Soulman45, I agree with you I think? Seems as if you left out another need that L.A. could invest in is the public school system!

“LA has lost 3 teams. The Chargers started in LA before moving to San Dieago. LA has never really taken to the NFL for some reason. LA loves baseball and basketball, but has a history of apathetic support for the NFL.”

I always find the LA ‘failed as a market’ arguments as somewhat hypocritical. It can also be argued the NFL or in the case of the Rams and Raiders the owners, failed to work with the area to keep the team here.

BTW: The NFL was set against the move of the Rams to STL, but allowed Georgia to move after losing a court case which Al Davis filed against the league arguing that he could move the team from Oakland to LA.

If we use your criteria that the team moved so therefore the city failed, then should we also not lump Baltimore or Cleveland in the same category? How about Houston or Oakland?

On the Chargers: They were the LA Chargers in 1960 and they competed directly against the established NFL franchise. In the early 60′s the AFL was viewed the same way as you see the UFL today.

The Chargers competed against the Rams for one season in LA, the owner, seeing that he was not selling tickets, wisely moved his team to San Diego.

So did LA fail him or did he fail to secure a place in the market?

Curiously another franchise also competed against an NFL team for market share, the Dallas Texans. The NFL established the Cowboys specifically to claim the Dallas market. The Texans were unable to
compete against the Cowboys and moved to KC. So can we also state that Dallas failed as a football market?

The history lesson is simply a device to demonstrate that the rationales for moves are much more complex than the simplistic version
you provide or understand.

As for LA apathy for the NFL, well the late 70′s saw the Rams as one of the hardest tickets to get in LA. The Raiders also saw a great following when they were here. Of course, after the strike of 1987 attendance fell off dramatically.

Both teams were looking for new stadiums by the time the 90′s rolled around and not getting one, moved on. Don’t believe me? The Raiders reasons for moving from LA are well documented in the court ruling for ‘Raiders V NFL’. The Rams reasons are to be found in the deal St Louis gave Georgia F.

“So, my question for all LA supporters is what has changed in the last 25 years?”

Does anything have to change? What do you think should be happening? There is a distinct difference in approach. You and others think LA has to do like most other NFL cities and give the owner anything they want.

But yet more and more cities are adopting LA’s attitude, namely that they are not paying for stadiums. Minneapolis is saying no to public funding, New Jersey said no, New England said no, and New York City killed off the proposed Manhattan stadium. What we see is that bigger and more affluent areas don’t have a need to pay the NFL to come to town. Smaller cities that want to be considered as major players do.

Let me use a golf analogy: The Masters doesn’t beg anyone to come there, the Houston Open does.

It is clear the attitude of the people of LA is and will remain the same, we aren’t writing checks for the NFL. But that does not make it a failed NFL market.

“Why would citizens support an NFL franchise now, when they couldn’t or wouldn’t before?”

How many citizens does it take to support an NFL franchise? If we use the common fans model, (The stadium has to be filled.), I could argue that is not more than 120,000. You can’t get many more people into a stadium, now can you? But that 120k has to have some spending money, the ability to buy suites and club seats, and they have to do it 8 times a year.

So how do you define support? I would offer that your POV and the NFL’s are different.

So, my question for all LA supporters is what has changed in the last 25 years? We know about the markets size, but it has been the 2nd largest market for almost 40 years! Why would citizens support an NFL franchise now, when they couldn’t or wouldn’t before?

“Thanks for the tired steaming pile of crap that you call the TV, music, and film industry.”

Your welcome. I see you pay attention to it so thanks for the money as well.

“What would we do without American Idol and Lady GaGa?”

Not sure, but we have plenty of other ideas and options for even the most ignorant amongst us. Like you.

“California is broke. L.A. is a sprawling out of control cluster and you are being bleed dry by a ton of illegals.”

Okay. Enjoy everything around you today. Your food? Probably picked by an illegal. The parts of your car, probably came through an LA port. The NFL Network? That is down the street from me. And I can go on, but you get the picture.

Now where are you from again?

“Enjoy that smog covered sun shine.”

I will. Heading to the beach today and you?

“You know what would make me feel better?
The NFL settling the lock out instead of focusing on how to put yet another team in L.A.”

You must not be following along as that is exactly what is happening.

“That and Jessica Alba.”

Jessica would need someone that will pay attention to her, not sure you are up to the task.

“But California can support a third AFC team when the two AFC teams already there have blackout issues and need new stadiums?”

The California teams all need new stadiums, no doubt. Which will help the blackout situation.

I think a team with a newer stadium and blackout issues probably has more to be concerned with.

