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Replay review wasn't available for facemask, roughing non-call

The failure of the officials to spot the facemask and/or roughing the passer penalties during the final play of Sunday’s Packers-Cardinals game directly resulted in Arizona’s 51-45 overtime win. 

And before we go any farther in this regard, let’s be clear.  Rule 12, Section 2, Article 5 states that “[n]o player shall twist, turn, or pull the facemask of an opponent in any direction.” 

So Michael Adams’ hit on Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers should have drawn a flag. 

Also, Rule 12, Section 2, Article 13(3) plainly states that defenders may not “hit the passer, or use hands, arms, or other parts of the body to hit the passer in the head, neck, or face.”

So Adams committed not one but two penalties on the play — and the officials missed not one but both of them.

And here’s our biggest concern.  But rule, replay can’t be used to determine that a facemask or a roughing the passer penalty occurred.

It’s not available because it’s not on the list of specific uses for instant replay.

But maybe it should be.  We believe that the league should embrace replay technology for all purposes, especially in those cases where no judgment or discretion by the officials is involved.

Recently, the league decided to add clock errors to the list of reviewable plays, taking the unusual step of instituting the change during the season, so that a clock error won’t affect the outcome a playoff game.

As we saw on Sunday night, many other errors can affect the outcome of a playoff game.  And we think the league should strive to ensure that none do.
 

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95 Responses to “Replay review wasn't available for facemask, roughing non-call”
  1. mixman34 says: Jan 11, 2010 10:00 AM

    Blah Blah blah… they gave up 51 points in a playoff game… 51!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It’s football. Some calls get made some don’t. Blame the refs all you want losers. If you want to win a playoff game… try not allowing the opposition to score 51 points. Duh.

  2. jamaltimore says: Jan 11, 2010 10:00 AM

    Please. The ball was out before any of the other stuff occurred. The hands to the face rule is obvioiusly only called on the Ravens!

  3. litemater says: Jan 11, 2010 10:00 AM

    And every holding call, pass interference, illegal contact, tripping, block in the back on returns. ETC!
    WINE & Cheese reception @ PFT!

  4. Vladimir says: Jan 11, 2010 10:01 AM

    Hey Florio, instead of crying over 1 missed call in a desperate attempt to make the Pukers look better than they are, why don’t you write an article on how that GREAT DOM CAPERS DEFENSE gave up 45 points before OT even began?

  5. mixman34 says: Jan 11, 2010 10:01 AM

    BTW that “psycho defense” was a busted version of prevent, it was terrible and laughable to watch.

  6. snigley says: Jan 11, 2010 10:01 AM

    Could they Replay Review for the refs overthrowing Jennings in overtime?

  7. Ryan says: Jan 11, 2010 10:03 AM

    Right, so let’s go and start reviewing every potential penalty out there. Give me a break. Refs are human. They’re going to miss things, but that’s also part of the game. I think the replay rules are fine the way they are. Catches, scoring etc. No need to go and review and see if a penalty happened. What the hell???!!! You know how much crap goes on in a scrum for a loose ball???!!! If that’s the case, let’s go and start reviewing horse collar tackles to see if just in fact that’s what it was, because that first one called against Arizona was NOT a horse collar, and that helped lead to a TD for the Packers. Give me a break. People are wanting sports to become just like the government. Big brother getting involved in EVERYTHING!

  8. Shinywalrus says: Jan 11, 2010 10:05 AM

    If the goal is not to affect the outcome of a playoff game, I would think that most fans would prefer that a play that results in the end of a game not be called back because of a penalty that did not affect the play in question. That ball gets fumbled regardless of where his hand is, and it gets returned for a TD as well.
    Facemasks and other penalties of that variety are meant to be punitive, to force players to conduct themselves safely as a general matter. Saying that we should institute replay to see whether someone violated a technical rule that didn’t impact a play that ended a game, however, seems to be playing on a pretty dangerous game.
    Let’s not turn the NFL into the NBA’s, “Nothing matters until the last 5 minutes that take 2 hours because they foul them every possession.”

  9. Milhouse says: Jan 11, 2010 10:05 AM

    “The failure of the officials to spot the facemask and/or roughing the passer penalties during the final play of Sunday’s Packers-Cardinals game directly resulted in Arizona’s 51-45 overtime win.”
    Actually, Karlos Dansby crossing the goal line with the ball in his hands directly resulted in Arizona’s 51-45 overtime win.
    The failure of the officials to flag a penalty *might* have changed the outcome of the game, but it certainly did not “directly result” in anything but another missed call.

  10. Skoal Brother says: Jan 11, 2010 10:05 AM

    Get a grip. Maybe in 2010-11 the officials should look at each play to determine holding calls. The Pack lost, move on.

  11. LBPACKFAN says: Jan 11, 2010 10:08 AM

    No blaming the refs…gotta win the game on the field. Defense couldnt stop a team with Helen Keller at QB.

  12. hckcm7315 says: Jan 11, 2010 10:08 AM

    As a life long Packer fan I have to say good game Cardinals. The Cardinals were the better team yesterday.
    I’ve cooled off since last night, and I realize calls are always missed, but I do not understand why some plays can be reviewed and others cannot. What’s the point? What is stopping the NFL from allowing teams to review each play? It will not slow the game down, because teams already have a limit on how many reviews they get.

  13. paynskii says: Jan 11, 2010 10:09 AM

    There is always going to be a human element in every game. You cannot take that out. It is part of the game. Baseball, football, basketball…..they all have umpires or refs. Isn’t that why they are there? The call it the way they see it or in this case did not see it.

