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Bengals have pieces in place for renaissance

Andy Dalton, A.J. Green AP

The Bengals got amazing value in their trade of Carson Palmer.

It’s almost as if the last few years of Palmer’s decline never happened.  The Raiders gave up a first round pick in 2012 and a second round pick in 2013 that could improve to a first.  That’s the price we’d expect Palmer to cost years ago, before his arm strength and accuracy started to tail off.

Bengals fans have a right to be excited about their young team. For all his faults, owner Mike Brown has done a nice job drafting in recent years at the top of the draft.

His top two picks this year: Andy Dalton and A.J Green — have re-shaped the franchise.

In 2009, the team added a strong starting tight end (Jermaine Gresham), a fine pass rusher (Carlos Dunlap), and a good defensive line piece in Geno Atkins.

The Bengals have seen some of their other recent picks slowly develop into solid contributors: Rey Maualuga, Michael Johnson, Andre Smith, and Jerome Simpson.

Go back even further and you find some top-shelf talent picked like cornerback Leon Hall, tackle Andrew Whitworth, and cornerback Johnathan Joseph, who left for Houston.

This is a better track record than most of the league. If Dalton is for real and the Bengals can hit on their two first round picks next year, they have the makings of a strong young core that will be dangerous in the AFC North.

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93 Responses to “Bengals have pieces in place for renaissance”
  1. rpiotr01 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:07 AM

    Imagine what they could do if they had an actual scouting department. They might actually find some players in later rounds too…

  2. bloggingpoodlewalker says: Oct 18, 2011 11:07 AM

    Amazing value?….Mike Brown said a year ago he wanted four 1st round picks,..guess he overestimated what he could get,…and please, the Bengals have never won a darn thing for a reason,…they are the Bengals. Raider Nation does it again!!

  3. edmazeing1 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:08 AM

    Sure karma is a itch, they knew we needed him….Go Raiders tho!!!

  4. rmm1984 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:08 AM

    Oh No the Bengals learned how to draft. This may be a 3 team race from now on for the division.

  5. whodeyz says: Oct 18, 2011 11:09 AM

    Who is this masked man they can Mike Brown in 2011? This is a GREAT day for the Bengals. Carson is no longer sitting out for NOTHING. Smart deal and unbelievable value none of us would have expected. It’s not a superbowl, but it’s a good move and it’s a start for a team that has had some good rebuilding.

  6. cardiovascularendurance says: Oct 18, 2011 11:09 AM

    Amazing value?!? They straight up fleeced Oakland.

  7. wawa33 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:10 AM

    They still have the worst, dated “zubaz” uniforms in the league.

  8. mvincent81 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:10 AM

    As long as they can beat the Steelers I don’t care who they draft.

  9. firerosenthalthebastard says: Oct 18, 2011 11:10 AM

    mike brown will screw it up anyway

  10. kevin3142 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:11 AM

    Not so fast my friend….. as quickly as MB can build it up…. he can botch it twice as fast.

  11. pftspellchecker says: Oct 18, 2011 11:11 AM

    MIKE BROWN IS THE BEST OWNER IN ALL OF PRO SPORTS! BOOM! ROASTED!

  12. ninernation49 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:11 AM

    No worries, they ship most of that talent to the Niners anyways, and we will send our scrubs back to them!

  13. trigzter says: Oct 18, 2011 11:13 AM

    highway robbery right there

  14. peytonwantsaflag says: Oct 18, 2011 11:13 AM

    I don’t know – I need to take a deep breath here – as a lifelong Bengal endurer all this positive Bengal talk is a little much.-

    I’m kinda excited but kinda scared – you know?

  15. tigeralum2010 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:13 AM

    Amazing trade from a cincy perspective. Who is running the ship in Oakland? Have they watched Palmer play at all over the last 3 years?

  16. countsnail says: Oct 18, 2011 11:14 AM

    Andy Dalton will be the best QB of the 2011 Draft Class, with Cam Newton coming in second. Just watch.

    Andy Dalton= Matt Ryan
    Cam Newton= A better version of Dante Culpepper

  17. malgorthewarrior says: Oct 18, 2011 11:15 AM

    they drafted gresham in 2010.

