that wish to blame his faults on his upbringing make a valid point. But you can’t erase someone’s upbringing. By that argument the low standards that were imprinted on him could be for life and there is a good chance he will screw up again. So defending him with that argument you are really opening up the possibility of making more poor decisions. Unless of course he is “rehabilitated”(HA). Lets not forget that there were incidents before the dog fighting episode that caused people to question his character.

  94. formyministy says: Mar 28, 2009 10:36 PM

    for starters, those posters claiming vick grew up in a “rural area” don’t know geography. hampton roads (tidewater, norfolk, virginia beach)is the 26th largest metropolitan area in the country. it is not rural.
    second, i grew up in that area. it is not common there to fight dogs. it is not common or acceptable to any “southener” i know.
    third, saying he is uneducated (he went to college, morons!) or trying to use his race as an excuse for his actions is the very pinnacle of racism. wasn’t it martin luther king, jr who said he dreamed of a country where we are judged on the content of our character and not on the color of our skin? (that’s a rhetorical question)
    finally, i think florio was not comparing the crimes of drunk driving and dog fighting so much as the surrounding circumstances. if you can prove that someone has been drunk driving for years, then that also is not a “mistake” but a lifestyle.
    ps i was a vick fan.

  95. nobodee says: Mar 28, 2009 10:47 PM

    What’s the difference between what vick did, and sport hunting wich I think is much worse! I ‘ ll tell you the difference nothing but a piece of paper stating law! And if the government could find a way to tax it and make it apealing to the public, (like sport hunting) it wouldn’t be a charge! Since is is against the law. Since he did his time. Dept pay’d. Any parent that has a problem with their children thinking vick is a role model, try doing some parenting and explain to you children about jail and that it’s a horrible place to be. That vick had to do some time and is being given another chance is society!!

  96. Shamrock says: Mar 28, 2009 10:52 PM

    I don’t think any NFL team will sign Vick.
    His best attribute was his legs, and now he’s nearly 30 and hasn’t played in two seasons. He hasn’t trained in an NFL facility in two years. The first thing to go for athletes is their legs.
    QB’s that were good runners early in their careers later mature and develop their passing skills to survive in the NFL for a long career. Vick never developed as a passer, like players such as McNair, Cunningham, Steve Young, etc did.
    The owner who signs Mike Vick will have the NFL’s worst nightmare for public relations descend upon his team. The “distraction” index will top the charts. Why put your team in that mess of negative publicity and potential locker room disruption by having the Nat’l media chirping away non-stop 24-7?
    Vick’s days in the NFL are done.

  97. blueandsilver says: Mar 28, 2009 11:08 PM

    I registered just to post this comment, which i don’t usually do, and I hope i’m not rewarding angry rants. I like dogs, but I can’t understand how so many people who don’t oppose eating meat or hunting think Michael Vick is Satan. What’s that about? Does Florio really believe that killing dogs is comparable to killing people?
    Maybe the outrage is because Vick was “torturing” dogs. I hate cruelty and torture too, but there’s plenty of other torture that’s gone on and not gotten everyone up in arms. Maybe Florio is an anti-torture activist and I just don’t know it. But if, as he suggests, the outrage is because Vick lied when caught instead of pleading guilty, that strikes me as lame. Lying is so rare.
    Michael Vick has paid a very, very heavy price already. I think that is pretty obvious, and what Lovie Smith said was a lot more sensible and fair than what Florio wrote. The idea that Michael Vick should never be allowed to play in the NFL “ever” for the reasons florio recited, as if no penalty could ever be severe enough for him, strikes me as built almost entirely on emotion and harsh, wrong, and hypocritical.

  98. BlueEyeDevils says: Mar 28, 2009 11:09 PM

    Florio is an idiot! I am sick and tired of these “blueeyedevils”, too whimpy and uncoordinated to even play sports, but feel they are smarter than the actual athletes that play.
    The problem he has with Vick is not his “sick love” for his furry significant other, but more because he has a more serious phobia. He just like the rest of the “blueeyedevils”, they are afraid that the quarterback position is the last role that is not dominated by black athletes, and Vick is a big threat to that last great white hope.
    Dogs are nothing more than furry property. Anyone or anything that would place human life below some stupid dogs are the ones that should be seeing a shrink.
    Here we have the P.E.T.A. idiots that are running “slaughter” houses, where they have murdered over 25,000 “adoptable” pets, instead of find them a suitable home, even though they were provided a 32-million dollar annual budget.
    Animal lovers are idiots.

  99. bo-dawg07 says: Mar 28, 2009 11:16 PM

    Amen Florio- what Vick did to those dogs in rediculous. I don’t believe in considering Stallworth and the other guy any less guilty but still, it’s rediculous how people say that the government has no right to tell Vick how to “dispose” of his “property”.

  100. bo-dawg07 says: Mar 28, 2009 11:24 PM

    Apparently Blueeyedevils believes it’s quite ok to beat and murder dogs because you feel like it, or because, hell, you want to electrocute a dog to death Wednesday at 7:43, just because that’s the thing to do at that time. I am by no means a PETA freak, matter of fact, they are friggin retarded, but dogs do not deserve to be mutilated or destroyed by humans because that particular human feels like it- that’s sick, inhumane, and a serious problem for whoever has it. I think it would be fun to see Vick return, but what would be even funnier to me would be the fact of how many teams would slam the door right in his dispicable face.
    Another thing- if you want to make this whole situation based on racism than you are an idiot- wow, throw the race card out there because you have absolutely nothing else to go off of, because deep down you know that killing dogs sickly and inhumanely is wrong. Get a life if you plan on throwing the race card everytime your arguement goes to the crapper, because once it’s thrown, no one even cares to listen to your pathetic little excuses.

