Skip to content

NFLPA president: “Punishment demands evidence”

foxworth_domonique_200 Getty Images

The NFL continues to decline to provide hard, direct evidence of the bounty allegations that fueled the suspensions of four players.  The NFLPA continues to call for such evidence.

Punishment demands evidence,” NFLPA president Domonique Foxworth writes in an item for USA Today.  Foxworth reiterates that the league has yet to provide “specific, detailed evidence of player involvement in a pay-to-injure program.”

As we understand it, the NFL has provided only the March 2 report of NFL Security, the March 21 announcement of penalties against the Saints and various non-players, and a 20-slide Power Point presentation that was shown but not given to NFLPA representatives at a meeting in New York.

“Instead of transparent and fair due process for the four suspended players, the NFL chose news media leaks, character assassinations, PR campaigns and legal manipulation to mislead the public,” Foxworth writes.

Foxworth also takes issue with the suggestion that the NFLPA is protecting wrongdoers at the expense of those who were targeted.

“Over the years, it has been the players who’ve fought the league to make changes to the prevailing attitudes about health and safety in football,” Foxworth writes.  “We led the change in the way concussions are addressed; successfully opposed 18-game seasons; demanded a change in the NFL’s leadership on brain trauma research and prevention; created new benefits for cognitive injury; shortened and limited contact in practices; created a better injury protection benefit and a $100 million health and safety research fund.  We continue to fight the NFL in 500 workers compensation cases.”

In this specific case, the NFLPA has every right to demand the raw evidence on which the league’s conclusions have been based.  To this day, no evidence has been produced to demonstrate that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so.

If that evidence exists, let’s see it.  With each passing day that the evidence isn’t disclosed, suspicions will grow that the evidence just doesn’t exist.

Permalink 81 Comments Feed for comments Latest Stories in: Rumor Mill, Top Stories
81 Responses to “NFLPA president: “Punishment demands evidence””
  1. fijabbersman345 says: May 9, 2012 2:15 PM

    Cool, the NFL supposedly has 50,000 pages worth of it. Now just show it to the NFLPA and shut them up about it

  2. mvp43 says: May 9, 2012 2:20 PM

    I typically support the league in most matters as opposed to the NFLPA. But in this case I completely side with the union. I see no reason why the league would take this route with the evidence, it makes no sense unless there’s a legal reason why. They should be plastering the union with hard evidence and not playin this game. They’re losing credibility….

  3. mryg24 says: May 9, 2012 2:20 PM

    Why cant the league who have so much Evidence just publish them out?

    I am sick and tired of this foolishness.

  4. fin72 says: May 9, 2012 2:20 PM

    All just a bunch of heresay. The commissioner is going to get his ass handed to him legally on this one.

  5. sg419 says: May 9, 2012 2:20 PM

    Maybe it was burned like the Spygate tapes.

  6. shzastl says: May 9, 2012 2:21 PM

    The NFLPA may have every right to “demand” it, but the problem is that they agreed to a CBA that doesn’t give them the right to “receive” it. The only thing the league is required to turn over are any “exhibits upon which they intend to rely”. Art. 46, Sec. 2(f)(ii). That could be simply the powerpoint or other similar summaries of the evidence. Then a hearing officer appointed by Goodell makes the decsion if that evidence is sufficient. The NFLPA agreed to a fundamentally unfair process–it doesn’t make the way the NFL has handled it right, but the bottom line is they really only have themselves to blame for agreeing to it.

  7. puppylovenyc says: May 9, 2012 2:21 PM

    LOL @ fijabbersman345. Dude, stop parroting what you hear. The NFL *reviewed* 50,000 pages (according to the NFL). That doesn’t mean there are 50,000 pages of evidence.

  8. daysend564 says: May 9, 2012 2:22 PM

    You did all that at the expense of the retired players. Now they all have to jump on the concussion bandwagon.

  9. unitedstateoftexas says: May 9, 2012 2:23 PM

    Ooooh, it’s about to get juicy.

  10. shzastl says: May 9, 2012 2:23 PM

    Oh by the way, Goodell may appoint himself as hearing officer for the appeal. Sec. 2(a).

  11. rr2000k says: May 9, 2012 2:24 PM

    Domonique, contracts demand performance too. We didn’t see much of that in Baltimore either.