  18. scudbot says: Oct 18, 2011 11:16 AM

    “The Bengals got amazing value in their trade of Carson Palmer.” No kidding.

    Did the Raiders hire Jerry Angelo while I wasn’t looking?

  19. SQLWhat?? says: Oct 18, 2011 11:17 AM

    I’m bracing for impact.

  20. hoobsher says: Oct 18, 2011 11:17 AM

    oh raiders…al is gone but your draft stupidity lives on…

  21. kyleortonsarm says: Oct 18, 2011 11:17 AM

    LOL Bengals. Renaissance. You’ve got to be kidding. These guys have always been and will always be terrible.

  22. yukon672010 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:18 AM

    And we all thought Al Davis was the only knucklehead running that team. Potentially two # 1′s for a qb who is past his prime ? Give the Bengals credit. They played chicken with Palmer, and their own future. They found lightning in a bottle with a rookie QB, and a sucker in the Raiders.

  23. paulisrollin says: Oct 18, 2011 11:19 AM

    I feel ya Peytonwantsaflag. I think this deal is great but in the back of my head I’m thinking of the million different ways Mike Brown and completely screw this up too. He has a special way of building us fans up and then cutting our legs out from under us in spectacular fashion. I guess time will only tell!

  24. 7thlombardiontheway says: Oct 18, 2011 11:20 AM

    Lolz

  25. clintonportisheadd says: Oct 18, 2011 11:20 AM

    Except that just as others have before them, these young Bengals will compare notes with their NFL brethren and discover they are working for the cheapest owner in the league. You would have thought the “one towel per week” policy would have been a clue.

    And as sure as you can say “free agent” they will end up going to where the pay is better and the team isn’t operated on the cheap.

    Lets face it-the Bengals are the NFL’s version of the Clippers. Nice drafts-good young talent-then they leave.

  26. djstat says: Oct 18, 2011 11:20 AM

    Wow the Raiders gave up WAY TOO MUCH. Kudos to Mike Brown. That lucky bastard should call Jason Campbell and send him on a trip to Hawaii for gettinghurt at the right time. One week later and this does not happen.

  27. redguy12588 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:21 AM

    “This is a better track record than most of the league. If Dalton is for real and the Bengals can hit on their two first round picks next year, they have the makings of a strong young core that will be dangerous in the AFC North.”

    But theyre still the bengals. 3 years from now, we’ll all be marveling at how mike brown screwed this up.

  28. boiler72 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:25 AM

    Amazing value?….Mike Brown said a year ago he wanted four 1st round picks,..guess he overestimated what he could get,…and please, the Bengals have never won a darn thing for a reason,…they are the Bengals. Raider Nation does it again!!

    _________________________________

    Dude, are you insane? The Bengals just fleeced the Raiders big time. This isn’t even close. The Raiders have a decent team, but no way did they win this trade, not even close.

  29. peytonwantsaflag says: Oct 18, 2011 11:26 AM

    “LOL Bengals. Renaissance. You’ve got to be kidding. These guys have always been and will always be terrible.”

    You’ve obviously got the internet kyleortonsknob so why don’t you use it for good?

    The Bengals have not ALWAYS been terrible – in fact they were created and coached by one of the greatest football men in NFL history.

  30. mattsffrd says: Oct 18, 2011 11:26 AM

    the Bungles actually came out on the right side of a dumb move.

    mind = blown

  31. xli2006 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:26 AM

    Maybe the Bengals will eventually be able to fill a stadium now.

    That place was easily 1/3rd empty overall and maybe 80% empty in the Upper Level the last few home games.

  32. samoanjungle says: Oct 18, 2011 11:26 AM

    @ninernation49 – I would trade Justin Smith and Ahmad Brooks for Nate Clements and Manny Lawson any day. They are big reasons we have been the #1 Defense.

  33. galatians62 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:28 AM

    Mike Brown has been wretched…this deal was genius. Palmer is done. He is the king of the pick-6. He is Donovan McNabb without the SUPER BOWL loses. Two 1st round picks? He he begged the Bengals to sign TO to go with Chad, Jermaine Gresham, Jordan Shipley, Jerome Simpson, and Andre Caldwell; he then proceeded to to QB 10 straight loses and he threw 5 pick-6′s in those loses. He used to be an elite QB until two devastating injuries. Sorry Raider Nation…this one is going to sting for a loooooong time.

