Former Vikings receiver Cris Carter has now been passed over three times for induction into the Hall of Fame.
Last year, he made it from the list of 15 finalists to the final 10. This time around, however, Carter was included in the first round of cuts, failing to make it into the final 10.
So what’s going on here?
The fact that Bills receiver Andre Reed made it into the top 10 suggests that there’s a sense that Reed should get in before Carter or former Raiders receiver Tim Brown.
Then there’s the argument that Carter didn’t force opponents to devise game plans around him. That mentality kept former Redskins receiver Art Monk out of the Hall of Fame for more than a few years — and the difference between Monk and Carter is that Monk possesses three Super Bowl rings.
Carter has none.
So Carter will wait at least another year. But he’s moving in the wrong direction; for 2011, it’ll be interesting to see whether he even makes the list of 15 finalists.
so, he is a democrat?
/low-five
Thats what he gets for playing his final year with the Dolphins. LMFAO!
Deserves to be in the hall. Maybe the voters didn’t want to take anything away from Jerry Rice by inducting them at the same time, so he might get it next year.
Another Vikings-focused post by Mike Florio.
Where’s the Tim Brown post? Or Andre Reed? Or Richard Dent?
Predictable.
FYI to everyone: Florio is a closet Vikings fan. Although he’ll only admit it on his KFAN (Minneapolis) radio appearances. Nothing wrong with being a fan, but he should be up front about it.
All he did was catch touchdowns. More than anyone not named Jerry Rice. What am I missing?
Former Vikings are HOF poison – always have been, always will be. Losing that many Super Bowls will do that to ya. Win one, just one, and the HOF winds might change.
Why has anyone mentioned Al Toon?
I grew up in Carter’s home town in Ohio. I worked at a beer drive thru in our crappy small town. He drove in one day right after he got suspended from Ohio state and got a 12 pack of coors light. He was a dick. Brush with greatness…I suppose. If you want to put someone into the hall from Ohio, think Issac Curtis first please……
$1o says it’s those freakish eyebrows.
Hall of Very Good….YES!
Hall of Fame…..NO!
At some point we have to realize very good players do not deserve to be in the Hall of Fame.
and oh yeah….FIRST BIOTCHES!!!!!!
Or, he was a giant asshole that nobody, outside of his team’s fans, liked.
He’s a hall of famer, he’ll get in. Being a first up entry is saved for the cream of the cream. Art Monk snub on the other hand was absolutely absurd. But that wrong has been righted.
1100 receptions. 130 TDs. How hard is this to figure out?
Reed should get in before them. Reed was the best WR to ever go over the middle.
“The fact that Bills receiver Andre Reed made it into the top 10 suggests that there’s a sense that Reed should get in before Carter or former Raiders receiver Tim Brown.”
Screw ‘em both. Bob Hayes had to wait 34 years. Drew Pearson STILL isn’t in and yes… oh yes, he deserves it. Both are Super Bowl champions. Reed and Carter? Really? See I know those are numbers guys because they have no blingity-bling when I see them.
Andre Reed, come on back to the NFL and play big in some big games. Mr. Numbers man, I look at your Super Bowl stat-lines and I see poo, crap, feces and turd. You need some numbers there, too.
8 for 62, no TDs
5 for 34, no TDs
8 for 152, no TDs
6 for 75, no TDs.
NO POINTS AT ALLLLL! It is the HALL OF FAME. Only for the BEST EVEREVEREVER. I’m not fooled by that 152 yard game. That was the game when the Cowboys were kicking yo ass, wasn’t it? You caught 6 passes in the first half, didn’t you? You mean to tell me that you could only catch two in the entire second half against that prevent D? See ya, numbers guy.
The fact that Carter is an annoying, self-important blowhard with a penchant for making blanket statements certainly can’t help his cause either.
I think he belongs in. Give him a few more years though.
A repost from another thread…
Reed should get in before Carter???
Reed had a Hall of Famer tossing him the ball, whereas Carter had no consistent QB throughout his career.
Carter: 1101 rec, 13899 yds, 130 tds, 8 time pro bowl, 2 time AP all-pro (1st team)
Reed: 951 rec, 13198 yds, 88tds, 7 time pro bowl, no AP all-pro (1st team)
Oh, and toss in a Walter Payton NFL Man of the Year for Carter (1999) too.