  12. panamon says: May 9, 2012 2:24 PM

    People involved with the damn thing spoke to the NFL, is it that hard to figure out that multiple common admissions and sworn statements that agree with each other prove the whole damn thing? What do the conspiracy theorists and NFLPA bozos think G.Williams and such said if nothing ever happened

    That somebody likely wasn’t hurt is a blessing, not a get out of jail free card for the NFLPA like the Saints and players did nothing. There’s no conspiracy, this “give us the evidence” angle is tired reporting as well, NFL wouldn’t list the years it was used if trustworthy and likely multiple people told them so. Even if it was mostly pay for play we heard that tape, Williams is a sick man who emphasized injuries and we know what he did in other cities. Give it up NFLPA, maybe defend players who were targeted for once before you embarrass yourself further.

  13. nikkodawg says: May 9, 2012 2:25 PM

    Who needs evidence? Gidel said they did it so it must be true.

  14. jaydog76 says: May 9, 2012 2:25 PM

    Think it was 18000 pages, but I agree. Gotta show the guys why they are going without pay…

  15. mrgroovesd says: May 9, 2012 2:26 PM

    That is true, present the evidence and get it over with so no more questions can be asked for it. The longer the NFL doesn’t show the evidence, the more I believe they don’t have it…but my opinion isn’t worth anything to them so it doesn’t matter.

  16. medtxpack says: May 9, 2012 2:27 PM

    Its not a US courtroon but it might end up there. No one wants to point what a lack of negotiating skills the NFLPA had to agree to some of the stuff the NFL is using against them….

  17. goodolebaghead says: May 9, 2012 2:28 PM

    The longer the NFL holds out on showing anyone any evidence, the worse it looks for them, even if they do have the evidence.

  18. geo1113 says: May 9, 2012 2:29 PM

    To this day, no evidence has been produced to demonstrate that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so.
    —————-
    The existence of a bounty program does not require any evidence that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so. If you say you will give someone $10,000 to knock Brett Favre out of the game, and no one does, it is still a bounty program.

  19. dpinchot says: May 9, 2012 2:32 PM

    The 50,000 pages of evidence contains about 48,000 pages of emails that have nothing to do with the charges. The NFLn did a huge document request to dig for dirt.

  20. bochamps says: May 9, 2012 2:33 PM

    “Punishment demands evidence”

    Where was the evidence on Ben Roethlisberger?

    Führer Goodell can punish for whatever he likes.

  21. citizenstrange says: May 9, 2012 2:33 PM

    … or maybe Goodell destroyed all the evidence a nanosecond after he go it.

    Like he inexplicably did with the Patriot’s cheating evidence.

    I still wonder why he did that???

    Sweep it under the rug like that???

    Behind closed doors with no transparency whatsoever???

    You do things in the dark that you’re ashamed to do in the light of day….

    … when the fix is in.

  22. kacapaco says: May 9, 2012 2:34 PM

    NFLPA has no moral ground to challenge the league’s action after it advised its players from telling their part of the story to the authority -the league. The players can’t have dual advantages by declining invitations and requesting the league the evidences. This is not court, this is employer-vs-employee.

  23. jenniferxxx says: May 9, 2012 2:35 PM

    In court … not on the job.

    Hint … if you’re getting paid then it’s a job.

  24. cdanczak says: May 9, 2012 2:37 PM

    I’ve heard alot of demands and call for evidence. Has the NFL responded to these demands in any way?

  25. sideoutshu says: May 9, 2012 2:38 PM

    Well Foxworth, the fact remains that the guys who were allegedly targetted were union members as well. What are you doing to see that jutice is had for Kurt Warner, Brett Favre, Peyton Manning, etc?

    And don’t try to paint yourselves as some sort of champions of safetey when you have been actively resisting HGH testing for the last two years.

  26. somekat says: May 9, 2012 2:40 PM

    Over the years, it has been the players who’ve fought the league to make changes that would require the league to change, but no change on the players end. We have no interest in safety in taht case, only when it effects the league. Players should be free to do whatever they want” Foxworth wrote

  27. hairpie says: May 9, 2012 2:40 PM

    Maybe Godell is gonna destroy the evidence to protect other teams, like he did with the Spygate “evidence” the Pats volunteered.