  34. theroc5156 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:28 AM

    This is a terrific move that should create real excitement for the Bengals.

    However, since Mike Brown is still the owner, he can easily screw this up.

  35. citynative says: Oct 18, 2011 11:29 AM

    Renaissance? Don’t you have to be good at one point to have a renaissance?

  36. ottograham says: Oct 18, 2011 11:32 AM

    Mike Brown musta been wearing a ski mask when he demanded that trade…. ROBBBED

  37. 1historian says: Oct 18, 2011 11:32 AM

    Somewhere Al Davis is saying ‘ “They did WHAT?!”

    Given the fact that Palmer is on the downslide and has been ever since he was hurt in the playoffs a few years back against Pittsburgh I have to say that Cincy made a good deal.

    Now if they would only do something about those terrible looking uniforms.

  38. samoanjungle says: Oct 18, 2011 11:32 AM

    If you think about it, injuries and suspensions set aside, the Bengals haven’t had a 1st or 2nd round bust in a long time. I think the last was Lamont Thompson rd 2 in 2002 and he actually had a couple decent years for the Titans.

  39. homelanddefense says: Oct 18, 2011 11:33 AM

    Wow, classic overpay by Oakland. Thats three years in a row they wont have a first round pick.

    Cinci is in great position now.

  40. otissor says: Oct 18, 2011 11:33 AM

    Getting robbed is nothing new in the great city of Oakland.

  41. pskotte says: Oct 18, 2011 11:33 AM

    Thank you, Raiders.

  42. 1historian says: Oct 18, 2011 11:34 AM

    One more thing – it would be very interesting to know who called who and got this deal cooking.

  43. godbrokemybanana says: Oct 18, 2011 11:35 AM

    I can’t believe the Raiders gave up so much for a guy that threw 33 int’s, was sacked 52 times, and had 13 fumbles the last two seasons. Wait…I can believe it.

  44. The Phantom Stranger says: Oct 18, 2011 11:35 AM

    It’s too bad the Raiders are out of draft picks or they could help create a renaissance for a lot of other teams, too.

  45. The Phantom Stranger says: Oct 18, 2011 11:36 AM

    countsnail says:
    Oct 18, 2011 11:14 AM
    Andy Dalton will be the best QB of the 2011 Draft Class, with Cam Newton coming in second. Just watch.

    Andy Dalton= Matt Ryan
    Cam Newton= A better version of Dante Culpepper
    ________________

    You just contradicted yourself. Daunte Culpepper before his knee injuries was better than Matt Ryan has ever been.

  46. dirtybird70 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:36 AM

    Bengals fleeced the Raiders in a major way. All that for a QB past his prime and hasn’t played well in years? The epitome of desperate in Oakland.

    I’m not a Cincy fan but do believe the franchise is setting themsleves up nicely. Very nicely.

  47. nineroutsider says: Oct 18, 2011 11:37 AM

    Brown takes a lot of heat, all of which he deserves, and he got lucky, but Bengals fans have to be pleased with this trade. I thought they were going to get nothing in the offseason for Palmer. Campbell going down made Palmer look better than he is.

  48. autumnwind999 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:37 AM

    Enjoy the 32nd pick in the 2012 NFL Draft, Bengals fans. Make it a good one.

  49. theroc5156 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:37 AM

    They’ll have two #1′s, #3′s and #5′s next year.

  50. autumnwind999 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:37 AM

    Hue Jackson … brass ones.

  51. yevrag3535 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:37 AM

    When, I hope so. That would ge great in my life time…….

  52. ron69 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:39 AM

    People should be starting to relax and think taht matters are only wins and losses no draft picks

  53. autumnwind999 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:41 AM

    - The 2011 Oakland Raiders –

    - Best RB rotation in the NFL (DMC, Bush, Taiwan): Check
    - Copious speed and playmakers at WR (Ford, DHB, Moore, Murphy): Check
    - Two solid posession WRs and TE (Schilens, Hagan, Boss): Check
    - A matchup nightmare FB (Reece): Check
    - An offensive line that’s playing as good as any in the league right now: Check
    - The best kicker in the league: Check
    - The best punter in the league: Check
    - One of the most dangerous return men in the league (Ford, 4 TDs in 22 games): Check
    - One of the best, deepest front 4s in the league: Check
    - A young LB corps that features three former 1st rounders, including two Butkus Award winners: Check
    - A young talented secondary with a great playmaking safety in Michael Huff: Check
    - A coach whose creativity is surpassed only by the brassness of his balls: Check.