Check the stats. Carter belongs.
It silly to think that Reed should get in before Carter. Carter has better stats with lesser quality quarterbacks. It should be noted that neither Reed nor Carter nor Brown have any Super Bowl rings.
Carter was always a very good WR but very good players dont go into the HOF, only the greats…
Chris Carter deserves to be in the HOF, but really I think Shannon Sharpe still not being in is ludicrous.
Andre Reed deserves HOF before Carter. Neither won SB’s (over-rated stat outside of QB) but Reed meant more b/c of his YAC ability. Carter had great hands, but wasn’t close to Reed in his ability to create plays once the ball was in his hands. Reed needs to go into the HOF now…….or 2011!
what a bunch of bullshit.
Maybe it’s because CC is just a jerk. Between his fake religiosity and his me-first act when he was playing, maybe that was enough for all the writers to just write him off. He wasn’t exactly fan- or reporter-friendly when he was playing.
Who cares? He basically got an honorable mention as a candidate. An honorable mention.
He is a loser who deserves to sit by “Laughing Tom Jackson” and talk to him about how close but no cigar feels.
Sorry, but Cris Carter belongs in the hall of fame. There’s no doubt about that. And this is a Packer fan saying it.
I’d like to hear the argument that Cris Carter is not one of the best 5-7 receivers in the history of the league.
My suspicion: 1) the highlight reel tape wasn’t running or 2) no one bothered to view the evidence or, 3) all he could ever run was that one end zone route Buddy whazziz-name would send him on.
Somehow I dont think he’s the, “It’s nice just to be nominated,” type.
Someone somewhere is getting an earfull of CC.
I think it would be ludicrous if Reed or Brown made the Hall before Cris Carter. So other teams didn’t game plan for him. Well, I guess they should have given the numbers that he has. Maybe that was the problem and teams DIDN’T game plan for him as much as they should have. All he did was average 1 TD every 8.5 catches. For his career. I’m not a Vikings fan mind you but a KC fan. I know, we suck right now. Let’s move on from the jokes. All I know is I actually like all 3 players equally (even tho Tim played for OAK he was still a beast on the field most of the time and I’ll give him his due) and I’m not saying that Carter should be in the HOF but he def is more worthy than the other two. And I hate the fact that Reed gets noted for having reached the SB 3 times and that’s possibly the reason he trumps Carter. I hate that. If Carter were on BUF, there’s no saying they still don’t make it. I know they’re different types of players, but Carter would have offered the same thing he did in MIN and they would have adapted. So it’s not his fault his teams didn’t make the SB while Reed’s did, for that is something that’s very hard to control for one WR.
And if I recall…CC dropped the last pass that was thrown to him…a touchdown pas that hit him right i the hands.
WTF…the NFL thinks they’re a bunch of limp d*c&ed mofos like the MLB writers? what about the term “the numbers dont lie”?
The voters? they lie.
Tim Brown was the go-to guy on very average teams. Not HOF, today or ever.
The HOF is just like the every sports all star game. It’s a damn popularity contest. It doesn’t matter what your stats are. It’s judged on how many championships you have. Carter can’t help he never won a championship. Damn shame he’s being punished for never getting one.
What’s the matter… just catching touchdowns isn’t enough to get into the HOF? Keep your spirits up, Chris. It will happen. Until then, enjoy the ride… it will be even sweeter when you get there.
Andre Reed has to make it next year. Those years with the Bills he and Jim Kelly were as lethal as a duo as anybody.
WHO CARES? Art Monk shouldnt be in the hall of fame and neither should Cris Carter…even Tim Brown is on the fence for me. If your going to put Cris Carter in the HOF, you may as well put Wayne Chrebet in too…
Reed took over games offensivley on a Team with several other big name weapons. Tim Brown was pretty Good but with him its more about impressive longevity. I would easily put Carter as a player (and person) third out of the three.
Carter was a good receiver but never great. I think you should be great to be a hall of famer.
yeah, him being a total D*CK doesnt help either! he’ll probably say something so arogant on air that he total sways voters against letting him in!
