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Jerry Rice: Randy Moss’s laziness was hard for me to swallow

JerryRiceGetty Getty Images

Jerry Rice is widely regarded as the best wide receiver ever to play the game, but he says he wasn’t the most talented. Randy Moss, Rice says, was more talented.

And Rice doesn’t mean that as a compliment.

On ESPN Radio this morning, Rice said he always had a hard time watching Moss because Rice hated to see a player so naturally gifted not making the most of those gifts.

“It was hard for me to swallow because I was not as talented and I had to work harder,” Rice said. “To see a guy with that much talent not give it 100 percent, it was almost like a little slap in the face. But Randy was Randy.”

Rice said he wonders what kind of player Moss would have been with a better work ethic.

“He could have been one of the greatest if he had worked just a little bit harder,” Rice said. “I don’t think he wanted to give it 100 percent. You never knew what you were going to get with Randy. Sometimes you’d get the unbelievable guy, the amazing guy. Other times you’d get the guy that took a couple plays off.”

In Rice’s view, the unbelievable, amazing guy didn’t show up to work often enough.

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161 Responses to “Jerry Rice: Randy Moss’s laziness was hard for me to swallow”
  1. tylerdurden187 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:17 AM

    He is one of the greatest of all time Jerry, stop being bitter.

  2. Waxxx4321 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:17 AM

    Well Jerry Rice now will always be the greatest, Moss could of should of would of..No excuses but everything happens for a reason..the example you set is made by the decisions you make.

  3. alonestartexan says: Aug 9, 2011 8:18 AM

    BURN !

  4. cavredleg15 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:20 AM

    That is the difference between Rice and Moss.
    Jerry Rice knew he had to work for everything. Randy Moss just existed with everything. There is no doubt Randy Moss is probably the most physically gifted WR in the history of the game.
    There are plenty of men who physically could be HOF material, however the mental aspect of the game is where players are separated.

  5. udontknowjaq says: Aug 9, 2011 8:20 AM

    “He could have been one of the greatest if he had worked just a little bit harder,
    ______________

    Sorry to say J.Rice as lazy as Moss played sometimes… He was 1 of the greatest!

  6. paulieorkid says: Aug 9, 2011 8:22 AM

    Rice’s comments are spot on – on all fronts. As for Rice on himself, he DID work his ass off — everyone knows about his legendary work ethic and “the hill.” Big kudos to the GOAT.

    As for Rice’s comments on Moss, hell – Moss admits it himself when he openly states he “plays when he wants to play.” How lame is that? I’m sure the employer paying him mega-millions must be comforted to know Moss only gives it up if it suits him personally. His teammates and coaches must be equally soothed knowing Randy is only out for himself. What a turd.

    Moss’ dropping F bombs and other profanities over catered food Moss wouldn’t feed to his dog and harsh words to the staff serving the team – while a Patriot shows what kind of person Moss was.

    Moss had dozens of other lame incidents, but that one shed light on the real Randy. Credit to New England for showing him the door after that.

  7. stinkfingers says: Aug 9, 2011 8:26 AM

    Moss is still considered one of the greatest WR to ever play, but there is no doubt that he could have been more if not for his piss poor attitude.

  8. robinyount19 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:26 AM

    Moss was lazy? I can already see the headline to the next breaking news story: “Scientists discover water is wet”.

  9. jimmysee says: Aug 9, 2011 8:27 AM

    In the work ethic department, Donald Driver reminds me of Jerry Rice.

  10. justentertainingthestupid says: Aug 9, 2011 8:27 AM

    He’s stating a fact that all of Moss’ coaches would probably agree with. I don’t see the problem with what he is saying.

  11. joecool16280 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:28 AM

    Simply the best. The combo of Montana to Rice was the two best at their positions…of all time.

  12. zimaman says: Aug 9, 2011 8:29 AM

    Dear Jerry Rice -

    I know you think you are gods gift to creation but the statement that Moss “could have been one of the greatest” is foolhearty at best.

    Moss is one of the greatest. Okay, you think he was lazy. Maybe, his attitude sucks or he took plays off , pain in the keester- whatever.

    Moss made catches that no other human being on the planet could make for a long time.

    Some would say on that alone he was the greatest, most talented and gifted wideout to ever play the game. Those that agree with me are likely in the minority because of the “other factors”. But if you only consider what went on in between the sidelines and he did not have Joe Montana or Steve Young chucking him the ball for his whole career Moss WAS better than Rice.

  13. udontknowjaq says: Aug 9, 2011 8:31 AM

    Straight Bust Hommie! Moss HOF speech!

  14. jjrs89 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:31 AM

    maybe moss was kind of a slouch but he is still 1 of the greatest of all time. I don’t understand where jerry rice is coming from when he says that he’s “could’ve been.” No matter what way you slice it randy moss is still 1 of the 5 greatest wide receivers to ever play the game

  15. zappa69 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:32 AM

    Hard to believe a man from Frisco had a hard time swallowing.

  16. duanethomas says: Aug 9, 2011 8:33 AM

    Doesn’t matter what anybody thinks Randy Moss will be in the same HOF as Jerry Rice. He will and his viewed as one of the greatest, despite his warts.

  17. redbird80 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:34 AM

    Randy WAS one of the greatest Jerry. In his prime Moss was the most exciting player ever. I will miss him.

  18. eodmike says: Aug 9, 2011 8:34 AM

    Hard to find fault in Jerry’s assessment. If anybody has the perspective and credentials to criticize Moss, its him.

  19. iplayforrexryan says: Aug 9, 2011 8:34 AM

    I have a poster in my room:
    “Dulcius ex asperis”
    Sweeter after difficulty

    The fact that he never got a ring, especially during his 2007 campaign, tells me that there is justice in the football world.

  20. theytukrjobs says: Aug 9, 2011 8:35 AM

    Plays Moss took off were typically running plays to the back side. Not sure how much better his numbers would have been had he blocked and run shadow routes on those.

    As far as work ethic he was widely regarded as one of the hardest workers at least in his first stint with the Vikings.

    The guy had a holier than thou personality but this myth that he didn’t work at anything is just a simple jab by folks who take the fact that Moss took certain plays off way too far.

    The other thing with Moss taking plays off is that there aren’t really any other WR’s in the league that run go routes over 50% of the time and were on the field every down. For most teams the “burner” got to rest up after long runs. Moss had such excellent conditioning that he was able to run a lot more yards than a typical player, but still required some rests.

    A lot of times when he took a play off he blew by a defender on the next down.

    Just saying. Taking them off is a bad team mate thing to do but it is a myth that he could have had much better number had he blocked more.

  21. netherscourge says: Aug 9, 2011 8:36 AM

    Moss was just a lazy pothead.

    All the talent in the world – and he flushed it down the toilet.

    T.O. > Moss

  22. mdd913 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:38 AM

    Don’t know why Rice is bitter.

    At the end of the day, he is still the greatest to ever play and Moss, as good as he was, will always have a tarnished image. Rice’s hard work paid off, Moss didn’t work hard and he’ll be mostly forgotten.

  23. laxer37 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:40 AM

    tylerdurden187 says:

    He is one of the greatest of all time Jerry, stop being bitter.

    —————–
    How’s the guy bitter? He answered a question truthfully.

    It’s no secret Moss was a tremendously talented slacker.

  24. bradymancrush10 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:42 AM

    @tylerdurden187
    How can you say Jerry Rice is being bitter? He is just stating the obvious.
    Rice has been voted the greatest player in the NFL on the NFL Network. I think he knows what it takes to be great.
    Rice has 2 Super Bowls; Randy, 0

  25. tennesseeoilers says: Aug 9, 2011 8:42 AM

    One year after the Oilers arrived in Tennessee, they passed on Randy Moss, electing to draft Kevin Dyson instead. And to this day, I’m thankful they did. (Music City Miracle? Sure, but more than that, Dyson didn’t take plays off.) Rice’s sentiments are spot on and sum up exactly why I never respected or appreciated Moss. He would’ve no more been the missing ingredient for a championship in Tennessee than he was anywhere else.

  26. botchedextrapoint says: Aug 9, 2011 8:45 AM

    Saw the words “Randy” and “hard to swallow”in the title and thought I’d logged onto a different sort of less family oriented website.

  27. semperfi24 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:45 AM

    Moss breaking his single season TD record was hard for him to swallow too… He spent weeks making sure everyone knew that it took Moss more games…

  28. akismet-0471142e4db6bf4edbfd8363d280b966 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:45 AM

    Hey everybody!! Look at me!! Look at me!! I’m the greatest but I had to work harder than everyone!!

    Blah blah blah. This is akin to Montana calling out the movie Rudy as “an exaggeration” and saying lots of that stuff “didn’t happen.”

    Why is being regarded as great or the best not enough? Why do these has beens have to opine about everyone else? Shut up already. You’re in the hall of fame Jerry. Act like it.

  29. pfahy22 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:46 AM

    Moss was already in Minnesota when catering rant occurred. Only thing worse than no talent is Wasted talent – Moss only had to keep his mouth shut in New England and play another year or two and walk redeemed into the sunset.

  30. sterling7 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:47 AM

    How ironic, I got into this incredibly huge argument with my sister-in-law about Randy Moss being released by the Vikings last year. My sister-in-law claims that he would be picked up when the Vikings let him go and that he is the best receiver in football so how could the Vikings release him. I argued Randy Moss could’ve been the best ever but he is his own worst enemy. Randy Moss is lazy not to mention has huge attitude problems-he never grew up! If you want to know how bad his work ethic is talk to the Oakland Raiders. I also stated can you imagine the statistics Randy Moss would have if he had just half of Jerry Rice’s work ethic? Needless to say it was like talking to a wall……………

  31. biggerballz says: Aug 9, 2011 8:48 AM

    give me a break rice, you had 2 hall of famer qbs. This guy had one and was on two of the most prolific scoring teams of all time. You set the record for rec TD in a strike season, he broke it during a real season. You are a hard worker, but you are also overrated selfish diva that played the game when we didn’t have 24/7 espn and media. Or you would be known as the most selfish player in the history of the game.

  32. rooneyruleblues says: Aug 9, 2011 8:48 AM

    Rice was a GREAT player. But I wish people only knew how big of an a hole this guy was. Most people see the smile and the laugh but behind the scenes he was one of the biggest aholes in NFL history. I feel sorry for the little people at Bristol that will need to put up with that ego at ESPN.

  33. gulaid26 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:51 AM

    It’s obvious Moss was a front runner. Years where his team was competitive or early in the season he was unstoppable. When they would fall out of contention, or the team just stunk he would mentally checkout. He obviously didn’t love the game as much as a guy like Rice. Now that he is “retired” just accept him for what he is, the best deep threat of all time.

  34. bhester1906 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:53 AM

    Took plays off, ran when he wanted, didn’t execute plays unless it was to him, ran one route, and is still a great. The people bashing should realize that he is better than them even when he is hardly trying.

  35. torturedraiderfan says: Aug 9, 2011 8:55 AM

    Moss was a dog. He only played when he wanted to play…….so he only should have been paid when the team wanted to pay. Given the way Jerry Rice played, its no wonder Moss’ laziness was hard for him to swallow. It would be an insult to Jerry Rice and the rest of the players in the Hall Of Fame to have Moss inducted.

  36. rubicon202 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:56 AM

    I agree…I seen him in Oakland and he took most plays if not all off…prolific indeed but work ethic not…

  37. philyeagles5 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:57 AM

    tylerdurden187 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:17 AM
    He is one of the greatest of all time Jerry, stop being bitter.
    ===============================

    hes not bitter. hes 100% right. who knows what Randy Moss really couldve been.

  38. platinumraider32 says: Aug 9, 2011 9:00 AM

    “Talent” is like a mini skirt, looks real nice and inviting, but you can’t see what’s underneath it!!!

  39. moneymike23 says: Aug 9, 2011 9:04 AM

    He will obviously get in the HOF but I hope it takes him a long long time.

  40. rugdog100 says: Aug 9, 2011 9:15 AM

    Randy’s laziness was from the dubage.

  41. c1d7 says: Aug 9, 2011 9:21 AM

    jimmysee says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:27 AM
    In the work ethic department, Donald Driver reminds me of Jerry Rice.