    Face it. We’re legit contenders right now. It’s time to go all-in. This is an all-in move if I’ve ever seen one.

  54. Jomolungma says: Oct 18, 2011 11:45 AM

    Everything’s coming together for an 80s repeat. Niners are improving. Bengals are improving. Dolphins, once they draft Luck, will improve. Just need the Giants to hold out a bit longer and the Broncos to find magic with Tebow….

  55. ravensfan4life52 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:46 AM

    it’s okay they’ll blow it. sure they’ll draft good players, but then Brown will refuse to pay them what they deserve and they’ll leave or refuse to play until they’re traded. I’m not worried.

  56. curufindir says: Oct 18, 2011 11:46 AM

    Who Dey, Baby!

    Long live the Ginger Gunslinger!

  57. rexismybff says: Oct 18, 2011 11:48 AM

    Wait a minute – didn’t all those draft geeks say Dalton could never make it in the NFL?

    Gary Patterson – best coach in the NCAA.

  58. epsv says: Oct 18, 2011 11:50 AM

    Good job Bengals. The Brown family got some sensed talked into them. They could be a solid team in a few years.

  59. grilledjesus says: Oct 18, 2011 11:52 AM

    Man, this is an all or nothing move by the Raiders. Hue Jackson must wear a WWAD bracelet.

    Congrats to the Cincy fans. With that defense, the young and emerging core on offense, and all these draft picks, this could be a real good team. I do howevere still support your decision to not fork over your hard earned money to Mike Brown.

  60. contraryguy says: Oct 18, 2011 11:52 AM

    Bengals next priorities: a line-busting RB, top cover corner. Both might be found in next year’s first round. Well done, Montgomery Burns.

  61. savocabol1 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:53 AM

    So all the Bungals fans that have been in hiding will come out again now?

    7 blackouts in a row.

    Biggest fairweather fans in football.

  62. ptownstripes says: Oct 18, 2011 11:58 AM

    citynative says:
    Oct 18, 2011 11:29 AM
    Renaissance? Don’t you have to be good at one point to have a renaissance?
    ___________________________________
    you must be 20 years old. i know it is not relevant now, but it is to idiotic, all-encompassing statements like this, but the bengals were in the super bowl twice in the ’80s. so, while it may not have happened in your shortsighted history of the nfl, they were good at several points.

  63. icantadd says: Oct 18, 2011 11:58 AM

    You know, Mike Brown, just when I think you couldn’t possibly be any dumber, you go and do something like this… and TOTALLY REDEEM YOURSELF!

  64. bengalguy says: Oct 18, 2011 11:59 AM

    It was a perfect storm in Oakland the past 2 weeks! Davis passes away 2 weeks ago…but the Raiders win the next 2 games to put them @ 4-2 and look like a legite contender!….but QB campbell breaks his collarbone in the process and is done for the year. Backup Boller comes in and looks AWFUL!… so they look @ D. Gerard, but he has neck surgury…so the only QB left is the one sitting on his couch doing nothing, DOWN THE STREET NO LESS!..so his FORMER COACH calls and wants to play lets make a deal, and has to overpay because Mike Brown is stubborn/ stupid….and in the end of all this, the Raiders get their man ( albiet for who knows how long…but they need him NOW!)…..and the Cincinnati Bengals, yes those CINCINNATI BENGALS come out of the whole damn things like winners because they don’t need Palmer anymore because Dalton is the real deal. Absolutly unbelieveable day to be a Bengal fan….WHO DEY!

  65. tdk24 says: Oct 18, 2011 12:01 PM

    1. those Raider picks will be late first rounders.
    2. Bengals still need a legit HC.