  28. treesloth16 says: May 9, 2012 2:50 PM

    There is no evidence of pay to maim scheme, other than heresay. First, where are the players that were maimed? Where’s the Saint’s opponent(s) that had concussions, ACL/MCL tears, broken limbs?

    If I didn’t kill anybody, can you still imprison me?

  29. blacknole08 says: May 9, 2012 2:53 PM

    To this day, no evidence has been produced to demonstrate that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so.

    ————————————-

    Then what was Sean Payton taking full responsibility for? With the rate of new info coming out and players continuing to speak more about this issue, trust me, the floodgates will open, and soon we will all know the truth about who did what, who paid who, and so forth. The evidence is coming.

  30. jcaro5566 says: May 9, 2012 2:57 PM

    Vilma, why don’t you answer for us why you were named as the main player involved many months ago and didn’t bother to claim your innocence until after your suspension. If I was accused of something I did not have anything to do with like you now claim, I would have been on every mountaintop claiming my innocence. The only folks claiming your innocence are your paid laywers, and Drew Brees.

  31. bduncanscott says: May 9, 2012 3:03 PM

    Absolutely demands evidence, it keeps the system honest and accountable if not you’ve just got a plain old DICTATORSHIP

  32. metrocritical says: May 9, 2012 3:03 PM

    Day by day, the NFL is squandering the credibility and high ground they possessed when the bounty scandal first broke. If the various pieces of suspicion, rumored admissions and innuendo were woven together and made public in the form of tangible evidence, the uproar would be rapidly quelled and confined solely to the consideration of whether the punishment were just in light of the infractions. Without knowing what the league purports to know, it is impossible for anyone to gauge the proportionality of the punishment to the crime. Whether or not the league is legally compelled to produce such evidence at this juncture is debatable but whether withholding the information erode’s the credibility of the league’s process is not.

  33. weepingjebus says: May 9, 2012 3:04 PM

    Not surprising there isn’t much “hard, direct” evidence to go along with the mountain of circumstantial evidence, given how the Saints coaches actively covered up the program for years even after the NFL tried looking into it the first time. It’s not like these guys were issuing each other receipts or carrying around an accounting ledger like that guy in The Untouchables. Personally, I think that tape of Williams’ “pep talk”/murder conspiracy combined with film evidence from the Vikings playoff game alone is plenty to go on.

  34. basballguy says: May 9, 2012 3:06 PM

    if you don’t like the rules you agreed to in the CBA then take your ball and go home.

  35. p01ntman says: May 9, 2012 3:08 PM

    Sir Bedevere: What makes you think she’s a witch?

    Peasant 3: Well, she turned me into a newt!

    Sir Bedevere: A newt?

    Peasant 3: [meekly after a long pause] … I got better.

    Crowd: [shouts] Burn her anyway!

    *Monty Python and the Holy Grail

  36. gacoltfan says: May 9, 2012 3:09 PM

    The NFL should not release any evidence that shows what player or coach provided the evidence. If it was a coach he would be blacklisted and never get another coaching job. If it was a player he would be targeted by other players as a snitch.

    Let’s say some player has a copy of a $10k check written by Jonathon Vilma dated 2 days after the NFC Championship game. If that is the evidence, Vilma would know exactly who “ratted” him out. Is that fair to the player that cooperated? If a defensive back coach for the Saints admitted to Goodell and gave some specific evidence on a bounty, is it fair to that coach that the whole league knows he “turned” on his his fellow coaches and players? There had to be some amount of confidentiality promised to players and coaches that cooperated.

  37. bozosforall says: May 9, 2012 3:11 PM

    hairpie says:
    May 9, 2012 2:40 PM
    Maybe Godell is gonna destroy the evidence to protect other teams, like he did with the Spygate “evidence” the Pats volunteered.

    __
    Goodell destroyed the Spygate evidence to protect his butt buddy, Robert Kraft. Whole lotta butt buddying going on in New England as well.

  38. geauxjay says: May 9, 2012 3:12 PM

    Well Foxworth, the fact remains that the guys who were allegedly targetted were union members as well. What are you doing to see that jutice is had for Kurt Warner, Brett Favre, Peyton Manning, etc?

    ________________________________

    Cross that bridge when you get there, people. Prove that they were actual targets with bounties on their heads, and then you can deal with providing justice for them.

