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	<title>Comments on: Injury stats irrelevant to existence of bounty program</title>
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		<title>By: sarentack</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-2139000</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[sarentack]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Nov 2012 19:57:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-2139000</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The reason its irrelevant?

Thats simple, because Baltimore and San Fransisco run a bounty system that has taken out numerous players, last year San Fran took out 6 RBs in the first 7 games. Thats no coincidence.

Meaning if it was Relevant (only to the NFL) then they would need to investigate the Habaugh brothers and probably some other coaches to like Dick Lebeau.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The reason its irrelevant?</p>
<p>Thats simple, because Baltimore and San Fransisco run a bounty system that has taken out numerous players, last year San Fran took out 6 RBs in the first 7 games. Thats no coincidence.</p>
<p>Meaning if it was Relevant (only to the NFL) then they would need to investigate the Habaugh brothers and probably some other coaches to like Dick Lebeau.</p>
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		<title>By: zn0rseman</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1888292</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[zn0rseman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jul 2012 03:49:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1888292</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Setting aside the fact that the high-low “give me my money” hit on Brett Favre inexplicably wasn’t flagged (but, please, give the locked-out game officials every last penny they want)

------

Ha!  Funniest line I think I&#039;ve ever read here!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Setting aside the fact that the high-low “give me my money” hit on Brett Favre inexplicably wasn’t flagged (but, please, give the locked-out game officials every last penny they want)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p>Ha!  Funniest line I think I&#8217;ve ever read here!</p>
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		<title>By: joekain</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887763</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[joekain]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 22:07:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887763</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The more I hear about this Saints saga, I cannot help but think that this has very little to do with player safety or injuries or locker-room banter...

All this is about (like most everything) is MONEY $$$. As far as the NFL is concerned, you can perform on Sundays, but you cannot be paid for it outside of what is outlined in the collective bargaining agreement (i.e. no non-contract bonuses).

Let me make one thing clear. Pay-for-performance v/s pay-for-injury is irrelevant. Paying cash to a player for a QB sack or an INT is a no-no to the league, as is paying cash for a hit (legal or illegal) that results in injury. However, I don&#039;t think fans would think it a big deal if the NFL cracked down on QBs or RBs buying their O-Line Rolex watches at the end of the season.

So, the league brought up the injury angle, in part to show off the image that they&#039;re taking &quot;player safety&quot; seriously now, especially in the face of ongoing litigation by former players. So rightfully, players like Vilma are gonna challenge the league on that front, because (according to them), they didn&#039;t set out to injure with malice, but to play within the rules of the game and dole out some $$$ as an incentive for big plays.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The more I hear about this Saints saga, I cannot help but think that this has very little to do with player safety or injuries or locker-room banter&#8230;</p>
<p>All this is about (like most everything) is MONEY $$$. As far as the NFL is concerned, you can perform on Sundays, but you cannot be paid for it outside of what is outlined in the collective bargaining agreement (i.e. no non-contract bonuses).</p>
<p>Let me make one thing clear. Pay-for-performance v/s pay-for-injury is irrelevant. Paying cash to a player for a QB sack or an INT is a no-no to the league, as is paying cash for a hit (legal or illegal) that results in injury. However, I don&#8217;t think fans would think it a big deal if the NFL cracked down on QBs or RBs buying their O-Line Rolex watches at the end of the season.</p>
<p>So, the league brought up the injury angle, in part to show off the image that they&#8217;re taking &#8220;player safety&#8221; seriously now, especially in the face of ongoing litigation by former players. So rightfully, players like Vilma are gonna challenge the league on that front, because (according to them), they didn&#8217;t set out to injure with malice, but to play within the rules of the game and dole out some $$$ as an incentive for big plays.</p>
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		<title>By: mrpowers88</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887554</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mrpowers88]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 20:30:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887554</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[People should realize that the Saints defense in those 3 years just wasn&#039;t that good at all.

All they did in their Super Bowl Season was force more turnovers than in any other year and Will Smith had a career year.  And even then, the only reason they beat the Vikings was that they repeatedly hit Favre late in the NFC Championship.

And through this whole process, the players haven&#039;t done anything to actually help themselves. 

