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Saints players believe Hargrove didn’t say “give me my money”

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Anthony Hargrove isn’t the only member of the 2009 Saints who believes he didn’t say “give me my money” in the now-infamous sideline video from the NFC title game.

Mike Freeman of CBSSports.com reports that “almost the entire team” believes it wasn’t Hargrove.  And the players do believe it was someone else.

Freeman says that the players are trying to get the person whom they believe uttered the words to take responsibility.  Though Freeman doesn’t identify the player believed to have said the words, multiple sources have told PFT that the players believe it was defensive tackle Remi Ayodele.

As MDS pointed out earlier in the evening, Ayodele’s agent, Jordan Woy, says that Ayodele doesn’t know who said the words.  That’s going to create some awkwardness and tension as Saints player continue to try to persuade Ayodele to own up to the fact that he said it.

For those of you who are sick of hearing about this specific issue (and more than a few fall into the category), we make no apologies for continuing to discuss and analyze and report on it.  The NFL inexplicably insists that Hargrove said the words, claiming that the video is clear on that point when it clearly is not.  Moreover, common sense points not to Hargrove (who didn’t hit Brett Favre on the play that injured his leg) but to Ayodele (who did) as the person more likely to want to be paid the purported bounty on Favre.

If the NFL would simply admit that which is obvious to anyone with at least one good eye and one good ear and one slightly average brain, this wouldn’t be nearly as big of an issue as it is.

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64 Responses to “Saints players believe Hargrove didn’t say “give me my money””
  1. urcrap says: Jun 25, 2012 10:47 PM

    Just in. Saints players determined deaf! Sewerleans fans get those paper bags ready. You’ll need them. Again.

  2. drgreenstreak says: Jun 25, 2012 10:49 PM

    Oh yes, let’s hear what the Saints players have to say about the Saints players.

    psst… bet they’re innocent. Who’d a thunk it?

  3. benh999 says: Jun 25, 2012 10:49 PM

    “anyone with at least one good eye and one good ear and one slightly average brain”

    PFT editor job description?

  4. truetrue85 says: Jun 25, 2012 10:50 PM

    Imagine that…

  5. roesty says: Jun 25, 2012 10:50 PM

    Who Cares anymore. Obviously every saints player, or coach involved thinks they are innocent. I know its the off season but for the love of god this “bounty gate” is getting so boring and its annoying the hell out of me. Screw the saints, they broke the rules, they deserve to be punished. Be a man and suck it up already.

    ps. profootballtalk.com rules.

    Go Broncos

  6. drgreenstreak says: Jun 25, 2012 10:51 PM

    You tell ‘em how to act, Florio!

    Florio for NFL Commissioner!

  7. shzastl says: Jun 25, 2012 10:54 PM

    No one disputes that Hargrove HEARD it said if he didn’t say it himself. Therefore, he still obviously knew about the bounty and lied by denying it, regardless of whether he’s the one who said show me the money

  8. trooper586 says: Jun 25, 2012 10:55 PM

    Really?? I’m shocked!! What a bunch of liars! How can these guys teach their kids right and wrong, when they don’t practice honest themselves?

  9. truthfactory says: Jun 25, 2012 10:56 PM

    If there is no bounty system, why did ANYONE on the sideline say “Give me my money!” when they are discussing the thought that they just broke Favres leg!?!????

    Why don’t they ask these guys that question???

    And please spare me the “It might have been a beer vendor”, or “maybe they had a side bet” excuse. It’s a very incrimenating audio clip, regardless of who said it…

  10. thejuddstir says: Jun 25, 2012 10:57 PM

    This is becoming so freakin’ childish, I’m sick of it. The entire team knows Hargrove didn’t say it but yet no one knows who did say it., as long as we know someone said it (it’s on tape), that’s good enough for me. If Fajita, Taco and Burrito want to claim their “innocence (sic)” then try showing your honesty and quit lying. If know one wants to say who did make the claim then I think the rest of us are perfecty fine with leaving things as they are.