    How can you give them “justice” when the NFL refuses to prove that they need justice?

    And why is that so hard for so much of the Hater Nation to understand?

  39. encroachmentor says: May 9, 2012 3:16 PM

    kacapaco says:
    May 9, 2012 2:34 PM
    NFLPA has no moral ground to challenge the league’s action after it advised its players from telling their part of the story to the authority -the league. The players can’t have dual advantages by declining invitations and requesting the league the evidences. This is not court, this is employer-vs-employee.

    ———————————————–

    Not true kacapaco. Vilma’s lawyer requested the meeting with Goodell, but Goodell didn’t want to disclose any evidence so Ginsberg and Vilma declined to meet.

    This is from a radio interview with Peter Ginsberg, I listened to around 12:30 PM CST. The quote was provided by CBS Sports reporter Larry Holder.

    Peter Ginsberg, LB Jonathan Vilma’s lawyer, said he wrote a letter to Roger Goodell saying that Vilma wanted to share with the league what really happened and help him understand the truth rather than what Goodell had been hearing. Ginsberg said it would be fair to share with Vilma what the NFL was concerned about and tell them what people have said about Vilma. Ginsberg said Goodell responded by saying he wasn’t going to share or give any information. “At that point, it became apparent to us that it wasn’t in the truth-seeking process that the Commissioner wanted us to get involved in,” Ginsberg said.

  40. randomguy9999 says: May 9, 2012 3:16 PM

    They knew what they were doing… Targeting concussed heads and acls and trying to send guys out on a backboard … Was wrong

    now they want to wiggle out of it on a technicality of one type or another… And they Also want to get respected as men…..

    Real life doesn’t work that way. ..

  41. thenavyandwhite says: May 9, 2012 3:19 PM

    In trials there are times when the identity of a witness is kept secret … to protect them.

    These seems similar to me. The NFL is protecting witnesses.

    Any thoughts?

  42. mjkelly77 says: May 9, 2012 3:20 PM

    Foxworth also takes issue with the suggestion that the NFLPA is protecting wrongdoers at the expense of those who were targeted.
    ______________________

    Foxworth’s attitude is making those that were targeted and any covert future targets the real victims in this scenario.

  43. puppylovenyc says: May 9, 2012 3:23 PM

    Vilma’s lawyer is also pulling no punches. Read his interview from today?

  44. rayburns says: May 9, 2012 3:23 PM

    Perhaps, the NFL is concerned that the evidence will reveal their source, and considering what happened after Sapp accused Shockey, is understandably reluctant to risk creating an atmosphere where additional sources will no longer come forward in fear of retribution from members of the NFLPA.

    If there are 18,000 pages of documentation, it will take a bit of time to redact information that might reveal who the source is.

    Of course, if the NFL just said that, it would quiet the furor.

  45. geauxjay says: May 9, 2012 3:27 PM

    There’s no conspiracy, this “give us the evidence” angle is tired reporting as well, NFL wouldn’t list the years it was used if trustworthy and likely multiple people told them so.

    ______________________________

    Remember when we went to war for 10 years because people in power said there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq? I mean, why would they lie to us and be so specific about something like that?

    Idiot.

  46. bryans49ers says: May 9, 2012 3:29 PM

    Ive been hard on the Saints on this thing, but c’mon already. . Give the union who REPRESENTS the players, the information that the league used to rule against the players, so that the NFLPA can evaluate it and set up any type of appeals that they may have on behalf of the players. There appears to be a credibility issue with the evidence as well as a credibility issue with this Goodell guy and the NFL in general.

  47. FinFan68 says: May 9, 2012 3:30 PM

    This is an employee relations issue and not a legal matter (yet). The NFLPA is screaming for evidence because they want to dissect it and discredit it. I don’t think anybody believes there is some sort of ledger that says “Bounty: Favre; $10k; supplied by: Vilma; collected by: ______.” If that is what some people will need for “evidence” then they are as delusional as the players that believe they should get a pass. The bottom line is simple: there is no doubt that there was an extracurricular program designed to pay players for performance and/or injuring opposing players. The coaches devised and condoned it and the players condoned and/or participated in it.

    If you conspire to kill someone and then shoot at them but miss, you do not get off scott free just because your aim sucks and there is no “evidence” that someone was actually shot.