    ___________________________________

    Is that real? I don’t care if it’s work ethic department or sports apparel please don’t put Donald Driver and Jerry Rice in the same sentence..Let me guess John Kuhn’s work ethic reminds you of Jarome Bettis too…

  42. essentialsausage says: Aug 9, 2011 9:21 AM

    Hey Jerry Rice, U MAD?

  43. svcfilmguy says: Aug 9, 2011 9:21 AM

    “It was hard for me to swallow because I was not as talented and I had to work harder…To see a guy with that much talent not give it 100 percent, it was almost like a little slap in the face.”

    Why was it so hard to swallow? Why was it a slap in the face? You weren’t as physically talented? Boo hoo hoo! I have nothing but respect for Rice, but he sounds a bit juvenile here. We get it Jerry, we get it…you were the hardest worker ever, in the history of everything, and anyone more naturally gifted than you who didn’t put in as much work basically spit in your face.

    Why can’t Jerry just let guys underachieve in their careers and be happy with his? Moss’s loafing ways have nothing to do with Rice. Nothing. Nada.

  44. briank1ne says: Aug 9, 2011 9:22 AM

    wasnt there a time when moss broke jerry rices single season td record that jerry called him to congratulate him and moss didnt take the call or something? I mean how rude is that. Listen Moss…you might have the single season record buddy. BUT… you cant disrespect the man that has every other record in the book.

    Moss, when it comes to football you may be very nice but in real life. Youre just a generic jerry rice.

    All hail to the true GOAT of this game. Work ethic, personality, and gameplay. He beats everyone in all 3 of those categories.

  45. rameyag says: Aug 9, 2011 9:27 AM

    It kills me when people complain about what Moss “could have been” had he only worked harder.

    What could Babe Ruth have been had he worked harder instead of partying?

    What could Mickey Mantle have been had he worked harder?

    What could Paul Hornung have been had he worked harder?

    What could Joe Namath have been had he worked harder?

    This whining about hall of fame athletes is only a recent phenomenon in our “holier than thou” society.

    No one said Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, Paul Hornung, or Joe Namath should have waited for induction into their halls of fame because of what they “could have been” had they only “worked harder.”

    They were appreciated for what they did on the field of battle and as to off the field, well, that was part of their personalities.

    And, for those who try to say Randy “took plays off.”

    First, no player, including Jerry Rice, gave it all on every play. That simply isn’t possible, particularly for a wide receiver who isn’t involved in most plays. Ruth, Mantle, Hornung, and Namath all “took plays off,” just as every hall of famer in every sport.

    Second, Randy “dogged it” on certain plays in order to set up the defender for later plays. All good offensive football players do. It is part of the the game.

    Finally, the records speak for themselves:

    Moss is third all-time for rookie TDs, behind only Gale Sayers and Eric Dickerson.

    Moss is third all-time for rookie receiving yards, behind only Bill Groman and Anquan Boldin.

    Moss is second all-time in seasons with over 1,000 receiving, behind only Jerry Rice.

    Moss is second all-time in games with more than 100 yards receiving, behind only Jerry Rice.

    Moss is third all-time in 100 yard receiving games per season.

    Moss is third all-time in leading the lead in TDs receiving, behind only Don Hutson and Jerry Rice.

    Moss is second all-time in career TDs, behind only Jerry Rice.

    Moss is first all-time in receiving TDs in one season.

    Most is first all-time in receiving TDs in a rookie season.

    Moss is second all-time in receiving TDs in one game, behind only Bob Shaw, Kellen Winslow, and Jerry Rice.

    Moss is third all-time in most consecutive games with a receiving TD, behind only Jerry Rice, Crazylegs Hirch, and Buddy Dial.

    Who is the best receiver all-time?

    The numbers speak for themselves — it is Jerry Rice.

    But, who is the second best?

    The numbers speak for themselves — it is Randy Moss.

    Now, Jerry, if I were you, I’d keep a little quiet in my criticism of Randy, because you posted your numbers in 20 seasons. Randy has posted his in only 13.

    Don’t give him any more incentive to come back and finish the job.

  46. raven4life21 says: Aug 9, 2011 9:27 AM

    What gets me is how all these comments on here defending Randy Moss as being one of the “best of all time” yet still blatantly admitting he was lazy… im sorry… the word “lazy” doesn’t fit Hall of Fame Caliber… that word alone takes any credibility away from him being “one of the greatest”… he may have been “one of the greatest” when HE felt like it… im sorry… the true GREATS don’t just play hard when they “feel like it” or when it “suits them”… the TRUE GREATS play hard 100% of the time

  47. flakazoid says: Aug 9, 2011 9:28 AM

    Can anyone think of two less anticipated Hall of Fame speeches than Randy Moss & Terrell Owens?

  48. svcfilmguy says: Aug 9, 2011 9:34 AM

    @raven4life21,

    Do you have any idea how many people would need to be removed from professional sports’ Halls of Fame if playing hard 100% of the time was a prerequisite? Those halls would get bare in a big hurry.

  49. kiltherl says: Aug 9, 2011 9:40 AM

    After hearing Rice’s comments I feel Moss was spoiled by his own talents. If you have everything given to you, you’d probably take it for granted.

  50. ny82jy says: Aug 9, 2011 9:41 AM

    I dont care what rice says. I would take him anyday of the week over moss. Rice Played the game the right way and with class. Something moss will never know anything about. Still waiting for the pats to pickup some more scraps and resign moss the washed up diva.

  51. c1d7 says: Aug 9, 2011 9:43 AM

    Also, could you imagine if Moss had Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing him the ball for 90% of his career? I understand that’s neither here nor there as far as Moss’ work ethic but Moss had three seasons with a hall of fame quarterback and on the downside of his career put up record numbers. I wonder how great Jerry’s numbers would’ve been with Cunningham, Culpepper, Bauman, George, Collins, (just to name a few) throwing him the ball in the prime of his career vs. Joe Montana and Steve Young?

  52. rabidbillsfan says: Aug 9, 2011 9:50 AM

    @c1d7

    Don’t forget about Brooks, and Andrew Walter. That just makes your argument better becasue noone remembers those guys anyway. He also got Cassell his own gig.

  53. stanmackley says: Aug 9, 2011 9:58 AM

    Moss is trying to avoid fading away his final year like Rice did on the Raiders.

  54. nyyankeedave says: Aug 9, 2011 9:58 AM

    zappa69 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:32 AM
    Hard to believe a man from Frisco had a hard time swallowing.

    ===================================

    Speaking from experience, zappa69 ? You don’t have to post a gay joke every time an SF story comes up. But if you are, don’t leave out meccas like Washington, Miami, Houston, Seattle, Dallas, Atlanta, Chicago, Oakland, San Diego, Denver, and of course my town, New York!

  55. threedeep1998 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:00 AM

    It amazes me that people are interviewing people like Steve Young and Jerry Rice about Moss’s retirement. They hardly were in the league/even know who Randy is. Why hasn’t anyone interviewed people like Randall Cunningham, Cris Carter, or Robert Smith? Jerry Rice dodged a bullet because if Moss stayed in the league longer he would have beaten Rice’s records.

  56. vikingbill1 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:01 AM

    Rice can S T F U. Moss has almost eclipsed Rices numbers in nearly HALF the time…take away the years in Oakland, Moss owns ALL receiving records…

  57. bozosforall says: Aug 9, 2011 10:04 AM

    bradymancrush10 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:42 AM
    @tylerdurden187
    How can you say Jerry Rice is being bitter? He is just stating the obvious.
    Rice has been voted the greatest player in the NFL on the NFL Network. I think he knows what it takes to be great.
    Rice has 2 Super Bowls; Randy, 0

    __
    Make that 3 Super Bowl titles. And one Super Bowl MVP.

  58. bozosforall says: Aug 9, 2011 10:05 AM

    semperfi24 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:45 AM
    Moss breaking his single season TD record was hard for him to swallow too… He spent weeks making sure everyone knew that it took Moss more games…

    __
    Let’s not forget that half of those TDs that Moss caught that year were from 10 yards or less (just like half of Brady’s TD passes that year). They were both record chasing, nothing more.

    Something easy to swallow: Bill and Tom’s choads by Pats fans like you.

  59. thearvidian says: Aug 9, 2011 10:08 AM

    Here’s what Moss meant by the infamous ‘I play when I want to play’ when asked the question ‘does so and so coach make you want to play harder – motivate you to play harder?’:
    What he said was: “No, I play when I want to play”. What he should have said and what he meant was “No, I do not need external motivation – I motivate myself – I do not need any external motivation – I motivate myself”. People never understand nor care to comprehend the context from which that statement came. He was always the hardest worker on the team. Two incidents that I detested: Walking off the field against the skins with TWO seconds left (though his desire to win and his disgust with the loss was the motivation – he didn’t look at ‘walking to the locker room with two seconds left on the clock’ as an abandonment of his teammates), and the insensitive remark in the Vikings locker room last year to the catering business. Randy lacked judgement and couth. He is a country-bumpkin from west virginia, not, as often depicted, an inner-city punk. Imperfect – yes! Rough around the edges – yes! Uncaring, insensitive Ass – NO! The guy was phenomenal. I hope he plays a bit more…..

  60. hatesycophants says: Aug 9, 2011 10:13 AM

    @rameyag,

    Excellent post.

  61. billsfan1 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:17 AM

    Wgive me a break rice, you had 2 hall of famer qbs. This guy had one and was on two of the most prolific scoring teams of all time. You set the record for rec TD in a strike season, he broke it during a real season. You are a hard worker, but you are also overrated selfish diva that played the game when we didn’t have 24/7 espn and media. Or you would be known as the most selfish player in the history of the game.
    ..wasn’t ESPN started in 1979? Wasn’t rice drafted in 1985? Not sure where u r going with this but ur last 3 sentences give u no credibility…

  62. dte421 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:19 AM

    @threedeep1998 and @vikingbill1 – uninformed people like you are why the internet sucks.

    Moss finished with 595 fewer catches, 8037 fewer yards, and 54 fewer TD’s. He was NOWHERE NEAR breaking Rice’s records, and considering how awful he looked last year, it’s not like he retired on top. Also consider that Rice’s early years were in a much less pass-friendly league with rules that actually allowed CB’s to cover.

    Glorifying a WR who for most of his career refused to go over the middle, never blocked, and took plays off is just wrong – especially in comparison to a the greatest ever to play the game. The only thing Moss did better than Rice was go deep. Rice was a better route runner, a better blocker, had better hands, and was better with the ball after the catch. Moss is 100 percent the greatest deep threat to play the game, but the comparisons stop there. Let’s not be revisionist and ridiculous.

  63. bcgreg says: Aug 9, 2011 10:21 AM

    @ paulieorkid

    The incident with the caterer happened when Moss was a member of the Vikings. It did NOT occur when he was with the Pats.

  64. qdog112 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:25 AM

    Jerry is absolutely correct. Moss had the most tools, but not the common sense to be all he could be. The worse thing any athlete or anyone on any team at work or at play, can do is admit to not putting forth effort all the time. You can never say you take plays off – even if you do.

  65. vadog says: Aug 9, 2011 10:29 AM

    As a long time Vikings fan it pains me to say that Rice is 100% correct!

  66. bcgreg says: Aug 9, 2011 10:32 AM

    @ dte421

    Really? The one thing Moss had better than Rice was hands (and speed–OK 2 things).

    And how did Rice look in Seattle? He didn’t retire on top. Not many do (Barry Sanders, Jim Brown did. Name me another. Elway?).

    Moss had a slightly better skill set. Rice had a much better work ethic. Rice’s attitude and work ethic pushes him past Moss. But if you gave me a choice between a 100% Jerry Rice versus a 100% Randy Moss, I’d take Moss. The difference between the 2 isn’t the skill set so much as the attitude. Because of that, taking Moss is dicey. You never knew which Moss you’d get. You always knew Jerry Rice would show up.

  67. hit2hurt says: Aug 9, 2011 10:34 AM

    Randy Moss is to Jerry Rice what Barry Sanders is to Emmitt Smith.. and I’m a Dallas Cowboys fan.