They repeatedly lied to NFL investigators; they complained about how overly-hard the suspensions are; they complained about how the process that their union agreed to is unfair; they refused to produce any REAL defense at their appeal; and now they&#039;re  saying that since nobody was hurt (and no money changed hands), that  there must have been no system at all.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>People should realize that the Saints defense in those 3 years just wasn&#8217;t that good at all.</p>
<p>All they did in their Super Bowl Season was force more turnovers than in any other year and Will Smith had a career year.  And even then, the only reason they beat the Vikings was that they repeatedly hit Favre late in the NFC Championship.</p>
<p>And through this whole process, the players haven&#8217;t done anything to actually help themselves. </p>
<p>They repeatedly lied to NFL investigators; they complained about how overly-hard the suspensions are; they complained about how the process that their union agreed to is unfair; they refused to produce any REAL defense at their appeal; and now they&#8217;re  saying that since nobody was hurt (and no money changed hands), that  there must have been no system at all.</p>
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		<title>By: realysickofbountygate</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887536</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[realysickofbountygate]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 20:24:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887536</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Having a &quot;bounty&quot; program is contrary to league rules regardles if they injured anyone or not. Sports betting by a player is illegal - regardless if they shave points or not. If you play in the league - you play by their rules. Sick of Saints fans and players finding every excuse in the book to avoid punishment. Covering up the existence of the program - guilty of not following the rules. Maybe when athletes and those associated such as coaches etc. are held to following the rules there will be less examples such as Dez Bryant, A Peterson, etc. etc.  in the news, and more stories like the Aaron Rodgers contract posted earlier]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having a &#8220;bounty&#8221; program is contrary to league rules regardles if they injured anyone or not. Sports betting by a player is illegal &#8211; regardless if they shave points or not. If you play in the league &#8211; you play by their rules. Sick of Saints fans and players finding every excuse in the book to avoid punishment. Covering up the existence of the program &#8211; guilty of not following the rules. Maybe when athletes and those associated such as coaches etc. are held to following the rules there will be less examples such as Dez Bryant, A Peterson, etc. etc.  in the news, and more stories like the Aaron Rodgers contract posted earlier</p>
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		<title>By: malgorthewarrior</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887475</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[malgorthewarrior]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 20:02:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887475</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hypocrisy indeed.  You can&#039;t get mad at players for inflicting clean, legal hits.  

The concept of hitting or going &quot;too hard&quot; while still in the confines of the rules is silly on-face.  How can you enforce such interpretations?  

If the NFL has a problem with the way those players were playing on the field, they should make more rules to govern those hits.  I&#039;m sure eventually they will.

I think we all know what this is-the NFL covering their butts to avoid losing these concussion lawsuits...but I don&#039;t think it helps their case to keep reminding us that clean, legal hits still cause injury.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hypocrisy indeed.  You can&#8217;t get mad at players for inflicting clean, legal hits.  </p>
<p>The concept of hitting or going &#8220;too hard&#8221; while still in the confines of the rules is silly on-face.  How can you enforce such interpretations?  </p>
<p>If the NFL has a problem with the way those players were playing on the field, they should make more rules to govern those hits.  I&#8217;m sure eventually they will.</p>
<p>I think we all know what this is-the NFL covering their butts to avoid losing these concussion lawsuits&#8230;but I don&#8217;t think it helps their case to keep reminding us that clean, legal hits still cause injury.</p>
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		<title>By: blackandbluedivision</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887425</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[blackandbluedivision]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:45:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887425</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Of course it&#039;s irrelevant whether there was bounty program. He just wants to see what evidence you have on him that there was one. So he can vehemently deny it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course it&#8217;s irrelevant whether there was bounty program. He just wants to see what evidence you have on him that there was one. So he can vehemently deny it.</p>
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		<title>By: saintsfan26</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887416</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[saintsfan26]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:43:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887416</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Roger Goodell should go to San Francisco and teach that rookie cornerback how to backpedal.  He seems to be an expert.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roger Goodell should go to San Francisco and teach that rookie cornerback how to backpedal.  He seems to be an expert.</p>
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		<title>By: sfsaintsfan</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887414</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[sfsaintsfan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:42:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887414</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And two New York Giants players admitted that they specifically targeted Kyle Williams because of his concussion history prior to the NFC Championship Game and the NFL did NOTHING about it!

This is all about getting in front of the concussion lawsuits and making a scapegoat out of the Saints, nothing more and nothing less.....