Florio, your hair cut should be in the Hall of Fame.
Only Florio would focus on the plight of one of his dear Vikings rather than on any other player who didn’t make it to the HOF. Andre Reed is obviously the better choice at WR. 1-Reed, 2-Carter, 3-Brown.
Well if championships are the determining factor then Dilfer should be more of a lock than Marino was.
“I think it would be ludicrous if Reed or Brown made the Hall before Cris Carter. So other teams didn’t game plan for him. Well, I guess they should have given the numbers that he has. Maybe that was the problem and teams DIDN’T game plan for him as much as they should have. All he did was average 1 TD every 8.5 catches. For his career. I’m not a Vikings fan mind you but a KC fan. I know, we suck right now. Let’s move on from the jokes. All I know is I actually like all 3 players equally (even tho Tim played for OAK he was still a beast on the field most of the time and I’ll give him his due) and I’m not saying that Carter should be in the HOF but he def is more worthy than the other two. And I hate the fact that Reed gets noted for having reached the SB 3 times and that’s possibly the reason he trumps Carter. I hate that. If Carter were on BUF, there’s no saying they still don’t make it. I know they’re different types of players, but Carter would have offered the same thing he did in MIN and they would have adapted. So it’s not his fault his teams didn’t make the SB while Reed’s did, for that is something that’s very hard to control for one WR.”
First of all Reed was in 4 Super Bowls MORON! And beyond that it was 4 in a row that will never ever be done again! Reed lined up in the slot more than wide out and took hits from linebackers and still has better career numbers than Carter. Besides that Reed caught 3 TD’s in the greatest comeback in NFL history. Reed has made great plays and memorable moments. What has CC ever done. I guess you can just blame it on Gary Anderson like we do Scott Norwood.
underdog_23
4 times…. its 4 miserable times.
People forget…that when Carter was with Eagles…there were severe drug & cocaine issues. Thats why/how he ended up in Minn in the first place.
For that reason alone, I wouldn’t vote for him if given opportunity.
Also, his ESPN ranting…for PERSONAL reasons [ ie Moss]…has let alot of people know that he’s really a bigtime jerk.
Tim says:
February 7, 2010 7:03 AM
WHO CARES? Art Monk shouldnt be in the hall of fame and neither should Cris Carter…even Tim Brown is on the fence for me. If your going to put Cris Carter in the HOF, you may as well put Wayne Chrebet in too…
Maybe his arrogance is keeping him out. Putting him in the HOF would require 2 busts: One for him, and one for his ego.
Tim Brown and carter have very similar stats. Brown had a more difficult situation to achieve those stats.
DRAT”- How do you say “Reed is obviously the better option”? What makes Reed so obvious? I contend he is the least attractive option. He only scored 10 or more TD’s once, once.
First ballot hall of famer for bitchy little a holes with no superbowl rings.
This blowhard continually puts players and teams down, like he’s the standard.
Screw him, he got what he deserved, nothing.
You guys are forgetting about one of the best ever, both stat-wise and on the field:
Andre Bad Moon Rison.
Compare his numbers to anyones….and keep in mind he played with over 20 qb’s.
As much as you all want to talk personality being a determination for HOF honors. Think for a moment how many quarterbacks Chris Carter played with over his career. To get that much output from different systems and ball slingers says a lot.
aramsiruni says: “I’d like to hear the argument that Cris Carter is not one of the best 5-7 receivers in the history of the league.” Well, that’s the easiest request I’ve heard in some time. Here’s the short 10-point argument, I could go on with another much longer list:
Don Hutson, Charley Taylor, Raymond Berry, Jerry Rice, Paul Warfield, Lance Alworth, Art Monk, Randy Moss, Marvin Harrison, Isaac Bruce. And that’s just a mild scratch of the surface.
Just tells u how stupid the voters are. His numbers are overwhelmingly better than Michael Irvin and he made it on his second try. Just so we are clear, Mushin Muhammed has better numbers all around than Michael Irvin. Its all political bullshit. Superbowl wins mean nothing at WR. Steve Largent made it his first time without a ring and his numbers are worse than Carter’s. Put Carter in the hall for god’s sake. Hes a top 10 rec all time. This is absurd.