    The intent was there on the part of the coaching staff and several players and any objective person can clearly see it. Many participants have admitted involvement or knowledge of specifics. The issue I have is that the league singled out the Saints and made an example of them. Similar programs have existed for decades–likely, in every organization.

    Goodell is trying to change the collective mindset/attitude towards player safety and it is strictly driven by the fear of losing $$ via litigation. It has to at least look like the league was unaware (league-wide issue) and then handled the problem when it came to light (Saints). To do otherwise admits a known/condoned systemic issue throughout the league and would be easy fodder for the scrubs that will sue for a quick buck down the road after their paychecks run out

  48. geauxjay says: May 9, 2012 3:30 PM

    The existence of a bounty program does not require any evidence that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so. If you say you will give someone $10,000 to knock Brett Favre out of the game, and no one does, it is still a bounty program.

    ________________________________

    If I said that I was going to punch you in the face but I don’t, would I be charged with battery?

  49. vikingamericann says: May 9, 2012 3:36 PM

    shzastl | May 9, 2012, 2:21 PM EDT
    The NFLPA may have every right to “demand” it, but the problem is that they agreed to a CBA that doesn’t give them the right to “receive” it. The only thing the league is required to turn over are any “exhibits upon which they intend to rely”. Art. 46, Sec. 2(f)(ii). That could be simply the powerpoint or other similar summaries of the evidence. Then a hearing officer appointed by Goodell makes the decsion if that evidence is sufficient. The NFLPA agreed to a fundamentally unfair process–it doesn’t make the way the NFL has handled it right, but the bottom line is they really only have themselves to blame for agreeing to it.

    You are completely and totally wrong in every possible way.

  50. cowboycjn says: May 9, 2012 3:43 PM

    fijabbersman345 says:
    May 9, 2012 2:15 PM
    Cool, the NFL supposedly has 50,000 pages worth of it. Now just show it to the NFLPA and shut them up about it.
    = = = = = = = = = =
    The article stated, “As we understand it, the NFL has provided only the March 2 report of NFL Security, the March 21 announcement of penalties against the Saints and various non-players, and a 20-slide Power Point presentation that was shown but not given to NFLPA representatives at a meeting in New York.
    = = = = = = = = = = =
    So the 50,000 pages you refer to may have only been the March 2 report of Security procedures and BS with still no tangible, physical evidence being asked for. Why is it everybody is a “know-it-all” yet they have not seen information, not read reports nor have any evidence other than the BS written in these post yet they think they know the facts?

  51. vikingamericann says: May 9, 2012 3:43 PM

    sideoutshu | May 9, 2012, 2:38 PM EDT
    Well Foxworth, the fact remains that the guys who were allegedly targetted were union members as well. What are you doing to see that jutice is had for Kurt Warner, Brett Favre, Peyton Manning, etc?

    I’m calling Poe on you. You work for the League. .A real poster would make their own argument, not use league propaganda.

  52. mjkelly77 says: May 9, 2012 3:43 PM

    fin72 says:May 9, 2012 2:20 PM

    All just a bunch of heresay. The commissioner is going to get his ass handed to him legally on this one.
    _______________

    I guess everyone just doesn’t understand this. The Commissioner is protecting the original informants, whose names will come out with any disclosures. With the intelligence level exhibited on the player rep side, I’m sure this will eventually happen anyway. The Commissioner of the NFL, an attorney himself, will certainly not have “his ass handed to him legally”. All the player slappies will see once these guys are forced to start serving their suspensions.

  53. cowboycjn says: May 9, 2012 3:48 PM

    geo1113 says:
    May 9, 2012 2:29 PM
    The existence of a bounty program does not require any evidence that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so. If you say you will give someone $10,000 to knock Brett Favre out of the game, and no one does, it is still a bounty program.
    = = = = = = = = = = = =
    And if you say you have commited murder yet there is no one missing nor any body found, legally there has been no crime commited. The law can not proscute a person of murder if there is no body. Understand????????

  54. drunkwino says: May 9, 2012 3:50 PM

    Dear Goodell,

    Nobody except your biggest fans believes you anyone. Either prove it, say you lied, or keep quiet over in your corner while the rabbel rousing grows. Maybe it’ll stop before you’ve lost so much credibility that the owners replace you rather that keep riding the hit to public opinion (and possible money from said public,) that you’ve made yourself.

