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LaMarr Woodley: Steelers' treatment is "kind of jacked up"

A month after Chris Johnson said he couldn’t play for his $550,000 base salary, the Titans gave him a raise. Steelers linebacker LaMarr Woodley is also scheduled to make a $550,000 base salary this season, and although he’s not saying he can’t play for that, he does think the Steelers aren’t treating him as well as they could.

It’s kind of jacked up,” Woodley told Michael Silver of Yahoo. “Everything I’ve ever done for the Steelers, on and off the field, has been positive. Sometimes you don’t get the same thing back in return.”

Woodley knows that the “30 percent rule” limits how big a raise the Steelers can give him, at least as long as there’s no new Collective Bargaining Agreement, but he tells Silver that he’s frustrated the Steelers simply expect him to play out his contract.

“I’m not going to lie – I was a little disappointed that they didn’t offer anything at all,” Woodley said. “I felt that was a little weird. I guess they decided they’re going to sit back and wait for the CBA and all that to play out.

“You look around the league and you see different teams getting stuff done with their players in similar situations, and you think, ‘What, the Steelers don’t care about me?’ Stuff like that goes through your mind.”

Woodley noted that his fellow 2007 second-rounder Kevin Kolb got a big raise from the Eagles, and Woodley is correct to think that if the Steelers wanted to, they could give him a big raise, too. But the Steelers don’t want to, and that means Woodley will play this season for $550,000.

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73 Responses to “LaMarr Woodley: Steelers' treatment is "kind of jacked up"”
  1. Ryan_Mack says: Jul 20, 2010 2:19 PM

    “he’s frustrated the Steelers simply expect him to play out his contract. ”
    IT”S A CONTRACT!!!!!!

  2. Joshsports60 says: Jul 20, 2010 2:21 PM

    It’s a little bit surprising, but Woodley isn’t the only one going through this same issue. For example, Chris Johnson, Vincent Jackson, Marcus McNeil, and Darrell Revis.
    If there’s hurt feelings next year, it looks like he could be playing in a different uniform. But, I do respect him for not being a pri madonna about his contract situation.

  3. Karl says: Jul 20, 2010 2:23 PM

    How dare they expect you to play out the contract you signed.

  4. Dallas22 says: Jul 20, 2010 2:23 PM

    What ever happened to honoring a contract? It’s getting borderline ridiculous these days.

  5. wope says: Jul 20, 2010 2:24 PM

    God forbid you do what you agreed to do in your CONTRACT…for the amount of money you agreed to do it for.

  6. myspaceyourface says: Jul 20, 2010 2:31 PM

    WOODLEY, PLEASE STAY.
    DON”T GET WORKED UP.
    THEY WILL TAKE CARE OF YOU.
    FULFILL YOUR CONTRACT.

  7. Ravenmuscle says: Jul 20, 2010 2:31 PM

    I’d suggest he just go through the motions this year and give the Steelers $550,000 worth of effort. Just kind of fart around.

  8. slizz says: Jul 20, 2010 2:32 PM

    ummm…comparing to Kolb is Apples to Oranges.
    The only thing those two have in common is the year & round they were drafted in along with the fact they play football in the state of PA.

  9. rjmcc01 says: Jul 20, 2010 2:34 PM

    You clowns…Teams don’t honor their contracts!! They’ll cut Woodley the second the choose too!
    OAK just cut Russell? Why don’t you b!tch about OAK not honoring his contract!!!!

  10. eradicator says: Jul 20, 2010 2:35 PM

    If there’s a new agreement, there should be a tradeoff so that:
    -The top half of the first round draft picks don’t get $20 million a year contracts like JaMarcus Russell
    -Players like Chris Johnson who outperform their rookie contracts can get paid in greater relation to their contributions to the team

  11. copes cabana says: Jul 20, 2010 2:36 PM

    This is why it surprises me when people say the Steelers pay off the refs. the Steelers don’t pay anyone what they deserve. Refs must be desperate for cash, cause you know it ain’t much.
    They are not cheap, just frugal. It’s how they have done business for a long time. It works. They will get a deal done with hime because he is a BEAST. When it is all said and done they will compensate him enough and he will be all happy again. Just like Hines when he held out.

  12. Chiefs2010 says: Jul 20, 2010 2:39 PM

    NFL contracts should be based on performance, they really need to restructure compensation and contracts in the NFL

  13. garrettmustgo says: Jul 20, 2010 2:45 PM

    Dallas22 says:
    July 20, 2010 2:23 PM
    What ever happened to honoring a contract? It’s getting borderline ridiculous these days.
    ———————————————–
    Totally Agree,
    I dont like what i make at my job, maybe another telecom company could trade for me and up my salary
    sounds crazy in that respect..

  14. EasyDrinkingBuschLight says: Jul 20, 2010 2:47 PM

    Players that sign rookie deals are forced into slotted contracts, and if they vastly outperform them they deserve to be renegotiated. If this was a player’s 2nd or 3rd deal THEN you can tell them to honor their contract.
    Besides, teams CONSTANTLY don’t honor contracts for players that *underperform* or get hurt, so why should the players be expected to when they *overperform*?