Pretty sure we all understand that he has ZERO freaking super bowl rings (thanks for taking that knee, Denny), but stats don’t lie. Cris Carter’s definitely a HOFer. And it’s total BS that many see the debacle from his last Minny year and make that appear to be his career’s entirety.
Pretty sure John Randle doesn’t have any rings, either. Glad he made it, undersized and kicked ass every down, but…
So Dr. 4iz says that Carter is obviously better than Reed because he has 50 extra catches and 700 more yards over an entire career. Pretty shallow, Dr.4iz. That’s an average season for a 3rd receiver. Puhleez, not relevant to the HOF. Watch how the two receivers played the game — Reed is better in every way, tougher, more competitive, better catcher, better runner, more committed to his team, made more of a difference when the chips were down. Carter: famous college pretty boy who racked up numbers and little else.
Most people posting here don’t realize that Carter’s arrogant, smack talking, self proclaimed expertise dribble that passes for analysis, he is merely a reflection of the Vikings and its fan base.
Plenty of talk, some stat’s that show potential but absolutely no championship hardware, only zero’s when it counted the most. Carter is a blowhard but that seems to be par for the course in Mpls.
While Cris Carter [i]seems[/i] like a Hall of Fame player, if you look at his stats he was never a dominant player, just what Football Outsiders would call a “compiler”. All he did was stay healthy and play for a really long time. Carter played for 16 seasons and was NEVER in the top 5 for receiving yards in a season. Not once. He had 8 1,000 yard seasons, but 3 of them were as the #2 receiver with Randy Moss getting all the defense’s attention. The dominant receivers of his era were Rice, Sterling Sharpe, Reed, and Irvin.
It’s really a shame Sharpe got hurt because he put up some amazing numbers. Sharpe only played 7 seasons, yet went over 1,000 yards 5 times (3 fewer than Carter) and was in the top 5 in receiving yards 4 times (4 more than Carter). Another player from the same era, Jimmy Smith, had 9 1,000 yard campaigns and from 1996-2001 finished in the top 5 for receiving yards 5 out of 6 seasons.
I don’t think Carter should ever get in.
We’re talking about Hall of FAME!!! Not Hall of STATS!! Put him in…he’s a FAMOUS football player in my eyes!! I’m sure everyone would agree with that.
OK so not on the first ballot, fine. 3rd time and still not in? The hall of fame gets a big FAIL.
Receivers need that me first mentality because that’s part of the job… you have to want anything and everything.
Rice even breaks out of his shell to the media, but I Guarantee he wanted that damn ball.
If he didn’t have the “look-at-me-play” mentality, that’s what I’d be concerned about.
Drew Pearson STILL isn’t in and yes… oh yes, he deserves it.
um…no he doesn’t.
118th all time in receptions.
(that’s THREE digits)
115th in TDs
And his three game total in SB’s?
7 rec
145yds
1 td (and still lost)
Just another babbling rant from Jerruh’s ball sack holder.
Swallow next time, Vox.
( Cue the witty repartee and Dallas drone spin from this idiot)
People who talk about his attitude keeping him out of the HOF don’t realize that the voters don’t look at anything but the stats, numbers, and honors they got when they played.
Carter > Irvin.
Carter’s another guy that didn’t make a WHOLE lot of noise in the post-season. I believe he was seven years and five playoff games into his career before Mr “All he does is catch touchdowns” caught a TD pass in the playoffs.
How else do u get into the hall Drat? Its all about numbers. Cause if superbowl rings are all that matters I guess we should take Marino out of the Hall and Put Jeff Hostetler and Trent Dilfer in because they both have rings. The hall is all about numbers. The best numbers means that they were the best players. Chris Carter is a hall of famer. This isn’t a tough decision. 14,000 yds and 130 TDS. What am I missing here?
Warrern Sapp goes in soon right?
I always though the argument that defenisve co-ordinators didn’t game plan for Art Monk was completely retarded.
The guy set a single season record for pass receptions in a run first offense. The fact that some DCs were so dense that they completely failed to realise just how critical Monk was to the Redskins was hardly his fault. Had they schemed for him may be they might have spent less time losing games against his teams.
