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League’s internal memo suggests that suspensions will be re-issued

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Many are painting the decision to wipe out the bounty suspensions imposed against Saints linebacker Jonathan Vilma, Saints defensive end Will Smith, Browns linebacker Scott Fujita, and free-agent defensive end Anthony Hargrove as a slam-dunk win for the players.

While it was a victory on the surface, it was fairly hollow and potentially temporary.

Apart from the fact that the timing of the decision prevented the players from practicing in preparation for Week One, the ruling gives the NFL another chance to impose the suspensions in a way that draws clear lines between conduct detrimental to the game (over which Commissioner Roger Goodell has jurisdiction) and salary-cap violations arising from a pay-for-performance/bounty system (over which Goodell has no jurisdiction).

It’s likely that the league will simply re-issue the same suspensions.  Indeed, the memo sent by NFL general counsel Jeff Pash to the various teams on Friday clearly indicates that the league continues to believe that wrongdoing occurred — and that there should be significant punishment for it.

“Nothing in today’s decision contradicts any of the facts found in the investigation into this matter, or absolves any player of responsibility for conduct detrimental,” Pash writes.  “Nor does the decision in any way suggest what discipline would be appropriate for conduct that lies within the authority of the Commissioner.  Per the panel’s direction, the Commissioner will promptly reconsider the matter and make a determination of the appropriate discipline consistent with the standards set forth in today’s decision.  All clubs will be advised when that decision is made.”

It would be a surprise if the outcome is anything other than what it already was:  a full season for Vilma, four games for Smith, three games for Fujita, and eight games for Hargrove.

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82 Responses to “League’s internal memo suggests that suspensions will be re-issued”
  1. canetic says: Sep 7, 2012 9:25 PM

    The lawyer$ will still be happy about that

  2. bucrightoff says: Sep 7, 2012 9:32 PM

    Boom Baby!!!

  3. randomguy9999 says: Sep 7, 2012 9:32 PM

    they did it, they should be punished

  4. Wisconsin77 says: Sep 7, 2012 9:32 PM

    Good. Make the cheaters pay.

  5. jimr10 says: Sep 7, 2012 9:32 PM

    Before everyone jumps on Goodell just remember he is doing exactly what the owners want him to do.

  6. rickastleydancemoves says: Sep 7, 2012 9:33 PM

    Pound your chest now Saints fans.

  7. kegowhisky says: Sep 7, 2012 9:34 PM

    You’re probably right that nothing will change in the long run on this case, but you have to think (hope) that Goodell will pick up on the court’s message. That message being: You’re not the supreme being and you have to play within the guidelines and are not free ad-lib whenever you wish. Of course, I’m not betting a paycheck that he ever changes until removed from the position.

  8. bigbabies says: Sep 7, 2012 9:36 PM

    GODell will impose his will……

  9. petehemlock says: Sep 7, 2012 9:39 PM

    Re-issue – Re-appeal – Repeat

  10. cappa662 says: Sep 7, 2012 9:41 PM

    You lost this one NFL, just turn the page.

  11. namelessfacelessfan says: Sep 7, 2012 9:42 PM

    For the Saints, as a team, the only player at issue is Smith. Vilma has been replaced. But Smith is their best D-lineman and will be missed if only for four games.

  12. gunndlewittlebaum says: Sep 7, 2012 9:43 PM

    Suspensions AND huge lawyer bills. Maybe these players should have kept quiet?

  13. jrdbrn says: Sep 7, 2012 9:44 PM

    I guess the NFL likes throwing away money…

  14. weswelkerspornstash says: Sep 7, 2012 9:46 PM

    Goodell suck it up!!! You are about to lose your job.

  15. greatminnesotasportsmind says: Sep 7, 2012 9:47 PM

    Cheaters will always cheat…

  16. edenprairieballer says: Sep 7, 2012 9:51 PM

    HAHA http://www.owned.com

  17. squinn21 says: Sep 7, 2012 9:52 PM

    Just go away already!!!

  18. theashleyguy says: Sep 7, 2012 9:54 PM

    If you are supportive of the players using all the options open to them to try to “defeat” the suspensions, you have to be supportive of Goodell and the NFL using all the options open to them, too.

  19. dalucks says: Sep 7, 2012 9:54 PM

    I guess the only way fans will find out the truth is when the players and NFL go to court and Roger Goodell has to testify under oath. I guess we will finally find out what is on those 50K pages of evidence if it really exist.

  20. voicefreason says: Sep 7, 2012 9:57 PM

    Good job Goodell. Keep them accountable. Vilma, go go hang out with your empty title for a year and contemplate your idiocy.