  14. TylerDurden says: Jan 11, 2010 10:09 AM

    Are we gonna hear about this woulda coulda shoulda for the next ten years. You guys sould like Raider fans…..sheesh

  15. Hauschild says: Jan 11, 2010 10:13 AM

    And, didn’t Warner also get slapped in the head on that TD to Fitz?
    Crying about non-calls just doesn’t look good from no matter which side you are on.

  16. No-Neck says: Jan 11, 2010 10:13 AM

    It took the all knowing Florio 15 hours to figure this out. How do you expect officials to make the snap judgement during the course of the game. Let it go. The Packers have. I’m sure there will be some new rules added to the books because of this. No matter what rules you make up, you’re never going to have a flawlessly officiated game.

  17. hckcm7315 says: Jan 11, 2010 10:13 AM

    As a lifetime Packer fan I have to say, good game Cardinals. You were the better team last night, and Warner and his crew walked up and down on the #2 rated Defense in the league (I’m thinking the Packers schedule played a big part in that ranking).
    However, I do not understand why some plays can be reviewed and others cannot. This needs to change, the game will not be slowed any more than it already is by the 90 minutes of commercials. Besides, teams already have a limit on the number of challenges. Can someone please explain the reasoning behind this?

  18. jbeeeb says: Jan 11, 2010 10:14 AM

    Actually they missed a helmet to the head a couple of plays earlier. It was the same play that they called holding on Darren Colledge. But that was just one of several calls that the officials missed….
    The blow to the head on Cullen Jenkins…Jenkins was shoved in to Warner on a play that was a hold.
    Fitzgerald pushes Woodson to the ground to get open on the touchdown pass.
    BTW – I agree a bit on the non-horse collar, but that is the way it was called all season.

  19. leatherneck says: Jan 11, 2010 10:15 AM

    This is a crock. The ball was out before Adams contacted Rodgers’s facemask. Thus, any penalty would be assessed on the kickoff. There is no kickoff because the game is over.
    The bottom line is this. If you want to win a game, take control of the game and don’t rely on the referees getting every single ticky-tack penalty called right.
    Take care of your business before you start bashing other people. The Packers themselves have not said anything about a facemask. This hullaballoo is entirely a fan/media invention.
    The Packers blew it. Now a large contingent of their fanbase is acting like spoiled brats.

  20. green&bold says: Jan 11, 2010 10:15 AM

    Would love to see penalties be under review. But more than that I’d like PI to be like college rule.

  21. Pervy*Harvin says: Jan 11, 2010 10:15 AM

    The day you take complete responsibility for yourself, the day you stop making any excuses, thats the day you start to the top.
    -O.J. Simpson

  22. Allied Biscuit says: Jan 11, 2010 10:17 AM

    how many Packer sympathy posts can you possibly do?
    if this was any other team, it would not even be whipsered.

  23. pushing50 says: Jan 11, 2010 10:20 AM

    I’m confused. Is the rule that they can’t review for a penalty non-call or does it depend on the situation. In the last Raven’s game, they reviewed if Flacco had crossed the line when he through a pass. The play was not flagged on the field. The booth decided to review it and called it a penalty. I didn’t think you could use reviews to call penalties, that you could only review a called penalty.

  24. Critias says: Jan 11, 2010 10:25 AM

    I don’t understand the author at all… how would replay have worked, exactly? Should the officials review each and every play to see if a penalty was called??? There was no argument among the officials here — in which case using replay might be beneficial (when one official doesn’t agree with a thrown flag by another official).
    It was missed call, among many missed calls (and almost as many phantom calls) made during the course of a game. The fact that this one went a long way to determining the outcome of a playoff game simply makes its magnitude larger than most, but at its heart no different than any.

  25. Pervy*Harvin says: Jan 11, 2010 10:27 AM

    As NFC North brothers…I welcome all of you to jump on the Minnesota Viking bandwagon and support your division! That is what good fans do! Good season Packers… get that d figured out and you got a team!

  26. Steel Wheels says: Jan 11, 2010 10:27 AM

    How about this line of thinking: The ball was free before the penalty(ies) occured. Therefore the QB was not a passer or QB at all but a defender just like everyone else when there is a loose ball.
    As far as the hands to the facemask, maybe the refs heard Troy Aikman complain about how bad the penalty was against Warner when he drew a 15-yard flag when he got hit in the head. He said it was a terrible call.
    I do agree with you on Joe Buck, he is a terrible announcer for football. I suppose we get him and Troy next week for the Viking game?

  27. birdmancometh says: Jan 11, 2010 10:28 AM

    Wow, Packer haters are crazy! Not a single Packer fan on here has blamed the game on that call. The facts are A) It should have been a penalty, B) The Packers shouldn’t have given up 45 points in regulation…
    Why are Cards fans trying to defend the call? You won the game. Try focusing on the fact that you get to play again next week. There is obviously a little guilt I guess…

  28. shannscott2000 says: Jan 11, 2010 10:35 AM

    If you want to watch a game that takes forever, watch baseball. I think the replay system is fine as is, for the most part.

  29. cusoman says: Jan 11, 2010 10:38 AM

    “Not a single Packer fan on here has blamed the game on that call.”
    LOL… are you sure you’re reading PFT? Look around man, in fact look at the reaction blog posts after the Cards won the game, that post is RIFE with Packer fans blaming their team’s loss on that “blown” call.

  30. slipkid says: Jan 11, 2010 10:38 AM

    refs wanted to let it go and get out.
    they do this all the time.
    call the penalty and here come the eggs and vegetables and batteries etc…
    esp if the pack had then won.