  101. WorldChampionBears2008 says: Mar 28, 2009 11:29 PM

    Well Vick did pay for the dogs he didn’t give birth to them or marry them.
    So by purchasing or getting them some other way technically they are his “property.”
    Secondly, I don’t get how Vick has to pay for this for the rest of his life. I have a feeling that once Vick gets released PETA will set-up shop outside his house and call for his head.
    Does anyone else see any problem with this? Even child molesters get married after serving time and get jobs. Why can’t Vick?
    PETA is asking VICK to be their personal b#tch in to stop them from stalking him.

  102. oncall0599 says: Mar 28, 2009 11:46 PM

    “If it were up to us, Vick wouldn’t play for the Bears or any other NFL team. Ever.”
    You know, Florio, I’m pretty happy that it’s not up to you, as you have shown your bias against Michael Vick for quite some time now. You feel so strongly against Vick that you’re now virtually defending a guy (Leonard Little) that you’ve blasted for years.
    If Little’s crime was unintentional, as you now state, why have you continued to blast him over the years?

  103. golds1 says: Mar 28, 2009 11:47 PM

    I just don’t get where the Vick apologists are coming from.
    As far as I’m concerned, he should be strung up by piano wire for what he did…he’s the worst kind of dirt-bag. What he did was no accident – it was intentional, cruel, inhumane, and inhuman.
    He did this with the worst kind of intentions, and thinks so much of himself he will never have regret or remorse. Not a chance.
    Piss on Vick…or is it Ron Mexico???

  104. BuckFutter says: Mar 28, 2009 11:49 PM

    Has anyone pointed out that by the time Vick can play again, Lovie will be unemployed?

  105. culturalelite says: Mar 29, 2009 12:03 AM

    For such a hot button issue, it sure seems like a lot of “readers” didn’t fully read Florio’s post.
    First, he didn’t say that the crime for which Leonard Little was convicted, and of which Dante Stallworth is accused were worse than Vick’s offenses, he was speaking of their intent.
    INTENT: “purpose; an anticipated outcome that is intended or that guides your planned actions”
    Personally, I think it’s unbelievable, unconscionable, unforgivable and deplorable that Leonard Little ever played a down in the NFL after what he did. I’m not a religious person, so I don’t see hell as an option for him, but I hope that karma catches up with him and every coach and personnel executive that allowed him back into pro football. I hope, as well, that Stallworth never finds his way back onto an NFL roster.
    These players acted selfishly, recklessly and foolishly, and deserve to be severely punished. But their intent was not to kill someone. Rae Carruth? He intended to kill someone. Love dogs or hate them, Michael Vick knowingly and willfully broke several law which included torturing and killing animals. He also broke what is perhaps the number one no-no in the NFL: running a gambling operation. And he lied about it all.
    As for this garbage about Vick being obviously “undereducated,” the guy got a full ride scholarship to college. If he didn’t take advantage of this extraordinary advantage offered to him on a silver platter, well, that’s his problem, not society’s. He also spent considerable time around veteran players and coaches who’ve experienced fame and fortune, and the pressures that come with it, without becoming thugs and embarrassments to the league.
    To me, the real issue here is this: No exact set of rules applies to whether a player plays again or not. Yes, Roger Goodell hold the cards right now, and until he gives the word, no NFL team can pursue a signing. Clearly there are a few coaches and personnel people who are open to Vick joining forces with their teams, but most, I suspect, will never consider bringing him aboard, and public opinion will likely prevent Vick from generating much NFL interest. In other words, whether you get back on the field depends not on whether you served your time, or expressed remorse. It’s largely about what type of crime you committed.
    The other day, Pro Football Talk posted an item about a player trying to land back in the NFL after child abuse charges several years ago. To paraphrase Florio, “don’t hold your breath.” Countless NFL players have served jail time for various offenses, and landed back with teams immediately after being released, but usually for crimes like drugs or theft, or DUI incidences that did not result in harm to victims. Juries don’t consider public relations and public opinion when handing down a sentence. Prosecutors and judges sometimes do, and the simple reason is that some crimes resonate more with the public than others. Regardless of whether one thinks Vick did anything wrong in the first place, or if one believes he has paid his debt to society, what he did is bad for business. Remember Rafael Septien? This Dallas Cowboys kicker never did a day of jail time for indecency with a minor, but despite being at the height of his career and one of the best field goalers in the NFL, he never played again. If he had robbed a liquor store at gunpoint and done a six-month stretch in the big house, he probably would have been welcomed back to the big league.