  68. tmac4454 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:37 AM

    My man JR, Mississippi native. You have to be taught from childhood about work ethics, if it was not presented to you, then you don’t know. As your homey, thanks for all the good times while I was residing in the Bay Area from 84-89. It was a pleasure waking up at 9:30am on Sundays getting ready to watch the Gold Rush. Moss could have been a great player but he was selfish and seemed to be a little immature. He had problems while he was in college then escalated to the pro’s. He was a sight to see when Culpepper/Cunningham/Moon was in Minn. I just wish him the best. I do hope that he get into the HOF, I just don’t think he will be on the first ballot.

  69. kellyb9 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:40 AM

    There’s absolutely no doubt in my mind that Randy Moss could have passed Jerry Rice as the greatest reciever in the history of the NFL. Jerry Rice had, for the majority of his career, two future hall of fame QBs (Montana and Young) and one very, very good QB (Ganon) throwing to him. Moss had a career where he made Culpepper look like a HOF QB, disappeared in Oakland, took Brady to the next level, and then.. well disapppeared again. It seemed like when he had a halfway competent QB he was unstoppable.

  70. TheWizard says: Aug 9, 2011 10:41 AM

    Totally agree.

    That’s why he didn’t finish a Patriot.

    Indeed, that’s why he made it to the Patriots in the first place.

  71. thehouseofho says: Aug 9, 2011 10:42 AM

    I find all the Jerry Rice hating going on here ridiculous. Mike Greenberg asked him specifically what he thought of the fact that Moss had all this talent, but not the work ethic of Jerry Rice. Rice answered the question honestly and candidly. That’s how he’s always been and that’s why people considered him a total dbag when he was a player.

    His only misstatement was saying Randy could have been one of the greatest because, let’s face it, Moss is already one of the greatest. To say that Rice needs to mind his own business is just as big as a misstatement because when someone asks you a question in an interview it is your business to answer it honestly.

  72. ron69 says: Aug 9, 2011 10:46 AM

    I wouldn’t want to tell my children “look son he was Randy Moss a HOFer the greatest talent ever but also was selfish, diva, lazy……. if he gets in let’s induct Bo Jackson and some others who had world class talent

  73. returnofmeezle says: Aug 9, 2011 10:50 AM

    I’ve always thought Rice was a tad bit overrated. Played with two hofers, in an revolutionary offense. While he took advantage of his opportunities via hard work, he is still partially a product of those other factors.

    Moss isn’t even as good as TO. ON THE FIELD, the only real knock on TO is he occasionally dropped a few. other than that to is an all around better receiver than both in my opinion.

  74. souldogdave says: Aug 9, 2011 10:52 AM

    Moss will always be tainted by his time on the Raiders. He punked the whole time.That selfish, me-first stuff should count against him.It’s been a running theme throughout his career.I would vote against him for that reason.There are standards to be upheld by professionals, he willfully refused to uphold those standards periodically in his career.At least make him wait 20 years…

  75. svcfilmguy says: Aug 9, 2011 10:58 AM

    T.O. occasionally dropped a few? And Pacman Jones occasionally has run-ins with the law.

  76. dte421 says: Aug 9, 2011 11:02 AM

    @bcgreg – are you out of your goddamn mind? Jerry Rice had the greatest hands in the history of the NFL, the dude practiced growing up by catching bricks. I can’t even begin to respect someone that thinks Moss had better hands than Rice.

    I said NOTHING about Rice retiring on top – my point was that there was no chance that Moss was going to come anywhere near Rice’s records, as he clearly was in decline last year.

    Moss did by no means have a better skill set. He was faster than Rice, and had good hands. Rice had even better hands, and did EVERYTHING ELSE on the football field better than Moss.

  77. rdcameron says: Aug 9, 2011 11:02 AM

    You won’t find a bigger Randy Moss fan than me, but Jerry Rice made some valid points. Rice, who was the undisputed greatest receiver who ever lived, was not as gifted as Moss, no one who ever played that position was. That part I agree with.

    And Rice is not the only HOF receiver who has been critical of Randy’s effort, Michael Irvin was very critical of Randy for many years for the same reasons. It’s not like Rice and Irvin are ripping Moss for no reason, they see a guy who was the most gifted receiver who ever played that position who could have been the best and they feel that he didn’t do everything possible to be the very best.

    I can’t defend Randy’s effort in 2006 when he was in Oakland, or how he played at times last year. But one thing I will say is Randy’s “I’ll play when I want to play” comment is over-stated and over-blown. In Randy’s first 7 years as a Viking, he put up Jerry Rice-numbers without a HOF QB throwing to him. We all saw what happened when he played with Tom Brady for 2 full seasons. I always wondered what Randy’s numbers would have looked like if he would have avoided going to Oakland and if he played with a Hall of Fame QB for most of his career like Rice and Irvin did.

    Regardless of Randy’s “lack of effort” he was the greatest deep threat who’s ever lived, he was great in the red zone, was one of the best sideline-toe-tapping receivers of all time and he made one-handed leaping catches look easy. Randy Moss should be a first ballot Hall of Famer based on his production but because of how he played in Oakland, his performance last year and some of his other incidents, there is no way that will happen with how the Hall of Fame voting process is currently constructed.

  78. pongonfl says: Aug 9, 2011 11:02 AM

    I think on review of his words, Rice would concede that Moss is one of the greatest, if he is not, then they have to start pulling players out of the HOF. There are steelers recievers in the hall that cant carry Mosses jock.

    But everything else Rice said is right on. Rice had the advantage of a healthy ego and a mental maturity that made him the best and helped make two QBs the best too. For Moss, his work with Brady made it clear just what a QB Brady is. But others.. meh.
    But Rice played with a fire in his belly, Moss with a chip on his shoulder, there is no comparison as to the careers those different motivations create.

  79. pongonfl says: Aug 9, 2011 11:03 AM

    I would personally take TO over Moss, but over Rice? Thats crazy talk. LOL

  80. nyyankeedave says: Aug 9, 2011 11:04 AM

    Any player who is associated with the Raiders is automatically tainted. The Raiders are like… the gonorrhea of the NFL.

  81. conjecture101 says: Aug 9, 2011 11:18 AM

    “He could have been one of the greatest if he had worked just a little bit harder”

    –He was one of the greatest Jerry. 16-0 season and 15-1 season.

    people that don’t have the physical talent of Randy cant comprehend what its like to have that much talent.

  82. krashie21 says: Aug 9, 2011 11:21 AM

    Jerry Rice is not only the greatest receiver to ever play the game, but in terms of preparation, study, work ethic, passion, blocking and the concept of “team”……..Jerry Rice may be the BEST FOOTBALL PLAYER who ever played the game.

    Even though he routinely killed my team (Cowboys), he was one of a kind…….guys like TO and Moss will always fall behind.

  83. jbeatzz says: Aug 9, 2011 11:21 AM

    Why are yall trippin on Jerry? 1st of all he’s more qualified to speak on the subject than anybody alive. 2nd, is he lying? If Randy had half of Jerry’s work ethic he’d be in the discussion for G.O.A.T. and that’s what Jerry means, hes not saying that Randy Moss is not a hall of famer.

    So instead, Randy is just the best deep threat of all time and most talented but hes not in the discussion for best overall. He knew he could half ass and still do work. That’s why TO has been a better all around WR than Moss, at least TO worked his ass off, and who did he learn from?

    If Moss didn’t have a crappy attitude and tank it on occasion, like for 2 years straight in Oakland, the discussion would be different but…he did, so its not.

  84. bullcharger says: Aug 9, 2011 11:29 AM

    Moss is one of the greatest, regardless of his level of consistent effort. His career stats are phenominal.

    Rice is correct and we all wonder how good Randy would have been if he had tried harder and not been a distraction. He obviously wasn’t capable of being mentally tough like Rice. That’s part of what made Rice so great.

    However, that’s part of Moss as a total package and you have to judge the mental part of his game along with the physical part when looking at his career.

    My opinion is that even considering all the on field and off field issues, Moss is still one of the greatest ever.

  85. smackingfools says: Aug 9, 2011 11:31 AM

    And Jerry Rice was to lazy to dance in the end zone so what?

  86. realfootballfan says: Aug 9, 2011 11:42 AM

    Don’t ever let me apologize for Moss, but he was one of the greatest, Jerry. What are you talking about he could have been one of the greatest, lol?

    It’s like your classmates that don’t need to study as hard as you, that’s not their fault that they can get to where you are with less effort and criticizing them because of that is absurd.

    Moss had an attitude problem and is one of the biggest front runners ever, but every team, outside of the Raiders and the teams he played for last year, were better because of his presence on the roster,.

    He’s the greatest deep threat ever, and he accomplished some pretty lofty perches in football playing with some terrible quarterbacks, which Jerry Rice never went through in his career as he played with 2 Hall of Famers and the best the Raiders have offered at the position in 25 years.

  87. 28purple4mvp says: Aug 9, 2011 11:48 AM

    jimmysee says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:27 AM
    In the work ethic department, Donald Driver reminds me of Jerry Rice.

    ___________________________________

    Is that real? I don’t care if it’s work ethic department or sports apparel please don’t put Donald Driver and Jerry Rice in the same sentence..Let me guess John Kuhn’s work ethic reminds you of Jarome Bettis too…

    Typical packer fan this thread is about rice and moss and its driving the packer turds nuts that its not about there team so lets talk donald driver. GET A LIFE

  88. bsizemore68 says: Aug 9, 2011 11:53 AM

    I think both were great players, however my favorite receiver was Ramond Barry of the Baltimore Colts, perhaps not the greatest, he always acted like he has caught a great pass before, unlike the in your face show boat players of today, younger fans seem to like that, I think older fans prefer the players from the 60′s, just my take. Bill

  89. thermalito says: Aug 9, 2011 12:06 PM

    Amen, Jerry, Everything Rice said about Moss was RIGHT ON THE MONEY.

  90. MichaelEdits says: Aug 9, 2011 12:53 PM

    Jerry Rice is just plain awesome, and everything he said is (to echo thermalito) right on the money.

  91. disp2 says: Aug 9, 2011 1:01 PM

    Some of you blow me away with your comments. The only reason Moss didn’t break Rice’s records is because Rice played longer? Rice has 8,000 yards and nearly 50 touchdowns more than Moss does. You’re telling me a guy who would probably be no better than 3′rd on the depth chart this season for a good team could average 1200 yards and 8 touchdowns over the next 7 seasons? Get real. Moss hasn’t even averaged 1200 yards over the past 7 seasons when he’s been the #1 receiver!

  92. marcsasharc says: Aug 9, 2011 1:20 PM

    what is wrong with more than half of you people. and by you people i mean idiots. Rice said nothing wrong and everything he said wouldnt be debated by people who knew Moss. Rice isnt saying he wasnt a great player, he was pointing out how much better he could have been. and hes 100% correct.

    some of you say Moss was better than Rice. LOL. maybe more athletically gifted (although that is a completely different debate) but thats all Moss was. look at the stats between the 2 and you realize how far Moss is behind Rice.

  93. raidernation3739 says: Aug 9, 2011 1:41 PM

    what moss did in oakland is a prime example of his character

  94. rdcameron says: Aug 9, 2011 2:09 PM

    To all those killing Randy Moss for his “lack of effort”, did you go to all of Randy’s games and watched him practice? Did you play with him? If you say “No” to any of those questions, you simply don’t know for sure.

    Look, could Moss have done even more? Sure, if he didn’t go to Oakland and have a lousy year in 2006(He was productive in his first year, even though he was injured) and last year. I do remember Jerry Rice being upset with Moss for not going his radio show after he broke his single season TD record. in 2007. I don’t believe Rice hates Moss or anything like that, but I do believe he feels disrespected because he didn’t bow down to him.

    There is no doubt that Jerry Rice was the greatest receiver who ever lived and he has a right to critique Moss because he was the best to ever do it, but being the greatest ever doesn’t mean that he’s right. If Rice came out and said that he doesn’t believe Moss is HOF worthy, then would have more of a problem with his comments. He just expected Moss to accomplish even more because of his gifts. The one problem I had with Jerry’s comments was that he said Moss, “Could have been one of the greatest!” Could have been? Randy Moss was one of the top 5 greatest receivers who ever lived.

