It was announced Wednesday that former Packers tight end Marv Fleming and former offensive lineman Greg Koch will be inducted to the Packers Hall of Fame.
But they wouldn’t be worthy of a post on their own. (Sorry Marv, Greg.)
Mark Chmura will be the third former Packer player inducted next July, and his inclusion could stir some debate because of the sexual assault trial towards the end of his career.
Frankly, we’re not sure if Chmura’s inclusion in the Hall is controversial or not. Chmura is a local radio host and remains a highly visible former player. (His recent comments about Brett Favre make us wonder if Favre will show up to the ceremony.) The Packers Hall of Fame isn’t even officially associated with the team.
But the beginning of the Associated Press’ writeup about Chmura’s induction is a reminder that he’ll never fully escape the memory of the trial: “Despite a career that was tarnished by scandal, tight end Mark Chmura will be inducted . . .”
So, what say you Packer Nation: Does Chmura belong?
Not only does this guy mess around with a 17 year old at a post proom party he does so after refusing to meet President Clinton over the Monica Lewinsky scandal. And now he is in the Packer Hall of Fame. Ya, one of their finest.
He was productive, but not Hall of Fame material. I’m sure his EX-best pal Favre would agree.
Tight end Mark Chmura was more specific. “[I]t all starts with Brett — Brett’s not as good as he was. . . . They have Adrian Peterson, but I think Chester Taylor is a guy. . . . Our quarterback was 10 times better, our receivers were better, our special teams were much better.”
Sure Favre won’t show up. Chmura proves he is a dumbass by those statements. 10x better lol He talks with the sense of a 17year old girl oops!
http://www.scgffl.com/fie/fie_2000_May_11_Chmura.htm
I spent my whole life playing by the rules. I guess I should have been out there breaking the law.
is there going to be a picture of that young girl he f*cked hanging up next to his picture? that girl was smokin, but mark, that wasnt right. she was YOUNG
Based on his play, he does belong. But he has to give up his grudge against Favre because he didn’t support him after he rapped that little girl.
HUH???
sure he belongs….as soon as I show my teenage daughter how to reload.
Average TE whose stats were inflated due to Favre.
I know the Packers had about a 25 year stretch (early ’70s to mid ’90s) where they weren’t very good or had many great players, but the franchise has too much history to fill its HOF with marginal players.
It’s not like they are the Jaguars or Seahawks.
In 7 seasons he had 188 catches for 2253 yards and 17 TDs. I don’t think the sexual assualt trial should matter but I don’t think he belongs anyway based on these stats. His best season was in ’95 when he had 54 catches for 679 yards and 7 TDs. No, he does not belong.
17 will get you HOF
The same people who bitch about Chmura want Pete Rose in the baseball hall of fame. They use the argument that the hall is for what a player does ON the field, Not off. The same should go for Chmura, For what he did ON the field, Not who he did OFF the field.
I think some of the people posting comments missed the “PACKER” title in front of the hall of fame. They put a handful of people in there every year, and remember, it was a long, long, LONG time between the Lombardi era and the Holmgren era. The criteria isn’t as high as you might think. If you were a recognizable name from those super bowl teams, you’ll get the call eventually.
Wow!!!!
I just looked up his stats after I called him average or medicore (can’t remember, my first post isn’t up yet) based on my memory. I guess that was a compliment.
The guy only scored TDs in 3 of his seven seasons (only 17 career TDs). His “career year” was 54 catches for 679 yards and 7 TDs. For his career he averaged 2.1 catches and 25 yards a game. There areback up TEs with more impressive stats than that. And that was with Favre getting him the ball. He probably would have been worse with another QB.
Add a sex scandal on top of a pedestrian career and he should have to pay full admission to visit the Packers HOF, not be inducted into it.
Wonder if he celebrates with a hot tub party ? Ooops sorry Chewey.
Remember when Chmura went to the prom and was in a hot tub with a high school girl? Ahhh … memories. How many 1-yard touchdowns did this guy catch from Favre? And is Bubba Franks heading into the HOF next?
He’ll be a welcomed addition to the Pervert Hall of Fame, but the Packers… not so much.
Can’t wait to see Chris Hansen ambush him at the podium.
“I’m going to need you to take a seat over there…”
Who’s next….Robert Ferguson?
Did I hear that right? They’re putting a hot tub in the Packer Hall of Fame?? The Chewey Tub!!!
In all honesty, based on his football experience alone I think he is deserving for the Packer Hall…during his time he was a top tier TE in the league and was productive for a number of years.
