***********************

The league was formed by a bunch of guys who reportedly didn’t even pay the $100 it took to gain entry and most of the teams were paid for by a lot less than you think. Only the most recent owners have paid a fair amount of change for their franchises while there are several that are still in the hands of their original owners or families that didn’t cost as much as you think and with the revenue that they get, there’s not as much risk as you think. You take more risk opening up a grocery store than the average NFL owner does when he buys a franchise.

Anyone who uses a line like ” I don’t see why the owners should have to open their books. You don’t ask the owner of the company you work for to open his books to you, do you? ” doesn’t know what they’re talking about.

“For many years, the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) has required charities organized under section 501(c)(3) of the tax code to report their top executives’ salaries on Form 990 when filing tax returns. This information has been made available to the public as a kind of quid pro quo for the favorable tax treatment received by the organizations. The main purpose of reporting the salaries is to provide taxpayers the opportunity to hold charities accountable for abusing their tax-exempt status by overpaying their executives.

Business leagues, defined by Internal Revenue Code section 501(c)(6) as “associations of persons having some common business interest, the purpose of which is to promote such common interest and not to engage in a regular business of a kind ordinarily carried on for profit” also use Form 990. This classification includes professional football leagues like the National Football League (NFL) which earns its revenue from dues paid by its 32 member teams… Business leagues must now report and publicly disclose… key employees that make over $150,000.”

http://jetl.wordpress.com/2008/09/02/show-me-the-money-the-nfls-opposition-to-the-irss-new-public-disclosure-requirements-for-tax-exempt-organizations/

Pay 1/2 of that in tax and the teams keep 5-10%. So at 67%? it seems ok.

It looks like the players are probably getting the better deal. Consider cases like Jamarcus Russel who walks away w $30M guaranteed for 3 years of part time work just isn’t right.

I think the other poster’s point is that the teams are what most fans root for. Every roster is different every single year yet the fans remain. The stars always get replaced (OK, so do some teams nowadays) by new players. I personally will root for my team (even now, ugh)…it matters not, whose name is on the back of the jersey

Each team could in effect take over what the union does for their players (like they do for other employees anyway).

The key for the NFL is a cap only to balance the playing field and protect the small mkt teams. The NFL as a co could still regulate this but in a way the fans self regulate the right % split for players/owners.

The fans pay for the product by watching TV (TV rights paid to teams, TV $ from commercials) or buying tickets/merchandise. For ex if say the cap is too low the talent/team will be lower and there will be less fan interest. This will hurt TV ratings/advertising and the $ paid to the teams for rights. Too high and the team can’t sustain itself. Cos seem to need a t least 5% profit not out of greed but to have the necessary cash for new investment and their growth.

It’s not like the NFL is a monopoly where ridiculous profit can be made. The compete against everything else on TV and other media which is another self regulator. So in a sense the business has a cap on its revenue and cost.

Good point, but if you cut 2 pre-season games you lose 2 games where the coaches can evaluate the on the edge players and 2 added real games increases the number of first line players who can get hurt. An interesting stat would be to look at the season starting rosters of each team – the 53 man squad. Then after 16 games how many of the players on those squads are on IR or have been out for a significant number of games? If they have to play 2 more regular season games I think that nunber would go up a lot more.

With few exceptions, every single job out there has some kind of salary cap. When you apply for your job, you see “Salary range- $X – $X” That’s a salary cap. If you perform well, you can bump yourself into the next salary range, or even make yourself more employable to someone else (Free Agency). If you have a degree, you can go even higher, but you’re still capped out at what the position pays.

Some jobs, like commission based sales or stock trading, don’t have a salary cap. Neither does owning the business. But the large majority of jobs out there do.

As for books being public, only publicly traded companies make their books public, because they have to. Failure to do so would result in a de-listing of their company stock. That said, most jobs aren’t with publicly traded companies. Most jobs are with smaller and mid-sized businesses, who don’t open their books up to their employees.

I restrict myself to only football, and have managed to survive without following the other sports. If the NFL wants to stop workage, in many ways, I will be better off, and there is no guarantee I will come back.

I would root for #16 Shane Falco.

I’m good with Replacements.

SpartaChris,
I did not miss your point, the players do make the game of football not one player, but all the players, It does not matter what team they player for they are still a player. The game of football is larger than one team. With out the players there is no game. With out the owners, the glitz and glam may not be there but I may be diffrent I actualy understand football and it more than just something to watch for me. Dallas is my team every since they had Danny White, but even when they are not playing I watch other teams. I follow highschool and college football as well. So maybe I’m a little diffrent from the norm.

Also if you work in the private sector they do make their books public unless they are privately held, local and federal goverment make their budgets public as well. Unless you work for a small mom and pop buisness your companies profit margin can be found.

It this situation the players are not asking for a raise, the owners want to them to get smaller piece of the pie. I’m with the players, why should the give up % of the revenue when the owners are not being honest about what they are marking by marketing their team and the players the play for them. I bet you along with most others can name way more players in the NFL than owners of NFL teams. Remember the USFL? The did not last, they had owners but not enough good players.

This is all a moot point as the owners are the ones that are signing the contracts in the first place, they just want a rule so other owners who are willing to pay they players more can’t and that’s not right.

I notice you did not address my analogy of asking your self it it’s fair for some one to place a salary cap on your proffesion as a whole?

If it weren’t for the owners putting their money on the line to own a team and form a league the players would be playing pick-up games in the park on weekends. I agree that good players make a good league, there would be no league without money, those great players would never have focused on football if it weren’t for a league that is popular and financially successful enough to pay them, etc. I bet the US has some incredible soccer players, but no one is willing to pay them so as they get older they realize they’ll need to develop other skills if they want to make a living (same with women’s sports, and other non-financially viable sports).