    I will say this: If Randy Moss would have played with a Hall of Fame QB for most of his career like he did, he would have broken some of Jerry’s records..

  95. radrntn says: Aug 9, 2011 2:16 PM

    Well if Randy Moss makes it to Canton, then they need to call it the football hall of fame, and drop the word pro….because i do not know of a pro who quits on a team, the way randy moss quit on the raiders….if he makes it to canton then everybody will know it’s a joke.

  96. favreblows says: Aug 9, 2011 2:23 PM

    rameyag says:Aug 9, 2011 9:27 AM

    It kills me when people complain about what Moss “could have been” had he only worked harder.

    What could Babe Ruth have been had he worked harder instead of partying?

    What could Mickey Mantle have been had he worked harder?

    What could Paul Hornung have been had he worked harder?

    What could Joe Namath have been had he worked harder?

    This whining about hall of fame athletes is only a recent phenomenon in our “holier than thou” society.

    No one said Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, Paul Hornung, or Joe Namath should have waited for induction into their halls of fame because of what they “could have been” had they only “worked harder.”

    They were appreciated for what they did on the field of battle and as to off the field, well, that was part of their personalities.

    And, for those who try to say Randy “took plays off.”

    First, no player, including Jerry Rice, gave it all on every play. That simply isn’t possible, particularly for a wide receiver who isn’t involved in most plays. Ruth, Mantle, Hornung, and Namath all “took plays off,” just as every hall of famer in every sport.

    Second, Randy “dogged it” on certain plays in order to set up the defender for later plays. All good offensive football players do. It is part of the the game.

    Finally, the records speak for themselves:

    Moss is third all-time for rookie TDs, behind only Gale Sayers and Eric Dickerson.

    Moss is third all-time for rookie receiving yards, behind only Bill Groman and Anquan Boldin.

    Moss is second all-time in seasons with over 1,000 receiving, behind only Jerry Rice.

    Moss is second all-time in games with more than 100 yards receiving, behind only Jerry Rice.

    Moss is third all-time in 100 yard receiving games per season.

    Moss is third all-time in leading the lead in TDs receiving, behind only Don Hutson and Jerry Rice.

    Moss is second all-time in career TDs, behind only Jerry Rice.

    Moss is first all-time in receiving TDs in one season.

    Most is first all-time in receiving TDs in a rookie season.

    Moss is second all-time in receiving TDs in one game, behind only Bob Shaw, Kellen Winslow, and Jerry Rice.

    Moss is third all-time in most consecutive games with a receiving TD, behind only Jerry Rice, Crazylegs Hirch, and Buddy Dial.

    Who is the best receiver all-time?

    The numbers speak for themselves — it is Jerry Rice.

    But, who is the second best?

    The numbers speak for themselves — it is Randy Moss.

    Now, Jerry, if I were you, I’d keep a little quiet in my criticism of Randy, because you posted your numbers in 20 seasons. Randy has posted his in only 13.

    Don’t give him any more incentive to come back and finish the job.

    ******They should use this post as prime evidence of a typical homer Viking fan idiot. You give Hargis a run for his money…..that’s for sure.

    Not one of the athletes you cited had such a piss poor attitude as Moss. He is a loser of a person….and frankly a loose cannon. From sending a kid to the hospital in high school in a kicking incident to getting kicked out of Notre Dame for probation violations to hitting a traffic cop with his vehicle to walking off the field multiple times prior to games ending to declaring “I play when I want to play” to just not trying a good deal of the time. He will go down as a selfish piece of garbage that eventually was not wanted by every team he played on. Despite his enormous talent.

    You completely miss Rice’s point. He accurately points out that Moss had much greater ability than he did and could have had such a better career. But he didn’t give a sh!t. For you to compare him to Ruth and Mantle is hilarious and is an outrageous statement from even the most extreme Moss apologist. What a joke.

  97. hit2hurt says: Aug 9, 2011 2:32 PM

    The word “professional” pertaining to sports signifies whether you get PAID to play the sport, not your demeanor.. FYI

  98. briank1ne says: Aug 9, 2011 2:37 PM

    key words (behind jerry rice)

  99. jvibottomline says: Aug 9, 2011 3:01 PM

    rameyag,
    Son, Jerry Rice missed the entire 1997 season with injury and only played 12 games in 1987. Randy Moss is in “second place” in a lot of those categories, but HE IS YEARS IN SECOND PLACE. We are talking 50+ touchdowns. Jerry Rice made guys like Jeff Kemp, Steve Bono, Elvis Grbac, and Rich Gannon millionaires. Do people realize that Jerry Rice only played with Joe Montana in 54 regular season games????? That’s how GREAT THEY were. If it had been 10 years, the numbers would be more incredible than they already are.

  100. threedeep1998 says: Aug 9, 2011 4:05 PM

    I’m uninformed? I love it. I only witnessed every game the guy played for the first 7 years of his career. Dude was flat out scary. Changed the game forever.

  101. coolzog says: Aug 9, 2011 4:05 PM

    Careful Jerry, or you’ll motivate Moss to unretire and play a few more seasons of lights-out football so he can break all your records…

  102. quasi1981 says: Aug 9, 2011 4:25 PM

    Wow! Moss a better skill set? Where? He may have been faster and got more wide open, but Rice had much better skills. He ran much better routs, he could score from ANY place on the field, he never got caught from behind, so he wasn’t that slow. He could turn ANY pass into a TD. Moss took one pass across the middle 2 years ago and ran about 30 yds and Pats fans were ecstatic. One time! Rice rarely made great catches because he was ALWAYS in position to make the catch. Rice went across the middle every game scoring from 80 yds, running by people, and he didn’t just break records, but he made great plays to win games. He won so many games in the last second, and his teams scored points in the playoffs and won titles. Moss was a choke in big games. I saw him in New England in their second game vs the Bills and I knew the offense with him was not going to translate into the playoffs, and he was in two losing battles – with the greatest offense ever? – and the Pats scored 14 points in 07 vs the Giants, and the same vs the Ravens in 09, and they lost both.

    There is a huge saying that great winning coaches use when the word statistics come up:

    Stats are for losers!!

    It isn’t how many catches you make, how many yds you get, total yds, yds after the catch and so on, it is when you get them. Rice was always making great plays, scoring huge TDs in the biggest games of his life. Moss? you never knew where he would be from game to game, and in the most important games? Where was he?

    Randy, you could go long, make great shape catches like the one against Revis last year I believe for the TD when Revis was hobbling and Moss slowed down and made a “Mary” leap and reached out for the TD. Come on!

    Randy had talent but he never was there at the most important times. In Oakland when he was voted Capt in 2004 season, the Raiders turned the season around, playing great against the best from 03 for the first 4-5 games and lost most or all of them in very close games, but the team had a spirit finally and they were into playing, knowing they could compete big time. Moss quit completely on his team right after those games! That was Randy Moss, quitting at the most important times!

    I saw both close up and if I wanted to win titles I would take Rice every time, and if I wanted to see shapes and great catches and speed and a guy who was afraid to be hit, and rarely going across the middle, I would take Moss.

    So with all this, I agree with Rice that Moss COULD have been one of the greatest of all time!!

  103. bozosforall says: Aug 9, 2011 4:53 PM

    Rice:
    303 games
    1549 catches
    22895 yards
    14.8 yards per catch
    197 TDs
    96 Longest TD
    5.1 receptions per game
    75.6 yards per game

    Moss:
    202 games
    954 catches
    14858 yards
    15.6 yards per catch
    153 TDs
    82 Longest TD
    4.7 receptions per game
    73.6 yards per game

    Give Moss a third more games with all of the same averages (this assumes that he could even reach those averages in each of those games on average) and Moss STILL doesn’t catch Rice in any category (except maybe total receiving TDs – but not total TDs, since Rice has another 10 rushing TDs while Moss has none).

    This pretty much settles the argument of whether Moss could or would have caught Rice if given the same amount of opportunities (seasons, games, etc.) to do so. Rice wins here, hands down.

  104. rdcameron says: Aug 9, 2011 4:59 PM

    No one is disputing that Jerry Rice is the greatest receiver ever, at least I’m not. It’s easy to throw dirt on Moss because of some of his incidents and because of how he played last year, but my point is that whether you like him or not, Randy Moss is an all-time great. Jerry Rice knows it too.

    And to your point about Rice playing 54 regular seasons with Montana, let’s not forget what he did with Steve Young(another First-Ballot Hall of Famer) in fact, they put up better stats. And look, Randy Moss helped make Randall Cunningham, Jeff George(late in their careers), Daunte Culpepper and Matt Cassell millionaires as well. Let’s not forget what Moss did when he was in his prime.

  105. pcoz99 says: Aug 9, 2011 6:28 PM

    Blah blah blah about his attitude. You ask any player that played with Moss and he worked his tail off. His play when i want to play line was completely taken out of context. He meant he’s not motivated by Denny Green or CC, but by himself. Rice was more polished, but not better. On the field, Rice never did what Moss did. If Moss had Montana, Young or Brady his whole career this conversation would be over already. He’s been part of the 2 best offenses ever and has 153 td’s. Off the field, who cares. I grew up watching Rice and NO ONE can or has done what Moss has done with less at quarterback.

  106. bplatvoet says: Aug 9, 2011 7:38 PM

    All you people that are putting Moss up there with Jerry are bleeping crazy. Moss could’nt shine Jerry’s balls.

    Moss who is retiring at the young age of 34, has only been to one superbowl and could’nt even win with Tom Brady as his QB. He deffinetly was an on field assest to some of the teams he played for, but he was also a liability to those teams off the field and in the locker room. He would always find a way to sabbotage his success.

    in the end, he was giving all the physical gifts to succed, but non of the mental. Most of the greats in this game were able to take the gifts they were given and were able to magnifly them to be the great player they were. I believe Randy many years from now, will be wishing he could go back and put in the effort he could have to be considered one of the greatest.

  107. quasi1981 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:22 PM

    Bozoforall – If you believe that having better stats makes Moss or any other athlete the best, you are just fooling yourself. Any great player in any sport knows it has nothing to do with stats. It is what do you do when it matters most. Barry Bonds, when he hit 78 homers, hit a bunch to take the lead, and most of them were in the first inning.

    Stats are for losers!! Great players make plays – Jerry Rice

    Stat guys have great stats period – Randy Moss

  108. quasi1981 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:24 PM

    Bozoforall – also It is infinitely easier to have great stats. I have said since the DBs cant’t touch receivers any more, that all of Rice’s records will be smashed. Stats mean nothing!

  109. v2flex74 says: Aug 9, 2011 8:45 PM

    Here are the facts…..Randy was a problematic phenom of an athelete at Marshall with a God given talent 2nd to none and he went to the NFL; that much, a monkey with a half brain knows. Now I’m not much to agree with everyone but I’ve been watching Jerry Rice since the mid-80′s and I have to say I remember “The Hill,” Jerry in the offseason on a regular running in full gear (with the parachute) either on the track or on grass, all the clips where that guy was ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS watching film trying to perfect his craft and on top of that, this guy wasn’t out there taking plays off, dropping f-bombs to the media, and throwing hissyfits like a 4 year old girl with a skinned knee!!! Jerry set the standard for the league almost 30 years ago to the point that IT’S STILL THE STANDARD NOW!!! Make no mistake about it, from a talent standpoint, I don’t think there will ever be another specimen that will ever be as gifted as Randy Moss. What’s even more sad is that Randy didn’t even have to try as hard and he absolutely smoked people making plays nobody on the face of the earth could make. He is a great athelete and a great player but he clearly will never be because he “played when he wanted to play!” Nuff said!

  110. purplehayseuss says: Aug 9, 2011 8:57 PM

    bplatvoet says: I believe Randy many years from now, will be wishing he could go back and put in the effort he could have to be considered one of the greatest.

    Here we go again. Another Genius. Did you ever hear Moss talk? Did you ever, in the thousand interviews he gave, hear him sound remotely as though he might give one tiny turd about what anyone thinks of his play, his skills, his attitude or his stats?