Now why would you say that the Packer Hall of Fame is not affiliated with the team, there is a link from the official website to it and its in Lambeau. That notwithstanding, they all three deserve it
How embarrassing. Shame on the Packers.
Just because he liked to bang 17 year olds doesn’t make him a bad player!
At least she was pretty hot though wasn’t she? lol!
Wonder if Jimmy Gantner and his daughter will be invited. Hah
Pardon me, but, um, wasn’t Mark Chmura found NOT GUILTY? You know, if Ray-Ray can still be treated like Jesus in cleats, then Chmura is definitely not disqualified from being in the Packers Hall Of Fame.
Most of you need to do a little research. The “little girl” he “raped” made a fool of herself in court and he was acquitted on all charges because she was almost certainly lying.
Still, I’m not much of a fan, especially later in his career when he spent most of his time blocking. Not PHOF-worthy.
You guys make having teenage girls in your hot tub seem like some kind of bad thing.
Oh, and 17 isn’t a *child*, regardless of what this country’s hilariously backward Victorian Age puritanism would have you believe.
Those are some pretty low standards for the Packers HOF. It’s a disgrace and dilutes the honor of membership for those that are in and really meant something to the team and the community.
Chumra was the guy who stood up for farve when he was addicted to vicodin and beating his baby momma and the packers wanted to get rid of him. Farve was the guy who never returned his phone call when he was caught being an ass. This was the proof of what a douche bag farve was/is.
His on-field accomplishments aren’t enough to get him into the Packer HOF. But his off-field scandals should be enough to get him into the Vikings HOF.
“I know the Packers had about a 25 year stretch (early ’70s to mid ’90s) where they weren’t very good or had many great players, but the franchise has too much history to fill its HOF with marginal players.”
Apparently not. Lynn Dickey, Don Majkowski, and Gilbert Brown are already in.
I didn’t know they had a hot-tub wing in the Packers HOF…
Tailgun says:
November 25, 2009 8:00 PM
Oh, and 17 isn’t a *child*, regardless of what this country’s hilariously backward Victorian Age puritanism would have you believe.
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Stay away from my daughter or I’ll kick your ass douche!
Mark Chumura was innocent of all charges. Anyone who watched the trial learned that the minor in question when examined still had her hymen intact.
The defense attorney had a full scale model of the bathroom built inside the courtroom to show that the allegations were impossible and therefore fabrications.
It was all on Court TV for all to see!
Mark Chumura has always been an innocent man and a great football player who’s career was cut short due to a neck injury.
There was no scandal except for a District Attorney who failed to fully investigate the matter.
Many of those commenting here are ignorant of the facts and perpetuate the false accusations slandering the man.
Anyone can look up the facts. It was a very public trial.
Dear Mr. Chmura,
Hopefully you have decieded to help your franchise in regards to the issue we are having with Brett. He doesn’t seem willing to give up the sport that he loves, so we are asking that you “speak your mind” in regards to his activities as well as comment on his comparison of this vikings team to our team in 1996. If you can help our team (and my job security) in this sense, we will consider overlooking your past which includes lackluster stats, and sexual misconduct with a 17 yr old.
Sincerely,
T. Thompson
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Where are the packer faithful in regards to this scum bag? You love to run your mouths about the love boat, but those girls where at least of age….. and consentual. thank god the season ticket holders where able to get him off the hook (wait, i mean a jury of his peers)
way to stay classy GB, let a rapist go because he was a packer, sounds decent to me….
you’re disgusting GB.
If he found a decent looking girl anywhere in Wisconsin, young or old, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.
Bob Nelson says:Mark Chumura was innocent of all charges. Anyone who watched the trial learned that the minor in question when examined still had her hymen intact.
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A 2004 study published in the Archives of Pediatric Adolescent Medicine reported “Subjects who admitted having past intercourse still had non disrupted, intact hymens in 52% of cases.”
Once again I have busted your hymen Bob. The trial was a joke. As is Chewy
Bob you just show your ability to blindly lie to cover for your sorry ass Packers. What a horrible organization that has fans like Boob that try to cover up for his team. Bob, you should be ashamed of yourself for condoning statutory rape. You really are a disgusting person. You will probably rot in hell.
I have the most important question of all:
Who gives a hobo’s shit who the alcoholic inbreds in that diseased state put in their Hall of Fame?
What was he charged with–having sex with a 17 year old. The shocking part is that she wasn’t his sister(or brother).
And somebody please squeeze a vowel in that f-uped name..No, I won’t say it or even type it. It’s a green bay name and belongs in the same bag I walk my dog with.
Go….Vikes!
Bob Nelson says:
November 25, 2009 8:25 PM
“Anyone can look up the facts.”