  15. LiOn TaMeR says: Jul 20, 2010 2:59 PM

    This is the NFL player contracts are not gaurnteed like the NBA contracts. Giving raises to Rookies or young players that out perform there contracts is a common thing. If I were woodley I’d keep quiet and just leave the team next year, if they wont pay up now. Dont let them try to sweet talk you into a deal next year. They had their chance

  16. tre1572 says: Jul 20, 2010 2:59 PM

    “You clowns…Teams don’t honor their contracts!! They’ll cut Woodley the second the choose too!
    OAK just cut Russell? Why don’t you b!tch about OAK not honoring his contract!!!!”
    Absolutely, 100% correct. I will never understand why fans take ownerships side on these things, rather than players.
    Woodley is a beast, has outplayed his contract, and deserves a raise.

  17. jibfest says: Jul 20, 2010 3:04 PM

    NFL contracts should be based on performance, they really need to restructure compensation and contracts in the NFL
    —All sports should be based on performance. They shouldn’t get 10,20,30 million upfront. You give the best players a few million. The other guys you make them perform. A guy goes 3-22 shooting? He makes little. A guy goes 4-4 at the plate with two homeruns? gets paid accordingly. This paying Sam Bradford ridiculous money is well, ridiculous.

  18. Pistol says: Jul 20, 2010 3:04 PM

    Up is better than off. Which in turn is better than on.

  19. RebaT. says: Jul 20, 2010 3:07 PM

    Steelers have always been cheap. People in Pittsburgh don’t have the money to pay for high dollar tickets any more than they can today. However, Ben Roethlisberger needs a HUGE pay cut. 110 million? Please, he’s not that great Mr. I Get Sacks All the Time!

  20. Nogard13 says: Jul 20, 2010 3:07 PM

    I’m with EasyDrinkingBuschLight.
    If Woodley had signed a contract where he had $10M guaranteed this year, and he had played like crap last year, they would cut him, regardless of the contract, and owe him nothing.
    Teams are allowed to “re-negotiate” a contract by releasing a player and not paying out the remainder of their contract (in essence, voiding the contract), so why shouldn’t players be able to demand more money when they perform at a higher level than expected/paid for?
    The only way to fix this is by fixing the rookie scale during the draft. All rookies should get a contract that is either 3 or 4 years long (depending on what round you’re picked in, with players chosen after round 2 getting 3 year deals). That way, when they’re done with their contracts, they can become free agents (restricted, if picked after round 2) and try to get what they deserve on the open market.
    It’s really what’s best for the players (but the owners will want something in return, namely that they get to pay them less and keep the money they would’ve otherwise spent on the rookies). I think this would be a fair trade off.

  21. RebaT. says: Jul 20, 2010 3:09 PM

    Woodley is an awesome player. The Steelers screw everybody over other than those with perceived records over their heads. #7 is an idiot and he’s getting paid HUGE dollars. Dump him and pay the right players.

  22. LiOn TaMeR says: Jul 20, 2010 3:10 PM

    I love how fans try to compare there crapy $5 desk jobs to NFL players and there Pay. Do they make tons of money yes… Do they put there body and health on the line to entertain us? yes. He nearly made the Pro Bowl and isn’t even making starter Money!!! He’s a class act guy who has no off the Field Incidents and you dont want to reward him? I hope players around the league are watching this and you loose potential FA’s in the future. Now if this Pro Bowl Caliber LB Woodley plays out this $500,000 he risk the chnace of injury and never make the money he deserves. Come On PiTT lets take advantage of one of the many Nice guys in the NFL because you know he is to Loyal and to nice of a guy to hold out

  23. WVUColumbus says: Jul 20, 2010 3:20 PM

    Steelers will keep Woodley.

  24. steelerfan9598 says: Jul 20, 2010 3:21 PM

    “OAK just cut Russell? Why don’t you b!tch about OAK not honoring his contract!!!!”
    They paid him 31 Million dollars to throw 18 TD passes. What is there to bitch about? Besides, he’s busy with his slurpy durp or sizzle burp or whatever that goofy nonsense is called. Nothing like rolling 31 million into an illegal cough syrup drink empire.

  25. droppingloads says: Jul 20, 2010 3:24 PM

    Yeah a contract is never a contract, take Iron Man- Downey Jr, signed a multi-movie deal at a price that was very favorable to the studio, when the 1st Iron Man made hundreds of millions of dollars, the studio, in good faith, redid his deal, so he could be paid more.
    Football team are notrious for not caring at all about players, if a guy overperforms his contract, the boss should understand the value of that guy, keep him happy and honor the work he has done. In Woodley’s case he has way overperformed and does derseve to earn more than 550,000, espically in a sport that has such a short window of time for players to make money. The steelers, like the pats are horrible to players, and guys like Johnson and Woodley are star players, who do deserve to make more that 1/2 million a year

  26. Ollie says: Jul 20, 2010 3:25 PM

    CONTRACT – An agreement between two or more parties, one written and enforceable by law.
    This should not even exist in the NFL. Neither the owners or the player honor them, like in the real world.

  27. Kaz says: Jul 20, 2010 3:27 PM

    For all the “character” problems the Bengals “have”. It’s good to see there is peace and unity in the much better run, strong Steelers, and Ravens organization/lockerroms….

  28. troll_aikman8 says: Jul 20, 2010 3:30 PM

    The steelers are notoriously cheap with linebackers.
    Cheap in general, but especially so LB’s.
    Maybe if he raped a drunk 20yr old in a bathroom he could get a $100M extension.