  106. jspeight says: Mar 29, 2009 12:50 AM

    here’s an idea… let’s actually start kicking these morons out of the league, permanently. Pete Rose ’em. Send a message, you are a thug, we don’t want you. People on the ban list should include:
    Little, Stallworth (possibly), Jones, and all other players who have significantly reduced (or eliminated) a human life
    Morons like Vick, who think it is ok to keep $750,000 a year before he pays off his debt – here’s a great idea, maybe AFTER he finishes paying his debt (literal) to society, he will face a suspension from the NFL – and if any team is willing to sign him after that – go for it

  107. theVIC says: Mar 29, 2009 12:50 AM

    Vick has already paid his debt to society and lost pretty much everything he had.
    He has a right to go back to work.
    Don’t give me this “playing in the NFL is a privilege” crap. Playing in the NFL is a job. It’s no more a privilege than being an accountant is a privilege, being a plumber is a privilege, etc.
    If Vick’s potential employers think that they might lose money by hiring him (i.e. Fans will stop buying their product), then they won’t hire him. If that’s not the case, then he’ll be suiting up for some team out there.

  108. da mad greek says: Mar 29, 2009 12:52 AM

    i think the seriousness of vick’s crime, besides the animal cruelty, lies in the racketeering. He was putting on a gambling ring, with the intent to make money. Sorry folks, ya just can’t do that.
    Many of you “obvious” animal lovers make your point about dogs being property and eating an animal is the same as electrocuting them to death when you have no more “use” from them. Interesting as your point of view may be, just because you have difficulty seeing a difference doesn’t make it so that there is no difference. Many of you may just be wrong here. He had a total disregard for life and I will not be surprised to hear that he will beat other “posessions” of his in the future. I believe Jefferey Dahlmer used to torture small animals for pleasure too—keep that in mind.
    But lets take this from a different perspective.
    Michael Vick, already linked to gambling, now owes over 12 million dollars. Lets do the math on that. I don’t want him playing for a team I love, thinking each game he plays could be the game he throws for money. It ruins every aspect of the game I love and I, personally, don’t want him to do that to me (call me selfish). I’ve heard allegations of Neil O’donnell throwing the superbowl against dallas and i couldn’t watch another game he was in afterwards. Not to mention making Larry Brown a rich rich man—crime enough for me.(my apologies to O’donnell if the rumor is false)
    Yes he served his time in prison and has paid his due, however that just allows him to reenter society. All does not need to be forgiven and an NFL job is not something that he “deserves”. Its amazing that this much chatter has resulted from an article claiming that in Florio’s opinion he should not get another job in the NFL. I don’t think he should get another NFL job either.
    I used to enjoy Vick and remember slapping high fives with several of my family members when he was beating the Packer’s ass in the playoffs. I thought about how the Urlacher–Vick showdowns would be awesome to watch for years.
    Someone probably will sign him.
    I just hope that sick son o bitch isn’t on the bears.
    So please Lovie–leave him in the pool.

  109. go_bucs says: Mar 29, 2009 1:06 AM

    if you think killing dogs is worse than killing people then you have your head up your ass. you cant bring your grandma down to the shelter and have her put to sleep.

  110. bemho73 says: Mar 29, 2009 2:00 AM

    It shows how uneducatated most MV supporters are he went to Jail for for running an interstate gambling ring not killing dogs. If the Black Da in the Black community would have pressed charged which had already have been admitted to he would be going back to prison but they chose not to prosecute the poor black QB who is a celebrity in that area. Pete Rose was banned for life from MLB because of gambling and he is white but it seems Vick got a free pass because of his color not inspite of it. So sick of hearing the race card. He intentionaly did what he did not because of how he was raised were hes from but because he is garbage and thought he was above it. To all the VIck supporters its sad knowing that you will be raising kids with these social views because that is why society it so screwed up. I agree that Vick deserves a second chance just not in the NFL. If a Dr lawyer military member cop or nurse commits a felony they are no longer allowed to practice in their chosen field but no one is preventing him from getting a job Why reward him with a second chance when he threw the first one away. As to the ones with DUI murders they shouldnt be in the NFL either.

  111. nobodee says: Mar 29, 2009 2:04 AM

    Hey, I just seen a group of angry dogs outside protesting equal rights!! What’s next. Hey listen animal cruelty is wrong I think we can all agree there. The guy isn’t a danger to society! Or anyones pets. Haha he was a big player in a underground dogfighting organization! He was found guilty and sentenced. Most of the people crying about him possibly being re-instated are mostlikly not even football fans. True football fans want to see the best players in the world in the NFL. So for all you haters get back to reading you “ok” magazines and star gaze and judge the world in the privcey of your own home!!

  112. SpartaChris says: Mar 29, 2009 3:35 AM

    >>ActionJackson says:
    March 28th, 2009 at 8:14 pm
    People have been involved in blood sports for ever, I bet u watched gladiator movies and didnt say thats terrible, and people have always compared football players to gladiators, so now people are shocked that these so called gladiators act like gladiators? Vicks problem was he didnt know when to stop. I don’t agree with dog fighting but football is the same thing. Its a bunch of guys trying to knock each other out in the most violent ways possible, and don’t say its about game plan and scoring and all that, if it was we would all watch soccer, listen to how the players have reacted to the new safety rules they hate it. They want the violence they want to see that hard take the guys head off hit. What did JonesDrew say? If you didnt want to get hurt u shouldnt play football.<<
    Right, but those guys are making the conscious decision to participate in the sport. They are deliberately making the decision to play the game, and get paid while doing so.
    Vick’s dogs weren’t. They didn’t have a choice. They were starved and beaten and tortured until they became bloodthirsty killers, and then they were turned loose on one another so a group of street turds could profit.
    Look, I’d be OK if the Leonard Littles and Donte Stallworths of the NFL never played football again. There is no excuse for ones carelessness to take another life. Ever. But the difference between Mike Vick and those guys is Vicks actions were intentionally cruel while those guys were careless. I’m not talking like picking on the fat kid cruel, or banging the ugly chick to win a bet cruel. I’m talking about senseless torture. The starvation and beating of a living being just to make it mean and then drowning or hanging the loser, and doing this all for profit.
    Look, people use poor judgment all the time. I don’t know of too many people on this planet who haven’t had too much to drink at one time and still decided to drive home. But that’s the difference between the Leonard Littles and the Donte Stallworths and the Albert Haynesworths. They used poor judgement that had a negative consequence. They will have to pay for their mistakes, and I’d be ok if they never play another down in the NFL as I’m sure most of you are. But I’m less outraged by their behavior than I am Mike Vicks, While their behavior was inexcusable, Mike Vicks was deliberately heartless, cruel, inhumane and disgusting. All four of those traits far outweigh the carelessness shown by drunk driving.

