Comments on: Dwayne Bowe suspended for violating steroids policy

By: gr8hucker

gr8hucker — Wed, 18 Nov 2009 11:39:51 +0000

@purple
Are you seriously comparing Joe Schmo’s recovery time to that of a world class athlete?
1. They can pay for world class surgeon’s. Yes, there’s a reason they all go to Dr. James Andrews, and it isn’t because he prescribes them steroids, it’s because he’s the best orthopedic surgeon in the country, and maybe the world.
2. They are in peak physical condition. They are stronger, ergo the healing process doesn’t take as long.
3. They rehab with world class physical therapists.
4. Rehab is almost constant because they don’t need to work 9-5. Work is getting back to peak playing condition.
Do you seriously think that Joe Schmoe’s recovery should be as quick when he doesn’t have these options?

By: SF Saints Fan

SF Saints Fan — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 17:17:25 +0000

bucc19:
“Yeah , good job NFL, lets suspend a guy from a losing team while the Vikes and Saints can continue their winning ways with their rule-breakers..just like high school…like I said following the $$$$ that’s all it’s about anymore.”
This issue is so much more complicated than your sophomoric response.
The Saints and Vikings players were “caught” taking something that was not supposed to be in the product they were taking. On top of that the NFL KNEW the product contained the banned substance (even though it was not supposed to contain it) and did not put the product on the banned substance list. In addition, Minnesota law did not allow for the Vikings players to be suspended and therefore the NFL decided to not enforce a suspension against the Saints players for the same “offense”.
Finally, “while the Vikes and Saints can continue their winning ways with their rule-breakers”, the suspension would have been for 4 games. I think most people would agree that the Saints would have won at least two of those and maybe three or four and then those players would have come back. Same goes for the Vikings. Look at the schedule they both played Detroit! So at worst the Saints would be 7-2 and the Vikings 6-3? At worst!! And probably no impact or maybe one game at most.
It’s not like it was the whole team…… Just two players each.
In the end this issue needs to be addressed and the NFL has to come up with a better system to inform players when banned substances are found to be in certain products. Better yet, the NFL should just come up with a line of their own supplements, they would make millions and players would know they were safe to take.

By: coachglove

coachglove — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:53:51 +0000

By some of the logic in this post, it would be reasonable for me to manufacture a pill with 11 sorts of different banned substances, not put any of that info on the label and players could then take it and say “well duh, I read the label and it wasn’t listed,” and be able to take all manner of illegal pills that way.
The fact is that the league makes it perfectly clear that the PLAYER, not the TEAM, not the LEAGUE, is responsible for what they put into their body. If in doubt, don’t take it. If the player isn’t 100% sure that the pill is clear of a banned substance (i.e. independently scientifically verified) then don’t take it. A player could always say “hey, my trainer recommended this pill and I want to make sure I’m in the clear before I start taking it, so can you please test the pill for banned substances before I put it in my body.”
I know that if I was risking hundreds of thousands of dollars (or more) in lost income, I would be damn sure of what was going into my body. The NFL is not the American justice system. It is a privately run enterprise and, as such, can have a presumption of guilt in these cases. If players don’t like it, then they are under no obligation to play professional football in the NFL…they can hit up the WWE or whatever. This is why diuretics are banned. Maybe a player is using them for a “legit” purpose. I’d argue that a lineman coming to camp at 400 lbs, knowing his contract has a clause requiring him to be at 330 is a fat fool and simple eating right, getting his fat ass on a treadmill, and working hard would be safer and more effective. They all know diuretics are banned, so no excuses.

By: CapsLockKey

CapsLockKey — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:50:10 +0000

“Is there a differance between a “Banned Substances Policy” and a “Steroids Policy”? Ray Edwards/Vikes (like Bowe) was suspended for steroids”
Bowe wasn’t suspended for roids. It was a diuretic, just like the Williams boys. Florio is the only dumbass in the media putting “Steroids Policy” in the headline.

By: dcfan-1212450

dcfan-1212450 — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:49:35 +0000

And i thought grabbing Chris Chambers off waiver wires even as i had Dwayne Bowe on my roster seemed silly. Guess not…

By: Eustus

Eustus — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:49:09 +0000

The league’s position on Star Caps and every other diuretic – the player is responsible for ingesting the product. Even if they label doesn’t include all of the ingredients, tough titty, you took it.
And that’s what makes the NFL steroid policy unfair.
A guy can be labelled a steroid cheat for taking a weight pill that contains a diuretic in it that he didn’t know was in there.
As leem so astutely pointed out – the way players can solve this problem is by not showing up for camp overweight.

By: Raiders4TL

Raiders4TL — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:47:41 +0000

The raiders should get a win for last week then. Bowe is a cheater!!!