  29. CurseofBoJackson says: Jul 20, 2010 3:31 PM

    Silly to claim the honor your contract crap. Everyone here with abrain knows how tenuous the last year of a contract can be when a palyer has GROSSLY overperformed based on his compensation. One slip on wet grass or a hit to the knee in the wrong place and he never gets correctly compensated for the extremely high level of play he put on for two years. If I have the money and own the team I deal with him, guy’s a beast. That’s coming from a Bengals fan. I’d LOVE to have him on my team.

  30. Wegot6doyou says: Jul 20, 2010 3:36 PM

    What part of the NFL is a “business” are you morons forgetting about? If the guy is producing at a high level and making $550.000 I say again 550,000 a year, and hes bitching about it? WTF you selfish peices of shit NFL players. Go dig ditches for 10 an hour, work at burger king, or mcdonalds for 8 an hour, better yet, be a surgeon saving lives and make 400,000. NO,, you play a GAME for 3 hours on a sunday, travel the nation, decide when to take off a play or even a game. And yet, 550,000 is not enough? WTF. Imagine, a surgeon working half ass on your beloved family member because hes pissed his CONTRACT says he will make a certain amount of money that year.

  31. SeaColt213 says: Jul 20, 2010 3:46 PM

    How bout these jack-knobs start with their agents? They negotiate these contracts.

  32. Ollie says: Jul 20, 2010 3:46 PM

    Things are coming apart! Get back here Dan. See what happened as soon as you left for Ireland?

  33. BHindEnemyLines says: Jul 20, 2010 3:55 PM

    “NFL contracts should be based on performance, they really need to restructure compensation and contracts in the NFL”.
    Amen, brother.

  34. CincyAllDaWay says: Jul 20, 2010 3:58 PM

    I’m not a Steeler fan but I’ve had an opportunity to watch this guy in action many times and he’s a player to say the least. The cheap bastards should pay the man what he’s worth. Take some money from the fat rapist and pay the man who comes to work on a consistant basis and gives his all!

  35. Holeinone09 says: Jul 20, 2010 4:00 PM

    For most part, the Steelers ultimately pay for their top players. Not all but over the years by and large many of them. Some in the past have held out, boycotted training camp, etc, but if they thought it was worth it the Steelers still resigned them. Some got away and played well for other teams. This is a business. Players will come and go. I like Woodley but the best thing he can do for both the team and himself is to shut the hell up, play hard, and things will normally take care of themselves.
    Finally, almost football season!!!

  36. bigstorm says: Jul 20, 2010 4:08 PM

    Woodley is just stating the obvious. He was “hoping” that the Steelers would be financial morons (like the Jets, Raiders, etc.) and open up the bank vault.
    This is an OLB factory. Don’t lose sight of the fact that the Steelers drafted two more OLB prototypes ala Woodley.
    Its tough on a class act like Woodley to see overpaid buffoons on other teams. I get that. He isn’t crying, just stating the wish list.

  37. Brew_05 says: Jul 20, 2010 4:12 PM

    When will people learn to stop complaining about what athletes make?
    It’s all relative to your industry.
    If’ you’re flipping burgers for 10 bucks an hour, but the guy tossing fries is getting paid 13 bucks an hour and burning half of them in the process, you’re probably going to approach your manager and say “hey buddy, pay me what I’m worth”
    you don’t just consider yourself lucky to be making 10 bucks an hour because the guy mopping floors is only bringing in 9.

  38. Tony Snow says: Jul 20, 2010 4:16 PM

    Woodley, there’s a reason the Steelers have six Lombardis, …it’s because they do business the RIGHT way! Don’t compare this situation with the Titans and Chris Johnson and/or Bud Adams with the Rooneys! The Steelers shouldn’t have to suffer because other teams are over compensating for years of terrible management. Woodley will get paid, but he has to understand ….The Steelers don’t do business like other teams. Ask Randle El! Larry Foote!

  39. Ronworth Dubbs says: Jul 20, 2010 4:19 PM

    “# Wegot6doyou says: July 20, 2010 3:36 PM
    What part of the NFL is a “business” are you morons forgetting about? If the guy is producing at a high level and making $550.000 I say again 550,000 a year, and hes bitching about it? WTF you selfish peices of shit NFL players. Go dig ditches for 10 an hour, work at burger king, or mcdonalds for 8 an hour, better yet, be a surgeon saving lives and make 400,000. NO,, you play a GAME for 3 hours on a sunday, travel the nation, decide when to take off a play or even a game. And yet, 550,000 is not enough? WTF. Imagine, a surgeon working half ass on your beloved family member because hes pissed his CONTRACT says he will make a certain amount of money that year.”

  40. Ncel17 says: Jul 20, 2010 4:20 PM

    Where’s that guy who was telling me Steeler players all handle it like perfect angels?
    Yeah.

  41. HandsofSweed says: Jul 20, 2010 4:21 PM

    Damn, Reba. How many sacks is Ben supposed to get for that extra 8 million you somehow think he’s making? How do you round 102 UP to 110 and when did Ben start playing defense?
    You never have your facts straight and then you run off at the mouth, talking all this shit about people you don’t even know. No wonder people hate us (Steeler fans) so much.