  31. clubfoot says: Jan 11, 2010 10:43 AM

    Florio you hate the Cards because a good guy named Kurt Warner plays for them. Stop all the crying. where were you last year Florio when the Cards got jobbed against the Steelers and you didn’t say a word when the Giants beat your Pats when you said that game was going to be the biggest blowout in superbowl history?

  32. Adam-Chris Scheftersen says: Jan 11, 2010 10:44 AM

    jamaltimore says:
    January 11, 2010 10:00 AM
    Please. The ball was out before any of the other stuff occurred. The hands to the face rule is obvioiusly only called on the Ravens!
    —————————–
    It’s not a question of when the ball came out. It’s a question of when the Cardinals established possession. If the penalty occurs while Rodgers has the ball or while the ball is loose, the Packers would retain possession and be awarded 15 yards.

  33. Manbearpig says: Jan 11, 2010 10:45 AM

    Said Cardinals DT Darnell Dockett, “Everybody picked us to lose, and now Aaron Rodgers can go home and practice putting his little belt on and go and shovel some snow out of his driveway.”
    LMAO!!!!!!!!
    Maybe he should practice his dropkicks too, so he can make sure they go to his teammates instead of Karlos Dansby!!!!!!

  34. Adam-Chris Scheftersen says: Jan 11, 2010 10:46 AM

    Pervy*Harvin says:
    January 11, 2010 10:27 AM
    As NFC North brothers…I welcome all of you to jump on the Minnesota Viking bandwagon and support your division! That is what good fans do! Good season Packers… get that d figured out and you got a team!
    —————————–
    Pervis, please stop cutting and pasting this bullshit into every thread. We all know you’d never root for the Packers if the situation was reversed.
    And good fans DO NOT simply switch allegiances because their team lost. If you hate the Vikings, you hate the Vikings. If you hate the Packers, you hate the Packers. You don’t just decide to root for them because your team lost. You’re not a good fan if you can’t understand that.

  35. Mr Krinkle says: Jan 11, 2010 10:48 AM

    They should just stop the game after every play to make sure no rules were broken and the ball was spotted in the exact spot it should have been.

  36. JerkStore says: Jan 11, 2010 10:48 AM

    More upset about the non call on the helmet-to-helmet hit on AR the second play of OT, (when the Packers were called for holding) because the ref had no other responsibilities on that one. But, game should have been over by that point if Rodgers would have hit Jennings on the first play.
    Amazing comeback by Rodgers and the O, very disappointing game from the D, tough way to lose.
    Congrats Cardinals and good luck!

  37. Reptar says: Jan 11, 2010 10:49 AM

    As an AFC fan invested in neither of these two teams (just hoping for a good game…got a great one), I was much more disturbed by the Larry Fitzgerald diving TD. The officials ignored *TWO* penalties on the Cardinals on that play: helmet-to-helmet when a Cardinals defender blasted Rodgers and offensive PI on Fitzgerald. These were two fairly egregious penalties and I was sure at least one would be called when I was the flag. Alas, it went against the Packers.
    Not saying officials affected the outcome of the game. There was no defense. I’m sure ‘Zona would have scored there anyway. But for any NFL crew to miss two penalties as blatant as those, on the same play nonetheless, is simply inexcusable.

  38. durno99 says: Jan 11, 2010 10:52 AM

    AP was facemasked on his fumble in OT against Chicago. That cost the Vikings the number one seed. The bottom line is to not put yourself in a position where a missed call can hurt you and that is what GB did. Quit your crying. All I could think about was poor BOOB Nelson! I love it!!!!!!!

  39. Adam-Chris Scheftersen says: Jan 11, 2010 10:53 AM

    cusoman says:
    January 11, 2010 10:38 AM
    LOL… are you sure you’re reading PFT? Look around man, in fact look at the reaction blog posts after the Cards won the game, that post is RIFE with Packer fans blaming their team’s loss on that “blown” call.
    —————————–
    I can’t say I speak for all Packers fans here, but I think you’re either misunderstanding or purposely mischaracterizing what you’re reading.
    My point of view.. Yes, it was a bad call. And yes, there were plenty of other bad calls and no calls throughout the game, mostly against the Packers. However, if their defense had shown up it wouldn’t have been a game.
    The missed blow to head/facemask DID decide the game in the end. But the failure of the Packers defense to actually stop the Cardinals is what put them in that position. The fault for this loss lies with the Packers’ defense, not with the refs.

  40. if yer not first... says: Jan 11, 2010 10:55 AM

    Jesus – can you stop trying to stir it up? Exactly how much money did you lose Florio?
    If you really want to gripe about a significant rule change gripe about the nonsensical overtime rule for the NFL where the winner of the coin toss goes on to win 95% of the time (except when they get screwed by the refs, right Florio?)

  41. 2 Dimes and a Nickel Back says: Jan 11, 2010 10:57 AM

    Yep then the coaches could challenge any play on the field since unnoticed penalties occur on seemingly every play. Lets slow the game down even more and take it completely out of the hands of the refs…
    Hell, how about all the refs just sit up in the booth and take a review session after each play to make sure they didn’t getting anything wrong….
    Brilliant post.

  42. Twiz says: Jan 11, 2010 11:00 AM

    Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but considering it was a fumble, any penalty would have been assessed on the kickoff. The fumble resulted in a touchdown, so why call the penalty in the first place. If I am right (yes, it does happen once in a while), the refs made the correct call by NOT throwing a flag in this instance.