  113. SpartaChris says: Mar 29, 2009 3:39 AM

    >>AFL1960 says:
    March 28th, 2009 at 8:47 pm
    And as for Goodell, he said that Vick has to show remorse before he comes back!? What remorse is there to show!? He just served a two year sentence, how much more sorry can a man be? And how will you ever know whether or not he is truly sorry?<<
    Yeah, he didn’t voluntarily serve that sentence. He kinda had no choice in the matter, so his serving two years in prison means jack shit in terms of showing remorse for his despicable actions.
    And you never know if a man is truly sorry, but actions do speak louder than words. Vick is going to have a long way to go to prove himself.

  114. Stone says: Mar 29, 2009 3:47 AM

    How come no one raises hell about Roy Jones Jr and his farm of cock fighters? Are dogs just that much better or do less people pay attention to boxers? I was listening to a friend describe the dog they ate in Vietnam. They butcher the dogs in one of two ways to ensure the most tender meat: 1) they hold the dog’s mouth open and pour boiling water down the throat or 2) they hang the animal by its legs and beat it to death. She said that there was an easily distinguishable paw cooking on the bbq. Vick has lost millions and spent time in jail for killing and fighting dogs; its enough already, free Michael Vick.

  115. SpartaChris says: Mar 29, 2009 3:50 AM

    >>qckappa says:
    March 28th, 2009 at 9:48 pm
    Once a person has paid their debt to society they should have all the all the reason able opportunities available to them that were available before. That is the way our judicial and correctional system was set up to be. No matter how he lived as long as he does not engage in that type of behavior any longer and does nothing related to what he did before he should have a chance to perform what he desires. <>Is it because he will make more money than the people that are against him having this opportunity, if that is the case, then choose a higher paying profession so that you can be happy with yourself. <>He killed dogs, inhumane to animals, definitely no worse than someone who drinks and drives in my book and takes the chance of killing a another human being. Matter of fact I don’t think what he did should be a felony. Has anyone other than a Black person been charged with those charges as felonies?<<
    You can see my other posts as to why it’s different.

  116. curiousjamal says: Mar 29, 2009 4:08 AM

    Florio
    Most often I agree with you, however this time your point of view is way out of line. This guy went to prison for….. dog fighting. He’s paid his debt to society.
    Mike our justice system is not based on the idea of Punishment and you should no better.

  117. ninersfan says: Mar 29, 2009 4:40 AM

    Agree 100% Vick needs to go do something else.

  118. joetoronto says: Mar 29, 2009 5:55 AM

    Ask yourself this, if Vick was white, do you honestly think Lovie Smith would even THINK about taking him back?
    This is racism folks. There are a lot of people out there that will defend someone of their own race no matter what he or she has done.
    Want another example?
    There was a march in the streets of Oakland the other day in support of the thug that killed for cops.
    I shit you not.

  119. peternorth1 says: Mar 29, 2009 6:59 AM

    Pitbulls are evil and as far as I am concerned – the less pitbulls – the better….and all you phony “how dare he hurt cute little doggies” people are a bunch of pussies. It is quite obvious that you care more about what happens to a pitbull than what happens to another human being…and those SAME pitbulls that Vick owned that you pussies are all so outraged about – those same pitbulls would rip your throat off and not think twice about it.

  120. bigblue59 says: Mar 29, 2009 7:56 AM

    How many of you would get a second chance if they had a federal conviction
    Hell he could not get a job as a garbage man with his criminal record if your all so worried about vick why dont you all hire convicks to work at your companys or around your homes?

  121. pft0320098 says: Mar 29, 2009 7:56 AM

    Sure, give animal abusers a life sentence in prison, even death. But you better make sure that the countless children, mentality challenged and the elderly who are abused at the hands of their ‘care givers’ are given the same respect and ‘justice’.
    Vick will never make it back to the NFL.

  122. Silvercat says: Mar 29, 2009 8:46 AM

    Now we know what Lovie REALLY think of Kyle Orton. Good luck this year, Chicago fans. Once the Bears finish behind the Lions in the North you’ll get your wish and Lovie will finally get the boot. Maybe then he can coach a UFL team with Vick at QB and Matt Jones and Charles Rogers as receivers.