  66. galatians62 says: Oct 18, 2011 12:14 PM

    An oft injured past his prime QB who lacks leadership, throw 20 INTs last year, and quit on his team…✓ CHECK
    autumnwind999 says:
    Oct 18, 2011 11:41 AM
    - The 2011 Oakland Raiders –

    - Best RB rotation in the NFL (DMC, Bush, Taiwan): Check
    - Copious speed and playmakers at WR (Ford, DHB, Moore, Murphy): Check
    - Two solid posession WRs and TE (Schilens, Hagan, Boss): Check
    - A matchup nightmare FB (Reece): Check
    - An offensive line that’s playing as good as any in the league right now: Check
    - The best kicker in the league: Check
    - The best punter in the league: Check
    - One of the most dangerous return men in the league (Ford, 4 TDs in 22 games): Check
    - One of the best, deepest front 4s in the league: Check
    - A young LB corps that features three former 1st rounders, including two Butkus Award winners: Check
    - A young talented secondary with a great playmaking safety in Michael Huff: Check
    - A coach whose creativity is surpassed only by the brassness of his balls: Check.

    Face it. We’re legit contenders right now. It’s time to go all-in. This is an all-in move if I’ve ever seen one.

  67. ktravp says: Oct 18, 2011 12:14 PM

    This reminds me of the scene from Dumb and Dumber, when Lloyd sells his dead parakeet to the blind kid. Way to go Mike Brown…Bengal Nation is proud of ya today! um….did I just compliment Mike Brown? If I’m asleep, don’t wake me up.

  68. footballwife32 says: Oct 18, 2011 12:14 PM

    As a Bengals fan, I will say that I DO NOT think Carson is washed up. I do think he made a lot of bad decisions and plays, but I think he had a core of receivers who were equally to blame. Having said that, this is, without a doubt, a huge win for the Bengals. Sometimes it all just comes down to timing. The Bengals wouldn’t have gotten near this for Palmer if Mike Brown would have traded him earlier when all fans were begging for it. It played out perfectly. I wish Carson well, but I am ECSTATIC for the Bengals future. And while I’m at it, I’m pretty ecstatic with the way this season is going, too! WHO DEY!!!!

  69. thetechnocrat says: Oct 18, 2011 12:16 PM

    Has Brown finally figured out how to gm? His 15 years stats for acquiring young pro bowlers looks like this:
    96-10 Mike Brown
    1996 OT Willie Anderson Auburn 1st (10)
    1997 RB Corey Dillon Washington 3rd (76)
    DB Tremain Mack Miami 4th (111)
    1998 LB Takeo Spikes Auburn 1st (13)
    2000 K Neil Rackers Illinois 6th (169)
    2001 DE Justin Smith Missouri 1st (4)
    WR Chad Johnson Oregon State 2nd (36)
    RB Rudi Johnson Auburn 4th (100)
    WR TJ Houshmandzadeh Oregon State 7th (204)
    2003 QB Carson Palmer USC 1st (1)

    that’s a long time between the young talent making it big time.

  70. Robert says: Oct 18, 2011 12:20 PM

    Way to go Bengals!!!

  71. goldstardk says: Oct 18, 2011 12:24 PM

    I think the AFC north is going to be the best division in football over the next few years. Ravens and Steelers have great front offices and solid QBs that should keep them competitive and Bengals and Browns are trending in right direction

  72. chobes68 says: Oct 18, 2011 12:25 PM

    “Raider Nation does it again!!”

    Yeah, they grossly overpaid, for a (never lived up to his potential) player on the back end of his career.

  73. dietrich43 says: Oct 18, 2011 12:30 PM

    As long as Marvin Lewis is still the coach, and Mike Brown is still around to pinch pennies, no number of draft picks will give them a championship.

  74. ampatsisahypocrite says: Oct 18, 2011 12:47 PM

    Let’s hope for the Raiders sake Carson brings his Heimlich Maneuver paramedics emergency squad with him.

  75. kinggw says: Oct 18, 2011 12:54 PM

    I remember hearing something similar last year about the Rams on the verge of being great. Lets pump our brakes for a minute. The Bengals look good, but they havent exactly been playing murderers row. They have played six games and have played two decent teams. Why dont we wait a few more games against better competition before we crown these guys.

  76. mondzy805 says: Oct 18, 2011 1:02 PM

    I’m a 49er fan, but this article is Spot On. Mike basically told the Raiders, 2 first picks for Carson or your both out of Luck. Way to go Mike.