    Maybe. Oh and have fun getting sued by just about every former player that’s ever been in the NFL. I’m sure your bosses and the public won’t hold you accoutable in any way.

  55. dexterismyhero says: May 9, 2012 3:51 PM

    EFF the NFLPA.

    They think they are riding higher horses than Goodell…….Well they are wrong in so many ways….

    They signed the CBA……The coaches and GM admitted what was going on…Maybe all of the Saints players need to sign up for concussion tests?

  56. drgreenstreak says: May 9, 2012 3:51 PM

    The NFL doesn’t have to do a thing. The NFLPA voted in the CBA. Live with it.

    … or go work in a different league.

  57. bdluckyshot says: May 9, 2012 3:52 PM

    During the 2009 NFC title game, which both sparked the league’s investigation and served as the most obvious example of assault and battery of an opposing quarterback, King writes that, after an unflagged high-low hit on Brett Favre resulted in a sprained ankle, an unnamed Saints defender was heard saying on an on-field microphone, “Pay me my money!”

    (We know what you’re thinking: The league killed Monday’s re-air of the game on NFL Network because the comment could be heard during the broadcast. Apparently, however, it was a different microphone.)

    King also explains that defensive end Anthony Hargrove can be heard saying, “Favre is out of the game! Favre is done! Favre is done!”

    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/06/saints-defender-after-favre-injury-pay-me-my-money/

    Looks like evidence to me.

  58. neilnixon says: May 9, 2012 3:55 PM

    I really have a hard time understanding why people such as Panamon and Sideoutshu are so adverse to seeing the evidence. What are you afraid of???

    Goodell and the NFL have made this — based on the suspensions, fines and penalties to the coaches, players and team — the worst infraction that ever occurred in NFL history. And the accused, the media, the fans have been given what in terms of hard evidence from this investigation??? Almost nothing concrete; just innuendo and “he said.”

    The NFL’s spin is very telling (and I’m in the spin business) as to the weakness of their case. First they pointed to an exhaustive investigation with 50,000 pages of documents; later it was 18,000 pages of documents. Then they paraded out their “independent” legal guru , although it was quickly learned that she had represented and been paid by the NFL on previous cases. Then they released Anthony Hargrove’s statement and basically stated that he “knew of and participated in” the bounty program when a literal reading of the statement says no such thing. Tie it up with the league’s lead investigator resigning on a Friday afternoon, the fact that in its statement’s following the resignation the league tried to downplay that individual’s involvement in the investigation, and the fact that they are totally mum and silent on the heightening requests for specifics on the involvement of the sentenced individuals and it’s starting to get more than a little fishy.

    For those of you who keep arguing “the new CBA allows Goodell to have sole authority” while that may be true, does that make the league’s actions in not providing those sentence any evidence the right thing to do??? Your taking away livelihoods here and impacting professional reputations, not to mention alienating a very long and loyal fan base in New Orleans. Bottom line, you could shut all this clatter up if you’ve got the goods you say you have, so why not release it??

    And why are so many of you upset by the thought of that??

  59. gingerkid2000 says: May 9, 2012 3:59 PM

    Question. How many members of the Saints staff, current & former, have come out in defense of these 4 players? I know Vitt said that he never told Hargrove to deny anything, but what have others said about the players knowing & participating in a “bounty system”. Not trying to start anything. Just curious if anyone has links of statements other than Vitt’s.

  60. latopia says: May 9, 2012 4:09 PM

    Exhibit 1A why Goodell should’ve at least threatened to refer the matter for RICO (conspiracy to injure/maim for profit) consideration. You can bet the union wouldn’t be demanding evidence then.

  61. vikingamericann says: May 9, 2012 4:17 PM

    bdluckyshot | May 9, 2012, 3:52 PM EDT

    Looks like evidence to me

    Umm your citing Peter King, not the League. The NFLPA wants the NFL to follow the CBA and turn over the substantive evidence to them. They wont accept hearsay from a blogger.

  62. blackrebeldog09 says: May 9, 2012 4:18 PM

    No coaches are ever gonna make comments on the subject for 1 reason. Their contracts have a clause where they cannot sue the league. If you cant take the NFL to court, then you can get blackballed, and really, where else are you gonna get a job that pays in the Millions??