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Take your own advice, Bob, next time you post about “stolen cars” and the Vikings. Or, for that matter, any time you post about the Vikings.
Truth is – Chmura was average at best. “Anyone can look up the facts (stats.)”
Typical Packer. Rapes a kid in a hot tub and the Packer organization covers it up. Great!
@Kenneth … Are you trying to say you think Mark Chmura’s NFL stats are equal to Pete Rose’s baseball stats? You’ve got to be kidding!
@T., Bob Nelson, and Tailgun … Chmura was acquitted of the rape charge, and the evidence indicates that was a just verdict. But he was a married father in his 30s partying and drinking with a group of minors. Yeah, Bob, saw it all on Court TV and it WAS scandalous and pretty disgusting. If 17-year-old girls aren’t as innocent as they used to be, Tailgun, you can in part thank leches like Chmura.
Guilty of rape? No. Guilty of horrible judgment, putting himself in a shameful situation with a bunch of KIDS, and being an all-around sleeze–not to mention a world-class hypocrite because of the Clinton situation? Oh yeah! Does he have the on-field stats to be in any kind of HoF? No.
he belongs in the Hypocrite HOF, but at least Clinton wasn’t caught w/a 17 y/old, this is supposed to be one of the NFLs most storied franchises, VINCE LOMBARDI would be so proud…NOT!!!
“Regardless of the verdict, he must live with the fact that one night last spring he got drunk and hung out in his underwear with teenage girls in a hot tub at 3:30 a.m. “If you can go to jail for being stupid, I belong in jail,” he says.”
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1021743/index.htm
Funny story here: So when I was about 11/12 years old, my parents put an offer in on a house, the realtor called about 45 later telling my parents that Ross Verba had just offered the full asking price in cash to the owners. Later we came to find out that Mark Chmura lived on one side of the house and Frank Winters lived on the other side.
Any time you could have a guy who drank an occasional beer on the sidelines living on one side of you and a guy that was messing around in hot tubs with girls half his age, you have to wonder how long it would have taken me to not only meet tons of 17 year olds as a 12 year old, but also to be drinking heavily during my early middle school years. Damn I missed out!
Bob Nelson says: “Mark Chumura was innocent of all charges. Anyone who watched the trial learned that the minor in question when examined still had her hymen intact.”
Well, OJ was found innocent. That doesn’t mean he was. (BTW — nice job of Chumura hiring Jeffrey Dahmer’s sleazebag lawyer to beat the rap).
Without getting too graphic, sexual assault does not necessarily mean an all-out rape. The victim and witnesses said Chumura was quickly interrupted. Does that make him innocent if he was caught and stopped within seconds of starting the assault, as if nothing happened?
And Chumra did admit that he showed bad judgement with his behavior. So it’s not like he denied anything happened. He just denies that he did enough to serve time in prison (thanks to the girl’s friends who were looking after her safety).
bob nelson is absoulutly correct he may have used bad judgement but he was found not guilty.i watched the trial as soon as the “victim” testafied i knew she was lying and he was innocent.as for being in the PHOF thats there call.
Somewhere, Bart Starr just puked a little bit.
I don’t agree w/what he did….but find it hilarious that all of you 40-50 year old pervs condemn him.
Each one of you would do the same…if you could.
Roman Polanski is not impressed. He won awards.
Bill Shroeder, you’re next in the HOF.
I’m not good at math, but how many times does 89 go into 17?
Let’s ask Mark Chmura!
(D’oh!….Had to say it!)
He was acquitted. Not guilty! How quickly so many seem to forget. He should never have been charged, but the prosecutor wanted to make a name for himself. I am not sure he belongs in the halls of Packer greats, but he should not be condemned for a crime that never happened.
Will there be a hot tub full of young teenage girls rolled into the stadium for the festivities???
“Mark Chumura was innocent of all charges. Anyone who watched the trial learned that the minor in question when examined still had her hymen intact.”
Ol’ Chewy had whiskey dick. I hear they’re gonna induct Jamal Reynolds next year.
way to hire jeffrey dahmers lawyer to keep you out of jail. or was it ed geen’s lawyer?
Why are Viking fans littering this story? and plus, do the Vikings even have a Hall of Fame? Oh right they won’t have enough players to induct.
Lifetime stats of 188 catches for 2253 yards and 17 TDs. Geez, Tony Gonzalez gets that in 2 years.