    Rice’s statement only matters because Jerry Rice is the only WR in NFL history that could make such a statement. Randy Moss is one of the greatest WRs in NFL history. Who cares why? Walter Payton never, ever was ‘disappointed’ by Eric Dickerson, was he? And if Sweetness was, who really cares?

    I don’t watch football for psychology or attitude skills training. I have a life.

  111. bcgreg says: Aug 9, 2011 9:02 PM

    @ dte41

    So, you don’t respect people who disagree with you? Do you respect anyone? My God.

    Rice was the greatest WR ever. But, I’m pretty sure he prolly dropped a few of those bricks growing up (yes, I’ve heard the story). He had great hands. Moss had better hands. That doesn’t make him a better receiver. I never said that. Rice’s attitude and work ethic COMBINED with his talent and production made him the best ever. Take away the attitude and work ethic and you get Randy Moss. Rice says that if Moss applied himself more then he would have been better than Rice. You can infer from that that even Rice thought Moss had a better skill set than himself. He even says Moss had more talent. I know you hate Moss, but I guess you don’t respect your hero Jerry Rice because he disagrees with you too.

    Your quote about Moss was, “it’s not like he retired on top” (see post 8/9 10:19). I took that to mean that considering the 2010 that Moss had, which you mentioned, that he wasn’t finishing as the best. My point was that when Rice finished up in Seattle, he wasn’t on top either. Not many “finish on top”. That’s why I mentioned Sanders, Brown, maybe Elway. Certainly Rice holds most if not all of the career receiving records, but by the time he retired, he was two years removed from his best days. He had long established himself as the best and the holder of all the records. However, he did not complete his career with his typical Rice numbers. Therefore, not finishing on top. Again, not many do. (Sounds like our definitions of “finishing on top” differ).

  112. favreblows says: Aug 9, 2011 9:05 PM

    pcoz99 says:Aug 9, 2011 6:28 PM

    Blah blah blah about his attitude. You ask any player that played with Moss and he worked his tail off. His play when i want to play line was completely taken out of context. He meant he’s not motivated by Denny Green or CC, but by himself. Rice was more polished, but not better. On the field, Rice never did what Moss did. If Moss had Montana, Young or Brady his whole career this conversation would be over already. He’s been part of the 2 best offenses ever and has 153 td’s. Off the field, who cares. I grew up watching Rice and NO ONE can or has done what Moss has done with less at quarterback

    ***Idiot—his comments were not taken out of context. Here is a copy of Sid Hartman’s column re: Moss. Sid was and is such a kissa$$, he thought it made Moss look good. But the guy flat out admitted that he just doesn’t give it his all some games. And remember Moron….actions speak a lot louder than words. The guy is universally criticized by the media AND his peers for being a lazy bum on many plays. Only homer apologists like yourself feel the need to defend the guy. Get a clue. The guy will go down as one of the better WRs of all time. But he could have gone down as the best. He won’t.

    “I play when I want to play,” Moss said. “Do I play up to my top performance, my ability every time? Maybe not. I just keep doing what I do and that is playing football. When I make my mind up, I am going out there to tear somebody’s head off. When I go out there and play football, man it’s not anybody telling me to play or how I should play. I play when I want to play, case closed.”

    Moss knows it helps when he goes at full speed.

    “With me playing at my highest level, it gives us a better chance to win,” he said. “But I think just with me going out there and playing, we have a chance to win. I don’t really think my teammates really see the desire and determination to get in the end zone when we play a not-so-good team. Winning is really a team thing.

  113. thearvidian says: Aug 9, 2011 9:56 PM

    dude – your quotes from Sid’s column have no teeth! Everybody ‘plays when they want to play’. This is the most overblown comment in the history of sports. ‘nobody tells me to ‘play’ – that doesn’t make me ‘play’ – I just ‘play’. That’s everybody and is so obvious that it needs no more elaboration. Unbelievable. ‘Hey, that guy says he ‘plays when he wants to play. What a scumbag.’ Really? Overblown to the extreme. If the Randy haters want to grab hold of that to justify their hate – well, I guess it’s something. I breathe when I want to breathe – no one makes me breathe – I just breathe when I want to breathe.

  114. vikingdoode says: Aug 9, 2011 10:08 PM

    Truth hurts……tell ya what in Minny you either you like him and forgave his short comings on the field.. Or you hated the fact he was so damn talented and could only imagine if he could just did a little more it could ha e been awesome to witness. Im sad to say he could have been so much better if he did just the little things he would have been almost Jim Brown like. But Randy is Randy….

  115. bplatvoet says: Aug 9, 2011 10:13 PM

    If you believe that Moss isn’t going to regret not playing up to his potential, thats fine. He is a self absubed scum hile. But, I know that selfish bastard will regret the money he missed out on…..

  116. favreblows says: Aug 10, 2011 12:28 AM

    @ thearvidian–

    You just don’t get it. The guy has given up on routes his entire career. What happens if a play breaks down and they look to an alternative WR? Huh dumba$$? How many games did he walk off the field on his team before the game was over? One of the really class acts in the league finally had to confront him and chased him down in the locker room. The guy was the ultimate cancer.

    Look….anybody that is that universally ripped by the media and his peers is clearly a selfish, lazy bum who doesn’t give a rip. And his column with Sid was just further evidence that they guy has absolutely no smarts. He was confronted with the question of whether he takes plays off. And his answer just threw gasoline on the fire. He was the ultimate jerk and never really gave a sh!t about anybody, other than himself. Actually, he probably hates himself too.

    Still hard to believe Vikings fans are still his biggest apologists….especially after he helped drag down your team last year.

  117. mikebrown2 says: Aug 10, 2011 12:42 AM

    if you are a chef you cook, if you are server you serve, if you are a doctor you treat patients, if you are a sportsman than you play the game and if your sport happens to be a team sport then you play like a team player and stop believing that the world revolves around you, it is amazing to me that Moss lasted this long in this league, his work ethic was never there 100%, thats necessary in a team sport, especially if you get paid in full for your full effort, no excuses Moss could do more, it was his choice to not give more, to get some you gotta bring some.

  118. 1historian says: Aug 10, 2011 4:57 AM

    Who better than Rice to make the comment? Rice made the absolute most of his ability by working his butt off while Moss – by his own admission – didn’t. I don’t know how many rings Rice has but I do know that Moss has none.
    Rice is right and Moss has no one but himself to blame.

  119. thearvidian says: Aug 10, 2011 9:34 AM

    favreblows,
    you exaggerate to the extreme. you make it seem like unless he was getting the ball, he stood there. Take an iso camera on any wr in the league and they run opposite -think the guy sprints down each time? not only is the answer no, but we really do not know as nobody else has the iso camera on him like that. i attend many games – i want my guys to play – i know football – i know media exaggeration – i know my players and i want players that play. randy played. you think he sat on the couch all off season and smoked the doobie and just showed up for football and he could out run and out jump and knew the playbook better than anyone else – and that was just ‘natural talent’? He was great – ran his mouth too much – and like what happens, when the ‘media’ decides it wants to hate – each and every syllable is magnified and scrutinized. Perfect? No. But an imbecile low life like you describe – not even close. Did you ever notice his activities with dying and underprivileged kids? I’m sure not – you, like all the media, turn your heads and close your eyes to that. It is like wanting to justify a divorce. If the decision is made, one can write volumes of ‘justifiable’ reasons to make it happen. Everyone can! Pretty crazy

  120. quasi1981 says: Aug 10, 2011 10:01 AM

    favreblows – You seem to think that stats makes the player great. Every great coach who WINS titles would say that stats are for losers.

    Rice was outstanding in the playoffs and Moss was not. His 2 years in the playoffs with the Pats alone, the team averaged 14 points, and that is 14 points in both games when they lost against the Giants in 07 and the Ravens in 09. When the Pats lost in 06 with Reche Caldwell as the man, the Pats scored 35 point vs the Colts when they lost, and in then last year when Moss was let go, the Pats scored 21 against the Jets with a bunch of young tight ends.

    These are tendencies. Moss can’t go over the middle out of fear, he goes down before he gets hit, his patterns are not great. He is a great deep threat, and yet he makes a lot of shape catches.

    Rice knows where that ball is going and is there in perfect position to catch and run. All in the know in sports say it is 90% mental, and 10 % physical with this 10 % being the most important. They look for physical skills in a player, and then they begin the hard part, finding out if he has character and what kind of character. The old Raiders were wild men appearing to have no character, but when it came to the games, they had character up the kazoo. Is he good in the film room, a leader etc. Moss went there and when the team finally developed some character in early 04, they played down to the wire in against great teams from 03 and almost beat all of them going right down to the wire, and CAPT Moss was the 1st one to quit, bigtime!!

    Moss has the 10 % physical, and most of it is him getting open down field, but when he catches the short ones, he goes down fast, even before the hit comes which can cost him 3-5 yds which Rice would always get and even more. Rice would break tackles, and break away from the pack for 70-80 yds and TDs.

    I went to the 2nd home game in 07 in Foxboro and said to my friends in the 2nd period that I didn’t like this offense because it wpn’t translate into the playoffs, and it didn’t. Moss just wasn’t a bigtime player quitting before anyone else.

    Brady got so tired of him begging for the ball that he just stopped throwing to him. He was to much of a me guy which is fine, but not in football and not for teams that love to win. Moss in the end is about Randy and just look at what happened w/ the Pats who most said he played his best ball of his career because of his ATTITUDE which once again was his usual downfall.

    10% physical 90% mental

  121. quasi1981 says: Aug 10, 2011 10:27 AM

    begreg, I think what everyone is saying is that Rice played WAY WAY past his prime and still had something left, thou very little, at the end. He was just very old and slow at that point thou he was a very good # 2 receiver for quite a while.

    Moss is still young enough to have an impact, maybe not the great long threat, but something. Randy is not very good without his ability to go deep. He can be stopped when the fear of his speed is diminished. Just like MJ when he went to Washington, he was so bad it was funny, and yet he was still a far superior athlete than Larry Bird ever was, and I would bet the house that if you put Bird in that old body of MJ, Washington would have made the playoffs. Without his skill set, MJ was just average at best, and Bird had so many other qualities he could use to bring the best out of his team.

    There is something extra Rice had that Moss didn’t. He did the little things, a great blocker, a leader, and all the things that gives a team the belief they may be able to win it all. Randy can do this at times, and yet when the going gets tough, Moss gets going; into the corner and starts to pout as he always did, even in Pats land in the end, and with him having a good attitude last year, and playing his best, the Pats might have beaten the Jets in the playoffs and then maybe take it all. The fact is when the Pats let him go, the team relaxed and started showing that they were a great team, far greater without him.

  122. bozosforall says: Aug 10, 2011 1:22 PM

    quasi1981 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:24 PM
    Bozoforall – also It is infinitely easier to have great stats. I have said since the DBs cant’t touch receivers any more, that all of Rice’s records will be smashed. Stats mean nothing!

    __
    Where did I ever say that stats were the “be all, end all”. I was specifically responding to those posters who claimed (falsely) that Moss could have caught Rice STATISTICALLY. And in that microcosm, I merely was showing that it was virtually impossible for him to do so.

    So leave your “holier than thou”, “I watch the games, so I know better than everyone else” attitude out of this, particular since you can’t quantify anything that you are claiming, regardless of if you may be correct or not on any particular point. Stats are quantification, particularly when comparing different things, in this case Rice vs. Moss. Yes, the intangibles made Rice the superior WR overall, but his stats also were a direct by-product of his impact on the game. Also, since this is a TEAM game, pretending that someone is better than another simply because his TEAM won Super Bowls is ludicrous. That all being said, Rice was better than Moss in nearly every way, both winning and statistically. At least we agree in that regard, or so it seems.

  123. favreblows says: Aug 10, 2011 1:23 PM

    @quasi1981–

    Can’t agree with you anymore. I have always thought Moss was a bum and a chickensh!t over the middle. He always avoided contact…..and therefore cost his team crucial extra yards. It all goes back to him being all about him. He would rather save his body than make the gutty play that could help his team win a game. Just think if he had put out 100% effort like the vast majority of professional athletes. This garbage that the apologists throw out there is such BS. They either claim that all WRs take lots of plays off…..or that this is all a vendetta against Moss because people don’t like him. They are right about one thing….people don’t like him. But it is because of the way he disrespects his profession and human dignity…..screaming at sponsors and caterers, hitting traffic cops, kicking kids and putting them into the hospital. Loser.