  21. larryjames836 says: Sep 7, 2012 9:57 PM

    Roger Goodell is know good him and the others thank they going to pull the wool over this woman head. What Roger Goodell going to do is make this Judge mad and she going to make the ruling herself. She looking for a change in the suspension if there is know change then the players going to go back to the Federal court if they goes back and if she not satisfied with the call then she will make the ruling. NFLPA nor Vilma attorney are not going for the same suspension its going back to the Federal court Roger Goodell don’t want to be fair. If Goodell a lawyer he is dumb slapnut knows you can’t fool these federal judges its on it way back to federal court you can take it to the bank this time it’s going to be final Goodell making right in her hand she know Goodell want to be a judge, jury, hangman she knows that she trying to help these two sides work together but the NFL want to be the HEAD.

  22. voiceofreasonsays says: Sep 7, 2012 10:02 PM

    As Nelson Muntz would say…Haw, Haw!

  23. bigperm33 says: Sep 7, 2012 10:02 PM

    The commissioner will “promptly” act – if the past is any indication, prompt for this commissioner means we will have a decision within the next few months.

  24. Mr. Wright 212 says: Sep 7, 2012 10:05 PM

    AS THEY SHOULD.

  25. lilrob10201 says: Sep 7, 2012 10:08 PM

    I say suspend them all for a full season.

  26. thetooloftools says: Sep 7, 2012 10:08 PM

    I say to the NFL. Let it go. The damage is done. But I would also drag the players union to the table to make 100% sure this never happens again.
    It is only in the best interests of all involved except the lawyers trying to make your teams out to be street walkers begging for their services.
    Everyone goes back into play, if I’m the NFL including everyone but Williams who was stone cold busted.
    Move on and then deal with it. Otherwise it’s gridlock.
    I could live with that.
    I welcome your abuse.

  27. rhodeislandpatriotsfan says: Sep 7, 2012 10:09 PM

    After reading the CBA Appeals Panel summary decision, I saw it as a “slam-dunk win” for Goodell and the league.

  28. link49 says: Sep 7, 2012 10:11 PM

    The League must show the prove to everybody in special to us the fans, because since the begining of the “bounty scandal” to much bla,bla,bla, and but not solid prove that these players were implicated in the so call bounty.
    With the today technology and the league said that the investigation is almost a year old Show these players receiving money,-some picture or movie- because the fact is nobody believe in the accusation- .
    The League is Acting as Judge and Jury at the same time…Unbelievable this happen !!!!

  29. stevenfbrackett says: Sep 7, 2012 10:12 PM

    Good. Besides it being the right decision, if the League just said, “okay, you win” and let it go, they would never have any credibility to punish players for anything again.

  30. succulentnipples says: Sep 7, 2012 10:13 PM

    I’m embarrassed to be a fan of this league. I wonder how the NFL offices feel. They appear very bad at their jobs. On second thought, I really don’t care.

  31. bgsusteelers says: Sep 7, 2012 10:15 PM

    I have a better idea for a punishment. Lock Goodell in a room with Jonathan Vilma and James Harrison.

  32. emmonsh says: Sep 7, 2012 10:16 PM

    The suspensions were thrown out because of the language. not the fact they were inocent. they are guilty and will go down. hard. so will the all the taints.

  33. The Prophet says: Sep 7, 2012 10:19 PM

    Just take your punishment like a man and move on …

  34. jamiebuf12 says: Sep 7, 2012 10:24 PM

    good!!!!
    i am tired of players when they get suspended just going to their hometown judge and fighting goodell in court….ie……..starcaps…those players got to play for like 3 years and when the ruling finally came their careers were basically done……..Vilma is a punk! he has been gloating and tweeting the whole way………there has to be a system where the players can’t sue or have the courts involved….maybe have a arbitrator like in the old days after the commish makes a ruling…………….

  35. eyeh8goodell says: Sep 7, 2012 10:30 PM

    So let’s see some of these supposed “facts” already. You say you got 55,000 pages worth…..so lets see even just one of them. If you really had these “facts” it wouldn’t be a matter of “believing” there was wrongdoing. There simply would be or would not be wrongdoing. That’s the definition of fact. If its factual, then belief has got nothing to do with it.

  36. conormacleod says: Sep 7, 2012 10:32 PM

    I hope a player gets arrested soon so we can stop reading about this.

  37. noahbird says: Sep 7, 2012 10:33 PM

    Being from WV, you are a very astute writer and legal mind.

  38. buchopeful says: Sep 7, 2012 10:39 PM

    I hope they get something, and Roger dont get too big of a head.

  39. rmdz7 says: Sep 7, 2012 10:39 PM

    … unfortunately for Mr. Pash, Goodell, and the NFL, this time around, he’s going to have to make available all of his alleged 50,000 pages of “evidence”. And this time, they better produce the actual ledger and all the signed statements from the Cerullos of the world to the salary cap arbitrator. That much is clear in the CBA regarding salary cap violations: ALL evidence must be presented to the arbitrator.