I happened to be in the car yesterday listening to this incredibly lame local sports radio show out of Milwaukee called “Homer” (perhaps the lowest rated sports talk show in the world with his 0.1 rating) and he had this smug A-Hole Chmura on talking about it on Tuesday night. Talking about how it was long overdue, and that he felt he “belonged” especially since in recent years some of his teammates that he deemed “lesser” players had gotten in the Packers Hall of Fame before him. And you should have heard the host and another goof – the since fired from the Wisconsin State Urinal Jason Wilde (whom NO ONE misses one bit, by the way) just gush over this clown like a couple of teenage schoolgirls – just because Chmura himself has a radio show in Milwaukee on Sundays.
This clown is a total douchebag, and STILL doesn’t “get it”. Anyone else (other than perhaps O.J.) and they’d still be in jail. Whether he raped her, fingered her, or whatever, he CLEARLY did something wrong with this girl. Quite frankly I’m surprised the girls father did go all postal on ole “Chewie” ! As a lifelong Packers fan it is embarrassing to see this dope honored in any way.
An average AT BEST player, and a total prick as a human being. Hey Chewie, why don’t you just crawl back under the rock from which you crawled out of, and thanks your lucky stars your a$$ isn’t in jail !
I may not hit the bottom but I can sure bang the shit out of the sides.
M. Chamura
Ring of scum is what GB should call it.
# johnko says: November 25, 2009 6:46 PM
Not only does this guy mess around with a 17 year old at a post proom party he does so after refusing to meet President Clinton over the Monica Lewinsky scandal. And now he is in the Packer Hall of Fame. Ya, one of their finest.
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Refusing to meet with Slick Williw is the only worthwhile thing a piece of trash like Chmura has ever done. Typical Packer.
No.
“Typical Packer.”
and like Viking players are perfect citizens in Minnesota. Psh they probably get in trouble more then Packer players do. Tell me the last time a Packer has been suspended compared to a Viking.
I don’t think the Pro Football Hall Of Fame takes character into consideration, so it shouldn’t be surprising if individual teams don’t either.
Thats not the reason Chmura shouldn’t be in the GB HOF anyways. Despite a dry spell, the Packers have a rich tradition with many great players. Why cheapen their accomplishments by inducting mediocre players, just because the team had a period where it didn’t have a lot of great talent? The Vikings V Shiancoe is just 700 yards behind Chmura and has one more TD, and he isn’t getting into the Vikings HOF anytime soon.
Gae4Brett says:
November 25, 2009 8:13 PM
But his off-field scandals should be enough to get him into the Vikings HOF.
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Actually, he fits in quite well with Green Bay’s long laundry list of players with questionable character.
packers4life says:
November 25, 2009 11:05 PM
do the Vikings even have a Hall of Fame? Oh right they won’t have enough players to induct
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Despite not winning a Super Bowl, the Vikings have had their fare share of success along with many great players. Bold of you to put your ignorance on full display.
Of course he shouldn’t be admitted just as no honors should ever go to Ray Lewis either.
insert obligitory, “Florio, your only doing this for web hits post” here.
Does Chmura belong? Ask O.J.
I really enjoy reading trashtalk from Vi-kinks fans who have a shorter memory, apparently, than a housefly.
Regarding Chmura: the media, of course, ignored the behavior of his good pal Brent Gump, er, Brett Favor. I will leave it at that.
Leave it to the Packers to induct a child molester in their hall of fame. Besides, he was average at best. If it wasn’t for Brett Favre, you wouldn’t even know who this clown is. Green Bay is a terrible city, with a terrible team, a terrible coach and a terrible GM.
Deb says:
Chmura was acquitted of the rape charge, and the evidence indicates that was a just verdict. But he was a married father in his 30s partying and drinking with a group of minors. Yeah, Bob, saw it all on Court TV and it WAS scandalous and pretty disgusting. If 17-year-old girls aren’t as innocent as they used to be, Tailgun, you can in part thank leches like Chmura.
Guilty of rape? No. Guilty of horrible judgment, putting himself in a shameful situation with a bunch of KIDS, and being an all-around sleeze–not to mention a world-class hypocrite because of the Clinton situation? Oh yeah! Does he have the on-field stats to be in any kind of HoF? No.
____________________________________
Those are my thoughts exactly. The Packers must be real hard up to find players to induct if they think this clown’s stats are even worth mentioning ten years later. That problem will only intensify with all the “talent” Ted has stocked our current roster with.
Since I don’t feel off-field controversy should have any bearing on awards (See also Lewis, Ray), I’ll address that one separately:
Viking fans-If you want to call out a Packers turd, and there are certainly several in our history, at least take the time to find one that wasn’t acquitted of all charges. Chmura isn’t a rapist, he’s just one of the biggest idiots to ever wear the green and gold.