  11. jason1980 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:00 PM

    Goddell’s desire to save face prevents him from being logical at this point. He’s between a rock and a hard place, by his own ineptness and that of his investigative team. At least Saints fans see this sham for what it is, and we thank you Mr. Florio for your excellent objective reporting. Goddell is irrelevant at this point, Saints fans are focused on the coming season. We will also continue to blast those commissioner for being the worst the NFL has ever had. His reputation is forever tarnished.

    Goddell *

  12. nflhof says: Jun 25, 2012 11:01 PM

    The NFL should let the Saints offer what their punishment should be like some of the College programs do when they get caught not playing by the rules.

  13. cali49er707 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:04 PM

    PAY DA MAN!!!

  14. istateyourname says: Jun 25, 2012 11:04 PM

    Just suspend everybody that was a Saint over the last three years and be done with it then.

  15. 6thsense79 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:05 PM

    If the NFL would simply admit that which is obvious to anyone with at least one good eye and one good ear and one slightly average brain, this wouldn’t be nearly as big of an issue as it is.
    ———————————–

    Not going to happen. The NFL is arrogant and rarely (if ever) admits it’s wrong.

  16. jamrho5 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:09 PM

    will smith looks at ayodele right after its said

  17. txtuff says: Jun 25, 2012 11:09 PM

    All the coaches involved need to come out and say publicly rather it was a bounty or not! Then the players can move on, rather its sue the NFL or take the punishment!

  18. shaggytoodle says: Jun 25, 2012 11:13 PM

    Free Anthony Hargrove!

  19. musicman495 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:15 PM

    NFLPA Letter to Roger Goodell, 6-22-12:

    “When journalists and fans publicly question the process it reflects poorly upon the stewards of the game. Our players, management and fans are entitled to a process that adheres to a standard beyond your interpretations of the bare minimum requirements of the CBA; they are entitled to believe in the fairness of both the process and the people entrusted to uphold it.”

  20. musicman495 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:18 PM

    Not only am I not convinced that is Hargrove speaking, I am not even convinced that the words SAID are “Give me my money.” And I sure as hell don’t know what was MEANT by whatever was said. Did Goodell even bother to ASK saints players what was said, or who said it, or what was meant?

  21. fukallusernamesaretaken says: Jun 25, 2012 11:23 PM

    The nfl’s insistence that it’s hargrove’s voice is simply mind boggling. Also, what happened to the early reports that something like 22 players were involved? They can’t suspend that many saints so they cherry pick two saints and two former saints. Roger effed up big. This thing reeks.

  22. thejuddstir says: Jun 25, 2012 11:26 PM

    jason1980 says:Jun 25, 2012 11:00 PM

    Goddell’s desire to save face prevents him from being logical at this point. We will also continue to blast those commissioner for being the worst the NFL has ever had. His reputation is forever tarnished”
    ————————————————–
    This is too damn funny….everyone outside of the Bayou knows who’s reputation is “forever tarnished”.

  23. cwwgk says: Jun 25, 2012 11:28 PM

    I just went back and re-read your article from yesterday morning. I still come away with a slightly different take on what Pash was driving at.

    At least in the quoted text of the article, Pash never expressly states that Hargrove uttered the words. But I certainly see the inference. What Pash does say is that the tape establishes Hargrove knew about the program and then lied about it.

    Even if Hargrove wasn’t the actual player who asked for his money, he was standing right there. Vitt tells Hargrove and his fellow lineman that Favre is out with a leg injury. In direct response someone states they’re entitled to money. Pretty strong evidence that some type of program is being operated. And since Hargrove is part of the group it’s more than a reasonable deduction he knew about it. And since he knew about it, he lied to league investigators when he denied the program existed.

    So, I think Pash/the league is saying the video justifies Hargrove’s suspension because it demonstrates he was part of the coverup, but not necessarily a participant in the program itself.

  24. chatham10 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:28 PM

    The thing about this that I do not understand, the players who were suspended are doing all the talking and crying about not doing anything wrong but not one word from the head coach or defensive coach who were also suspended, would you not believe that if they agreed with the players that they would be speaking out?

  25. samapoc says: Jun 25, 2012 11:31 PM

    The tape doesn’t prove that ANYONE on the Saints said anything. Furthermore, it doesn’t prove anything about the existence of a bounty unless you artificially read in context, and this could result in a wrong conclusion. In fact, it’s much more likely that a wrong conclusion is what you will make.