  123. afischer@mp-trainer says: Mar 29, 2009 9:24 AM

    YES, he is the serial-criminal.It seems to be a family thing, he is not a project kid anymore he is a criminal, not a victim of a lapse in judgement.
    I will donate to any organization to fight his entry into the nfl or other area’s where his redeption is fame and false praise because of unique skills.
    He is a scumbag!
    Only fitting he should have to live like a dog

  124. jasnite says: Mar 29, 2009 9:37 AM

    So, you mean to tell me that since Mike Vick was caught dog fighting, no one else is doing it? NO ONE ELSE HAS BEEN CAUGHT DOG FIGHTING!!!!!!! THATS BULLSHIT….Leave that man alone and let him play football.

  125. Shaun Lowrie says: Mar 29, 2009 10:06 AM

    The problem for me is that commentators are depriving him of a chance to redeem himself on the field. Sure, he was stupid, and he deserved his punishment, but why do people continuously attempt to ruin lives in the name of ‘justice’. Consider this: If I committed a crime, intentionally or otherwise, and showed remorse, served my punishment etc, then what use to society is it to then treat me as a pariah and deny me the chance to do a job that I am qualified for?
    As far as I’m concerned, Mike Vick without football is more of a danger to both himself and in turn the public than Mike Vick with football. It should also be shown that the NFL practices redemption and gives people a second chance, because frankly we all make mistakes. The nature of those mistakes may vary, but there is no need to punish people continually once they have served their sentence in the eyes of the law.
    The guy is a bit of an arsehole, I think we all know that anyway, but in 5 years time, it would be nice to think that Vick would appreciate his privilege more as a player, than as someone who was shunned by the only employer he has ever known.
    To give an analogy, if you were dumped by your Girlfriend for flirting with other women all of of the time, you’d probably think ‘why the hell did I risk it all for some stupid tramp in a bar that meant nothing?’
    If she took you back you’d most certainly consider it a blessing to be given a second chance, and not make the same mistake again.
    Unless you’re Pacman.

  126. brasho says: Mar 29, 2009 10:13 AM

    @Fantastik:
    So what of how he was raised? Part of changing the ills of society is to eliminate the crap people are subjected to when they are being raised. If that means making an example out of a guy because he clearly engaged in an activity that was illegal (just to get the word out to others that are being raised this way) then so be it.
    Just because you were raised to crap in your pants until the age of three doesn’t mean you should still go around doing it. This is a question of knowingly doing right or wrong, Vick is an adult, he knew it was wrong, he got caught, now the other morons in the country that still engage in this activity also know it is wrong, or at the very least a punishable offense.
    That being said, I strongly disagree with Florio, he paid his debt, what he has done cannot be considered any worse than what Pacman does…Pacman and Henry got 8 games (and I think Tank Johnson did too), I don’t see Vick being suspended any more of less than 8 games.

  127. j the bears fan is always right says: Mar 29, 2009 11:00 AM

    look i have been a dog owner all of my life… right now i have an ankle biter and a golden retriever… but if the league is alright with having murderers in it then let vick back he didnt kill a human being!!! u forgot someone on that list that was thought to have pulled an oj ray lewis… no one seems to remember him being up on murder charges before. why not? kill some one, feel bad about it, put mom in cambells commercial, all better….. bottom line is this. vick did do some stupid, incredibly stupid crap. but if we as people think that dog killings is worse than murder we are down right RETARDED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  128. dean2512 says: Mar 29, 2009 11:49 AM

    Vick is a thug and Lovie Smith is an idiot. They deserve each other!!

  129. HelmetKing says: Mar 29, 2009 11:50 AM

    “If it were up to us, Vick wouldn’t play for the Bears or any other NFL team. Ever.”
    When number 7 trots out onto the field, I want you to remember how powerless you truly are, despite your “almighty” blog.
    “Little (and possibly Stallworth) engaged in criminally reckless actions. They didn’t intend to harm anyone. Little’s crime (and possibly Stallworth’s) was to drink to excess under circumstances that did not prevent him from exercising impaired judgment by getting behind the wheel of a 2,000-pound sculpted block of rolling steel.”
    That is the text equivalent of a steaming pile of dog****. They were sober when they CHOOSE to drink in a situation where they knew they would drive later. Your argument, used in different context, would be “I just pulled the trigger, I didn’t intend for the gun to shoot.” If Little couldn’t forsee the danger of his drinking and driving then he should probably never have been released because his stupidity is a danger to all who come into contact with him.
    “Mike Vick didn’t make a mistake. He engaged in a lifestyle for a period of years and changed that lifestyle only because he got caught.”
    LoL, yea and Leonard Little stopped drinking and driving because he saw the error in his ways right?
    Ultimately, you showed your true colors with your incredibly insensitive post regarding the severity of Vick’s crimes in comparison to crimes that resulted in the loss of human life. Obviously this is your site and you decide what goes on here, but you fail to see that your large audience does not reinforce the validity of your opinions. To put it bluntly, you simply do not value all human life. Please remove my “handle” from your database, contact me via email, whatever, I no longer want to support this site.

  130. Creeper says: Mar 29, 2009 12:03 PM

    Based on the laws that govern our society, once Vick is released and reinstated to the NFL, he has a right to try to play. However, that works both ways. Once he’s back in the public eye, I have every right to make every second he spends within eye/earshot of me and anyone else with me absolutely miserable. He will once again be a free man. I will continue to be a free man who’s able to remind him that he’s a giant POS whose very name on an active jersey smears the league for what it is. I’m not one of those face-painting, screaming fans, but rest assured that millions of otherwise reasonable fans will ride this piece of trash’s ass all the way back into anonymity.