  124. bozosforall says: Aug 10, 2011 1:26 PM

    @bcgreg,

    Leave your Pats bias out of this discussion. Moss wasn’t the greatest WR ever for many reasons, not the least of which that he wasn’t a team player. Add to that the fact that given the same number of games, his averages wouldn’t have added up to totals that would have caught Rice’s total numbers.

  125. bozosforall says: Aug 10, 2011 1:28 PM

    quasi1981 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:22 PM
    Bozoforall – If you believe that having better stats makes Moss or any other athlete the best, you are just fooling yourself. Any great player in any sport knows it has nothing to do with stats. It is what do you do when it matters most. Barry Bonds, when he hit 78 homers, hit a bunch to take the lead, and most of them were in the first inning.

    Stats are for losers!! Great players make plays – Jerry Rice

    Stat guys have great stats period – Randy Moss

    __
    Rice did BOTH. End of discussion.

  126. bozosforall says: Aug 10, 2011 3:30 PM

    favreblows says:
    Aug 10, 2011 1:23 PM
    @quasi1981–

    Can’t agree with you anymore. I have always thought Moss was a bum and a chickensh!t over the middle. He always avoided contact…..and therefore cost his team crucial extra yards. It all goes back to him being all about him. He would rather save his body than make the gutty play that could help his team win a game. Just think if he had put out 100% effort like the vast majority of professional athletes. This garbage that the apologists throw out there is such BS. They either claim that all WRs take lots of plays off…..or that this is all a vendetta against Moss because people don’t like him. They are right about one thing….people don’t like him. But it is because of the way he disrespects his profession and human dignity…..screaming at sponsors and caterers, hitting traffic cops, kicking kids and putting them into the hospital. Loser.

    __
    Coming from a poster (you) who still can’t get over Favre dumping on your butt Packers, you have zero credibility.

  127. rdcameron says: Aug 10, 2011 3:56 PM

    To everyone who has an opinion about Randy Moss, good or bad, I have one question: WILL HE be a Hall of Famer?

    All of the comments about his attitude, judging him for this or that really doesn’t matter in the end. He was flawed, but so are many players that are currently in the HOF. That also includes people who write about him and either defend or rip him, including everyone here leaving comments.

  128. quasi1981 says: Aug 10, 2011 5:09 PM

    FavreBlows – Sounds more like you were saying you can’t agree with me more. I said he stunk across the middle, and always (almost) goes down before the hits, especially in the middle.

  129. quasi1981 says: Aug 10, 2011 5:17 PM

    Bozo for all – you don’t have to cry. I just said that stats mean very little. Great players make great and big plays when it matters most. Everyone will take a Montana over a Peyton Manning because he more than most, came up with the big plays at the most crucial times, where Manning chokes in the biggest of games seeing his team has averaged about 13 pts in their 10 or 11 losses in the playoffs, and then they go and blame their defense, like the Pats fans are doing. If you have the so called best offense in the game and the most yds and points during the season and can’t score in the post season when the games are on the line, what do the stats mean?

    Even if Moss and Rice switched stats, just the #s, I would still take Rice hands down, simply because he could score from anywhere on the field in every situation, with no weaknesses, and more than anyone, scored the most important TDs in the most important of games. Rice was great because of the way he played the game, when he stepped up and so forth.

  130. quasi1981 says: Aug 10, 2011 5:24 PM

    rdcameron, he might because if they consider just his stats, but he was not a great player when it counted, and the HOF may consider his stats too much. He quit on the Raiders big time and they had turned the team completely around early on in 04, and he was Capt. They lost 4 of 5 or so against some excellent teams who made the playoffs the year before, and all of them went down to the wire, and this terrible team became very confident in being so competitive, and Moss totally quit on them, and I mean he screwed over them on his radio show, and was as bad a cancer I have ever seen. He was ok with the Pats for a while, and then he did it to them and then the Vikings? HOF? You decide.

  131. favreblows says: Aug 10, 2011 8:45 PM

    bozosforall says:Aug 10, 2011 3:30 PM

    favreblows says:
    Aug 10, 2011 1:23 PM
    @quasi1981–

    Can’t agree with you anymore. I have always thought Moss was a bum and a chickensh!t over the middle. He always avoided contact…..and therefore cost his team crucial extra yards. It all goes back to him being all about him. He would rather save his body than make the gutty play that could help his team win a game. Just think if he had put out 100% effort like the vast majority of professional athletes. This garbage that the apologists throw out there is such BS. They either claim that all WRs take lots of plays off…..or that this is all a vendetta against Moss because people don’t like him. They are right about one thing….people don’t like him. But it is because of the way he disrespects his profession and human dignity…..screaming at sponsors and caterers, hitting traffic cops, kicking kids and putting them into the hospital. Loser.

    __
    Coming from a poster (you) who still can’t get over Favre dumping on your butt Packers, you have zero credibility.

    ***Favre dumped on the Packers…..???? Favre dumped on every team and coach he ever played for. The difference is the Packers finally gave him the boot. He tried his fake retirement one too many times for Thompson and McCarthy. They knew exactly what they had in Rodgers and they told Favre to go to hell. And what ended up happening. Favre went on 1 1/2 years later to thrown yet another idiot pick in the playoffs to cost his team a SB. Boy…..that sure sounds familiar. And what else happened. The California kid (who Favre despised) led the Pack to a Super Bowl win.

    See son…..you misinterpret the significance of the call name, “Favreblows”. It really describes his reality as a human being. Yes pal……he is a scumbag cheater and liar. He cheated on his wife throughout his career in GB…..continued in NY…..and likely had some times in Mpls. He sent pictures of his junk to women via his cell phone. He harrassed team massage therapists. He lied his face off about his entire “retirement” from GB. That is the reality of Favre the person.

    As far as Favre the ball player…..he is a HOFer who gave GB some great years. But the team knew when it was time to move on to a much better option.

    So to clarify…..Favre was a hell of a player for many years……but finally was replaced by his underling who had surpassed him in talent. And Favre gave the team a clean out by trying to stretch his “retirement” games a little too far. But as a human being……..Favre blows.

    Get it?

  132. bcgreg says: Aug 10, 2011 9:20 PM

    @ bozosforall

    Can you read? Can you? If you can, read the the first sentence of the 2nd paragraph of my last post. Wait, I’ll save you the time. I wrote, “Rice is the greatest WR ever.”

    So what the elf are you talking about?

    All I said was that IMO, Moss had better hands and better speed. That doesn’t mean I think Rice had neither. He had great hands and excellent game speed. Moss was just better at those 2 things. Rice was a better route runner and had a far superior work ethic and attitude, which seperates him from Moss.

    Does that sound like I think Moss was better than Rice?

  133. thearvidian says: Aug 10, 2011 9:54 PM

    hey Favreblows,
    Case in point: “how many times has he walked off the field early?” = ONCE!

    embellishment is your modus operandi

  134. deangelo23hall says: Aug 10, 2011 10:06 PM

    …. Moss is going into the HoF, but not as the greatest at his position. /story

  135. favreblows says: Aug 10, 2011 11:39 PM

    thearvidian says:Aug 10, 2011 9:54 PM

    hey Favreblows,
    Case in point: “how many times has he walked off the field early?” = ONCE!

    embellishment is your modus operandi

    ****Actually…..Moss left for the locker room prior to games ending several times in his career. The Redskins game was just highly publicized because the game was still much in doubt and he got chased down later by Birk in the locker room.

    The following shares more light on the piece of sh!t, otherwise known as Randy Moss:

    “The message everybody was sending Moss last fall was that times had changed. He needed to become the kind of player who was more concerned about helping a team win than landing a fat contract. He needed to become the kind of player who was willing to block tirelessly and run routes hard when the ball wasn’t thrown his way. The NFL can be a forgiving place for talents who still have something to offer. It eventually became all too clear that Moss found such compromises to be beneath him.

    The irony here is that Moss always has been this way. It’s just that his numbers and his highlights always helped obscure that fact. When fellow Patriots were raving about how great a teammate Moss was upon his arrival in 2007, you just knew they might eat those words someday. Anybody who had seen Moss underachieve with the Oakland Raiders the previous two seasons had to know he might eventually return to his old, familiar habits.

    As it turned out, Patriots quarterback Tom Brady was one of the first to notice his decline last summer. A league source said Brady was so concerned about Moss’ lagging work ethic that he discussed it with Patriots head coach Bill Belichick in training camp. When Belichick decided that Moss would be fine, Brady became even more agitated after Moss dogged it on a couple routes during an early-season win over Miami.

    According to the source, Brady told Belichick during that contest that the team could keep Moss but the receiver wasn’t going to be seeing any passes again. Moss was working in Minnesota within days of that conversation.”

    Moss…..an even bigger loser than Paul Hargis.

  136. baddfrog says: Aug 11, 2011 1:21 PM

    Work ethic is equally important to talent in the NFL. Don’t sell yourself short Jerry.

  137. deconjonesbitchslap says: Aug 11, 2011 6:04 PM

    shut up, jerry.stop bashing this guy. He was more talented than you and he didn’t have to try that hard to be. sure you have better numbers, but he didn’t have your QB’s. and he still has numbers that are beyond incredible. 23 td’s with a hall of famer in one season. give moss montana or young, and teams like you had, he puts up 20td’s a year. guarantee.

    you just don’t understand that no matter how hard you work, there is always going to be somebody who can half ass his way through the same thing and be better than you. that’s life. maybe moss skipped a few routes (which he did, to put corners to sleep!), but he wasn’t lazy. i watched him for 7 years tear downfield for deep throws.

  138. bozosforall says: Aug 11, 2011 8:16 PM

    favreblows says:
    Aug 10, 2011 8:45 PM
    bozosforall says:Aug 10, 2011 3:30 PM

    favreblows says:
    Aug 10, 2011 1:23 PM
    @quasi1981–

    Can’t agree with you anymore. I have always thought Moss was a bum and a chickensh!t over the middle. He always avoided contact…..and therefore cost his team crucial extra yards. It all goes back to him being all about him. He would rather save his body than make the gutty play that could help his team win a game. Just think if he had put out 100% effort like the vast majority of professional athletes. This garbage that the apologists throw out there is such BS. They either claim that all WRs take lots of plays off…..or that this is all a vendetta against Moss because people don’t like him. They are right about one thing….people don’t like him. But it is because of the way he disrespects his profession and human dignity…..screaming at sponsors and caterers, hitting traffic cops, kicking kids and putting them into the hospital. Loser.

    __
    Coming from a poster (you) who still can’t get over Favre dumping on your butt Packers, you have zero credibility.

    ***Favre dumped on the Packers…..???? Favre dumped on every team and coach he ever played for. The difference is the Packers finally gave him the boot. He tried his fake retirement one too many times for Thompson and McCarthy. They knew exactly what they had in Rodgers and they told Favre to go to hell. And what ended up happening. Favre went on 1 1/2 years later to thrown yet another idiot pick in the playoffs to cost his team a SB. Boy…..that sure sounds familiar. And what else happened. The California kid (who Favre despised) led the Pack to a Super Bowl win.

    See son…..you misinterpret the significance of the call name, “Favreblows”. It really describes his reality as a human being. Yes pal……he is a scumbag cheater and liar. He cheated on his wife throughout his career in GB…..continued in NY…..and likely had some times in Mpls. He sent pictures of his junk to women via his cell phone. He harrassed team massage therapists. He lied his face off about his entire “retirement” from GB. That is the reality of Favre the person.

    As far as Favre the ball player…..he is a HOFer who gave GB some great years. But the team knew when it was time to move on to a much better option.

    So to clarify…..Favre was a hell of a player for many years……but finally was replaced by his underling who had surpassed him in talent. And Favre gave the team a clean out by trying to stretch his “retirement” games a little too far. But as a human being……..Favre blows.