    The NFL has tons of photographers, camera guys, and personnel on the sideline of every game. Why would it take until the NFC title game to hear a possible (not even close to certain) mention by a player about a bounty? It just doesn’t make sense. The evidence released by the NFL is not convincing. It’s not even circumstantial evidence. It’s just wrong to call it evidence of anything.

  26. wunsa says: Jun 25, 2012 11:41 PM

    If Hargrove didn’t say it, and all evidence and logic says he didn’t, is it out of the realm of possibility that he didn’t hear it? Lot’s of noise there – players talking over each other, multiple coaches, staff, film crews, photogs, official, fans, reporters, etc. And it was three years ago. Do every one of you remember everything you heard three years ago? There are any number of reasons beyond a long-term bounty program in place for someone, player or otherwise, to have made the statement.

    For the video to PROVE a bounty on Farve or a larger bounty system there needs to be corroborating evidence. Such as a bank statement showing a payment amount withdrawn or deposited, a voice analysis done, eye-witness testimony…the league has none.

    So bottom line is that the statement in no way PROVES that Hargrove new about a bounty PROGRAM. And he’s the one Goodell charged with lying about knowledge of a PROGRAM, not a single instance, PFP, etc. It appears this is the only proof that the league has that Hargrove lied. So in this case it seems the evidence shows Goodell wildly exaggerated (AKA lied).

  27. randomguy9999 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:46 PM

    Doesn’t matter who said it…. That tape alone is proof there was a bounty system….. All the lawyers and media arguing the point is great for them to get paid….. But reality is…. The saints did it…. Case closed.

  28. 4t9er says: Jun 25, 2012 11:52 PM

    This continuous coverage of the bounty issue isn’t helping the Saints at all. This is not a criminal case, there is no jury to acquit them because of “reasonable doubt”. The players signed on a CBA to give Goddell all this powers, and if they didn’t want him to be the judge, jury and executioner they shouldn’t have agreed to the CBA.

  29. tangysizzl says: Jun 25, 2012 11:53 PM

    I wonder if they even asked McCray or Ayodele about the bounty program? Shouldn’t those two have been priority number 1 considering they were the guys that almost took Favre out of the game.

    So either they lied too and both should be suspended for 8 games or both of them admitted to the program and they are part of the chain of evidence used to suspend everyone else.

    Either way something is very fishy about this entire process.

  30. benchwarmer69 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:56 PM

    They’re so full of it.

  31. crazybeardedjack says: Jun 25, 2012 11:56 PM

    “Saint players believe….’

    And that’s where I stopped reading.

  32. zn0rseman says: Jun 26, 2012 12:09 AM

    “Almost the entire team.”

    Means some of them think he said it.

  33. micker716 says: Jun 26, 2012 12:16 AM

    Anthony Hargrove lie? Why would anyone doubt the word of a two-time suspended drug cheater?

  34. harryglyphics says: Jun 26, 2012 12:19 AM

    Everybody is missing the point of the whole “bounty” thing: It’s not about “intent to injure”; every football player from day one is told to go “hurt” that guy. It’s semantics to say “Oh, but don’t injure him. Just hurt him.” Anymore than it was about the “humane” treatment of dogs when it came to Michael Vick. It was about the fact that he bankrolled the gambling. It’s all about the money — and where it came from. In the case of the Saints, some of it (who knows how much) came from Ornstein. A convicted felon. That’s the real problem. Goodell told Payton and Williams to cut it out with paying money coming from that guy and they didn’t.
    Like Pete Rose, they didn’t gamble against their own team but gambling on the game (with outsiders) is gambling and when it gets to 5 or 10 grand, the IRS gets interested.

  35. frankyvito says: Jun 26, 2012 12:22 AM

    It’s funny how players always say, “it was the heat of the moment I don’t remember.” Yet everyone “KNOWS” Hargrove didn’t say it. Sure bro… Then how do you explain saying it on the field right after that illegal hit?

  36. ftcsubs says: Jun 26, 2012 12:31 AM

    wh dont NBC do some investigatie reportin and do te voice analysis.I asure there hunders of interviews of all the saints players. plus the current video, why we keep speculating. why dont someone prove or exonerate hardgrove. there would be a story if someone spent some money and hired an expert.