By: leem

leem — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:29:52 +0000

Chin
Caps had ingredients in it that wereNOT on the label. The NFL knew it but they made a cognitive decision to NOT INFORM the players.
dont take my stance as pro roid because im not.
I just dont think you can say everyone taking a diuretic is taking roids and thats what you said it
is “reasonable to assume”
its really sorta stupid to assume that someone taking a diuretic is taking a roid.
you would be wrong an awful lot.
good luck with that Big ole infected place on your chin. A steroidal cream would help it heal faster

By: Bzilla

Bzilla — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:12:16 +0000

Is there a differance between a “Banned Substances Policy” and a “Steroids Policy”? Ray Edwards/Vikes (like Bowe) was suspended for steroids – the other Vikes “The Williams Brothers” completely different issue! NOT STEROIDS! Why can’t people understand this? What they took was barely worse than ephedra – or something like that! Why do so many fail to understand this fundamental differance? Does it help them achieve some type of silly (only my opponents are cheats) cynicism? Bumetadine is a weight loss diuretic (some also say a masking agent) – most agree they were simply cutting off-season weight. Do they only announce the violating substance if it’s not a steroid??

By: Occam

Occam — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 16:05:12 +0000

“I’m tired of hearing “I’m sorry. I didn’t know it was in there.” ”
Sounds like a personal problem.

By: steelersmichele

steelersmichele — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:50:03 +0000

I’m tired of hearing “I’m sorry. I didn’t know it was in there.”
I’m sorry, but don’t put just anything in your body. You get paid millions of dollars–pay attention. Read. The NFL has a list of banned substances. Before taking anything, ask the NFL. I’m sure they wouldn’t mind.
If players are tired of people thinking they’re dumb and stupid, then they should quit acting that way. Because as fans, we’re not dumb and stupid to think they weren’t doing something illegal.

By: Satanic Hell Creature

Satanic Hell Creature — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:45:01 +0000

They were taking Star Caps ( a Hollywood type OTC weight loss pill that you could buy just about anywhere fat people shop ). Star Caps had a substance called Bumetanide in it that is a diuretic. Bumetanide was not listed as one of its ingredients, but was listed on the NFL’s banned substance list. The NFL admitted they knew Bumetanide was in Star Caps but did not tell its players for over a year. This is not saying that the players didn’t know it was in the pills, but the NFL knew it was there and didn’t tell its players, then a year later tries to suspend those players for testing positive. Not real up front by the league I’d say. They could have avoided this entire mess by telling the teams and players what was in the pills.
Also, if the league really cared about keeping it’s players clean, it would do a league wide test monthly. Not just a few players randomly and those on the abuse policy list. They can’t do a sweeping test because they know it would deplete all the rosters to a point nobody would be able to field a team. For those of you that believe there isn’t a performance enhancing drug problem with most of the NFL (all the other major pro leagues also), you’re sadly mistaken. They just want to “bust” a few players a year, it saves face, they can say they’re trying to keep it clean.

By: Bill Cowher's Chin

Bill Cowher's Chin — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:23:04 +0000

“If the ingredient is not listed nor previously known to be in a product, can you explain how anyone would know it is in there to begin with?”
Leem, the NFL knew that it was in there…….. how did they know, if no one else in this entire world knew about it????

By: birdmancometh

birdmancometh — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:22:05 +0000

Thank you Cowhers chin, plus, we don’t even know what Bowe (or Hanson) actually took since they don’t disclose this. I love how you guys (mixman, twiz) assume it’s steriods with them, but are quick to point out that it’s not in the star caps case.

By: Bill Cowher's Chin

Bill Cowher's Chin — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:17:13 +0000

This may be a stretch for some of you, but anybody taking steroids, is going to take a masking agent, right????
So it is reasonable for the NFL to suspend people who test positive for steroids, as well as those that test positive for masking agents.
Do I think Williams’ fat ass was taking steroids, no, I dont think he was. But if you let Williams take a masking agent, because he is fat, every other fat guy is going to start taking steroids, and masking agents, and then the excuse will be weightloss.
Then people like Ray Lewis will be taking steroids and masking agents, for weightloss………..

By: ch19079

ch19079 — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:11:44 +0000

Diuretics are illegal because they mask the use of illegal sterioids. The NFL knows this. The NFL Players Know This. Everyone Knows This.
If you think that a player knowingly used a banned substance, which would result in a suspention, embarassment, and devestating to their reputation (as everyone would assume they are taking steroids), to simply lose a few pounds, you are either delusional or intentionally closing your eyes to the truth.
One of their best, if not the best, player on thier team is suspended for sterioids…. It sucks for Chiefs fans. However, if he comes back and plays well, all will be forgotten, just look at Marriman.

By: buzzbissinger

buzzbissinger — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 15:07:13 +0000

Using a diuretic is exactly the same thing in my book, because that’s what guys do when they’re on steroids!! That’s how they get away with it, that’s why they test for it! See?

By: CapsLockKey

CapsLockKey — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:48:42 +0000

How about changing the headline to “banned substance policy” instead of jumping to conclusions there Florio. Schefter saying it was a diuretic. Not exactly the same thing as steroids.