  42. Ronworth Dubbs says: Jul 20, 2010 4:24 PM

    “# Wegot6doyou says: July 20, 2010 3:36 PM
    What part of the NFL is a “business” are you morons forgetting about? If the guy is producing at a high level and making $550.000 I say again 550,000 a year, and hes bitching about it? WTF you selfish peices of shit NFL players. Go dig ditches for 10 an hour, work at burger king, or mcdonalds for 8 an hour, better yet, be a surgeon saving lives and make 400,000. NO,, you play a GAME for 3 hours on a sunday, travel the nation, decide when to take off a play or even a game. And yet, 550,000 is not enough? WTF. Imagine, a surgeon working half ass on your beloved family member because hes pissed his CONTRACT says he will make a certain amount of money that year.”
    He essentially IS working for a minimum salary. The importance of Woodley to the Steelers is astronomical in comparison to other individuals and even rookies who’ll see PT that won’t even get on the field. Your analogy for the surgeon is ridiculous, if they’re that good at fixing people some other hospital will gladly look to upgrade his pay and he has the option to leave and get a pay increase. Bottom line is that, in the NFL, Woodley is worth about 10 times the amount he’s being paid. There is absolutely nothing wrong with him wanting fair compensation.

  43. Deb says: Jul 20, 2010 4:54 PM

    Salaries are based on supply and demand. Since there’s no shortage of ditch-diggers, those jobs command minimum wages and workers are dispensible. But only a couple of dozen men have the skill to play linebacker at the pro level. And Woodley has proved one of the best. He deserves to have his contract restructured, and the Steelers wouldn’t hesitate to vacate his contract if it suited them.
    I don’t blame him for being frustrated. But the person he should consult is Rod Woodson. The Steelers promised Woodson that if he’d play out his contract, they’d make sure he was rewarded for his performance and loyalty. He trusted them–and they kept their word, making him the first Steeler to earn more than a million dollars a year. They’ve said Woodley is a priority and they’ll see that he’s well-compensated. Now is not the time for him to do something stupid.

  44. Goldhooka says: Jul 20, 2010 4:57 PM

    Rjm: yes teams can cut players under contract; the contract that they signed says in varying forms, states: “should a player not fullfill their duties or underperforms in a way the organization deams productive, the player may be waived/cut/let go”. It’s similar to what you and I sign when we got hired at our jobs. Same reason companies can fire you for facebook stuff “personal conduct clause” these players were not forced to sign their contracts. If they didn’t like the performance clause stated, their dumb ass agents should have caught it. They are working for a company just as much as you or I are, but with more money involved. I’m sick of celebrity athletes trying to pull this crap. They need to get a clue.

  45. Laxer37 says: Jul 20, 2010 5:14 PM

    “You look around the league and you see different teams getting stuff done with their players in similar situations”
    ————————————————
    There aren’t any similar situations. The Steelers have a business plan that has brought them a record six Lombardis. Other teams that spend foolishly don’t have the positive results to support their actions.

  46. CKL says: Jul 20, 2010 5:14 PM

    Brew_05 says: July 20, 2010 4:12 PM
    When will people learn to stop complaining about what athletes make?
    It’s all relative to your industry.
    ___________________________
    Truth.
    Also it is true that a team can cut a player at any time but often the cap (as it was anyway) makes it more attractive to keep him along with the fact that while a guy may be making 550k base, they almost always got a giant signing bonus and/or a few other bonuses right up front that when factored into the salary as they should be make it more reasonable looking pay wise.

  47. Wegot6doyou says: Jul 20, 2010 5:29 PM

    You play a SPORT and complain about making 550,000? hahaha This nation is ass backwards.

  48. sharkattack says: Jul 20, 2010 6:00 PM

    Deb says: July 20, 2010 4:54 PM
    Salaries are based on supply and demand. Since there’s no shortage of ditch-diggers, those jobs command minimum wages and workers are dispensible. But only a couple of dozen men have the skill to play linebacker at the pro level. And Woodley has proved one of the best. He deserves to have his contract restructured, and the Steelers wouldn’t hesitate to vacate his contract if it suited them.
    ———————
    I agree with Deb. Hell just got a little colder.

  49. kurtismantronik says: Jul 20, 2010 6:08 PM

    EasyDrinkingBuschLight says:
    July 20, 2010 2:47 PM
    Players that sign rookie deals are forced into slotted contracts, and if they vastly outperform them they deserve to be renegotiated. If this was a player’s 2nd or 3rd deal THEN you can tell them to honor their contract.
    Besides, teams CONSTANTLY don’t honor contracts for players that *underperform* or get hurt, so why should the players be expected to when they *overperform*?
    Well said.
    I hear alot of excuses and arguments against the players but you guys are just coming of as some broke-ass haters who are just bitter that you can’t hold your boss by the balls when you’ve earned the right too. Go better yourselves instead of complaining.
    When a player is slotted into a contract for whatever reasons, and outperforms it, he has earned the right to renegotiation. The ticket sales, the merchandising sales and the boosts to franchise value offered by these players entitles them to a few more bucks from the BILLIONS the owners are making off of them.

  50. Deb says: Jul 20, 2010 6:37 PM

    @sharkattack …
    ROFL Wait until the season starts … it may get surprisingly cold ;)

  51. stnmmc says: Jul 20, 2010 7:21 PM

    # Joshsports60 says: July 20, 2010 2:21 PM
    It’s a little bit surprising, but Woodley isn’t the only one going through this same issue. For example, Chris Johnson, Vincent Jackson, Marcus McNeil, and Darrell Revis.
    If there’s hurt feelings next year, it looks like he could be playing in a different uniform. But, I do respect him for not being a pri madonna about his contract situation.
    —————————————–
    And I respect you for not falling into the traditional PFT poster trap of referring to him as a pre-Madonna. I’ve seen that one almost as much as should of, could of, and so on. Having said that, you are still wrong. It is prima donna.