  37. wunsa says: Jun 26, 2012 12:32 AM

    If Hargrove didn’t say it, and all evidence and logic says he didn’t, is it out of the realm of possibility that he didn’t hear it? Lot’s of noise there – players talking over each other, multiple coaches, staff, film crews, photogs, official, fans, reporters, etc. And it was three years ago. Do every one of you remember everything you heard three years ago? There are any number of reasons beyond a long-term bounty program in place for someone, player or otherwise, to have made the statement.

    For the video to PROVE a bounty on Farve or a larger bounty system there needs to be corroborating evidence. Such as a bank statement showing a payment amount withdrawn or deposited, a voice analysis done, eye-witness testimony…the league has none.

    So bottom line is that the statement in no way PROVES that Hargrove new about a bounty PROGRAM. And he’s the one Goodell charged with lying about knowledge of a PROGRAM, not a single instance, PFP, etc. It appears this is the only proof that the league has that Hargrove lied. So in this case it seems the evidence shows Goodell wildly exaggerated (AKA lied).

  38. jcbadger34 says: Jun 26, 2012 12:32 AM

    Gotta love the stupidity of the Saints players here. They’re so eager to make Goodell “look stupid” by proving someone other than Hargrove said it……that they’re trying to get a player on their roster to admit it and likely get suspended himself….so they can save a player who is on the roster of one of their 2012 opponents and NFC contenders.

  39. joyjoy69 says: Jun 26, 2012 12:41 AM

    jason1980 says: Jun 25, 2012 11:00 PM

    …At least Saints fans see this sham for what it is…

    ———–

    Really?! I’m a huge Patriots fan, and I never had this level of denial! Yes, I accepted the fact they did what they are accused of, I just nitpick about how bad a crime they committed, and whether it was fair to punish them what the league did – and whether all the BS about an asterisk was warranted. I can always rest on the fact that what they did wasn’t criminal or blatantly and obviously immoral. Saints’ fans don’t have that luxury. I feel for you as an avid fan of a team that used to suck then became really good. But be honest, the evidence is overwhelming that your team’s defense was more focused upon injuring other players than they were about making plays (and those aren’t always the same thing!), and that the expected to be paid for that fact. Nevermind avoiding taxes on undeclared income (a federal crime), the team was paying money to players to injure others. Take that off the field, we are talking about an obvious criminal violation. Some will say so what, but perhaps that indicates a broader problem in society?

  40. badintent says: Jun 26, 2012 12:56 AM

    Send all the Aints to Russian Embassy , have KGB agents used the “lights on” interrogation method to determine the truth. no blood, no mess, just no sleep for 3-4 days. Used on CIA agents. Works like a charm.

  41. tramonisland says: Jun 26, 2012 12:56 AM

    @roesty

    Dom Capers cares

  42. ningenito78 says: Jun 26, 2012 12:58 AM

    Thank god someone is beating this to death. Goodell is praying people stop talking so he can press forward. Places like profootballtalk will ensure that, at some point, the truth will have to come out. Keep the pressure on, Florio. Somebody has to.

  43. msclemons67 says: Jun 26, 2012 12:59 AM

    So someone on the Saints tried to claim his bounty payment but it may not have been Hargrove. The Saints players anonymously claim that it was Ayodele, not Hargrove, who wanted to collect the bounty.

    We now have Saints players admitting to a bounty program along with the owner, GM and coaches. And Hargrove lied to the league about said program.

    Suspension upheld.

  44. xtutx says: Jun 26, 2012 1:13 AM

    we make no apologies for continuing to discuss and analyze and report on it. The NFL inexplicably insists that Hargrove said the words, claiming that the video is clear on that point when it clearly is not.

    ———————-

    Oh wow, we are going to beat this one until we get the equipment in to prove what is already evident. But sure, fine, lets be through, lets do this! We have the technology.