  131. SpartaChris says: Mar 29, 2009 12:18 PM

    >>theVIC says:
    March 29th, 2009 at 12:50 am
    Vick has already paid his debt to society and lost pretty much everything he had.
    He has a right to go back to work.
    Don’t give me this “playing in the NFL is a privilege” crap. Playing in the NFL is a job. It’s no more a privilege than being an accountant is a privilege, being a plumber is a privilege, etc.
    If Vick’s potential employers think that they might lose money by hiring him (i.e. Fans will stop buying their product), then they won’t hire him. If that’s not the case, then he’ll be suiting up for some team out there.<<
    Yeah, you’re wrong. Making millions to play a kids game is absolutely a privilege. It’s a dream, one he had and squandered.
    Having a job is a right, but that job doesn’t have to be in the NFL and pay millions of dollars.

  132. SpartaChris says: Mar 29, 2009 12:32 PM

    >>SpartaChris says:
    March 29th, 2009 at 3:50 am
    >>qckappa says:
    March 28th, 2009 at 9:48 pm
    Once a person has paid their debt to society they should have all the all the reason able opportunities available to them that were available before. That is the way our judicial and correctional system was set up to be. No matter how he lived as long as he does not engage in that type of behavior any longer and does nothing related to what he did before he should have a chance to perform what he desires.
    Yeah, you’re wrong. Using your logic, an elementary school teacher convicted of child molestation ought to be allowed to teach elementary school again.
    See the problem?
    >>Is it because he will make more money than the people that are against him having this opportunity, if that is the case, then choose a higher paying profession so that you can be happy with yourself. <>He killed dogs, inhumane to animals, definitely no worse than someone who drinks and drives in my book and takes the chance of killing a another human being. Matter of fact I don’t think what he did should be a felony. Has anyone other than a Black person been charged with those charges as felonies?<<
    Typical idiotic comment. Have nothing of substance or merit to support your case, so you try and play the race card. When will people learn that not everything in life is about race?
    Just because a black man got convicted of a crime doesn’t mean it’s racist. He’d still be just as much of a low-life piece of trash if he were white, brown, red or green. It has nothing to do with skin color and everything to do with the heinousness of his actions.

  133. VA R8rgrrl says: Mar 29, 2009 1:03 PM

    Thing is, Leonard Little didn’t set out to kill for sport and pleasure. Vick did–on more than one occasion. Vick is a psychopath who has yet to show any remorse for his heinous choices. As Florio said, he’s only sorry he got caught. It’s true that he has served his legal debt to society, and he has the right to petition the NFL for reinstatement. But the NFL is a business and it has the right to deny Vick’s petition if it believes his inclusion will damage its public image. And believe me, it will.

  134. Darth Ringo says: Mar 29, 2009 1:11 PM

    That statement drives me crazy: Vick did not “make a mistake…”
    For YEARS he was part of a criminal enterprise, and for years he lied about it.
    At the very least say he made mistakeS. Plural. Do you get the distinction, you geniuses?
    I take it Lovie Smith is tired of coaching and wants to get fired.

  135. formyministy says: Mar 29, 2009 4:10 PM

    can we stop with the “someone else is getting away with a crime, so you have to let vick off the hook” argument? is there just one court in this country, just one judge? i think our justice department can go after multiple criminals at the same time. and who here has been pulled over for speeding and tried the “but officer, that other car was speeding! you can’t give me a ticket unless you go catch him and give him one, too!” trick? and has it ever worked? no. you don’t get away with your crime just because someone else didn’t get caught. what a retarded sense of justice some of us have.
    to “blueeyeddevils”: are you only racist against people with blue eyes? and what do you do if you meet someone who is wearing sunglasses or colored contacts? how confusing! i bet i have the same eye color as you do…so it’s good to know that you don’t hate me.

  136. smiley says: Mar 29, 2009 4:36 PM

    Amen Florio!

  137. vbeach31 says: Mar 29, 2009 4:54 PM

    Florio,
    can we get a lil more gossip and less opinion please,especially when it’s bias. how in the world is killing dogs(which i dont condone) wors than killing people. That is a repulsive statement. Wrong is wrong. I’m not even going to go on a tangent about how dog fighting is not less brutal than hunting deer or killing animals in any type of variation. I think the whole purpose of going to jail is to rehabilitate a person and let him pay his debt to society. Who are people to say he isn’t rehabilitated and who are you to say that once he pays his dues, he shouldbe able to get paid off his god given talent. I’ve seen people not go to jail for a lot worst things than dogfighting.

  138. pats suck says: Mar 29, 2009 5:31 PM

    Reading these comments gives me a headache. So very few of you grasped what Florio is saying in the difference between impaired judgment and intent you morons.
    Excellent post Florio.