Monk didn’t get in for so long because he wasn’t flashy, and was prepared to to do the underneath work whilst Gary Clark got more of the glory boy deep routes. Monk could go deep as well as anyone on that team, but he was the only one who could play the short stuff that well.
Monk was a great football player and team-mate. He was also to some extent unique. A blue-collar, 0-linemen type, team player; all hard yards and making other players better. A big, punishing, chain mover and not some gliding, glory seeking, pretty boy.
Carter, on the other hand, was a hugely talented receiver that put up incredible stats but didn’t help his team enough to win championships. There are going to be an awful lot of those guys to choose from in the next few years.
Carter had 150 more catches you dumbass. Also had 42 more TD’s than Reed. Guess that’s just an average season for a 3rd WR though.
As for the “more competitive” and “better catcher” comments, you fail… hard.
Cris Carter deserves to be in the HOF. Period.
put a side what team he played for and how many SB rings he doesn’t have. Stats alone HOF. Voters put him in!
Andre Rison was better!
First off, none of you know what D-cord planned for. second, ALL of these WR’s need to be in. I watched Carter, Reed, and Brown and they were all great. The problem is this “only five get in” crap.
yeah, he got screwed again… he may have hit an early road bump in philly, but had been nothing short of a fiery competitor since.
he even helped bring randy along, and kept him grounded for his first few years… back to back 122 catch seasons, the first being a record. some of the most spectacular grabs(one handed, side-line, tip, you name it…), and he gets screwed once more.
and he didn’t get game planned for? hard to single out someone when he helped lead the type of teams that dumped 556 points in a season, i suppose.
He has better career production than any WR not named Jerry Rice. Best hands in the history of the game. It’s a joke. I’m happy that Randle got in, he’s all heart.
That being said, Carter will get in eventually, as will Randy Moss. You can ignore facts and truth for only so long.
Brown and Carter had very similar stats, both better than Reed. Niether had great QB’s throwing their direction, and almost everyone will tell you that you need a great QB to win a championship. They both deserve to be in the HOF.
Now add Brown’s kick and punt return yards and TD’s and he should be in before Carter and Reed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RASB4uIMzQc
how the hell do you argue with that??
Carter should get in eventually. Brown should be a lock. Reed should get in also.
Just a gut feeling, but I get the impression Carter is kind of a dik. Maybe that’s why the voters have been so tepid on him so far.
# AutumnWind999 says: February 7, 2010 12:35 PM
Just a gut feeling, but I get the impression Carter is kind of a dik. Maybe that’s why the voters have been so tepid on him so far.
———–
he can be a hot head, and a bit arrogant. his competitive nature made him hold everyone on the team to the expectations he had for himself.
much like the well publicized ripping of jeff saturday that manning made for him suggesting that they should run the ball near the goal line… and the “god damnit donald!” that was actually pure comedy.
So how much of this is slotting?
Five players (non senior category) get in…..an o-line, a d-line, a running back, a receiver and a linebacker.
Did Carter go south because Rice was now eligible.
Deon Sanders next year, does he eliminate all the d-backs?
How did Grimm get him when it didn’t seem he was all that close? It was his time?
I just want to echo the sentiment that Carter is a hall of famer no matter how long it takes to get there. Sure, he has been a prima donna, but the stats don’t lie. Few, if any receivers not named Jerry Rice, have produced more.
Beyond that, he is the ultimate possession receiver, somehow always open for an impossible catch just beyond the sticks or in the end zone on third down. Among current players, only Donald Driver seems even remotely comparable at keeping his team in the game.
Why hasn’t anybody mentioned Renaldo Nehemiah???
.VoxVeritas says:
February 7, 2010 10:19 AM
Carter’s another guy that didn’t make a WHOLE lot of noise in the post-season. I believe he was seven years and five playoff games into his career before Mr “All he does is catch touchdowns” caught a TD pass in the playoffs.
—————————–
Michael Irvin didn’t score a playoff TD until his 5th playoff game. I guess that kind of shoots down the whole you-need-to-score-playoff-TDs-to-get-into-the-hall-of-fame argument. At least for a Cowboys shill like yourself.
“Carter > Irvin.”
Dumbest post of the day.