And it is all about illegal hits and injuries according to the media, if not why else would you and everybody else not be constantly fixated on that ONE hit on Brett Favre?  The FACT that the Saints were the 2nd &quot;cleanest&quot; team in the NFL over a three year time period, second only to the Chargers, should mean something, shouldn&#039;t it?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And two New York Giants players admitted that they specifically targeted Kyle Williams because of his concussion history prior to the NFC Championship Game and the NFL did NOTHING about it!</p>
<p>This is all about getting in front of the concussion lawsuits and making a scapegoat out of the Saints, nothing more and nothing less&#8230;..</p>
<p>And it is all about illegal hits and injuries according to the media, if not why else would you and everybody else not be constantly fixated on that ONE hit on Brett Favre?  The FACT that the Saints were the 2nd &#8220;cleanest&#8221; team in the NFL over a three year time period, second only to the Chargers, should mean something, shouldn&#8217;t it?</p>
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		<title>By: eaglesw00t</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887408</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[eaglesw00t]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:39:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887408</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Completely irrelevant.  Certain QBs get nailed and never get a call.  

You can nail most RBs as hard as you like wherever you like, and most of the time theres no call.

Come on Vilma.  Is there anything else you want to throw against the wall in this big old pile of sh?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Completely irrelevant.  Certain QBs get nailed and never get a call.  </p>
<p>You can nail most RBs as hard as you like wherever you like, and most of the time theres no call.</p>
<p>Come on Vilma.  Is there anything else you want to throw against the wall in this big old pile of sh?</p>
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		<title>By: wfmulder</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887382</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[wfmulder]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887382</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[siriusred67 says: 
Jul 19, 2012 3:17 PM 
You were doing fine until the second-to-last paragraph. There is nothing inherently wrong with encouraging players to apply clean, hard hits with the potential for injuring an opponent. Adding a monetary reward for doing so is the one and only problem in this scandal.
__________________________________________________

So obviously you have an issue with incentive clauses in contracts that state if a defensive players gets a certain amount of tackles per year they get a bonus, or if a defensive player gets a certain amount of sacks they get a bonus? Both or done in the confines of clean, legal hits and ARE BINDING by a CONTRACT. How do the two differ, please explain?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>siriusred67 says:<br />
Jul 19, 2012 3:17 PM<br />
You were doing fine until the second-to-last paragraph. There is nothing inherently wrong with encouraging players to apply clean, hard hits with the potential for injuring an opponent. Adding a monetary reward for doing so is the one and only problem in this scandal.<br />
__________________________________________________</p>
<p>So obviously you have an issue with incentive clauses in contracts that state if a defensive players gets a certain amount of tackles per year they get a bonus, or if a defensive player gets a certain amount of sacks they get a bonus? Both or done in the confines of clean, legal hits and ARE BINDING by a CONTRACT. How do the two differ, please explain?</p>
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		<title>By: robf2010</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887380</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[robf2010]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:27:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887380</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It was a well-orchestrated league campaign to make a mountain out of a molehill.  They had to.  They couldn&#039;t make it about player safety because no one was hurt and they couldn&#039;t make it about the money because the money was peanuts.

They violated a rule and denied doing so (According to the league, anyway).  That rates punishment.  What the league handed down was excessive and I might even say personal.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was a well-orchestrated league campaign to make a mountain out of a molehill.  They had to.  They couldn&#8217;t make it about player safety because no one was hurt and they couldn&#8217;t make it about the money because the money was peanuts.</p>
<p>They violated a rule and denied doing so (According to the league, anyway).  That rates punishment.  What the league handed down was excessive and I might even say personal.</p>
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		<title>By: tpa43</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887366</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[tpa43]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:17:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887366</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hold on. When was it determined that you aren&#039;t supposed to inflict pain into your opponent. Isn&#039;t this football? Stop pretending that all of this wasn&#039;t part of the game two years ago.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hold on. When was it determined that you aren&#8217;t supposed to inflict pain into your opponent. Isn&#8217;t this football? Stop pretending that all of this wasn&#8217;t part of the game two years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: siriusred67</title>
		<link>http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/19/injury-stats-irrelevant-to-existence-of-bounty-program/#comment-1887364</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[siriusred67]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:17:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=1055646#comment-1887364</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You were doing fine until the second-to-last paragraph. There is nothing inherently wrong with encouraging players to apply clean, hard hits with the potential for injuring an opponent. Adding a monetary reward for doing so is the one and only problem in this scandal.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You were doing fine until the second-to-last paragraph. There is nothing inherently wrong with encouraging players to apply clean, hard hits with the potential for injuring an opponent. Adding a monetary reward for doing so is the one and only problem in this scandal.</p>
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