The FANS are the reason the NFL is such an insanely profitable entity.

The FANS are the ones who were there at the beginning and are still here.

The FANS ARE the NFL.

WE are the folks who make this thing go, so you would do well to remember that.

How else to spend a Sunday afternoon in the fall?

Read a book, walk the dog, write a book, take pictures, family time NOT centered around the game, take a drive in the country or in the city, visit your neighbors or invite them over, re-establish contact with someone you haven’t seen in years, haveadoobie and sit on the porch admiring the scenery,

etc.

+

18 regular season games

+

up to 4 post-season games

That’s as many as 26 games.

That’s half a year

That is TOO MUCH
============================
If the 18 game season were to go into effect, they would cut out two pre-season games.

I didn’t say the “Players don’t make the game.” What I said is they are a cog in the big machine that is the whole team. Yes, we pay to go see the players, but in the example I gave, which you obviously missed, I suggested that if one player leaves your favorite team, you still support that team. This tells me that the players specifically are not the product. The team, the brand is.

If you do some research you find that the Owners are not willing to put all their cards on the table and show the players where they are loosing money. In the real world a corporation shows it’s employees the bottom line to justify cuts period.

No, they don’t. Your boss doesn’t come to you with his books wide open and tell you he needs to make cuts, and neither do most people’s bosses. There’s no reason why the players should expect any different from the owners.

Let’s get real here for a moment. It’s not like the players are being forced to play football. They have options, and could choose to do any number of things. They chose football, which is great. Either play for the money they’re offering, find a team offering to pay more or find a new line of work. The owner doesn’t owe it to the players to account for every penny in and out, and the players are unreasonable in asking for it.

Sure there are millions of people that would like to play the game, some of the had a chance to play when scabs filled the rosters and how bad was that. The owners sign the contract so if the don’t want to pay a player a give a mount it’s their choice not to, the player can sign with another team. I’m not sure what you do for a living but I would be pretty pissed if someone capped my salary for what ever work I did no matter where I worked. Uh where is the capitalism in that??????????

Where’s the capitalism in that? You said it yourself- The player can sign with another team. Obviously there are some rules they have to follow, but at some point a player can sign for another team of their choosing for an amount they agree to.

By the way, it’s not like the players are getting robbed. I mean, they do negotiate salaries and such. The team says, “We’ll pay you this much,” the player says, “No, I want this much.” Back and forth they go until they reach an agreement. If they don’t agree, the player sits out. If they do agree, they move on.

Seriously, stop making it sound like the players are mere victims here. They really aren’t.

This is a 3 way deal.

Owners – you pay the players big bucks and there are 2 reasons why – 1) you have lots of bucks to start with

Players – You are all making big bucks now – which you have every right to – and those bucks are coming from 2 sources – 1) The owners, who have big bucks (and big egos)

and

2) – US FANS. WE are the ones who tolerate the huge ticket prices, the outrageous parking fees, the overpriced food, and all the folderol because we love the game.

Lesson to be learned? There is a point at which we say “enough is enough” and with all your silly posts and all the b.s. you insist on throwing in our faces you are pushing us in that direction.

I for one have watched pro football for more than 50 years. I remember ‘The Greatest Game Ever Played’.

The members of the team that won that game needed off-season jobs to make ends meet.

Be VERY careful over the next few months with your little hissy-fit fight – and I am addressing BOTH of you.

+

18 regular season games

+

up to 4 post-season games

That’s as many as 26 games.

That’s half a year

That is TOO MUCH

First, employees all over the country (And probably the world) take pay cuts while doing the same type of work. Sure, it sucks, but it beats the alternative.

Second- I don’t see why the owners should have to open their books. You don’t ask the owner of the company you work for to open his books to you, do you? Of course not, that would be the fastest way to lose your job. Fact is it’s none of the players business how much the owners make. If the owners feel like they should be getting a bigger piece of the pie, so be it. The players aren’t forced to take it either. They also have options- Play for another team or find a different line of work entirely.

Finally, I maintain it is not the players who are the “product,” but the team itself. The brand, if you will. The New York Jets are the product. The Dallas Cowboys are the product. The Chicago Bears are the product. The players are merely employees who, along with all the other employees of the organization, help make the product (The team) better.

For example, if Mark Sanchez, Tony Romo or Jay Cutler get traded and start playing elsewhere, are fans going to stop supporting the Jets, Cowboys or Bears?

Of course not, because most fans have been supporting the Jets, Cowboys or Bears long before Mark Sanchez, Tony Romo or Jay Cutler got there. And most fans will continue to support them long after those players are gone. It is the team itself, not the individual players, that are the product. The players are merely cogs in the machine helping to make the product they represent better. Their performance is definitely the reason we watch, but they are not the product themselves. They are simply a piece of the puzzle.

“The NFL has lost my business, forever!” – 1987.

Funny but the two people that I knew that uttered that, were back at that their TV sets, ready to root for their team when both of those strikes were over and I see it happening again. Unlike the other three, the NFL has bounced back quickly and I don’t see it being any different this time, even if they lose a season. It may take two seasons, at most, but the fans will be back, especially in cities like Green Bay and Pittsburgh, where the realists will understand that once they give up their seat, they’ll be in the ground before they’ll ever be able to get another ticket (I guarantee you that there are fans in those cities that may not want a strike or lockout but who will swoop down and pick up any season tickets that come up for sale because of it and they won’t be thinking of themselves as hypocrites while they’re watching the games). You can talk big but you’ll be back.