But if Al and Dean want to avoid blackouts they should follow the Weaver lead and cut ticket prices.

As one wag wrote after the Lakers loss to the Mavs, “Lakers lose, but it is still 78 degrees and sunny outside the next day so enjoy another perfect So. Cal day.”
So what have we done? Nothing, but then again we don’t need to do anything more.
====================================

Thanks for the tired steaming pile of crap that you call the TV, music, and film industry.
What would we do without American Idol and Lady GaGa?

California is broke. L.A. is a sprawling out of control cluster and you are being bleed dry by a ton of illegals.
Enjoy that smog covered sun shine.

@ philtration:

“If they could not support the Rams and the Raiders then why does anyone believe that they would come out to see an expansion team? . . .They had their chances and they did not care. Move on already.”

Not exactly what happened, but if it makes you feel better you continue believing it.
====================================

You know what would make me feel better?
The NFL settling the lock out instead of focusing on how to put yet another team in L.A.

That and Jessica Alba.

“They have already HAD at least 2 and failed every time. . . .Raiders, Rams…”

You do know why these teams left don’t you? If not you should look it up.

“2, then 1, then 0 teams. I want to know what LA has done, other than grouse about a stadium, to become a better NFL market.”

Hmmm…..your post reflects the differing attitude between LA and other towns.

LA looks at it this way: We have 17 million people in the region with billions in discretionary spending money. We are the home of the TV, music, and film industry. We have the second largest TV market. We are the gateway to the Asian and Latino markets. So if you want to come and do business here, fine. If not, that is fine as well.

And other localities see themselves as ‘needing’ the NFL. Smaller cities are more than willing to give the NFL and the team owner anything they want to keep a team, LA doesn’t.

We don’t see a team as being our ‘identity’. It doesn’t define us nor does it reflect our self worth. Without a team we are still a big city with lots of money.

As one wag wrote after the Lakers loss to the Mavs, “Lakers lose, but it is still 78 degrees and sunny outside the next day so enjoy another perfect So. Cal day.”

So what have we done? Nothing, but then again we don’t need to do anything more.

But California can support a third AFC team when the two AFC teams already there have blackout issues and need new stadiums?

Jun 22, 2011 3:08 AM
dontouchmyjunk says:
Jun 21, 2011 9:01 PM

“The teams that are out are the Chargers and the Raiders. The state of California already has those teams. The state would not help them relocate to LA. What the state will get behind is an entirely new business in the state. That means a team from one of your towns.”
————————————–

You obviously know little about team relocation, funding and the process that goes behind it…the “State” plays little to no role. If Davis or Spanos see Los Angeles as a viable market with a Stadium ready to fill…they will relocate…plain and simple.

Get a clue bud, this like any other business, not politics…and as a Charger fan this is a reality I hate to accept.

F-the lockout

Juday

______________________________
I think what he talking about when he say the State wont get behind it is, AEG is asking the State for money (I think I heard 300 M) and they wont give money if a team from within CA just moves to LA. They want NEW business

They have already HAD at least 2 and failed every time.

Raiders, Rams…

MJD is welcome to take HIS team there

What is he gonna say next? that there needs to be a “player-owned team”?

LA is the second or third biggest potential NFL market in the US, but they were 2nd or 3rd biggest market when they had 2, then

“The teams that are out are the Chargers and the Raiders. The state of California already has those teams. The state would not help them relocate to LA. What the state will get behind is an entirely new business in the state. That means a team from one of your towns.”
————————————–

You obviously know little about team relocation, funding and the process that goes behind it…the “State” plays little to no role. If Davis or Spanos see Los Angeles as a viable market with a Stadium ready to fill…they will relocate…plain and simple.

Get a clue bud, this like any other business, not politics…and as a Charger fan this is a reality I hate to accept.

F-the lockout

Juday

“We get all the games we won’t on TV their is no money to build anything in LA that is money that can be use for a need people is in need of food housing the thing it take to live. You can’t build a stadium with no money.”

You do know the proposed stadiums, if built, will be built with private money? So unless AEG or Majestic Realty is in the homeless shelter business, the poor will not lose out on housing.

Check out the LA Times and the San Gabriel Valley Tribune for the stories…..

“If they could not support the Rams and the Raiders then why does anyone believe that they would come out to see an expansion team? . . .They had their chances and they did not care. Move on already.”

Not exactly what happened, but if it makes you feel better you continue believing it.

Jacksonville.

Jacksonville who? Jacksonville who?

Don’t deserve an NFL team either.

Oh wait, no he isn’t.

Los Angeles is not some mythical destination just waiting for an NFL team to love.
They had their chances and they did not care.
Move on already.