  63. flannlv says: May 9, 2012 4:23 PM

    Who cares if the NFL invited the players to discuss the possible suspensions? How would that go exactly? We have evidence you engaged in a pay for performance system. No I didn’t. Well we have the evidence. Show me. No, take our word for it. Here’s a synopsis. Our independent (paid) counsel reviewed it and said it’s all in order. Well let me look at the evidence. No.

    Why won’t the league show the players/attorneys the evidence?

  64. hairpie says: May 9, 2012 4:28 PM

    bozosforall says: May 9, 2012 3:11 PM

    hairpie says:
    May 9, 2012 2:40 PM
    Maybe Godell is gonna destroy the evidence to protect other teams, like he did with the Spygate “evidence” the Pats volunteered.

    __
    Goodell destroyed the Spygate evidence to protect his butt buddy, Robert Kraft. Whole lotta butt buddying going on in New England as well.

    —————————–

    that doesnt make sense. why would Goddell leak the 6 plays they taped in NJ, yet destroy the evidence the Pats VOLUNTEERED …. unless of course, there were other teams on those tapes doing the same thing, which was the case after-all.

  65. vikingamericann says: May 9, 2012 4:29 PM

    neilnixon | May 9, 2012, 3:55 PM EDT
    I really have a hard time understanding why people such as Panamon and Sideoutshu are so adverse to seeing the evidence. What are you afraid of???

    I understand your frustration. The motivations of idiots are never easy to determine. However, you are off to a good start. You have identified fear as one possible motivation. The other part is stupidity. You see dumb people don’t value evidence. They hear something, believe it, and react angrily to anything that might contradict their original conclusion. Hope this helps.

  66. mjkelly77 says: May 9, 2012 4:30 PM

    cowboycjn says:May 9, 2012 3:48 PM

    And if you say you have commited murder yet there is no one missing nor any body found, legally there has been no crime commited. The law can not proscute a person of murder if there is no body. Understand????????
    ________________

    I take it you’re not an attorney. Ever hear of attempted murder? No body but it’s still punishable.

  67. patriots123456 says: May 9, 2012 4:31 PM

    All I can say is it’s a good thing it was the Saints defense involved in the bounty program.

    If it was one of the other team’s defenses involved someone might have actually been hurt.

  68. lolb23 says: May 9, 2012 4:32 PM

    Accusing the NFL Commisioner of setting up the Saints also demands evidence.

  69. drunkwino says: May 9, 2012 4:33 PM

    Exhibit 1A why Goodell should’ve at least threatened to refer the matter for RICO (conspiracy to injure/maim for profit) consideration. You can bet the union wouldn’t be demanding evidence then.
    _________________________________

    Hey man, if Goodell were withholding evidence of a crime, that makes him an accomplice in the crime. I kinda doubt Goodell, former king of the NFL’s legal team, would ‘forget’ that basic factoid.

    You wanna try again?

  70. geauxjay says: May 9, 2012 4:35 PM

    Then what was Sean Payton taking full responsibility for?

    ___________________________________

    Sean Payton appealed his suspension, and it was heard by the same person who punished him.

  71. The Overtime Sports Talk Show says: May 9, 2012 4:36 PM

    Typical NFL players..Evidence is only provided to you as a right by law when you are facing criminal charges. You are employed by a corporation (NFL Team) and you are a contracted employee. The “NFL” regulates the “NFL Team” you are contracted with. The Union represents you via a CBA. Read your CBA. Then go back to your off season workout.

    In any employee/contractor to company relationship, evidence is not required to inflict discipline after you are informed not to break policy or warned about rules violations.

    This is why altheles should be required to finish college.

    They should count their blessings that they haven’t been banned. You aren’t gonna lie to the Commish and get away with it. Just ask the Saints leadership..

  72. lombarditrophies says: May 9, 2012 4:42 PM

    “To this day, no evidence has been produced to demonstrate that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so.”

    There is always more to the issue and there might be very good reasons why the information is not being released.

    If I am the player’s attorney, I am fighting the league to keep this information from coming out. The last thing they want is to hand the IRS a tax evasion case on a silver platter.