  77. dirtyjersey9er says: Oct 18, 2011 1:06 PM

    @galatians62

    The best punter in the NFL is on the other side of the bay :-P.

  78. blackdonnelly says: Oct 18, 2011 1:17 PM

    For the Raiders, it’s a completely ballsy, all-in move.

    For the Bengals, this had to be done.

    For us long-suffering Raiders fans, I suppose it’s now or never.

  79. dukemarc says: Oct 18, 2011 1:28 PM

    As long as Mike Brown is calling the shots, the Bengals are doomed.

  80. TurdSandwich says: Oct 18, 2011 1:31 PM

    Interesting stat: Since Baltimore landed The Ravens they have won the Central the same anount of times Cincy has. Since 04 Cincy has won it twice as many times.
    How do The Bengals still get laughing stock status in the division while The Browns, who have done squat exactly never get mentioned in this regard?

  81. trollhammer20 says: Oct 18, 2011 1:36 PM

    The Bengals probably want to stay north of the Ohio River, because what they did to the Raiders in this trade is probably illegal in the state of Kentucky.

  82. walk929501 says: Oct 18, 2011 2:05 PM

    This would have been a good deal for the Raiders…if they got Rodgers or Brees. Palmer?? Yikes.

  83. samoanjungle says: Oct 18, 2011 2:07 PM

    They should have 9 picks in the first 3 rounds over the next 2 years.
    Time to build the O-Line, get some Safeties & a young RB!

  84. truthserum4u says: Oct 18, 2011 2:29 PM

    Just think of what they might have if Brown had pulled the trigger on sending 8-5 to Washington for the two 1st round picks that were supposedly offered. Yikes!!

  85. quittsburghstoolers says: Oct 18, 2011 2:47 PM

    Too bad the Bengals can’t get someone else who is better at drafting players to make those 2 selections for them.

    Chances are these future picks will either not be able to play very well in the NFL or they will keep getting themselves arrested on a regular basis…

  86. cmack21 says: Oct 18, 2011 2:48 PM

    Bengals are looking really smart right now. Carson sucks, they got great draft picks for him AND they are winning w/o him & a rookie quarterback.

  87. homelanddefense says: Oct 18, 2011 3:14 PM

    check, check, is this thing on?

  88. bsputnik says: Oct 18, 2011 4:37 PM

    Renaissance = rebirth.

    The Bungals were never good.

  89. gobills716 says: Oct 18, 2011 5:08 PM

    When I went to the Bills-Bengals game a few weeks ago. There were only about 30,000 Bengals fans at the game. The reason was because the fans were “boycotting” Mike Brown…what do you think about him now? Seems like he just sold a used Ford Pinto for 100 grand. Let me guess, the bandwagon is going to fill up again in Cincinnati?

  90. rozz513 says: Oct 18, 2011 6:28 PM

    I like how everyone says that Mike Brow isn’t going to pay the players the Bengals are going to draft, and talk about how cheap he is. Especially when there is a new rookie pay scale in place as well as a minimum salary rule. It’s almost as if you guys have no clue what your talking about…Weird.

  91. aldavisisthenfl says: Oct 18, 2011 9:49 PM

    The draft is nothing more than a crapshoot, only 50% of the #1′s even make it in the NFL over the long haul. I remember all the picks we got for Gruden……not much there long term …Phillip Buchanon …..along with some other forgetful crap.

    The Bengals have to hit them all to get where the rising Raiders are today. Seymour is a big part of that.

    The gurus said we gave up too much for Ted Hendricks back in the day, two #1′s, we 3 got super bowls in return, can’t remember what the Packers ended up with….

    I say win now, heck with later………..

  92. mac3333 says: Oct 18, 2011 11:37 PM

    trollhammer20 says: Oct 18, 2011 1:36 PM

    The Bengals probably want to stay north of the Ohio River, because what they did to the Raiders in this trade is probably illegal in the state of Kentucky.

    ————————————————–

    Obviously you’re not familiar with the state of Kentucky.

  93. 1historian says: Oct 19, 2011 10:49 AM

    Open letter to Mike Brown;

    Good trade, but if sometime late next March your secretary says;

    “Mr. Brown, a Mr. Bill Belichik is on line one.”

    HANG UP!!!!

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