It’s Vox’s Theory of Relativity that if you hang around one place long enough, you’ll hear that all of the early 90′s Cowboys except the OL sucked. Emmitt was a product of the OL, Irvin pushed off on every pass he caught, Aikman was a system guy that wasn’t really that good, Deion wouldn’t tackle, Maryland was overrated, Haley only rushed the passer and was crazy, Norton Jr. got to the NFL because of his daddy, Alvin Harper wasn’t good enough to be a #1 guy, Chmura and Brent Jones were better than Novacek, etc.
WHo cares if Cris Carter isn’t a good guy? No one will care who was a nice guy 20 years from now. This is the nonsense that infects the HOF process in every league. None of you have met this guy, know him personally or probably even know anyone who knows him. Who cares what you think of his personality? Why should that matter? Voters are not supposed to take into account anything but ON FIELD stuff. Boo on them if they allow their own personal issues to cloud their judgment.
The bottom line is, on the field the man produced year in year out with some very average QB’s throwing to him, he was a GREAT downfield blocker and has the stats that rank him as one of the best all time. He will get in no question and deserves to.
I don’t see why Reed would get in first. Carter had much better stats and career accomplishments. Carter is a bit of a pain in the arse but not to the point where is should really have a bearing in his candidacy. Carter is a brat but I would say he is for the most part a very good person which isn’t the case for all NFL players.
When I think of offensive players as great, I want someone who scares me everytime he touches the ball and does it consistently. Marshall Faulk, Sanders, PAyton, Rice, Moss, Owens, Tomlinson. They put fear into defensive coordinators, Carter doesnt do it for me, he was a good WR with very good numbers. I got in the same arguement 3 years ago about Jerome Bettis. He had very good numbers on bad Rams teams and padded his TD stats on Pittsburgh. Not great in my book and the Hall of Fame should be greatness.
Carter was an arrogant prick to fans, reporters and teamates when he played, and doesn’t seem that much different now. If nothing else, maybe making him wait will force him to eat some humble pie. Then again, with Randle getting in, and McDaniel the year before, they probably couldn’t vote in more Vikings. It’s not like the voting was all crowded with the regular cheeser posters beloved Packers though.
Carter has more career receptions and receiving TDs than Reed or Brown. In the case of TD’s, he has more by quite alot.
I think what hurts Carter is the the competition. Guys like Marvin Harrison, TO, and Randy Moss are either within striking distance or have recently eclipsed Carter’s numbers, so people are trying to make sense of just how good they were.
The fact Carter played with Moss doesn’t help either. People see Moss as the freak talent, and Carter as the benificiary of it.
# Ghost of Studwell says: February 7, 2010 6:40 PM
The fact Carter played with Moss doesn’t help either. People see Moss as the freak talent, and Carter as the benificiary of it.
————-
you’re beyond stupid. cris made the pro bowl EVERY year from 1993-2000. 2 time all pro, madden all millennium team.
so for 5 years prior to 1998, carter benefited from the foretold coming of randy moss?
not to mention that cris almost killed randy with his “welcome to the nfl workout regiment,” showed him how to read a d off the stadium display panel, and even his patented push off… randy knows damn well he owes cris a lot. cris was approached prior to the pick to see if he was up for baby sitting when randy fell to 21st overall(for a reason)…
not to mention back to back 122 catch seasons, the first setting an nfl record.
take the ignorance elsewhere…
Drat says:
February 7, 2010 9:34 AM
So Dr. 4iz says that Carter is obviously better than Reed because he has 50 extra catches and 700 more yards over an entire career. Pretty shallow, Dr.4iz. That’s an average season for a 3rd receiver. Puhleez, not relevant to the HOF. Watch how the two receivers played the game — Reed is better in every way, tougher, more competitive, better catcher, better runner, more committed to his team, made more of a difference when the chips were down. Carter: famous college pretty boy who racked up numbers and little else.
============================
(Bills-N-Yankees this is for you too, since you seem to think Reed had better numbers than Carter)
The extra 150 catches (not 50 as you post) 700 yards and 43 TDs (funny you forgot to mention them) came in the exact same number of games played. Since Reed is at least worthy of HOF consideration, and Carter had better than 3rd receiver numbers in the same number of games, then I guess you could only conclude Carter is more deserving.