  40. dretwann says: Sep 7, 2012 10:47 PM

    How long will you beat a dying horse Goodell? This fight just isn’t worth it. Especially not based on suspect evidence. Let it go and lets play some football!!

  41. Where's Bud Grant when you need him? says: Sep 7, 2012 10:49 PM

    DUH!!

    Apparently everyone who read the quotes from the decison understood this… well everyone except Vilma, Brees, and a few who dat folks who can’t handle the truth.

  42. letmesetyoustraight says: Sep 7, 2012 10:49 PM

    “Nothing in today’s decision contradicts any of the facts found in the investigation into this matter, or absolves any player of responsibility for conduct detrimental”

    This could have all been avoided if the NFL would have opted to share the facts if they actually have any. This “trust me” BS is not cutting it as many are now skeptical of the league’s investigation.

  43. caliangel08 says: Sep 7, 2012 10:50 PM

    Did memo mention why they screwed up in the first place ???

  44. geauxjay says: Sep 7, 2012 10:51 PM

    Go ahead and just stubbornly do it again, and you stupid jackasses will just lose again.

    If you believe that the “evidence” is overwhelming, then share it with ANYONE. Especially the players who were not even given a fair opportunity to defend themselves last time because they had no idea what the “evidence” was.

  45. geauxjay says: Sep 7, 2012 10:56 PM

    Good God. Could you people who “know” that the players were guilty please share ONE LOUSY PIECE OF EVIDENCE you have or have seen that proves their guilt?

    Go ahead. I dare you.

    And Gregg Williams’ “confession” does not count. The NFL wrote it and it provides ZERO evidence that Jonathan Vilma paid anyone.

  46. lostsok says: Sep 7, 2012 11:05 PM

    Vilma is a cry-baby.

    Do the time already. Your whining is annoying.

  47. cwwgk says: Sep 7, 2012 11:10 PM

    @geauxjay: no stronger piece of evidence than a confession. According to Judge Berrigan, Vilma admitted under oath to participating in a bounty program as alleged by Goodell.

  48. jhaug1016 says: Sep 7, 2012 11:11 PM

    This is the way these things go. Goodell tried to make the suspensions stick without having to present the evidence to the public for various reasons (public opinion, protection of the witnesses). In legal matters you don’t play all the cards when you don’t have to. It is the same thing with the Ryan Braun case, he won on a technicality because he didn’t have to argue the case on the facts. No one knows what would have happened had he been forced to. All this ruling does is force the NFL to show their hand. I suspect that a league with this much clout would not have gone this far if they weren’t prepared to show everything.

  49. cax20 says: Sep 7, 2012 11:13 PM

    league simply does not need to prove conduct detrimental to you me jurors judges or anyone

    the only thing the NFL did wrong was not to perfectly document that the punishment wasn’t due to their salary cap violations ( which has been admitted by some involved parties ) but was entirely due to conduct detrimental, which is somewhat vague (to me at least).

    I can’t see any way the league won’t just slap the suspensions back on with slightly better paperwork and the players will go back to their lawsuits/injunctions that are basically their last ditch.. If they don’t they will look stupid at best, vengeful racist liars at worst.

    if the players win their lawsuit and the league is forced to give up its power it negotiated for, do the players give up money or do extra practices as a concession?

  50. bkostela says: Sep 7, 2012 11:17 PM

    geauxjay says:
    Sep 7, 2012 10:56 PM
    Good God. Could you people who “know” that the players were guilty please share ONE LOUSY PIECE OF EVIDENCE you have or have seen that proves their guilt?

    Go ahead. I dare you.

    And Gregg Williams’ “confession” does not count. The NFL wrote it and it provides ZERO evidence that Jonathan Vilma paid anyone.

    ———————

    what happens when the whistleblower turns out to be your beloved drew brees? would you still fault the league for withholding that information, and trying to protect a player who is calling out an illegal operation for the integrity of the game? but who am i kidding – drew brees is only out for drew brees.

  51. mjkelly77 says: Sep 7, 2012 11:25 PM

    I have no doubt that the suspensions will be re-issued and deservedly so. This procedural move will allow the language will be clarified to demonstrate that the miscreants engaged in conduct detrimental to the NFL.

    Then all of the wishful slappies who are claiming victory will realize this was only a delay in the rightful, eventual punishment.

  52. promickey says: Sep 7, 2012 11:25 PM

    It would be a surprise if the outcome is anything other than what it already was: a full season for Vilma, four games for Smith, three games for Fujita, and eight games for Hargrove.
    ==================================
    It would then also be a surprise if the Judge does not rule to overturn the suspensions. The Judge did ask both sides to settle. I have no clue how this Judge will respond. However judges are human and I would expect her to be angry.