Leave it to the Biqueen fans to post the ignorant posts so let’s try to clear up a few facts.
First, Chmura does not belong just based on his stats, that much we can agree on.
Second, Chmura played his last down for the Packers and then came the hot tub incident. His neck injury might be cited as the reason for his retirement so the Packers never really had to deal with the hot tub incident.
Third, like or not, he went to trial and the outcome was not guilty. No one is trying to say he is a choir boy but the evidence wasn’t there to convict him.
Lastly, to compare this to the Loveboat shows a level of stupidity that surprises even me and I didn’t think that is possible when the subject is Biqueen fan ignorance. To state the obvious, Chmura is one ex-player compared to multiple active Vikings on the Loveboat, Chmura’s incident was with one girl and the Loveboat employed multiple hookers and lastly, the Loveboat involve felony crimes (flying hookers over state lines) that warranted national press vs. a blurb in the local newspapers.
Is it any wonder that the Biqueen fans are ridiculed as dumbasses?
I don’t know. I think Chmura was cool.Along with Jolly and Najeh, some of the Packers finest. They all could hang in the hot tub downing codeine syrup with young girls. Too much codeine may give you the shits though,so a couple of hampers nearby would be helpful.
He was an integral part of great team regardless of what he decided to do with his personal life and how narrow minded he is in politics. His play warrants that he be included in the Hall of Fame. He is probably someone that I would choose not to go out to dinner with or discuss politics, but he was integral part of the Packers Super Bowl teams of the 90′s.
JimmySmith – Dude,you are so lame. The Loveboat was a great show of team unity and supporting interstate commerce. I for one, think it is a sad world when grown ass men and women can’t get their freaky on on a private boat in the middle of a lake. I’ll take some of that anyday!!
The big surprise in all this was that a girl from Wisconsin was still a virgin at the ripe old age of 17. Was the heifer also under 250 pounds? That would be an unlikely quinella.
zappa says:
November 25, 2009 9:21 PM
Typical Packer. Rapes a kid in a hot tub and the Packer organization covers it up. Great!
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They covered it up? Please explain. I was under the assumption he never played another game for the Packers.
VoxVeritas says:
November 26, 2009 11:32 AM
The big surprise in all this was that a girl from Wisconsin was still a virgin at the ripe old age of 17. Was the heifer also under 250 pounds? That would be an unlikely quinella.
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Because a Cowboys fan should really be commenting on another team’s misfits… Hmmm. Yeah, that makes perfect sense.
JimmySmith -
The Love Boat girls were “dancers” not “hookers”. They were adults – consenting adults, unlike the under age females Chmura thought it wise to be drinking with. A transgression is a transgression. Your little rant comes off as defending Chmura’s act, although I’m not sure that was your intent, but if that’s the case it speaks volumes about you.
You say Chmura played his last down for the Pack before the incident, as if he was no longer on the team, but he was still technically a Packer when it happened wasn’t he? I can’t remember but I thought the retirement came later.
Chmura – Packer HOF? Really? That SB team had far too many guys who were outstanding players and contributed much more than Chmura.
Tompadre says:
November 26, 2009 12:10 PM
JimmySmith -
The Love Boat girls were “dancers” not “hookers”. They were adults – consenting adults, unlike the under age females Chmura thought it wise to be drinking with. A transgression is a transgression. Your little rant comes off as defending Chmura’s act, although I’m not sure that was your intent, but if that’s the case it speaks volumes about you.
You say Chmura played his last down for the Pack before the incident, as if he was no longer on the team, but he was still technically a Packer when it happened wasn’t he? I can’t remember but I thought the retirement came later.
Chmura – Packer HOF? Really? That SB team had far too many guys who were outstanding players and contributed much more than Chmura.
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The question is NOT whether or not he was a Packer when he got in the hot tub. No organization can control the actions of its members when they’re not at work. The question is how the organization handled it AFTER THE FACT. And he never played another down for the Packers.
As I said earlier, Chmura was a United Way posterboy. His nose was clean.
Also, sorry but you’re wrong about the “dancers” on the Love Boat. It was widely reported that they were prostitutes flown in from Georgia and Florida.
I agree on Chmura’s inclusion in the Packer HOF, though. He was a good player on a championship team. Nothing more. I don’t know why they decided to induct him.
Anyway, comparing Chmura to McKinnie or any of the other guys giving/receiving some kind of sex from prostitutes on the Love Boat cruise is just plain funny. Chmura never suited up for the Packers again. McKinnie plays every game. I don’t think he (or anyone involved) was even suspended for a game. Were they?