  139. hanjna says: Mar 29, 2009 8:50 PM

    florio, i love the site, but if you want to renounce our place at the top of the food chain, leave me out of that initiative. dogs or any other animals are not worthy of protective laws. they are a property. if you want a dog, you pay money for it. dollar values can be assigned to their lives. in some parts of the world, their meat is bought and sold for food. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat)
    i have to question your morals and your typically sharp understanding of the spirit of various rules, laws and contracts. in Vick’s case, i cant fathom that you think he is a bigger threat to society than two people who have killed, whether intentional or not.
    “reckless” is a nice way of saying someone is capable of harm even if intent is not present. its a copout to lump stallworth and little into that category. even if its simply engaging in some social binge drinking–and as easy as it is to rationalize that behavior given so many americans do the same–to get behind a car as so many athletes do is lunacy. to excuse their behavior or try to rationalize it in contrast to someone who has killed animals is demented.
    the issue with vick, as much as people try to discount the notion, is a socio-economically driven one. there is no way to rationalize the existence of horse-racing (and killing of injured horses) as legitimate if dog fighting is not. but because breeding horses is a hobby of the elite and fighting dogs is typically a hobby of the poor, one is acceptable and the other is not. id love to see ingrid newkirk go after some of the breeders, just so we could all be fortunate enough to see and hear them chortle at her attacks.
    speaking of ingrid newkirk, lets talk about the PETA response to the travis the chimp attack that took place in CT. did we expect PETA to admit that, hey, maybe animals are below ethical treatment because ultimately, they cannot be controlled? of course not. (never mind that dogs are pack animals and are more easily domesticated if isolated). instead, they took the tact that the owner of the chimp was inhumane for domesticating him. are you flippin serious!!?!!?

  140. hanjna says: Mar 29, 2009 8:54 PM

    re: post at 5:31pm by pats suck
    you shouldnt assume that people cant see the difference. maybe they are arguing that despite the presence of intent or not, those who put themselves in a position in which their judgement is impaired are still more dangerous to OTHER HUMANS, given that theyve demonstrated the ability to take lives, intentional or not, than someone who endangers the lives of DOGS, intentionally or not
    maybe some dont see dogs as living beings ON PAR with humans or anyhwere close

  141. Chadowe says: Mar 29, 2009 8:55 PM

    I’m so sick of all the retards that put ANIMALS over HUMANS. To me, HUMAN welfare is so far above that of ANIMALS, that they don’t even deserve to be in the same conversation. If you feel so strongly that Vick hasn’t payed his price to society, then you should vent your ire at those in the system that didn’t make him pay enough. Frankly, the price Vick has payed for his stupidity was so high, that everything else is simply pandering to PETA and other mental midgets whoes sense of priority and importance is ridiculously skewed.

  142. AceNubian says: Mar 30, 2009 12:02 AM

    Mike:
    There is over the top, and then there is OVER the top. Had you cut your post off half way through, it simply would have been a misguided attempt to make a point, which was a good one by the way. Using the word “mistake” to describe Vick’s actions is a gross simplification of what he did. Unfortunately, you do the exact same thing that you are criticizing when you use the term “abomination” to describe Vick’s actions. In both cases, a term is used in a very general sense. Nevertheless, I understood your point.
    Where your post goes from mildly uncomfortable to unabashedly disturbing is when you claim that Vick’s actions were worse than Little’s and (possibly) Stallworth’s. Perhaps you simply used a poor choice of words to make a larger point about an individual’s intent. If this is the case, so be it. But, even so, never did I think I would see you make an argument that the intentional killing of a dog is worse the unintentional killing of a person.
    Please step back for a moment, and try to remove yourself emotionally from the Vick case. It is starting to affect you in ways that are really quite frightening. You can be an advocate for dog safety – that’s great. But, you are dangerously close to becoming pathological at this point. You can care about dogs, but don’t make them out to be more than just that – dogs. And, more importantly, don’t minimize or trivialize the value of human life. Human life is, was and always will be more precious than the life of a dog.
    God bless you, Mr. Florio. May you find peace.

  143. SpartaChris says: Mar 30, 2009 10:04 AM

    >>AceNubian says:
    March 30th, 2009 at 12:02 am
    Mike:
    /snip
    >>Where your post goes from mildly uncomfortable to unabashedly disturbing is when you claim that Vick’s actions were worse than Little’s and (possibly) Stallworth’s. Perhaps you simply used a poor choice of words to make a larger point about an individual’s intent. If this is the case, so be it. But, even so, never did I think I would see you make an argument that the intentional killing of a dog is worse the unintentional killing of a person.<>Please step back for a moment, and try to remove yourself emotionally from the Vick case. It is starting to affect you in ways that are really quite frightening. You can be an advocate for dog safety – that’s great. But, you are dangerously close to becoming pathological at this point. You can care about dogs, but don’t make them out to be more than just that – dogs. And, more importantly, don’t minimize or trivialize the value of human life. Human life is, was and always will be more precious than the life of a dog.<<
    Spoken like someone who’s never had a pet he truly appreciated. Maybe you should get one sometime. You might understand the outrage people are showing over guys like Vick.
    While I would kill an animal to save a human, I too would kill a human to save an animal. Vick should rot in hell.

  144. AceNubian says: Mar 30, 2009 11:11 AM

    SpartaChris:
    I respect your passion and your thoughts, but I would argue that it is the fact that I have never owned a pet that allows me to give an unbiased opinion. This lack of bias allows me not to make statements such as “While I would kill an animal to save a human, I too would kill a human to save an animal.”
    Perhaps you were simply trying to emphasize a point, or perhaps you are very emotional over this case. But, think about what you just wrote. I mean, really think about it. Take Michael Vick and your feelings toward him out of the equation. Doesn’t it seem, at least, a little extreme that you will kill a human to save an animal?
    It’s a very interesting (to say the least) commentary on how greatly you value the lives of animals, or devalue the lives of humans. Not sure if you were using animal in the general sense (to include insects, reptiles, fish and the like) or in the specific sense (dogs, horses and other animals that are pets). But, in either case, I respectfully disagree with your opinion that it is OK to kill a human to save an animal.
    Please note, unlike many others on these boards who use derogatory terms when disagreeing with another poster, I have not done so and have tried to articulate my position without using personal attacks.
    Take care.