Tom Selleck -
You left out the part where Carter was in the top five for receiving TDs in a season seven times(was also 6th one year). He was also in the top five for receptions six times (was also 6th one year as well).
chris -
I guess being 8th in career TDs in NFL history shouldn’t scare anyone.
sven -
Thanks for the link. It covered a few things I was going to post.
Not only was Carter great at acrobatic catches he was a master at foot control at the edges of the field. The catch on the video against Detroit was absolutley incredible. I remember he reached out and got only his middle finger on the ball (on the point) and brought it back to his shoulder while parallel to the ground. Carter was also a great blocker. Just take a look at the high-lights of Robert Smith’s runs and see who’s helping make it possible. Even Jerry Rice said Carter had the best hands in football.
Then take a look at the QBs throwing to him over his career. Players prior to or past their primes.
R Cunningham, R Gannon, W Moon, W Wilson, S Salisbury, J McMahon, B Johnson, J George, D Culpepper, S Wynn, T Bouman, J Fiedler & R Lucas.
Reed & Brown were very good wideouts and perhaps worthy of Canton (although Brown dropped way too many passes for my liking) but check his stats and his game film and you’ll see a Hall of Famer.
His personality or past problems shouldn’t have anything to do with it either. If that were the case many players would be held out of the Hall, including Michael Irvin & Lawrence Taylor.
I realize I am several days late on this. Let’s not forget how brilliant CC was at finding the “soft” part of a zone coverage (and even man to man). In fact, I have not seen anyone come close to being able to keep plays alive and make QBs look better than CC. It was because of his incredible hands and that ability to slide around after the original route was over that helped project his HOF numbers to where they are today.
Most “all world” WRs in his and later generations give up when the route is covered. But Cris was always moving and seemed to know just where to go to get open.
Adam-Chris Scheftersen says:
Sorry, but Cris Carter belongs in the hall of fame. There’s no doubt about that. And this is a Packer fan saying it.
____________________________________
I second that. It’s not Cris’ fault he never had a decent QB to throw to him. He was more talented than Irvin ever was, and has far less off-field incidents too. He was robbed, plain and simple.
Ah…we all know that Cris Carter was riding Jake Reed’s coattails in Minnesota….
He should get in the Hall, in like ten years or something. His old reputation couldn’t be helping much. Guys like this who were good but were rotten human beings should get in on their last chance.
jibfest says:
He should get in the Hall, in like ten years or something. His old reputation couldn’t be helping much. Guys like this who were good but were rotten human beings should get in on their last chance.
____________________________________
Michael Irvin, OJ Simpson and others put a huge hole in that argument. Carter may not be a class act like some, but there are a lot more “rotten human beings” than him already in the Hall.
Agreed. The hall of fame should be about what you did on the field. I’d put Michael Vick in the hall if his play warranted it.
Truth is you could make a strong case for most of the guys on the final 15 list. These guys were truly enjoyable to watch, although probably broke your heart if they were playing against your team.
Adam-Chris & Beer,
Nice to see someone not let a rivalry get in the way of appreciating a players skills and worthiness of the Hall.
Now let me do the same – how the hell is Jerry Kramer not in the Hall?? He was a staple for the running game that garnered all those GB Championships. He was a 5 time 1st Team All Pro. Grimm played the same number of seasons (more games due to the longer schedules) and made the 1st Team All Pro two fewer times. I’ve never heard an explanation as to why he doesn’t get the love. I hear more people complain about Kuechenberg then I do Kramer. Somethings wrong when the HOF doesn’t have Kramer as a member.
It is you stat douchebags who are the reason the HOF is packed with Offesive players and lacks defensive players.
Your type pisses me off.
The Real Shuxion says:
February 9, 2010 9:17 AM
It is you stat douchebags who are the reason the HOF is packed with Offesive players and lacks defensive players.
Your type pisses me off.
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So you’re trying to make the case that Cris Carter doesn’t belong in the hall of fame? Enlighten us with your “logic”.
As to your general point, I agree. There are not enough defensive players in the hall. Too much attention is placed on offense. No doubt.
But that has nothing to do with Cris Carter and whether or not he belongs in the hall.