By: leem

leem — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:44:59 +0000

BillCowhersChin
These so called ‘masking agents’ are the same thing used for WEIGHTLOSS, hard to draw a straight line there and say its ‘reasonable to think’
so you are saying that fatass Pat Williams was on roids and not trying to shed pounds to make weight and get the BONUS check??
you might want to rethink that uhh “reasonable to think” position dude.
Some ARE masking roids
some are substantially overweight from the offseason and are doing ALL they can, including taking Diuretics to lose waterweight.
Just thinking outloud here boys and girls
You bump your head when scraping your chin dude?? i hear there are some outstanding concussion specialists in Pittsburgh, ironically.

By: Twiz

Twiz — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:39:59 +0000

# Bill Cowher’s Chin says: November 17, 2009 2:25 PM
Twiz says: November 17, 2009 2:09 PM
@bucc19
Thanks for showing your extensive football knowledge dumbass!
The attempt to suspend Saints and Vikings players was NOT due to ‘roid use, but for taking a substance that can mask the use of ‘roids.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hahahahahahahahahaha, are you serious? I agree with your point, but only part of it. Since they have never failed a test for steroids.
Look at it this way. If, a player is taking a substance, known for masking steroid use, it is reasonable to think, that the player is taking steroids, and using the masking agent, to mask the steroids…….
I could care less, but common sense says that players arent taking a masking agent because it makes them feel good about themselves…….
___________________________
If the ingredient is not listed nor previously known to be in a product, can you explain how anyone would know it is in there to begin with?

By: leem

leem — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:26:55 +0000

per adam on espn
diuretic taken during training camp to lose weight.
sounds like his ass shoulda been more concerned about his weight while eating cheetos and drinking light beer on the couch all off season.

By: Bill Cowher's Chin

Bill Cowher's Chin — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:25:21 +0000

Twiz says: November 17, 2009 2:09 PM
@bucc19
Thanks for showing your extensive football knowledge dumbass!
The attempt to suspend Saints and Vikings players was NOT due to ‘roid use, but for taking a substance that can mask the use of ‘roids.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hahahahahahahahahaha, are you serious? I agree with your point, but only part of it. Since they have never failed a test for steroids.
Look at it this way. If, a player is taking a substance, known for masking steroid use, it is reasonable to think, that the player is taking steroids, and using the masking agent, to mask the steroids…….
I could care less, but common sense says that players arent taking a masking agent because it makes them feel good about themselves…….

By: Evpimp

Evpimp — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:20:56 +0000

@ Bucc19
Your and idiot!!
Second it was a Minnesota law that allowed Pat and Kevin Williams to push legal action against the NFL suspension. Witch in turn the NFL held up on the saints players also until its resolved.
Third they they didn’t use roids like Dwayne did! It was a masking substance…

By: scomibord

scomibord — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:20:27 +0000

The only reason the Saints players haven’t served their suspension yet is because the NFL could not suspend them & let the Williams still play.

By: SirSuperSouthern

SirSuperSouthern — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:19:14 +0000

Prohibiting steroids just makes the playing field uneven. What I mean is, they’re all on something – from the kickers to the refs (I’m looking at YOU, Ed Hochuli) – and banning steroids just makes everybody mask what they ARE using.
Just legalize it, have the steroids administered by team doctors, and test each player twice a week to make sure everyone is using at the same level.
Face it – its their JOB to be as big, fast, and aggressive as possible. There’s no going back to the early days of football when steroids weren’t around yet.
It just cracks me up that most people believe that only a small percentage of NFL players use steroids because “the NFL has the best testing policy in all professional sports!”. Grow up…

By: CapsLockKey

CapsLockKey — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:17:56 +0000

Probably a weight loss supplement of some sort with all that Haley weight regimen he forced on those guys in training camp. Bowe was one of the guys who showed up more overweight than expected if I remember.

By: bearsrule

bearsrule — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:15:54 +0000

Now I know why all the talking heads continually refer to Bowe as a “big, strong target.” Sounds like the target is on his backside, where the needle goes.

By: Bill Cowher's Chin

Bill Cowher's Chin — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:13:21 +0000

# purplepuzzyeatrz says: November 17, 2009 2:05 PM
Adding to my previous post…
Think about it……you Joe Shmo…break a leg….6 months in a cast…..6 months recovery….
COLLEGE AND PRO ATHLETE…..OUT 6-8 WEEKs…..
HHHHMMMMM………whats that????? are the doctors that much better???
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
What? 6 months in a cast for a broken leg? You might want to find a new Dr brother…..
As far as the athletes recovering faster, when you break a leg, you let the leg heal. When they break a leg, the Dr goes in and rebuilds it with plates and rods……
Aside from that, does steroids cause players to drop passes? That might explain TO’s problems…..

By: mixman34

mixman34 — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:11:53 +0000

@ bucc19
You doooooooo realize that the NFL is pushing hard against those players but the state Courts overturned it right?! RIGHT!? Dumb@$$

By: Bird Man

Bird Man — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 14:10:19 +0000

So you have no idea what he tested positive for (or merely possessed) but you run a headline announcing that he violated the “steroids policy?” It was probably just some diuretic and now you’ve made it sound like he’s juicing.