    Get it?

    __
    All I get is that you are butthurt Packers fan who still can’t get over Favre leaving the Packers. And that is the only thing that anyone else who isn’t a Favre hater will get as well. If you want to continue crying about it, go cry to your mommy because the rest of the world is just laughing at you.

    Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. I’m guessing that you are no angel either, so your passing judgment on Favre’s personal life carries absolutely no weight in the real world.

    Get it?

  139. bozosforall says: Aug 11, 2011 8:21 PM

    bcgreg says:
    Aug 10, 2011 9:20 PM
    @ bozosforall

    Can you read? Can you? If you can, read the the first sentence of the 2nd paragraph of my last post. Wait, I’ll save you the time. I wrote, “Rice is the greatest WR ever.”

    So what the elf are you talking about?

    All I said was that IMO, Moss had better hands and better speed. That doesn’t mean I think Rice had neither. He had great hands and excellent game speed. Moss was just better at those 2 things. Rice was a better route runner and had a far superior work ethic and attitude, which seperates him from Moss.

    Does that sound like I think Moss was better than Rice?

    __
    Glad that we agree that Rice is the GOAT WR. We still disagree on the hands thing. Rice’s hands were better.

  140. thearvidian says: Aug 11, 2011 10:01 PM

    I give up favreblows. you’re too smart – you’d argue the color of the sky – and it is tiresome. You remind me of my ex – oh, never mind. I’m sure you remind a lot of us of our ex – oh, never mind.

  141. thearvidian says: Aug 11, 2011 10:01 PM

    I give up favreblows. you’re too smart – you’d argue the color of the sky – and it is tiresome. You remind me of my ex – oh, never mind. I’m sure you remind a lot of us of our ex – oh, never mind. And you see souls…..

  142. racnwith8 says: Aug 12, 2011 11:27 AM

    I think the whole point of the story was just for Rice (who was an amazing WR) that he thinks Moss had incredible talent that came naturally to him BUT that Moss didn’t always use that natural talent…I didn’t ever hear Rice say that Moss was not talented or a bad player…I think he was referring more to the fact that Moss had an all about me attitude and he didn’t always play up to his God given natural talent…..Now I don’t know about anyone else but you can put that scenerio into anything in life…It is frustrating in any aspect of life to deal with or see someone that has knowledge and talent and doesn’t use it….Football is not an “all about me sport” it is a team sport…and when you have the talent that Moss has you should USE IT…ALL THE TIME, not just when it suits you….I don’t think anyone is saying, especially Rice, that Moss had no talent…just that he chose not to always use the talent that he had!!!

  143. bozosforall says: Aug 12, 2011 5:07 PM

    quasi1981 says:
    Aug 10, 2011 5:17 PM
    Bozo for all – you don’t have to cry. I just said that stats mean very little. Great players make great and big plays when it matters most. Everyone will take a Montana over a Peyton Manning because he more than most, came up with the big plays at the most crucial times, where Manning chokes in the biggest of games seeing his team has averaged about 13 pts in their 10 or 11 losses in the playoffs, and then they go and blame their defense, like the Pats fans are doing. If you have the so called best offense in the game and the most yds and points during the season and can’t score in the post season when the games are on the line, what do the stats mean?

    Even if Moss and Rice switched stats, just the #s, I would still take Rice hands down, simply because he could score from anywhere on the field in every situation, with no weaknesses, and more than anyone, scored the most important TDs in the most important of games. Rice was great because of the way he played the game, when he stepped up and so forth.

    ___
    Who’s crying? Not I.

    And as for pretending that stats mean NOTHING, you couldn’t be further from the truth. Of course, they don’t mean EVERYTHING either, but they do show the capabilities and measure the production of any one person or player, no matter the activity. You really can’t have it one way over the other, particularly since this is a TEAM sport, not an individual one like boxing or wrestling. And until football becomes an individual sport, rather than a team one, ignoring individual stats to measure a player at least to some extent will always be important. To deny this is the height of ignorance.

  144. tatum064 says: Aug 14, 2011 1:36 PM

    tylerdurden187 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:17 AM
    He is one of the greatest of all time Jerry, stop being bitter.

    He isnt, he’s actually giving Moss a compliment. Rice is to WR’s what Jim Brown was to Running backs

    The irony is, players now a day can make a lot more just by concentrating on one particular aspect of the game – catching Touchdown passes, to the detriment of downfield blocking, leadership, etc. In Rice’s day he had to work harder. Rice wasnt just one of the greatest WR’s of all-time he was one of the greatest players of his generation, along with Ray Lewis, Peyton Manning and John Elway.

  145. quasi1981 says: Aug 14, 2011 8:37 PM

    bozofor all – I still disagree. Bonds had great stats but he y them out w/ a terrible attitude, and he hit 90% of his 78 homers against nobodies. His arrogance got everyone to walk him all the time.

    Not until recently did basketball leading scorers win any titles. The game has changed to support it, but teams with scoring balance are the best.

    You show me where Moss stats stand up against Rice’s with winning big games, and don’t say it was all Montana and Young. Moss played w/ Brady and ended up being a total loser on a team that could have won it all last year if he had actually PLAYED the game, and forgot about his stats.

    Stats are for losers and you are sounding more like you love losers. Moss always has been a loser in the game of football.

    Jeter or Rodriquez? Mays or Bonds? Russell or Wilt? Russell or MJ? Orr or Gretzky? Montana or Manning? Rice or Moss?

    The smart person would take the first player in all of the questions. Jeter, Mays, Russell, Orr, Montana, or Rice played the game to win, and they were the best and their stats were nothing compared to the other athletes, except Rice. They all played to win and never cared about stats. Most people would take them if they wanted to win, and the others if we were playing fantasy sports.

    Stats are your Fantasy!

  146. bozosforall says: Aug 15, 2011 9:10 PM

    quasi1981 says:
    Aug 14, 2011 8:37 PM
    bozofor all – I still disagree. Bonds had great stats but he y them out w/ a terrible attitude, and he hit 90% of his 78 homers against nobodies. His arrogance got everyone to walk him all the time.

    Not until recently did basketball leading scorers win any titles. The game has changed to support it, but teams with scoring balance are the best.

    You show me where Moss stats stand up against Rice’s with winning big games, and don’t say it was all Montana and Young. Moss played w/ Brady and ended up being a total loser on a team that could have won it all last year if he had actually PLAYED the game, and forgot about his stats.

    Stats are for losers and you are sounding more like you love losers. Moss always has been a loser in the game of football.

    Jeter or Rodriquez? Mays or Bonds? Russell or Wilt? Russell or MJ? Orr or Gretzky? Montana or Manning? Rice or Moss?

    The smart person would take the first player in all of the questions. Jeter, Mays, Russell, Orr, Montana, or Rice played the game to win, and they were the best and their stats were nothing compared to the other athletes, except Rice. They all played to win and never cared about stats. Most people would take them if they wanted to win, and the others if we were playing fantasy sports.

    Stats are your Fantasy!
    __
    You are so engrossed in trying to prove that you know it all (you don’t by a longshot), that you fail to see that I am a much larger fan of Rice than I ever will be of Moss. Let me guess though: You “watch the games” so you know who the best is. You “don’t need stats” to tell yo anything…despite the fact that every person that works IN football (something that you obviously don’t do) analyzes not only game film but also statistical output in order to analyze players. Of course, performance when the spotlight glares hottest is of great importance, but if that was the only criteria, then let’s put David Tyree in the HOF right now, since he did it when it mattered most, on the largest stage in pro football (something Moss never really did). Of course, that wouldn’t make any sense, since
    Tyree doesn’t have the statistical record to convince anyone with any sense to really take considering him a HOFer seriously. Therefore, to pretend that stats mean nothing, as you claim, only shows what false arrogance you have regarding your own knowledge of football.

    Your supposed knowledge of football is your Fantasy!

  147. quasi1981 says: Aug 16, 2011 12:45 AM

    bozoforall, I don’t know it all, but I can tell a great ball player from a not great player, and Tyree doing it once means zilch.

    Moss needing everyone else to play great before he does is why he is disliked, where Rice plays the game to win, and his attitude rubs off on his team where Moss will play great when his mates play, and then he will play as long as he feels like.

    Rice made Montana and young better, and Brady made Moss better till Moss quit on them like all his teams, so take his stats and throw them away.

    Bye Bye!

  148. tatum064 says: Aug 16, 2011 4:45 AM

    rooneyruleblues says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:48 AM
    Rice was a GREAT player. But I wish people only knew how big of an a hole this guy was. Most people see the smile and the laugh but behind the scenes he was one of the biggest aholes in NFL history. I feel sorry for the little people at Bristol that will need to put up with that ego at ESPN.
    ================================
    Moss was a complete Jack_wagon..he fought his teammate, got kicked off of Notre Dame, hit a cop with his car, went half-a$% in routes, quit, smoked chronic, was aloof, just a hard guy to figure out….there were A LOT OF NFL players who were a-holes behind the scene…many of whom still work at ESPN, so they’re USED TO IT. Rice’s work ethic MORE THAN MADE UP FOR IT – and i’ve met Rice…was no more egotistical or selfish as any other player.

    END THREAD

  149. tatum064 says: Aug 16, 2011 4:48 AM

    akismet-0471142e4db6bf4edbfd8363d280b966 says:
    Aug 9, 2011 8:45 AM
    Hey everybody!! Look at me!! Look at me!! I’m the greatest but I had to work harder than everyone!!

    Blah blah blah. This is akin to Montana calling out the movie Rudy as “an exaggeration” and saying lots of that stuff “didn’t happen.”

    Why is being regarded as great or the best not enough? Why do these has beens have to opine about everyone else? Shut up already. You’re in the hall of fame Jerry. Act like it.
    ====================
    Sorry. Elders tend to care for the condition of the game and the legacy that will be left by others. He is MORE THAN ENTITLED. Its an outrage, and the only thing worse are the people that condone the play by calling out the greatests of all-time. “Blah blah blah” is indictive of CHILDISH, SHORT ATTENTION SPAN people that dont realize what a joke the NFL is becoming.

    Some of us know better. Kudos to Rice for pointing it out.

  150. quasi1981 says: Aug 16, 2011 9:56 AM

    BozoforAll – You really are Bozo! I watched every almost every game Rice played in during the SB years, and I am a bartender, working in local taverns, and I can never remember anyone talking about Rice’s stats. None of us could be bothered. No one said look at Montana’s QB rating either, or Craig’s yards. All that mattered was they were winning, and it didn’t mattered who was the star of the day.

    Same with the Pats, my team, until 19-0 and Moss’ TD record possibility. This no it all here, knew when he went to game 2 of that season that this offense stunk, and it was because I knew it wouldn’t translate into the playoffs. It didn’t scoring only 14 points vs the Giants in 07 and 14 more in 09 vs the Ravens, and the young fans around here were blaming the D.

    They scored the most points ever, the most TD caught by a receiver; Rice caught 22 in 12 games to 23 for Moss in 16 games not that it mattered. Brady the most TD passes ever, and his first MVP. Great stats!!

    I will remember the Brady who had average stats at best who was in every game, never a game where we ever felt he couldn’t get the guys to come back and get the win.

    Since Moss, I rarely ever see this, and he has 2 MVP awards, and his offense can’t move the ball in the playoffs when it counts and the fans blame the D.

    If you look at the young Brady, his stats are meaningless when judging his talent, just as Montana’s are meaningless also. Every QB in the 49er SB era had almost identical stats; QB rating and all that crap, and yet only one of them will go down in history as maybe the greatest ever. Why? Because he won SBs, and also he was always in the game no matter the score, coming from behind, and that was also Brady. Steve Young had maybe even better stats, but he was like Tiger Woods, and had no idea how to come from behind.

    No one ever talks about Joe’s stats, Brady’s stats, Bradshaw’s stats, Aikman’s stats, and why? Because they gave up the stats to win.

    Marino, always about his stats, Peyton Manning the same, and maybe the best stat man ever, and in the playoffs in his 10 or 11 losses his team averaged about 13 points a game. Now that is a stat to look at. Brady with Moss? The same with 14 points in the 2 losses, and Moss goes and they score 21 points which is still better than w/ Moss and the big one is in 06 with Reche Caldwell as the # 1 WR, the Pats put up 35 points vs the excellent Colts D, and in the 2 losses in the playoffs with Moss, the pats scored a total of 28 points.