  45. theashleyguy says: Jun 26, 2012 1:18 AM

    Here is what I find hilarious about this whole thing. There are exceptions, but for the most part professional athletes tend to be very conservative. They demand that people own up to their mistakes and take responsibility for what they’ve done. They hate people who try and get out of trouble on a technicality. Even though they are in a union themselves, they hate unions and everything they stand for. And now we find out that when the chips are down and they are in serious trouble, they suddenly become the very people they hate.

  46. omnipotentcrab says: Jun 26, 2012 1:27 AM

    Sure sounded like Hargroves voice to me. And who cares he obviously knew there was a program in which people were given money for hits that injured people. It’s definitely karmic payback, albeit the punishments were a bit harsh.

  47. vtopa says: Jun 26, 2012 2:04 AM

    Uncle Rodger is starting to feel the heat. Hope Hargrove sues you too, dictator.

  48. voicefreason says: Jun 26, 2012 2:07 AM

    So the Saints don’t believe. So they don’t really know. Guilty.

  49. getsome99 says: Jun 26, 2012 2:18 AM

    This is why it’s pointless for the NFL to provide “evidence” to the players. Why should they? The players know what they did. The funny thing is Goodell outsmarted these idiots and got them to confess. Hargrove already signed a written statement acknowledging the existence of the bounty program and his suspension was for lying about it in 2010. It doesn’t matter who said it on the video. The comment itself is evidence regardless of who said it. The NFLPA is trying to save face because the real issue is you have players fighting the NFL regarding player safety when it’s these same players who are going out of their way to try to make the hell out of each other.

  50. mwindle1973 says: Jun 26, 2012 2:36 AM

    If your talking about me being sick of the bounty issue being discussed, no I am actually not sick of it. Because I want to know what nobody seems to want to talk about. Was any other teams doing this? How common place are bounty systems in the NFL and how many of them resemble the pay for injury scheme the Saints were running? Is my team doing this? See it disgusts me no matter who is doing it. I want to know if the Saints went rogue or this was common, that way it can be squashed out of the game. But if in the article you were talking about us being sick of Hargrove video issue, I most certainly am sick of listening to spin. This is not a court, it’s a workplace dispute. Have you examined whether the NFL has had a voice expert listen to the tapes? Nobody has established that they haven’t. SO according to the very logic that drives all these articles, then the NFLPA must have something to hide because they haven’t done it either. Look it’s simple…if anyone, including PFT wants to prove something, have a voice expert examine the tape. They can tell if it’s the same voice saying Bobby and give me my money. To my simpleton ears it sure sounds like the same voice throughout the statement. And i’d bet that’s what the NFL is talking about as well. But really does it matter? The players are going to sue and then a court will decide if the NFL had enough proof to prove NFL rules were broken. And I mean ANY NFL rules. And they have proven that. All this detail about who said what is more detail and more proof than the NFL needs to act.

  51. latenightroach says: Jun 26, 2012 2:39 AM

    There were people right there when those words were spoken who know who said what. These people need to have some integrity and officially speak up to clear whoever is innocent.

  52. silvercutlery says: Jun 26, 2012 2:48 AM

    @thejuddstir

    Well said. Perfectly captured what most are thinking.

  53. piemasteruk says: Jun 26, 2012 3:43 AM

    Has it occurred to anybody that Goddell knows (or at least strongly suspects) it wasn’t Hargrove that said it, but claims that he is certain it was Hargrove in the hope that the real culprit is will do the honourable thing and own up, knowing that he has no chance to make the evidence stick otherwise?

    And has it occurred to you that Ayodele (or whoever it actually was) may remember saying it but doesn’t own up because he *knows* the above (his agent probably figured it out). And he correctly keeps quiet and claims no recollection knowing that the NFL will likely have to drop the issue in the face of lack of evidence?

    Everyone commenting on this story (even Florio in the original story) is just taking everything they see at face value and not thinking it through. Every official press release and carefully crafted comment that you lap up is just smoke and mirrors. What is really happening right now is anybody’s guess, but the above makes much more sense than the commonly touted lines that the NFL is ‘stupid’ and Ayodele is a coward.

  54. bearsoxass says: Jun 26, 2012 4:44 AM

    Probably jesus voice

  55. marat28051988 says: Jun 26, 2012 5:19 AM

    Goodell Is too busy looking for more fake documents to use against the Saints I mean the man got 1000 plus so called documents and counting as he makes more to look through, give the man a break lol.