  43. The Centurion says: Jan 11, 2010 11:00 AM

    Had they not failed to also acknowledge the blatant helmet to helmet hit on Rogers in that drive as well, this last call wouldnt have raised so many eye brows. Bottom line is you “refs are humans too” say that when your team gets beat by a bad/mis call. my question for Florio or anyone who knows is, would that have offset the play? Or would it still have been Arizonas ball?

  44. Danc says: Jan 11, 2010 11:01 AM

    I’d like some replay to take back about half of the pass interference calls in that game on the Cards. Pack got sooooooo many 15 yd or longer variety calls in that game, the refs kept them in it.
    Waaaaaa waaaaaaaaaaa waaaaaaaaaaaaa….LOSERS

  45. tommy997 says: Jan 11, 2010 11:02 AM

    Replay is getting way too crazy. Listen, just like the players must prepare for a game, so must the referees. One of the best aspects of sports is the HUMAN ASPECT. Mistakes happen, it is part of the game, the HUMAN part of the game.
    My question to Florio is should we start to replay the actual plays as well? If the left tackle misses a key block, should the team get to “do it over” because they made a mistake that had an adverse impact on the game?

  46. drbob1117 says: Jan 11, 2010 11:03 AM

    The refs had already made 4 or 5 questionable calls on that particular player, how many did you want them to make? I think the body of things that are reviewable is fine, if you add too many things you’d never be able to play the game. Like everyone else has said , they gave up 51 points, they got all sorts of iffy calls on Adams go their way, they deserved to lose.

  47. Wrathchild says: Jan 11, 2010 11:05 AM

    Here’s the video of the play…
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foVp8i86Z_Y
    “And before we go any farther in this regard, let’s be clear. Rule 12, Section 2, Article 5 states that “[n]o player shall twist, turn, or pull the facemask of an opponent in any direction.” ”
    Yeah, but, no. You can do all those things if it would have resulted in the old 5-yard penalty variety.
    “Also, Rule 12, Section 2, Article 13(3) plainly states that defenders may not “hit the passer, or use hands, arms, or other parts of the body to hit the passer in the head, neck, or face.””
    Define “hit.”
    Either way, the fumble occurred first. Rodgers is no longer a “passer” after a fumble or interception, he’s fair game. Hitting the passer in the face, irrelevant, facemask, maybe the old 5 yard variety.
    Regardless, it’s AZ ball even if the refs threw the flag. With all that said, if it were Tom Brady instead of Rodgers, Adams would have been ejected from the game and two personal fouls would have been called.

  48. durno99 says: Jan 11, 2010 11:11 AM

    Where can we leave our sympathy cards for MR.Nelson? Her or can we start a new post for that?

  49. isuhuskie says: Jan 11, 2010 11:11 AM

    Please, it was a terrible non-call. It wasn’t like the play was over and he grabbed the mask. He hit the ball and then grabbed the mask at nearly the same time. The ball was free when he was yanking Rodgers down by the head.
    And as a Bears’ fan, I normally hate the Packers. But if the rule is there… make the call. You can’t claim there’s a QB fumble and now you can do whatever you want to him because the ref isn’t looking.

  50. Zaggs says: Jan 11, 2010 11:14 AM

    The only way this complaint is valid is if they stuck to the letter of the rule on other plays. if they had already made some borderline calls against the same player odds favor they’ll let one go as a makeup.

  51. i'm back says: Jan 11, 2010 11:16 AM

    I’m not complaining, just have a legitimate question.
    I thought there was a rule against taking your helmet off on the field of play in the NFL. Kurt Warner took his helmet off on the field to scream at Doucet after the Fitz fumble. Even though play was dead, shouldn’t that draw a dead ball flag?
    When the rule was first established, players were penalized for taking their helmets off after scoring a TD, which is also a dead ball foul. Same situation.

  52. danlinker says: Jan 11, 2010 11:20 AM

    Look at the sour grapes on florio. A punk as always. He never lets me down when it comes to his whining and crying. Cards won Mike. And that just frosts you as always. It also kills any hopes you and others might have had for a pack rematch with favre. You’ve lost what little face you had Mike on two fronts with this win. And I LOVE it.
    This is exactly what McCarthy and TT deserved with their pats like arrogance in the pre season game and last game of the regular season. NO go away pack, your season is over. And by the way, favre would have hit jennings on that deep route, and you all know it.

  53. Jack Factor says: Jan 11, 2010 11:23 AM

    I am a life long Packers fan and the bottom line is both offenses deserved to win and one of the did – The Cardinals – by their defense when one defensive team needed to make a stop.
    If Rodgers hits Jennings on the first play of OT it would have been over. If Rackers would have made the kick, it would have been over. If Crosby would have made a 55 yard FG int he first half, it would have been over. Many chances.
    The second to last play with the helmet to helmet no call was shocking to me. The last play, the judge’s eyes followed the ball – can’t really cry over that one.
    Great game to watch – my team lost – they need to shore up their o-line and get the secondary fixed.
    I think the officiating was terrible for both teams and I do not mean the last play.
    I hope that this team is reviewed and not allowed to do another playoff game this year. Officials are human, but at this level, there were at least five worng/no calls before the last play.
    I would hate to see them screw up an NFC Championship game or Super Bowl.
    Good luck to you all with teams still in the show.

  54. RacerX says: Jan 11, 2010 11:24 AM

    I’d like the PFT analysis so much more if it weren’t informed by a lawyer whose only conclusion is to litigate or committee every point.
    Its sports, not a motion or a brief. Pls stop trying to introduce more legislation into an already overlitigated sport. Why don’t you suggest a jury or peers to review every OT play?