  52. gotsix? says: Jul 20, 2010 8:01 PM

    just hope this doesn’t turn into another Bret Kiesel. I think the steelers have a class act front office but I don’t like it when they get cheap…Our line never recovered. how much difference do you think Kiesel would have made last year?

  53. steelerfan9598 says: Jul 20, 2010 8:39 PM

    “What about Joey Porter(non factor in Miami),Willie Parker(On a roster with three other has beens),Plaxico Burress(In Jail), Randle El (Bust with Skins / overpaid/ back in Pitt for peanuts), Chris Hope(Good player, overpaid), Mcfadden (overpaid now back in Pitt at a reasonable salary) and Fanaca (The only guy on this list worth mentioning – won another Super Bowl without him though also, overpaid thus, cut by the Jets)”
    That is a horrible list of examples dude. You forgot Yancey Thigpen and Neil O’Donnell. If you pay attention, you’ll find that after a year or two you realize they made the right decision – just about every time.
    If the Steelers cut Roethlisberger, it will set the franchise back 10 years. Never mind that he has yet to be charged with anything. That would be just plain stupid.

  54. Tony Snow says: Jul 20, 2010 9:38 PM

    There’s a difference in being cheap and a bargin. Woodley is good, but how much of that is due to the players around him, the coaches and the organization? With that being asked, there’s also the franchise tag, the new CBA talks and a myriad of other release, trade and/or injury factors yet to be weighed….especially if, just ONE, of the rookie LB’s outplay their respective contracts. Woodley will get paid, there’s no question in that, but he’ll also recieve a quality supporting cast, at a great wage and an excellent chance to win another Superbowl. Now that’s what I call a bargain!!!
    So geniuses… When you lose a Joey Porter to the Dolphins for
    20 million guaranteed and get a Harrison for basically the league minimum or a Nate Washington to the Titans for what? 30 million. The Steelers signed him undrafted out of Tiffin and replaced him with a Mike Wallace. Sorry but in my opinion, this is just a team First philosophy that works.

  55. QJ1984 says: Jul 20, 2010 10:00 PM

    @Dallas22
    Then the Cowboys had NO right to cut Flozell Adams. I mean they signed that agreement to.

  56. BCGreg says: Jul 20, 2010 10:01 PM

    C’mon, people. Some of you can’t be pissed at management for cutting a player who “underperforms or is injured” based on the “honoring a contract” line, can you?
    First, they cannot cut injured players without a settlement. Second, you are forgetting that there is another contract that is in place–the CBA–which gives the owners the right to cut players because the ‘playing’ contract is not guaranteed! The teams are penalized for doing this in the form of carrying “dead” money on the salary cap. The players have no leverage in this regard. They can holdout, or they can play out their contract. They also have the right to free agency after the contract is up as one person has mentioned.
    YOUR issue should be with the players for agreeing to these terms, not the owners who legally excercise their right to adhere to the CBA, which trumps the ‘playing’ contract.
    Maybe the players should give back a percentage of the revenue they take (currently, players get 60% of the revenue)–maybe down to 50%– in return for full guaranteed contracts.
    Just an idea

  57. gotsix? says: Jul 20, 2010 11:41 PM

    oops… mind fart I meant Fanaca of course.

  58. Deb says: Jul 21, 2010 4:27 AM

    Deb you mentioned Woodson. What about Porter, Parker, Burress, Randle El, Hope, Mcfadden and Fanaca.
    ————————————————
    Mentioned Woodson because the situations compare. Woodson was at the height of his career and the Steelers said re-signing him was a priority. Woodley is up-and-coming and the Steelers said re-signing him is a priority. His contract issue results from the 30 percent rule–not anyone else’s issues. Based on how they treated Woodson, I believe they’ll do what’s necessary to re-sign Woodley and he should be patient. If they don’t, he can command what he wants on the open market. The only way he’ll lose is if he starts acting like a jackass.
    As for other players you’ve mentioned, their situations don’t compare …
    * Porter was beginning downward slide & to receive $1mil roster bonus + salary. We couldn’t afford him. Dolphins offered $6mil/yr–$8mil guaranteed w/$12mil bonus. He had one great yr. We replaced him w/Harrison for less. Harrison made All Pro 1st yr and Def MVP 2nd yr.
    * Parker’s career is essentially over.
    * Gee, if we’d kept Burress, he could be in prison for us. Steelers have long-standing policy of not paying big $$$ to receivers who only touch the ball a few times/game. Holmes’s contract was up at the end of 2010 and they didn’t plan to re-sign him. He’d had many legal issues & when he went on a public forum announcing plans to commit a crime & violate the substance abuse policy, they just got rid of him sooner than expected. Since they practically had to give him away, it shows he wasn’t worth keeping.
    * Snyder offered #3 receiver 7yrs@$31mi. ROFL. They cut Randle El after 4 yrs.
    * Hope wanted $4mil/yr. Ryan Clark took less than $2mil/yr. Hope has 16 INTs to Clark’s 8; otherwise their stats are comparable.
    * AZ offered McFadden $5mil/yr then tossed him back after a yr. We signed him for half that.
    * Jets paid Faneca 5yr/$40 mil w/$21 mil guaranteed. Match that? Are you nuts? They cut him after 2 yrs. He’s making $2.5 this year in AZ because Whis took him in. He made his last couple of Pro Bowls on his name, not his play.
    When it comes to management decsisions, the Steelers’ overall success of the last 40 years speaks for itself.