  56. williamxl22 says: Jun 26, 2012 5:24 AM

    I remember watching this game and rooting the Saints because I thought they had a better chance of beating the Colts. The more I saw them beating Brett Favre to a bloody pulp, the more I began rooting for the Vikings. It was obvious that their gameplan was to take him out of the game. Each time Peterson fumbled, I yelled at the screen.

    It was clear the Saints were playing hard and trying to get hits on the opposing quarterback. They won the game and they won the Super Bowl. However, does this bounty evidence change that? Absolutely not. They paid players for big hits. While I personally find that unnecessary and foolish, the bigger question in the long run is: who cares? They would have hit Favre regardless of bounties. It was part od their gameplan. Let’s just move on and start the season.

  57. tampatexansfan says: Jun 26, 2012 5:56 AM

    I think the players are just plain stupid. They have seen the evidence they are just trying to gain the public’s support so when this goes to trail they will have some support.

    There lawyers are taking them to the bank.

  58. mbj360 says: Jun 26, 2012 6:15 AM

    Straight cash homie!

  59. blackcatsluck says: Jun 26, 2012 6:40 AM

    It was said. That makes it pretty clear that the bounty system was in place with injuries intended. The coaches got what they deserve but , it appears that there are many questions on which players were responsible for what. I could see some reductions to players’ punishments, but not total elimination.

  60. gingerkid2000 says: Jun 26, 2012 7:04 AM

    So no one will own up to saying “Pay Me My Money!” and yet we’re supposed to believe that these guys are all innocent because they say so, even though they have been given the opportunity to provide proof of their innocents and have given nothing.

    In a court of law a murder suspect will at least try provide an alibi. So let these guys take on Goodell in court. Eventually they will have to provide more than the statement “You have no evidence I did it!”

  61. wiley16350 says: Jun 26, 2012 7:59 AM

    O.k. something that needs to be explained is Hargrove’s motive to say “give me my money”. Because apparently many people seem to think that since he wasn’t the one that injured Favre then he wasn’t the one that would say it. But probably at that point no one was for sure which hit was the one that took Favre out. They didn’t even know he was out. Hargrove had hit Favre a few times, so in his mind he could have been the one to injure Favre. We all have been around guys that will take credit for anything if there is any possibility that they were the ones that accomplished the goal. So it is a possibility that either Hargrove believed it was one of his hits that took Favre out or he wanted McCrary to believe he was the one or he could have just been joking with McCrary that he was the one. But I have watched the video many of times and I come to the same conclusion each time and that it is Hargrove that makes the “give me the money” comment. I come to that conclusion because the voice that says “Bobby” (which is clearly Hargrove) sounds exactly the same as the voice that says “Give Me The Money”. I have tried to pretend that it is someone else, but I don’t hear it any other way. Obviously, Goodell hears it and sees it the same way I do. So unless the video is doctored, I have a hard time believing it was somebody else that said “Give Me The Money”.

  62. harryglyphics says: Jun 26, 2012 8:21 AM

    The question shouldn’t be whether Hargrove and Ayodele hit Favre high and low; the question should be Why didn’t the Packers block them better?

  63. duridynasty says: Jun 26, 2012 9:21 AM

    If you view it in context of the full conversation, it all becomes clear.

    Coach tells them he thinks Favre’s leg might be broke. They all process the comment, and Smith (back to camera) wants confirmation, looks at Hargrove and asks Hargrove if it is ‘true’ (the last word out of his mouth).

    Hargrove answers him. He doesn’t say ‘Bobby’ but he says ‘Might be’. His comment ends.

    Ayodele then throws in his money request. (Note Smith is looking directly at who is speaking)

    Still not turning out well for the Saints, but Hargrove is not the one who says it.

  64. sfsaintsfan says: Jun 26, 2012 10:28 AM

    Everybody says, “If Hargrove was standing there and heard, give me my money, then he knew there was a bounty program”. Were any of you at that game? I was there, it was so loud in that building, you had to scream directly in the ear of someone so they could hear you. Directional microphones can pick up things from a distance, that cannot be heard by a human from two feet away.

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