  55. NCSailor says: Jan 11, 2010 11:29 AM

    Are you kidding me? The game is already way to slow. Replays, commercials, injuries, TV timeouts,timeouts. Maybe fans should be able to call in from TV land and tell the officials to review everything. 3-5 minutes between 6 seconds of playing time is rediculous already. Maybe, if the crummier of the two teams would learn to block and tackle they would have won.

  56. polishkingski says: Jan 11, 2010 11:32 AM

    florio is exactly correct making a big deal out of the no call. the difference was this non call decided the outcome of the game. as i watched the play live i thought for sure a flag would be thrown, a.rodgers sure looked like he did also. something should be done about this stuff esp during playoff games. florio is also correct when he says that one day this is how a superbowl is going to be lost or won. i know if i were a pack fan i`d be going bonkers today! it was one fxxking great game though. p.s- i would love to go down on pam oliver….man is she sexy. hey pam, do you like polish guys with hefty kilbasa`s?….im here waitin baby!

  57. ZombieRevolution says: Jan 11, 2010 11:33 AM

    W0w- I’m impressed by all the PFTers against Florio. At what point do we not review every play. During one of the GB scores one of the Cardinals DEs was being held, during the play he even had a hand in the air to show he was being held- no call, GB scores.
    “But rule, replay can’t be used to determine that a facemask or a roughing the passer penalty occurred.”
    Of course Florio means “By rule…” but as a blogger he does not have to check his writing before posting. Florio- you are paid to do this, at least act like a professional.

  58. MEDTXPACK says: Jan 11, 2010 11:38 AM

    im a true packer fan and im not complaining about the calls. we lost, but the cardnials still suck and their greybush QB will retire after he loses next week. good game, but Arizona wont be able to handle another one like that, hell they almost lost that huge lead. id rather still have the tradition and comfort of rooting for the best traditional football team, who has the best stadium (voted by the fans and players), more world championships than any other team (WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS IN THE HISTORY OF FOOTBALL, 12) than a team that keeps squeeking by. go cards?? id rather root for the lions.

  59. Hauschild says: Jan 11, 2010 11:41 AM

    I think we all should be careful here and not wish for something we might not want to get.
    This is how football has always been and it is one aspect that has made the game the most popular sport in America. If we tinker too much, we’re gonna ruin the game.
    So everybody calling for replays galore, or worse, changing the overtime rules – wake up! Just enjoy what the NFL is giving us that no other sport could ever hope to match.

  60. JimmyY says: Jan 11, 2010 11:46 AM

    OK, so you’d like 22 cameras on the field to follow every single player. If they line up in the neutral zone and its not called, STOP THE GAME, replay. If there’s a little pushing and shoving by WR’s and Safeties, STOP THE GAME, replay to see if a penalty was actually committed, etc. Get a grip, that’s just stupid.

  61. GirthyOne says: Jan 11, 2010 11:51 AM

    Since you aren’t complaining about the bad call on the first horse collar tackle, I think you are just a whine bag in this case.
    That rule states that there has to be a downward tugging motion. Since it only grasped the jersey, that what a crap call. Oh and it led to a TD. Shocking that there are calls both ways that benefited/hurt both teams.
    Stop your whining!

  62. CT Stiller says: Jan 11, 2010 11:55 AM

    Florio, as usual, is looking for controversy. It’s what this site has become. How does a non-call on a facemask when the guy already fumbled affect the outcome of a game? It doesn’t, but it makes for more comments on this blog to say it does.

  63. crackbubba says: Jan 11, 2010 11:55 AM

    I think everything should be reviewable by the booth. Coaches should be limited to what they can review, but the booth should be watching for everything. The Packers would have gotten the ball back and had a 1st if they had been called, possibly changing the outcome. How many more games need to have missed calls effect them before the NFL does something about it?

  64. Pervy*Harvin says: Jan 11, 2010 11:59 AM

    Be proud Packer fans. You didn’t allow 2 crushing defeats at the hands of your ex HOF QB gone to the enemy or a humiliating loss to the Buccs keep you out of the playoffs! You fought through adversity pretty good!

  65. nfldraftpost says: Jan 11, 2010 12:09 PM

    If you are gonna review facemask, the you should also review those interference penalties. That would mean even more timeouts and that can´t be good.

  66. wrath4771 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:14 PM

    The Packers lost and as much as that sucks I accept that. Not just with Rodgers, but this year I’ve seen a fair number of shots to the quarterback’s head that weren’t called. I’ve seen Roethlisberger take two that weren’t called, Vince Young take one and I think Kyle Orton. With the concern over concussions would it be that big of a deal to have a quarterback say, “Hey I took a shot to the head.” and have them look at it? If a quarterback keeps calling wolf on it then maybe there is a penalty for it, but if you’re looking to protect the quarterback and prevent head injuries, maybe that’s something to think about.

  67. zbon1234 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:19 PM

    I usually bite my tongue on threads much like this, but those people who are trying to be righteous saying that Packer fan’s need to realize that they lost the game fair and square and shouldn’t have given up 51 points are equally if not more annoying. How can you possibly say that those penelties weren’t blatently obvious and would not have affected the outcome of the game? I am not saying the Packers deserved to win that game because the Cardinals were on, but at least look at what you are saying before you say it. It was a good game by both sides, there was some poor officiating, game over. Quit trying to be righteous and defend the obvious and be happy that you won and move on. Don’t sit here and complain about how Packer fans are upset that they lost a playoff game, come on now.