  59. i'm president charlie! says: Jul 21, 2010 8:37 AM

    Pay the man. He has been extremely productive and even did it without Aaron Smith freeing him up last year.

  60. gotsix? says: Jul 21, 2010 1:21 PM

    wait a sec, Deb. I think you’re getting out there a bit saying Fanaca made the Pro-Bowl on his name. That guy is a maniac and when you watch him play he’s outstanding. Most important is that he is a leader and I think our O-line needs a leader. I remember going to training camp in Latrobe he was like another coach in drills. Even the staff treated him as such. If I recall correctly he asked to be franchised for less than what the Jets gave him. I’m also willing to bet he makes the pro-bowl again this year.
    The other thing I would say as that I have read your stuff for a long time. I bet you were pretty sad when Joey left and that you’re leaving that part out for the sake of argument.

  61. Deb says: Jul 21, 2010 5:19 PM

    @gotsix? …
    You’re close ;) Post was gigantic; edited before submitting. “I LOVE Joey, but” got chopped :)
    Didn’t meant to disrespect Faneca. (Voted him for the Pro Bowl! ;) Though he’d have stayed for less than the Jets paid, he wanted more than he was worth to us. We won a SB w/out him and he was cut in two years. That reinforces our decision to let him go.
    Love the Steelers and our players. But I’m dispassionate on personnel issues. It’s business and players are assets. Purely cost v. benefit. That means weighing:
    * current performance
    * intangibles such as on-field leadership, heart, willingness to enhance value thru training/study
    * appreciation/depreciation
    Last is trickiest. Players start on upward curve, peak, then decline. Steelers are masters at gauging moment of decline; that’s why they let Joey and Faneca go. It’s not an exact science and anyone can miscalculate–as Tom Donahoe did with Rod Woodson. But the Steelers’ track record at knowing when to cut bait is impressive, evidenced by how most of these guys do after leaving.
    HATE saying it but the Dark 80s were triggered partly by Steelers loyally retaining 70s champs past their prime rather than replenishing those positions with young talent. By campaigning for free agency, players ensured their redundancy. Teams can’t afford to keep people past their ability to produce. Dan Snyders will throw $$ at anything w/a ring, but Steelers know better.
    If a player’s on our roster, it’s because his benefits outweigh costs–including any problems he’s had. If not, then he cost more–or was more trouble–than he was worth. Period. It’s a multibillion-dollar business, not a daycare. Steelers are making business decisions, not playing faves. Those who don’t get that are simple-minded :)

  62. gotsix? says: Jul 21, 2010 9:08 PM

    Is “The buisness” winning or making money. That is my concern. I think they saved money but won less. I feel if they treat Woodley poorly its going to be the same. There’s nothing simple minded about wanting to win. Pay the winners and keep winning.
    As far as Ben. I think he sucks. I’d like to send him and his buddy Arians to Oakland where they belong. join me in my new organization “GIVE DIXON A CHANCE.”

  63. Deb says: Jul 22, 2010 1:36 AM

    @gotsix?
    Profit is the #1 goal of all for-profit companies. But because of revenue-sharing and media contracts, NFL franchises don’t have to win to prosper. So team owners have WIDELY divergent ways of doing business.
    The Rooneys are pioneer NFL family. They’re FOOTBALL people who want to win–but are more concerned with creating a tradition of excellence than with any individual season. That’s why they won’t fire a coach after a bad year or throw money at big names to fill a hole. They have a philosophy and stick to it come hell or high water. They won’t make rash decisions based on player rants or whims of public opinion. Even when I don’t agree, I respect that. Few people have the balls to stand pat when the world is throwing a collective hissy fit.
    Wanting to win isn’t simple-minded. But since no team wins a Super Bowl every year, the goal is consistently being in contention. Since 1970, Pittsburgh has won more Super Bowls and AFC championships, and competed in more AFC championships, than any franchise. We’ve won 19 division titles;. next closest is Cincy with 7. And we’ve done that even though the Rooneys lack the personal wealth to compete for players w/the Jerry Joneses, Paul Allens, or Dan Snyders.
    In a typical year, all teams operate w/the same cap restrictions. But wealthier owners can cut checks for multimillion-dollar signing bonuses–cash up front–to lure players. The Rooneys have never had that kind of liquidity–especially don’t have it after the recent restructuring.
    As for Arians and Dixon …
    Arians was abysmal last year, but many things played into that. He’s capable of calling a better, more-balanced game–as he proved guiding the offense the year we won XLIII.
    Players went bonkers at prospect of Dixon starting v. Ravens, and when QB was suspended, coaches 911’d Leftwich–two clear no-confidence votes. Brave performance v. Ravens at home w/all clapping and praying Tinker Bell would live. But let’s be real. He threw one TD, completed less than 50 percent of his passes playing a dumbed-down offense, and Reed read that INT before ball was snapped. He’s not ready and will never be a top dog in the NFL. Won’t debate our #1. Get it: You hate him. But on-field, he’s got the goods. Barring something unforeseen, he will be the Steelers starting QB until his skills decline.