  73. dan39564 says: May 9, 2012 5:56 PM

    As someone who has been wrongfully outed by a SNITCH, I can sympathize with anyone who may be innocent, and wrongfully accused. I am not saying anyone is innocent or guilty, just show me the evidence, so we can refute or disprove it!

  74. emmonsh says: May 9, 2012 6:59 PM

    geo1113 says:May 9, 2012 2:29 PM

    To this day, no evidence has been produced to demonstrate that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so.
    —————-
    The existence of a bounty program does not require any evidence that a player received money for inflicting injury or paid money to induce another player to do so. If you say you will give someone $10,000 to knock Brett Favre out of the game, and no one does, it is still a bounty program.

    this is about the only guy who makes sense.
    comspiracy is still a crime. you dont have to injure some1 to be guilty. a bounty is not the act, a bounty is the conspiracy to commit the act. look at the fuucking loser who says ill give 10000 to knoch him out. got it on tape, that is guilty. no other evidense is necessary. the guy who got 8 games. he signed a affidavid that he knew about the bountys and participated.

  75. gacoltfan says: May 9, 2012 10:08 PM

    treesloth16 says:
    May 9, 2012 2:50 PM
    There is no evidence of pay to maim scheme, other than heresay. First, where are the players that were maimed? Where’s the Saint’s opponent(s) that had concussions, ACL/MCL tears, broken limbs?

    If I didn’t kill anybody, can you still imprison me?

    ——————————

    Yes. Ever hear of conspiracy to commit murder?

  76. saints4evah says: May 9, 2012 10:10 PM

    Nice to see so many people finally coming out and seeing that this whole thing is fishy since day one. We Saints fans hope GODell gets called to a place of reason sometime soon. This has been the worst off season ever. Just outrageous what the public pillory feels like with some all-powerful DemiZod throwing unfounded charges around as law demanding we lose our coaches, draft picks, public trust, and season for glorified trash talk.
    i mean dang, did anybody even SEE our defense the last 3 years? They couldn’t TACKLE much less be rightly accused of being the dirtiest squad ever out to inflict doom on the world.

  77. gacoltfan says: May 9, 2012 10:18 PM

    vikingamericann says:
    I understand your frustration. The motivations of idiots are never easy to determine. However, you are off to a good start. You have identified fear as one possible motivation. The other part is stupidity. You see dumb people don’t value evidence. They hear something, believe it, and react angrily to anything that might contradict their original conclusion. Hope this helps.
    ————————————-

    I don’t understand how you can’t see the most likely “motivation” for not releasing the evidence – people were promised confidentiality for telling the truth. What kind of person would Gooddell be if he promised players and coaches confidentiality, then released their statements?

    Furthermore, what possible motiviation would Gooddell have to make this such an issue and go after the Saints? His #1 priority has been the image of the league. This does nothing but put a black eye on the league. The conspiracy theories don’t make any sense. If anything he would have been better served sweeping this under the rug.

  78. shzastl says: May 10, 2012 12:28 AM

    “You are completely and totally wrong in every possible way.”
    ___________________
    @vikingamericann — at the risk of “feeding the trolls,” please explain

  79. silentcount says: May 10, 2012 1:36 AM

    THE REAL EVIDENCE has always been what happens on the playing field. That’s where a hit is called illegal and when the punishment occurs. This new thing with Goodell trying to punish players for things they might have said or were thinking, is not gonna work. Players and fans will accept a penalty on the field, because the evidence can be viewed in a replay. A year’s suspension with no evidence will never be fair or accepted. If Goodell doesn’t understand that, then he’s not qualified to be head of the NFL. Time for the lynch mob to go after him, instead.

  80. gacoltfan says: May 10, 2012 7:12 AM

    Saints fans and the NFLPA need to be careful what they wish for, if the evidence were released, it may lead to people questioning why only 4 players were suspended. In all probabilty, more than half the defense was guilty to some degree, but Goodell couldn’t suspend half the Saints players.

  81. dcnblue says: May 10, 2012 10:50 AM

    Where do we live????–America. Innocent until a preponderance of evidence shows you’re guilty! Giving out punishments without disclosing evidence to the union or players smacks of practices that are not American and are clearly wrong–regardless of who signed what in the new agreement!

Leave a Reply

You must be logged in to leave a comment. Not a member? Register now!