  68. loggerhead12 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:21 PM

    There was some other interesting stuff going on that the official was busy looking at – AR kicking the ball, the ball hovering in the air, the defender collaring it and bringing it in, and then running for the score. It’s not physically possible to watch the QB’s facemask at all times.
    There are lots of rules that are squishy in interpretation, facemask being one of them. Watch Peterson or Barber use a stiff-arm to the facemask some time and see how many times it’s called.
    Fortunately, in this case while the defender did touch AR’s facemask it didn’t affect the outcome of the play and certainly didn’t injure the QB. As a penalty away from the play, while it was a technical violation of the rules it was probably a good no-call.

  69. JimmySmith says: Jan 11, 2010 12:31 PM

    Any team that deems Jared Bush worthy of a roster spot deserves to fell the full consequences of that decision. That guy flat out sucks and to make matters worse, the coaching staff is somehow under the impression that he might not suck but the Cardinals found out just how much he really sucks.
    He wasn’t responsible for all 45 points but he didn’t belong on the field either. This whole ref situation is getting tiresome, if you want to see a team get totally hosed by the refs, watch the Steelers steal a Superbowl from the Seahawks, now that was a tradegy of epic proporptions. Yesterday’s game was about average in terms of ref’s missing calls and not worth the true Packer fan’s attention.

  70. jc107 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:33 PM

    You know what is even more sad, that the ref’s in this game, is the people posting here defending a team cheating to win.
    It speaks a lot about the posters personalities here, in real life, they must cheat at everything they do. That is just sad, and pathetic.
    Anyone claiming what happened here is just fine, is a complete cheating moron in life.
    I’m guessing these posters are Viqueen fans, and Cardinal fans.
    BTW Viqueen fans, you got your butt kicked by this same Cardinal team. At least the Packers played them close, and should have won 2 games in a row against them.
    I hate the Cowboys, but will be rooting for them to beat the Viqueens. But overall I’ll root for the Saints. But then again, I may not watch anymore NFL games, why waste my time watching a corrupt sport.

  71. jc107 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:35 PM

    Oh, I forgot, for the idiots posting here that the ball was out before the facemask. Well if you had any knowledge whatsoever of the football rules, you would know that the penalty happened before the Cardinals even had possession of the football. Its still the Packer ball when the penalty happened idiots.

  72. Unbreakable02215 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:35 PM

    As an impartial Patriots fan, the play had me screaming at my TV for a call on that play. He hit him right in the face with his helmet.

  73. jc107 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:36 PM

    “As a penalty away from the play, while it was a technical violation of the rules it was probably a good no-call. ”
    ————————-
    I rest my case of proving an idiot with a post like this. This is just pathetically sad that people can be so stupid.

  74. Adam-Chris Scheftersen says: Jan 11, 2010 12:50 PM

    CT Stiller says:
    January 11, 2010 11:55 AM
    Florio, as usual, is looking for controversy. It’s what this site has become. How does a non-call on a facemask when the guy already fumbled affect the outcome of a game? It doesn’t, but it makes for more comments on this blog to say it does.
    —————————-
    So a penalty should only be called if it affects the outcome of the game? And in this case, the proper call WOULD HAVE affected the outcome of the game. The proper call would’ve resulted in Green Bay keeping the ball and getting 15 yards.
    Remember, he had lost the ball before the facemask, but Arizona had NOT recovered the ball yet. Therefore, if the correct call was made the Packers would’ve kept the ball.
    Again, I’m not trying to blame the refs for this game. But it was a terrible call and it did directly affect the outcome of the game.

  75. grunt24 says: Jan 11, 2010 12:53 PM

    Packer Fan here…im not gonna sit there and blame the refs just like the packers players and organization isnt…it was a heartbreaking loss but im proud of them, AROD played great bringing them back from 21 down in the 2nd half and 14 down twice in the 4th quarter, was one hell of a game—as far as the replay thing, i think it would be rediculous to take the human element out of the game, yea refs are gonna miss calls it happens every game to every team, great season GB…looking forward to next year

  76. Adam-Chris Scheftersen says: Jan 11, 2010 12:55 PM

    loggerhead12 says:
    January 11, 2010 12:21 PM
    There are lots of rules that are squishy in interpretation, facemask being one of them. Watch Peterson or Barber use a stiff-arm to the facemask some time and see how many times it’s called.
    —————————–
    That’s legal. As a ball carrier, you can stiff-arm a defender in the helmet as long as you don’t grab and twist the facemask. As long as you’re not grabbing the facemask it’s legal.
    And for as many times as I’ve seen Peterson stiff-arm a guy in the face, I’ve never seen him grab it. And this is a Packer fan saying that.

  77. isuhuskie says: Jan 11, 2010 12:58 PM

    Talk about people missing the point.
    The only reason he was able to hit the ball out of Rodger’s hands was because he went in HIGH on the QB…His follow through on the hit resulted in him grabbing the mask.
    Facemask calls shouldn’t be open to interpretation. It’s just one of those things you don’t do – If you make a hit that high that you end up grabbing the mask… Then that’s a hit you should NOT have been allowed to make.

