Comments on: Eli’s worries over Cruz play likely were based on first-hand experience

By: jaymc1988

jaymc1988 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 18:06:44 +0000

can we cut slack for refs.. EVERY ref in sports has to make judgement calls, should i throw the flag, is that a penatly, refs has to see stuff in split second timing.. we as fans get the ability to see 5 different angles and replays where the ref gets 1 view, possibly distorted since theres 22 players on the field at one time and no replays to view unless challenged. cut the refs a break if i was a ref i could carless about a critic or fans opinion unless it was blatent biased call. other than that it will always be a judgement call for some calls forever no matter how a rule is worded…give it up n more 2 the next week ppl

By: jaymc1988

jaymc1988 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 18:01:11 +0000

first off let me say how much enjoyment i got out of ngata wrecking sanchez all night…. now on to cruz being a giatns fan i LOVED the call obviously.. that bein said i would be highly highly pissed if i was a cardinal fan BUT it was correct call if u see the video its obvious he gave himself up. he looked right kept goin n when he seen the guy on left comin up about to collide into him and become a giant sandwich gave himself up.. yah the fall looked weird but its a fall anyone w any common sense could tell he gave himself up willingly trying to get down and give gaints a chance to save time! simple as that and thats not a giants fans perspective its someone with some common senses perspective

By: jakek2

jakek2 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 16:38:47 +0000

Whether you are a Giants’ fan or not, the bottom line is this if you are a fan of fair football….

There should be NO rules whatsoever that gives referees discretion to judge intent. Such rules can only lead to irregular interpretations.

Therefore, the NFL needs to clarify the rule to remove discretion from the refs. “intent to give himself up” is not clear. Who even knows what that means? Unless these refs have ESP, there is no way for them to know what was going through Cruz’ head when he went down (and they should NOT be forced to guess). Clear up the rule!

By: Justified By God

Justified By God — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 14:35:52 +0000

Did you see the Stevie Johnson catch that got rules incomplete. That was most certainly a catch.

By: dawkphan

dawkphan — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 13:37:39 +0000

Simple , Play to the Whistle. there was no whistle so ball is live.

By: TheDPR

TheDPR — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 12:58:37 +0000

Horrible rule. Sure they followed it correctly. That doesn’t make it a good rule.

By: j3ts83

j3ts83 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 12:56:53 +0000

beastofeden says:
Oct 3, 2011 8:02 PM
Get off JaMARKus Sanchez’s jock.

Maybe if he were a better QB with a quicker release he wouldn’t have been in that position.
________________________________

Are you really this big of a moron? because Sanchez didn’t release the ball fast enough it is his fault and he deserves a cheap shot from a 350 pound man to the back of the head? stick to your dungeons and dragons.

By: prince2123

prince2123 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 12:54:34 +0000

For those of you who disagree with the call — what if, instead of voluntarily releasing the ball, like we can all agree he did — he got up, without being touched, and tossed the ball to the line judge? (Happens virtually every game during a hurry-up offense?!)

If a Cardinal grabbed the ball out of the line judge’s hand and started running with it…I guess you’d call that a fumble?!

I would agree if was a fumble if he pulled an Eli against the Eagles, actually fumbling the ball against the ground without being touched. He placed it on the ground. Different story, different intention.

By: eustus

eustus — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 12:50:56 +0000

Football was more fun when common sense applied to the rule book. I used to know what a catch was. I used to know what a fumble was. Now I have no clue anymore.

They should change the name of the game to Lawyerball.

By: gcsuk

gcsuk — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 12:47:09 +0000

jackbauerqb1 says: Oct 3, 2011 9:23 PM

Hey GIVE IT UP ALREADY MIKE!! Clearly it was a live ball. The receiver did not “give himself up”. He did a Plexico and thought the play was over. Just like Plex spiked the ball because he thought he was down, Cruz thought he was down. REFS BLEW IT, PLAIN AS DAY. The fact you keep bringing it up probably gives away that you KNOW it was wrong and are just playing devil’s advocaate. PLAY AWAY!!HA HA
———————————————————————-
If you know so much more than everybody else (including every ref and the NFL office itself), then why are you sitting at your computer screaming at a writer from PFT? Why aren’t you in NY running the NFL?

By: gcsuk

gcsuk — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 12:42:41 +0000

yevrag3535 says: Oct 4, 2011 2:34 AM

Eli blows.
——————————————————————–
Thanks for adding that deep, insightful comment to the conversation. My life is so much more complete after reading it.

By: nflofficeadmin

nflofficeadmin — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 11:18:22 +0000

A number of Eli apologists on here… (meh) He’s no Phil Sims. Then again, not many people are.

Could you see Eli getting fired up and yelling back at Coughlin the way that Phil used to do with Parcells? Phil had the fire..

By: 1historian

1historian — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 09:41:46 +0000

no matter what the reason, and I already know I’m insensitive – I’m actually rather proud of it – pro football players look like wimps when they are FORCED to play wearing something pink.

Pink shoes?

GIMME A BREAK!!!

By: luciano26

luciano26 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 09:33:42 +0000

So the rule hasnt changed since back then when Plex spiked it? You guys got the Plax stuff from a comment I made on Sunday, right? Cant believe I remembered him doing that but its still one of the most boneheaded things I’ve seen in my life even if the refs got it wrong.

By: brainsmasher

brainsmasher — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 08:34:42 +0000

I thought it was the right call when seeing it live and after hearing the rule I know it was the right call. Because you don’t know the rule or have never seen it applied does not make it a bad rule.