  64. gotsix? says: Jul 22, 2010 5:26 PM

    Deb,
    I think you work on Water Street, Say Hi to Art for Me.
    Dixon also ran for a TD that night (24 YDS!!) He took us into overtime!
    Ben was 66 Pct completion last year. His best ever. he threw 12 interceptions and was SACKED 5o TIMES. No thanks, man. I think Dixon can outpass and outrun him if he was given the chance and not brought up from third string to suddenly start against one of the BEST D in the NFL

  65. Deb says: Jul 22, 2010 9:20 PM

    @gotsix? …
    Wish I worked for the Steelers, thanx LOL But I’m a loyal member of Steeler Nation because I like the way they do things. And no one else is doing it better.
    3 reasons for those 50 sacks:
    1. Play-calling last season was predictable. If you don’t balance run/pass, Ds know to expect pass every down and swarm. Makes QB a sitting duck.
    2. O-line. We have some personnel issues, but guys were out of place on many plays. They’re looking confused like they don’t know who they’re supposed to be blocking. That’s a coaching issue. I’m excited about Kugler hire. He’s a teaching coach and made big improvements on Buffalo’s line. A detail guy. Losing Colon won’t help. And we need to get Pouncey signed, into camp, and out of the spotlight. But at least we have a better coach now.
    3. Speaking ONLY re football, #7 is his own worst enemy. TRULY believes he can make things happen if he keeps the ball. VERY similar gunslinger mentality to Favre. Wants to be the guy who saves the day–see how that ended for Favre in the championship game.
    #7 has things you can’t teach that Dixon does not: Power arm. Elusiveness. Durability. Leadership–forget fans mouthing off about locker-room drama. LISTEN to players talk. They may think he’s a moron off field but they’ll follow him thru hell on field. They trust him to get it done–only a handful of QBs have that and it was a key to winning XLIII.
    He’s got a player’s superstition that modifying his style to take fewer sacks will screw up his mojo. But he needs a firm hand to coach him out of that notion. He can combine instinct and discipline. Constant recklessness is just going to shorten his career.

  66. Deb says: Jul 23, 2010 12:49 AM

    Deb you cant be down on Dixon based on one game.
    ————————————————-
    Not down on Dixon. Proud of his effort. Just because I don’t see elite potential doesn’t mean I’ve written him off. Of 32 QBs, only three are sure HoFers. Five or six more are “elite.” Another five have potential. That’s fewer than half. #7 needs a lot of discipline to unlearn bad habits, but he is one of the elite due to previously mentioned inherent skills Dixon doesn’t possess. But if coaches get creative, Dixon definitely could be a threat in wildcat and “Slash” formations.
    You’ve posted how you feel about #7. Not interested in discussing those issues. But as someone who’s also worked w/many rape victims, find your username offensive because it trivializes a serious subject. The guys chanting that at the draft reminded me of those cheering ON the rapists in “The Accused.” QBs come and go but we’re all Steeler fans. #7’s not here, so the only people affected by your name are Steelers fans who’ve been getting that from haters for months and deserve some peace from their own fans on their own threads. Seems like you could make the point with something that at least tells people what side you’re on … like “lovesteelershateben.”

  67. gotsix? says: Jul 23, 2010 2:50 PM

    Wow she said no,
    that’s some stat work there.
    I’ve got to say the argument of him as a leader is weak as well. Porter had to call him out, and if you listen to Ward’s radio show its obvious he doesn’t like the guy.
    Dixon is the future. Which just makes this whole Leftwich debacle all the harder to take.
    BTW Deb. The key to winning XLIII was not Pig Ben…it was James Harrison and his legendary ride…greatest moment in SB history

  68. Deb says: Jul 23, 2010 4:40 PM

    @gotsix? and …
    1. My earlier comment “Arians was abysmal last year, but many things played into that” was a reference to #7’s interference. As I said, he must be reined in. Didn’t happen under Cowher/Whis, hasn’t happened under Tomlin/Arians. When parents spoil kids, they need to take responsibility.
    2. Whis isn’t there because he took a head-coaching job in Arizona.
    3. Not sure why you provided those stats. I’d already said #7 causes A LOT of those sacks and needs to unlearn bad habits to avoid a short career. I’m aware of his abnormally high sack count and his part in it. But we’ve also had personnel issues going back to Grimm. And line play has deteriorated under Zierlein. But re Batch and Dixon … boys, when your primary job is handing off, you’re not gonna get sacked.
    4. For me, Harrison was MVP of XLIII. A 14-point swing, most important play of the game, and greatest defensive play in SB history. But that’s NOT the point I was making. We needed a miracle drive to win. Team must BELIEVE QB can get it done. His coolness/confidence keeps them cool/confident. #7 was the general on that drive.
    5. The issue Joey addressed several years ago isn’t relevant in 2010. Ward was screaming loudest about not wanting Dixon against the Ravens. Like I said, they may think #7’s a moron, but they want him on the field.
    6. Yes, I’m sure the Leftwich thing is hard to take because if the Steelers saw Dixon as the starter of the future, Leftwich wouldn’t be there.
    7. You don’t decide whether your name is offensive. That’s an emotion experienced by those reacting to it. I’m offended because it trivializes rape and is a horrifying reminder to victims, and the accuser wouldn’t find it supportive. Besides, since you clearly have longtime issues w/#7’s play, I expect it’s really about football anyway. But it’s a free country.
    Bye.