  78. Lamblow Field filled with Dairyland Drunks says: Jan 11, 2010 1:03 PM

    jc107 says:
    January 11, 2010 12:33 PM
    You know what is even more sad, that the ref’s in this game, is the people posting here defending a team cheating to win.
    It speaks a lot about the posters personalities here, in real life, they must cheat at everything they do. That is just sad, and pathetic.
    Anyone claiming what happened here is just fine, is a complete cheating moron in life.
    I’m guessing these posters are Viqueen fans, and Cardinal fans.
    BTW Viqueen fans, you got your butt kicked by this same Cardinal team. At least the Packers played them close, and should have won 2 games in a row against them.
    I hate the Cowboys, but will be rooting for them to beat the Viqueens. But overall I’ll root for the Saints. But then again, I may not watch anymore NFL games, why waste my time watching a corrupt sport.
    jc107 says:
    January 11, 2010 12:35 PM
    Oh, I forgot, for the idiots posting here that the ball was out before the facemask. Well if you had any knowledge whatsoever of the football rules, you would know that the penalty happened before the Cardinals even had possession of the football. Its still the Packer ball when the penalty happened idiots.
    Waaaaaaaaaaa Waaaaaaaaaaaa Waaaaaaaaaaa
    Freakin Cry Baby

  79. drbob1117 says: Jan 11, 2010 1:05 PM

    jc107: A call might have been missed, but that doesn’t mean anyone cheated.. you play the game as hard as you can, and if the ref detects something, he calls it…If the ref missed a facemask, he missed it, I’m an Eagles fan that wishes they had made the right call on the Sean Jones INT ( if you have control when the ball hits the ground it’s still a catch), but they didn’t and I don’t blame the refs for the Eagles getting their rear ends kicked. Sure, you played a much closer game, but if your defense had one stop all day , or your FG kicker didn’t stink, you wouldn’t be begging for calls in OT.

  80. jonesmuc says: Jan 11, 2010 1:05 PM

    Here’s something for Florio and his fellow-cheeseheads, great stuff from SI’s Peter King:
    “[...] Adams keeps his hands on the mask as he plows into Rodgers and brings him to the ground. Adams didn’t tackle him by the mask, but his hand did stay secured on the mask as Rodgers fell to the ground. [...]
    For a facemask penalty to be called, there has to be evidence not just of a hand on the mask, but of twisting and pulling of the facemask. And there is a slight pulling of it, but not in a flagrant way.
    “To me, it’s a close call. But what complicates matters is this:
    The referee, Scott Green, is the official on the crew with the responsibility of watching plays involving the quarterback. Once the ball has been dislodged, Green has to watch the ball, not the contact on the quarterback. He has to see if the ball hits the ground and judge if it’s a forward pass or a fumble, then he has to follow the live ball until the end of the play. So Green could not — at least, he should not — have seen the contact on the mask of Rodgers.
    “Of course, the reason this is a big concern is if a facemask had been called, Green Bay would have had a first down at its 32 in a game where defense was optional. I don’t see how the call could have been made any differently with the current rules and officiating assignments the way they are.
    Source:
    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/peter_king/01/10/mmqb/

  81. Beer Cheese Soup says: Jan 11, 2010 1:09 PM

    CT Stiller says:
    Florio, as usual, is looking for controversy. It’s what this site has become. How does a non-call on a facemask when the guy already fumbled affect the outcome of a game? It doesn’t, but it makes for more comments on this blog to say it does.
    ____________________________________
    EXACTLY. You hit that one on the head. No game has ever had perfect officiating. Watching this one, which I’ve done twice now, it’s very hard to say that the officials had a hand in the outcome.
    Mr. Florio is just doing what he does best: creating site hits through controversy. I can’t say I blame him, it’s half the reason for his success.
    What I don’t like, however, is the fact that it attracts some of the more loudmouthed, homer type fans (which every team has, not just the Pack). They give the rest of us all a bad name, make our rivals think we’re ALL just like that very vocal and ignorant minority. That can get frustrating.

  82. Roboto says: Jan 11, 2010 1:12 PM

    I’m tired of people blaming “bad” officiating. Everyone wants to be a victim when they don’t win. I didn’t care who won this game but the Packers have nobody to blame but themselves for that loss. Worst defensive performance I’ve seen in a long time by any team. Kurt Warner just shredded them. No more debate about the Hall of Fame. He’s in!
    And, as a Steelers fan, I must tip my hat to the Ravens even though they are a rival I generally root against. They showed a lot of heart and guts to win that game. The Patriots were empty and showed no heart. Tom Brady has no layers as a human being. He’s a great QB but just a pretty boy without much else going for him. The Steelers played with no heart much of the season. That is why my team is watching the playoffs on television. Underacheivers!
    Ray Lewis did make Tom B his bitch! HA!

  83. packersurle says: Jan 11, 2010 1:22 PM

    The call should have been 15 yard personal foul, Packers ball and automatic first down.
    This is not a dead ball penalty. If you are going to make a point, please at least have a basic understanding of the rules.
    I would also point out that the Packers fan didn’t write this, it was written by a viking fan who owns this site.

  84. kahnoodie says: Jan 11, 2010 1:26 PM

    My main beef with the calls at the end, was that all year the rule has been touching the QB’s head at all = 15 yard penalty. I think this is moronic, but I’ve seen the facemask or top of the helmet get grazed, and it gets called.
    Even earlier in the game Warner got the call when Jenkins got tackled into the QB. Jenkins arm hit Warner’s facemask, and it got the flag even though Jenkins had his back to Warner.
    Can’t wait for the official review where Mike Pereira breaks out the excuse train about how the ref was doing his job watching the loose ball. The replay shows him looking right at Rodgers when Adam’s hand is on the facemask.
    I would like to give credit to the NFL Network. I think they were the only ones to even acknowledge the last two plays at anytime in their post-game coverage.