    Brady starts throwing the ball like Manning, has MVP awards, record stats and he can’t win it all, and Peyton has maybe his worse Stat year and he wins it all.

    Bill Russell’s Celtics won 11 titles in 13 seasons, one of the losses Russell go hurt going into the finals or it would have been 12. Sam Jones was almost always the leading scorer averaging about 21 points a game, and no one ever spoke about the great stats of that team, except wins and titles. Everyone played as a unit, and until a great stat player learns it, he will rarely win titles.

    I would take Paul Warfield, making the probowl with 25 catches, but deadly when needed, and you can take Randy “fluffed up stats” Moss.

    I am ready Boze

    Ok Big fella give it to me and I will show you more of this

  151. vikingjedi says: Nov 26, 2011 3:24 AM

    Rice isn’t half the WR Moss was. While Rice had Montana and Young throwing the ball to him Moss had QB’s like Culpepper, Frerotte, etc.

    Even then Moss still only has 44 TD’s less than Rice and played 7 fewer seasons. If he had wanted to Moss could have destroyed Rice’s TD record.

    If Moss had the QB’s that Rice had fans would be saying Jerry who? because Moss would have put Rice’s to shame.

  152. quasi1981 says: Nov 26, 2011 9:50 AM

    viking, every QB who played with the 49ers from day one with Montana till Young left had the same almost the same passer rating. It was the system, and what made Rice so great were his TD passes and best catches when the games were on the line and in the biggest of games. He was all clutch, and he wasn’t great because of all his records, but because he was the best player on his team, and he didn’t get lazy and play when he FELT like it, and that is one of the reasons why Moss was a loser. He destroyed a Raider team that turned the corner in the early season; Moss’ second I believe, but he was voted Capt, and they lost 4 of 5 first games I believe against the best from the year before, and all the games went down to the wire, last minute stuff.

    They lost, but the team knew they were back to being the Raiders!! They had their strut back and they knew they just had to keep working and everything would fall into place.

    I was living there and watched this all happen, and all my friends were die hard fans, and after that 5th game or so, Moss completely gave up on the team. Just Moss and nobody else! He ripped the team and organization apart, and had his own radio show and really put it to his team.

    He had a great QB in Brady and he gave up on him and the Patriots!!

    You know little about sports my friends, because virtually every coach in existence would say to you and to Moss:

    Stats are for Losers!!

  153. mdk5189 says: Jan 17, 2012 6:07 PM

    I am 20 years old and have lived in Pittsburgh my entire life. I in no way, shape, or form consider myself a Steelers fan. As soon as I knew what football was, I was obsessed with Moss. I rewatched any old Marshall games I could. I watched high school basketball tapes of him. Painted my room purple and yellow before his last year in Minnesota. Everything. And I just spent hours the past couple days reading all of these posts and the majority of you don’t even seem to understand football. It bothered me so bad I decided to make a blog or whatever you want to call it so I could comment on here and say that. You are all (minus maybe 12) downright dumb. You say he doesn’t work hard? Ask his coaches. Don’t ask “did you like him personally?”. Ask “was Randy Moss a hard worker?” They will say yes. Hell, ask Bill Belichek about him and he will tell you he’s the smartest player he has ever coached. And I’m sure TB will join the conversation and agree with him. You say he took plays off? Ask any other wide receiver in the history of the game if they ever gave less than 100% on a play. Actually, ask Jerry Rice it. You are all blowing Rice for answering the question he was asked truthfully, but bashing Moss for not hiding the fact he set up receivers and STAYED IN THE GAME for backside runs and opposite field passes instead of taking a breather on the sidelines. Those were his plays off. If he had the slightest chance of getting the ball, he didn’t half ass it especially since he was sooooooooo “selfish” Not a single one of you could run a 60 yard go-route and come back in time for the snap and another route, let alone do it 25 times a game. No other reciever to play the game could. Now, comparing Rice to Moss is one of the most impossible things anyone could ever attempt to do. The game has changed too much, especially defenses. If Rice would have played in Moss’ era, he wouldn’t have put up as spectacular of numbers as he did. Granted, he would still probably have the majority if not all of the records he does. But the way receivers beat defenses these days is by going deep. Rice would be a better producing Hines Ward (in his prime) but I honestly can’t see him doing as well against Revis and the freakish athletes on D in the game today. Say what you want in response to this but know that I know way more about Moss than you do.

  154. jacksprat57 says: Jun 10, 2012 8:59 PM

    “Sorry. Elders tend to care for the condition of the game and the legacy that will be left by others. He is MORE THAN ENTITLED…. “Blah blah blah” is indictive of CHILDISH, SHORT ATTENTION SPAN people that dont realize what a joke the NFL is becoming.

    Some of us know better. Kudos to Rice for pointing it out.” –tatum064

    Too many of us were asleep when they started teaching as if a short attention span were a desirable product of a public education. All that nonsense did was reinforce the impact of an on-line, video game world. God help us all, but it will define our and their futures.

  155. dunklespeed says: Jan 30, 2013 1:49 AM

    John Madden kows football probably better than anyone. He has stated many times that Randy Moss is the greatest receiver ever in history.

    There is one stat that is not kept and explains Moss hasn’t taken every record Rice has. The stat is one that tracks how many defenders are diverted to Moss who causes other receivers on the team to get the receptions.

    Randy Moss is the only receiver in history who is almost always has 2 defenders on him and sometime 3. This is extradinary and proveshis greatness. If they kept a stat on what receiver has the most defenders during his career Randy moss would win the stat.

    Randy Moss is a super human. Who is faster, can jump higher and can catch the ball in unusual circumstances. This is something Rice was never for.

    Jerry Rice was the greatest receiver before Moss, but Moss is the greatest of all time.

    John Madden, who knows football, got it right. Randy Moss is the greatest receiver in football history and his football cards will be more valuable than Rices as time goes on.

  156. dunklespeed says: Jan 30, 2013 2:05 AM

    Randy Moss is the greatest receiver in pro football history. Rice may have more records and stats, but Moss would hold the world record ( if one was kept ) for the most defenders on him during his career. No receiver in history has had 2 and sometimes 3 defenders guarding him.

    The team players and caches know who the best receiver is and he is the receiver that gets the most respect from the defense.

    John Madden, who said ” Randy Moss, in my opinion, is the greatest receiver in history “. This comment was made right after Rice retired. Madden knows football probably better than anyone and for him to say that is extradinary.

    Moss is an animal, a super human, he can jump higher, run faster and make extradinary catches that Rice could only dream about. Rice was a great player, but when God was handing out the super human qualities he gave more to Moss than anyone I’ve ever watched.

    History will show us that the Moss football cards will be worth much more than the Rice cards as time goes by.

  157. quasi1981 says: Jan 30, 2013 11:15 AM

    Dunklespeed, I am the last person to ever care about stats. Rice had plenty of double coverage, and some of the differences we have here is Rice was a far superior route runner, the best of the best. Moss doing a down and across the middle was as long winding road with no crispness. When a DB comes near him after the catch, he goes down 2 strides before the DB gets to him.

    Great catches!!! Moss? How many of them are great, because he doesn’t know where the ball is going? Rice in the other hand was like a great centerfielder who knows where the ball is going right away off the bat, and he turns and runs to where he KNOWS the ball is going and in the last second he looks up and the ball comes to him!! A great receiver lets the ball come to him.

    Most important in any sport is the greatest of the greatest work harder than anyone else. Rice worked very hard at his craft, and he could run the down and across 5 yards downfield and catch and run 80 yards, and Moss never ever could. Rice ran superior roots and for not being fast, you never saw anyone catch him from behind. Rice was always alert, and especially at the end of games where he made so many game winning catches and didn’t walk off the field before the playoff games ended. All the great players were great mostly because they brought great attitude to the games and bigger the games, the better they would play, always stepping up. Moss destroyed teams, especially the Raiders where he dismantled them when he wasn’t getting the ball all the time, and Brady was even getting aggavated with Moss wanting the ball to get “records” and that is a stat.

    The greatest QBs are not the ones who had the most talent. The 6’6″ QBs with the great arms and all the talent don’t always win, cos they don’t work at their craft.

    John Madden isn’t right about everything, and realize the offenses rule changes favored Moss over Rice, because Rice played in the mid 80s to the early 2000′s, and now 23 TD passes in 16 games is nothing, and Rice caught 22 in 12 games and that is almost 2 per game so realize Moss didn’t win and Rice won 3 times, and Moss had plenty of good teams and good QBs and so did Rice, and Moss did little with his QBs and Rice made the best with his. Montana and Young weren’t great long throwers so who cares who went deep the best? Rice did everything great including blocking and played every play, and Moss was maybe the best deep threat ever, but that one thing doesn’t mean he was the best ever!!

    Go Jerry Rice!

  158. quasi1981 says: Jan 30, 2013 12:59 PM

    Dunklespeed, one more thing, in 2 playoff years with Brady and the Pats, they lost to the Giants in the SB and that great great offense with the so called greatest WR ever scored only 14 points, and 2 years later vs the Ravens in the first round only scored what, oh, oh what was, oh 14 points again. Where was this great WR? how come he did very little to help them to the point the next year early in the season, he complained in an after game press conference and they canned him right away?

    It isn’t just what you do on the field catching the ball for TDs, it is your mental involvement in games, and he checked out in too many in his career, and maybe he was a main reason his teams never won!!

  159. quasi1981 says: Jan 30, 2013 1:04 PM

    Dunklewood, Michael Jordan won 6 NBA titles, and Bill Russell won 11 in 13 years and one of those losses was in the Eastern Conf final and he got hurt so in his last 2 years in college 2 NCAA titles and last 13 years in NBA he lost only one game that mattered. So MJ may get more for his card, but Russell won and changed the game more than anyone ever and 90% of his game was defense.

  160. skins1970 says: Feb 1, 2013 10:55 AM

    Randy Moss is the most talented WR ever to play the game there is no doubt about that but he isn’t the best. There were many games that he took plays off and didn’t look like he cared. Jerry Rice is the greatest WR ever and it’s not even close.

  161. quasi1981 says: Feb 1, 2013 1:17 PM

    I agree he may have been the most talented deep threat, but he was not a talented WR in genera. He ran lousy patterns, went down like a QB as soon as a DB was 2 strides away from him, couldn’t run after the catch on a 10 yard pattern across the middle, and usually dropped them because of his fear of being hit!! He was very much a cancer near the end of his Viking contract, and Chris Carter couldn’t guide him any more, and he destroyed the up and coming change of chemistry the Raiders got back in the 1st 5 games of Moss’ 2nd season when he was voted Capt, and they lost all or most of those games against very good teams from previous year, and they all went down to the last minute, and the team was excited to be playing so well despite the losses, and Moss 1000% quit the team and bad mouthed individuals on his Saturday sports talk show. Talent is only 10% and it may be the most important 10%, but you still have to play the game, be a teammate, team player and not always quit on the team, and so many other things!! Talented? I always felt that way, but how many of THE #1 picks in any particular draft are great protype QBs, w/ great arms, can see over the Offensive line, and have so much talent, but they never learn the game and they go nowhere even though they put up some great #s. Are you going to take them over the great game managers who won multiple SBs? Starr, 3 SBs and 5 NFL titles, Griese 2 SBs, Bradshaw 4, Montana 4, Simms 2, Aikman 3, Elway 2, Brady 3, Big Ben 2, and Eli 2. Most of them were game managers, or had to like Simms with Parcells, and Elway with Shanahan, and they won when they played more conservatively!! So talent goes so far and who cares? Michael Jordan had more talent than Bill Russell, and Russell won 11 titles and lost one game in his career that mattered. Talent or not, Russell revolutionized the game and took 2 separate teams to titles. Randy you may have talent, but I watched you in Oakland and Boston and you self destructed in them and obviously in Minnesota and Minnesota and must I say more!! You hurt your teams, and so what? Talent means nothing if you don’t use it right!

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