  69. gotsix? says: Jul 23, 2010 8:26 PM

    Just so DEb doesn’t feel like she getting circled like a lion among the jackals, I want to say I imagine if cut she would bleed black and gold…I still think Ben is a problem. He’s no Bradshaw that’s for sure.

  70. Deb says: Jul 24, 2010 12:27 AM

    @ …
    It’s a free country but you share it with others who are also entitled to their opinions. Behaving like the bigger jackass doesn’t make you more right.
    Choose any name you want. But some women who’ve been through that experience will be offended–and I know much more about that than you do. I was just trying to explain that concept, not telling you to stop hating #7. So you can stop disrespecting me by making idiotic comments about heroes. I’m a grown woman and my heroes don’t wear sports uniforms.
    Whis is gone because he wanted to be a head coach. He asked for a guarantee they wouldn’t give so he took the one available. Dan couldn’t guarantee Whis the job without interviewing minority candidates. Dan’s two previous hires were young defensive coaches from outside the organization. His current hire is a young defensive coach from outside the organization. If you’ve researched Tomlin, everything about his background and philosophy matches the Rooneys’ style.
    No, I did not blame the sacks on the o-line. I posted: “3 reasons for those 50 sacks:”
    1. Play-calling …
    2. O-line–some personnel issues and coaching …
    3. #7 is his own worst enemy; keeps the ball; gunslinger mentality; wants to be the guy who saves the day; needs a firm hand; constant recklessness is going to shorten his career.
    Wideouts don’t run the offense, so they cannot be field generals. That’s nuts.
    Porter’s comments are relevant only if #7 is still last to arrive, first to leave. Coaching staff has said he’s not.
    Ward was airing locker-room business in public–nothing to brag about. And he was throwing that hissy fit because Batch was out and he didn’t want Dixon starting that game.
    I never treated you like a kid or showed you the kind of disrespect you’re showing with that bit about being here to set me straight. That’ll be the day. Don’t know who you think you’re talking to with that nonsense, little boy, but the conversation is over.
    @gotsix? …
    You’re right about me bleeding black and gold. Have been since I was a kid–30+ years. Only a deep and abiding love for the team could have kept me with them considering some of the fans I’ve encountered here :) Thanks for being respectful to a fellow member of Steeler Nation. Been surrounded by many jackals of all stripes on these threads. But I’m still standing ;) See you around.

  71. Deb says: Jul 24, 2010 7:29 PM

    @ …
    Shouldn’t come back to this discussion, but your football analysis can be interesting. Yeah, your name is your business–I’ve said that. My criticism wasn’t nasty; just said it offends ME and would offend “some” others. Glad it doesn’t bother your friends. Just because we share a common experience doesn’t mean our views are interchangeable. Let it go–I have.
    Nooo, I didn’t start the name game. You launched with “I’m here to set you straight” and “Ben’s your hero” and “you’re one of those excuse mongers.” I fired back w/”jackass,” etc. I’m no one’s victim. So when people are disrespectful to me, I fire back.
    I don’t like #7 personally. He has Hall-of-Fame potential being wasted by arrogance and undiscipline. I’m furious at the Steelers for kowtowing rather than showing THEY run the team. Read that after bike accident, he’d begun coming early, staying late, studying film. Maybe I was misinformed. Grrrr.
    Hear you about alienating star QB. McDaniels proved his immaturity–much as I dislike Cutler. But you can’t just let an egomaniac QB run your offense into a wall–or kill himself w/recklessness. Read a great article about when #7’s ego started going off the rails and how someone warned the Steelers to get it under control while they could. Too bad they didn’t listen.
    Nope–only general on any offense is the QB. But Tone was brilliant on that drive.
    LOVED Ward for years, but he lost points w/me on that. My personal code: Don’t air family problems. It’s like showing the enemy cracks in your armor. If he wanted to call out #7 in the locker room and the story leaked, that’s different. But don’t get in front of cameras before a big game and run your mouth about your QB. Don’t care if it’s Hines/Ben or T.O./Donovan. Don’t care who’s most respected. Family business stays in-house. Serves no good purpose for the team to put it on TV.
    Great stuff on #7 leaving the pocket too fast and on his pre-snap reads. But have also seen the pocket collapse before he’s out. Still believe we have a combination of issues. But yes, he must modify his style, and address those pocket and read issues.
    Would like to see Dixon in some wildcat formations. Cowher’s offenses may have been overly complicated, but this one is overly simplified. Maybe that’s because #7 doesn’t want to study. Well … this season he’ll have extra time for learning plays.
    If you’re not an ass to me with all that hero and victim junk, I won’t call you an ass or any other name.

  72. BCGreg says: Jul 25, 2010 11:49 PM

    Steelers treatment is “kinda jacked up”?
    You mean like all of the Steelers on the 70s teams on steroids that cheated to get 4 Lombardi’s?

  73. BCGreg says: Jul 26, 2010 12:00 AM

    It’s so fun to listen to Steelers fans argue with one another. I feel like I’m at Wimbledon!
    I also find it funny that Deb likes the way the Steelers dump aging players before their production falls off instead of hanging on to them too long like they did in the 80s.
    It’s funny because the Steelers took the philosophy of the Patriots–a team that Deb and many other Steeler fans like to diss since they can’t beat them–who were the first in this generation to make those kinds of decisions (Milloy, Law, Seymour, Vrabel to name a few) as a way of keeping the team viable for a length of time not just for a few years.

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