  85. purplejesus28 says: Jan 11, 2010 1:30 PM

    I agree with it being a bad no-call. but shouldn’t this have been posted on PFT after the Bears beat the Vikings due to the same thing? AD was tackled by his facemask which should have nullified the fumble in overtime. didn’t seem to be as many opposed to the no-call then.
    “The failure of the officials to spot the facemask penalty during the penultimate play of Monday’s Vikings-Bears game directly resulted in Chicago’s 36-30 overtime win. “

  86. Frank Burns says: Jan 11, 2010 2:24 PM

    Cue BeerSleazeSoup to whine again about ref conspiracies — even though his own team got away with the same thing vs. Minnesota. Funny then we didn’t hear any “outrage” or cries of “injustice” from him then. Just when the OTHER guys get some supposed benefit does he whine. Oh well, time for BeerSleaze to go boo hoo under the bed again and hide out til next sleaze-son.

  87. Myballshurt says: Jan 11, 2010 2:29 PM

    I’m ashamed to be a Packer fan today. You crybabies are doing exactly what you accuse viking fans of for 40 years. Suck it up…we were DOMINATED last night. A couple lucky plays (onside kick, Jennings miracle catch, Rackers becoming retarded….) made it close at the end but we only have ourselves to blame. Too many mistakes.

  88. loggerhead12 says: Jan 11, 2010 3:02 PM

    “I rest my case of proving an idiot with a post like this. This is just pathetically sad that people can be so stupid.”
    Well, the NFL has officially disagreed with you, but since you’re in mourning I’ll let you have your moment. However, you might want to consider that the two horrific turnovers in the first two possessions of the game and his indecision on the final play were far more of a factor in the loss than the incidental contact to AR’s facemask after he fumbled the ball.
    In Dallas we used to love playing the Packers in the playoffs because, even thought they always lost to the Cowboys, their fans were a breath of fresh air compared to the usual cretins we see in the NFC East. I see that is changing.
    Hope the groundhog doesn’t see his shadow and you get to dig out soon.

  89. Fansince74 says: Jan 11, 2010 4:17 PM

    @leatherneck
    WRONG! No change of possession had yet occurred before the alleged foul, so had it been seen and called by the official, it would have been a 15 yard personal foul and a GB first down.
    As for acting like spoiled brats, I seem to remember a lot of Cardinal fans acting the same way after the previous Super Bowl – i.e.- all the non-calls on Harrison’s int. run back, not reviewing Warner’s fumble at the end of the game, etc. So give it a rest, hypocrites – every team’s fans do the same thing after such a painful loss, just as many of you did a year ago. Be gracious and happy that your team is moving on.

  90. LarryFitzgerald4MVP says: Jan 11, 2010 4:53 PM

    so basically, florio hates the cardinals and this is one of many statements that show it?

  91. socco says: Jan 11, 2010 7:32 PM

    And before we go any farther in this regard, let’s be clear. Rule 12, Section 2, Article 5 states that “[n]o player shall twist, turn, or pull the facemask of an opponent in any direction.”
    …I didn’t see any twisting, turning, or pulling.
    Also, Rule 12, Section 2, Article 13(3) plainly states that defenders may not “hit the passer, or use hands, arms, or other parts of the body to hit the passer in the head, neck, or face.”
    …If the ball is fumbled, is Rodgers even the passer anymore?

  92. 1mge says: Jan 11, 2010 9:04 PM

    If the follow through motion of the hit that causes the fumble also hits the QB’s head it’s automatically 15 yd PF and offense retains possession.
    Watch the video clip before you make stupid comments. The video is very clear, watch it all.
    1)It is clear his head & face mask were hit AND his head turned. (2 penalties)
    2)It is clear he pumped and stopped his throwing motion to pull the ball back in. If not a forward pass he was tucking it back. ANYONE EVER HEARD OF THE BRADY TUCK RULE???? I know Raider fans have.
    3)Why wasn’t the play reviewed & confirmed? Overtime…Playoff game…No booth review???
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foVp8i86Z_Y

  93. 1mge says: Jan 11, 2010 9:10 PM

    I’m not saying the refs were for or against either team they just plain screwed this call up which is sad.

  94. Unbreakable02215 says: Jan 12, 2010 12:56 PM

    Roboto, Brady has no heart ? Broken index finger on his throwing hand, cracked ribs and a bad throwing shoulder ?
    Did he play WELL ? with the injuries I listed above who
    would have ? The Pats have problems. Brady’s heart
    ain’t one them.
    I’ll keep him as the QB for my team. He’s got more guts
    than any other QB in the league Roboto.

  95. Adam-Chris Scheftersen says: Jan 13, 2010 3:24 PM

    purplejesus28 says:
    January 11, 2010 1:30 PM
    I agree with it being a bad no-call. but shouldn’t this have been posted on PFT after the Bears beat the Vikings due to the same thing? AD was tackled by his facemask which should have nullified the fumble in overtime. didn’t seem to be as many opposed to the no-call then.
    “The failure of the officials to spot the facemask penalty during the penultimate play of Monday’s Vikings-Bears game directly resulted in Chicago’s 36-30 overtime win. ”
    —————————
    Dead wrong. First of all, the Vikings still had an opportunity to win that game. The missed call was not on the final play of the game, and the refs did not force Antoine Winfield to assume the role of spectator for the game-winning catch on the next play. The Vikings had an opportunity to overcome that bad call.
    Secondly, do you really think these games are on the same scale? A late-season game that didn’t matter in the grand scheme of things compared to a win-or-go-home playoff game? Big difference.

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