  145. SpartaChris says: Mar 30, 2009 12:16 PM

    Eh, I’m a bastard, what can I say. Depending on the circumstances, I would absolutely take out another human to save an animal. Maybe killing them is a bit harsh, but if some guy is throwing his dog around the yard like a rag doll or kicking and punching it over and over again, I would most definitely step in. To me it’s the same as if they were beating a defenseless child, and there’s no excuse for it.
    As far as devaluing the lives of humans, I wouldn’t say that’s completely true. I don’t believe animals are far more important than humans, but I’ll take animals over certain types of humans any day. For example, I just heard a local story about some teen age tagger who was tagging the center divide on the freeway and got hit and killed by a driver. My first reaction was to laugh and say “GOOD, the bastard deserved it!” And it’s true. The bastard totally deserved it. I only wish that happened to more taggers and their ilk, but I digress…
    I think it’s because you have never owned a pet that you can’t make an unbiased decision. Without sounding like some kind of pro peta, animal above human at all times whackjob, let me explain- When you have a pet, your pet becomes a family member. They bring joy, laughter and many wonderful memories. They love unconditionally and forgive you for everything. It’s like having a kid in the house. Yes, it’s humanizing them a bit, but until you’ve experienced the pleasure that having a pet can bring, you’ll never understand why folks like me are outraged over Mike Vick.

  146. hanjna says: Mar 30, 2009 12:26 PM

    “While I would kill an animal to save a human, I too would kill a human to save an animal.”
    leader in the clubhouse for dumbest paradigm ever

  147. milburg2 says: Mar 30, 2009 12:48 PM

    Lets be honest for a moment. All of this criticism on Vick is subjective. If we are comparing intent lets look at LJ who beats women and still plays in the NFL. Pac Man has been involved in multiple violet altercations that has ruined lives has been allowed to play yet Vick is crucified. This is a situation is subjective and political. The NFL is about money and they have been getting pressure from animal rights organizations to be done with Vick. Vick is bad for the NFL brand because people don’t like him and that could cause possible boycotts/ loss in future revenue. He is too risky.
    This would not be as big of an issue if not for the interest groups. I even go as far to say if it were cock fighting people wouldn’t care. We eat chicken so their treatment isn’t as important. The chickens that you eat are treated horrible. They are kept in horrific conditions and bred to die. The circus whips and keeps animals in cages for our entertainment. Think about that for a moment. You’re on the road traveling the country with these animals and you have to train them. Not pleasant for the animal at all. It’s torture. In addition to that, there is the zoo, horse racing, dog racing, and hunting for sport that needs to be looked at. If we are condemning Vicks actions solely off of inhumanity to animals, these other industries need to be looked at as well. They in no way treat there animals humanely.
    Now with all that being said the question is should Vick be allowed to play. As a fan of the game I say YES. Convict does not equal social outcast. People who are imprisoned should not be banned from there profession. Child molesters are allowed to reenter society and that is far worse than Vicks crimes (sorry). Let the man get on with his life. Just don’t allow him around animals.
    As a business man/the NFL, I would stay as far away from Vick as possible. His name alone generates revulsion and if he is rehired there’s no upside. If anything we would lose money from sponsors and fans. Not worth the risk from the business side.

  148. jimicos says: Mar 31, 2009 5:50 PM

    Kilroy was here.

  149. KSpec says: Apr 2, 2009 7:18 PM

    In a land that claims to embrace the love,compassion,forgiveness and redemption what a shame… You won’t practice these acts that you claim to embrace as a nation on this man. We talk a good game but thats all it has ever been TALK. I don’t condone what he has done but I cannot condemn him as a person. I bet there wasn’t any teachers or coaches in high school stopped him. Why didn’t Virginia Tech stop his or any other member of the Virginia Tech football team who participated in dog fighting while and after Mr. Vicks’ career ended there. Why didn’t the Atlanta Falcons stop him while he was employed by them. Mr. Vick engaged in dog fighting as a youth and was never checked until now… Hell they didn’t care as long as the cash was rolling in. When his jerseys was selling like mad.. When the stadiums were filled nobody said a thing .. Until PETA stepped in then all hell breaks loose. Dog fighting was going on in my youth in the 70’s. Some enjoyed it. Personally I did not… I loved my pets cats, dogs, lizards, chicks whatever we could find tiny to give love to. But lets be real here why is he villified so much becuase of his celebrity or is it his skin color? Because black men have always been the boogeyman… Boxer Jack Johnson was the treated the same because he was with a person that he loved that happened to be another color and he is finally vidicated. Wow, that long for some redemption. And now the Falcons are asking for money back. The man has paid his debt. Give him a chance to redeem himself. Counselling, therapy, life teachings to help him be a productive citizen. You speak of this man as if he is Hannibal Lectur and he was a cannibal… Silence of the Lambs was such a smash that a sequel was made. When is this country gonna really practice good deed with good words. It will probably be a cold day in hell or a day of recogning…

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