Tompadre says:
February 9, 2010 5:28 AM
Adam-Chris & Beer,
Nice to see someone not let a rivalry get in the way of appreciating a players skills and worthiness of the Hall.
Now let me do the same – how the hell is Jerry Kramer not in the Hall?? He was a staple for the running game that garnered all those GB Championships. He was a 5 time 1st Team All Pro. Grimm played the same number of seasons (more games due to the longer schedules) and made the 1st Team All Pro two fewer times. I’ve never heard an explanation as to why he doesn’t get the love. I hear more people complain about Kuechenberg then I do Kramer. Somethings wrong when the HOF doesn’t have Kramer as a member.
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Denying that Carter had a hall-of-fame-worthy career would be assinine… As several people in this thread have proven. I hate the Vikings with every fiber in my being, but on the field Cris Carter was a professional. No one worked harder, no one used their talents to the best of their abilities.
I’ll take issue with one comment Beer Cheese said, though. And I realize I’m splitting hairs because in general we agree… But that’s what I do. I wouldn’t say Cris Carter was more talented than Irvin. I think Irvin was without a doubt more talented than Carter. But I believe Carter used his tools to the absolute best of his ability. His hands were like velcro and his toes were loaded with magnets. Irvin was a great player, clearly deserving to be in the hall. But Carter made so many unbelievable catches. He perfected the push-off, he used the sideline like no one before or since, and he generally caught every ball thrown his way. He wasn’t going to beat you deep, but he’d beat you everywhere else.
Carter is one of the game’s best ever players at that position and for him to be left out of the HOF is just insane. I don’t know what the rationale is for selecting players these days, but he is clearly deserving as is Shannon Sharpe. Both players have the stats. I think that because the HOF has minimum of how many players it can select every year, they have to keep a marquee name in every class so they can draw people to come to their induction ceremonies every year. Remember, Canton is in the rust belt and every dollar being pumped into that area helps a great deal.
To keep Chris Carter out of the HOF and to even consider Andre Reed before Carter can not be explained by the numbers. Chris Carter is one of the top 5 receivers to EVER play the game, Super Bowl win or no Super Bowl win. The HOF should change it’s name to the Hall of Shame. It’s all perceptions even in sports…
Ten of Reed’s 15 years and all seven pro-bowl years had Kelly at the helm. Of his seven pro-bowls, four were gained when his QB also made the pro-bowl. Further, Reed’s QB made the pro-bowl six times during his career. Reed’s average without Kelly was 590 yrds/season and 46 catches/season. If we take out his last season, leaving only four non-Kelly years, his average goes to 712 and 52. Those aren’t exactly HoF inspiring numbers.
In Brown’s 16 years, he got to the pro-bowl nine times with three different QBs. Of his nine pro-bowls, only three were gained when his QB also made the pro-bowl. Brown’s QB made the pro-bowl a total of five times during his career (Hostetler 1, Gannon 4). Brown’s average without Gannon is 60 catches and 831 yards/season. If we take out his worse season (1989), they go to 65 catches and 900.
In Carter’s 12 years, he got to the pro-bowl eight times with six different QBs! Of his eight pro-bowls, four were gained when his QB also made the pro-bowl. Carter’s QB’s went to a total of five pro-bowls while throwing to Carter and a total 24 pro-bowls! In fact, the only QB to throw to Carter that did not make the pro-bowl at some point in their career was George. Carter’s numbers are obscene no matter which QB you take out.
IMO, Carter should go in next and then Brown. Reed shouldn’t make it. He’s on the cusp of greatness but the question that will dog him is whether he was great because of Kelly. Carter and Brown were great with sub-par QBs.
To address some BS arguments:
“Carter was never a dominant player”
Silly. Reed averaged around 5th or 6th in his best years in receptions. Carter average around fourth with more top seasons and three seasons ranked third or better. Reed never placed better than fifth in receiving TDs whereas Carter placed first in three different years and fifth or better in seven years.
“Monk didn’t get in for so long because he was flashy”
No. Monk didn’t get in because in the Redskin’s biggest games he disappeared. Against the Raiders in the Super Bowl he caught one pass all game…in the fourth quarter. Against the Broncos four years later he caught…one pass.
Perhaps Sidney Rice will get in before CC.