By: Mr. Wright 212

Mr. Wright 212 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 06:43:22 +0000

stratomaticfan says: Oct 3, 2011 10:02 PM

Anyone remember Walter Payton tripping untouched at the goal line, putting the ball down, and getting up (thinking he was down) and the defense recovering what was ruled a fumble? You would think that the player would have to either a) cause himself to go down intentionally, or b) to be down and to stay down for some period of time to establish himself as down. By him tripping and falling, he should have to stay down until either the D touches him, or the ref rules him down. It shouldn’t happen when he pops up almost immediately. The ref should have to have time to determine that he is no longer making an effort.
————-

Situation, dude. It is understood by everyone involved that the Giants are in hurry up mode. Any other point in the game, that’s probably going to be a fumble and the rule doesn’t come into play — because a receiver has no incentive to “give himself up” with 3:17 remaining in the 1st, instead of the 4th. And had the call been made a fumble at THAT juncture of a game, then I would have commenced yelling at Cruz as I was until I heard the explanation.

The rule is not new to me, but I am surprised that for ONCE the refs don’t cheat the Giants with a misinterpretation. With all the times we’ve been screwed just since 1997, God knows that getting the benefit (and correct) call was pleasing for once.

By: yevrag3535

yevrag3535 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 06:34:11 +0000

Eli blows.

By: bullcharger

bullcharger — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 06:17:50 +0000

I agree they missed the call on the Ngata hit to Sanchez. Ngata dipped his head right before the hit and purposely popped him in dead center of his back. That will be fined for sure if the league is consistent. It should have been called too but I think it was missed since it was from behind.

That said, I do hate Sanchez, so I don’t mind seeing him get smoked like that.

By: stanstandard

stanstandard — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 05:49:43 +0000

Kinda hard to argue he was declaring himself down, when he said after in an interview that he thought someone touched him.

Also if he had gotten back up and kept running you think the refs would have stopped him and said he had declared himself down? nope

Bad call bad viewpoint

By: eldritchblast

eldritchblast — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 04:45:27 +0000

To everyone pointing out that Cruz didn’t know the rule which PROOVES it. How many want to bet Tom Brady never heard of the “tuck rule” before ’01? The rule is still the rule whether the player was aware of it or not.

By: eldritchblast

eldritchblast — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 04:39:47 +0000

@azbroncos – if you think that’s true you either don’t watch enough NY football or are a conspiracy nutjob. As a Giants fan I can tell you the Giants are usually getting jobbed on calls. In Sunday alone, The Cardinals O-line were clinging on the Giants’ defenders like a co-dependant girlfriend. Haolti Nata speared Sanchez causing a fumble. Btw, that fumble should’ve been a forward pass. Against Philly Eli fumbled while getting face-masked and there was no call.

And the BIG one, in ’02 playoffs vs. the Niners, there were two penalties against the Niners on the last play (a FG attempt to win) and the refs called a random penalty on the Giants. Season over. The next day the NFL _apologizes_ which leads to the Giants getting NOTHING.

If I had a nickel for each time the refs screwed the Giants, I’d never have to work again.

By: dclogicatlast

dclogicatlast — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 02:57:18 +0000

Looking at NFL rules through the lens of lawyer is a sure fire way to ruin the game.

By: 44kyle

44kyle — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 02:49:39 +0000

Cruz thought he must have been touched because he heard the whistle. What HE thought has nothing to do with the ruling. The officials felt he had given himself up and their judgement is all that matters.

By: showtyme34

showtyme34 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 02:46:52 +0000

I look at this like the same thing as when a quarterback kneels down on to run the clock out or if a kick returner kneels down to down the ball in the endzone. If this rule was not established, they would have to wait until someone touched them before they would be down.

Logically the situation should have been like the Plaxico Burress play where he gave up the ball, but there needs to be something so the quarterback doesn’t get smashed everytime he tries to kneel the ball.

By: forthelove

forthelove — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 02:27:39 +0000

Basically, this is a stupid rule.

So if a ballcarrier dives to the ground and then crawls forward for yards the play is still going. Or if a ballcarrier dives to the ground and then gets up and runs, the play is still going. Buuuut, if he dives to the ground and then drops the ball, then he’s down.

By: forthelove

forthelove — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 02:22:24 +0000

Seriously, this rule means that any time a receiver is down and not touched, but let’s go of the ball because they thought they were touched (which by Cruz’s own admission is exactly what happened here) that they are actually down and the play is dead. Previously this has been called (apparently incorrectly?) a fumble and the receiver is railed for being a bonehead.

By: stratomaticfan

stratomaticfan — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 02:02:21 +0000

By: waxedagain

waxedagain — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 01:51:06 +0000

@azcardinal32: have some cheese with your whine. Cruz didn’t know the rule that he doesn’t have to be touched to give himself up. If he tried to advance the ball after he fell to the ground – some players try to crawl forward – then it would have been a fumble if he left the ball on the ground.

By: waxedagain

waxedagain — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 01:45:11 +0000

Former VP of Officiating Mike Pereira is one of the biggest critics of the officials blowing that call. It just goes to show how many blown calls were covered up by him when he was the VP – he really doesn’t understand the rules. I recall so many controversial calls that were endorsed by him. I was so glad when he was replaced.

By: jackbauerqb1

jackbauerqb1 — Tue, 04 Oct 2011 01:23:25 +0000