  53. ravensaintsfan says: Sep 7, 2012 11:28 PM

    The ruling requires Roger to present PROOF that he is suspending the players for intent to injury. He can’t just say we have multiple cooperative statements confirming the intent to injury. So if Roger wants to re-suspend he needs to put up or shut-up. No amount of whining for the shills will change that. Saints players took it to Roger today and there nothing you can do about it.

  54. meandjuliojonesdownbytheschoolyard says: Sep 7, 2012 11:30 PM

    Good. Tack on a couple more for being such whiney jerks.

  55. warrenpeacephotography says: Sep 7, 2012 11:35 PM

    jimr10 says: “Before everyone jumps on Goodell just remember he is doing exactly what the owners want him to do.”
    ——————

    And this is supposed to be an excuse? The fact that Goodell is nothing but a fanboy for the owners makes this even worse!

  56. conormacleod says: Sep 7, 2012 11:37 PM

    It’s always funny to read “we haven’t seen any evidence”. You mean Goodell and the NFL haven’t come to Podunk, Louisiana, knocked on every door, and made their case to every anonymous poster here? Really? Well, then they must all be innocent! Just boys being boys! I guess Goodell and 31 other owners just woke up bored one day and said “let’s F with the Saints for absolutely no reason!!” Yep, that must be it.

  57. mjkelly77 says: Sep 7, 2012 11:37 PM

    larryjames836 says:Sep 7, 2012 9:57 PM

    Roger Goodell is know good him and the others thank they going to pull the wool over this woman head. What Roger Goodell going to do is make this Judge mad and she going to make the ruling herself. She looking for a change in the suspension if there is know change then the players going to go back to the Federal court if they goes back and if she not satisfied with the call then she will make the ruling. NFLPA nor Vilma attorney are not going for the same suspension its going back to the Federal court Roger Goodell don’t want to be fair. If Goodell a lawyer he is dumb slapnut knows you can’t fool these federal judges its on it way back to federal court you can take it to the bank this time it’s going to be final Goodell making right in her hand she know Goodell want to be a judge, jury, hangman she knows that she trying to help these two sides work together but the NFL want to be the HEAD.
    ________________

    Is English your second language?

  58. andrewfbrowne says: Sep 7, 2012 11:41 PM

    This is totally a win for the NFL, they avoided the Federal judge being involved and now they just issue the same suspensions from a different office. The appeal board delaying their decision until the Friday before the first game lets the players get a week and then get slam dunked. Then NFLPA has far less to go to Feds with. Players got beat in first quarter, pulled even in second quarter and it looks like league is making some half time adjustments and is going to dominate the second half.

  59. vegasvinnie says: Sep 7, 2012 11:41 PM

    Go ahead, Roger. Judge Berrigan is waiting to strike you down next.

  60. richndc says: Sep 7, 2012 11:43 PM

    as long as old Rog keeps bustin thme sweet ginger farts, he is ok by me.

  61. brenenostler says: Sep 7, 2012 11:44 PM

    Good God. Could you people who “know” that the players were guilty please share ONE LOUSY PIECE OF EVIDENCE you have or have seen that proves their guilt?

    Go ahead. I dare you.

    And Gregg Williams’ “confession” does not count. The NFL wrote it and it provides ZERO evidence that Jonathan Vilma paid anyone.
    ______________________________

    Former players of Williams in Buffalo and Washington have admitted that Williams ran a bounty system there. And since Sean Payton and Gregg Williams never once denied there was a bounty system, it probably happened.

    The reason the NFL doesn’t want to release the evidence is because they have more class than these players that are trying to bring him down. You never heard Goodell saying things like “These players are a bunch of scumbags. They deserve these punishments.” No, he doesn’t do that. Think about it, if they release all the evidence for the whole world to see what these guys did, doesn’t that make the NFL look just as bad as the players?

    Think about it like this……if your girlfriend or wife cheats on you, are going to update your Facebook status to tell everyone what she did? Probably not. It’s no one else’s business, and it makes you look bad too.

    If I were Goodell, I wouldn’t release the evidence either. If everyone saw the evidence, Vilma would probably be much more hated. And I don’t think that’s the commissioner’s goal.

  62. sfsaintsfan says: Sep 8, 2012 12:00 AM

    No Florio, you have this all wrong:

    1) If the conduct is for off the field “salary cap” violations, the Goodell does not have authority to issue suspensions period. He does not have that authority under the CBA.

    2) If the conduct is for on field “intent to injure / bounty” violations he will have to reveal his evidence to the players. If he does not reveal his evidence, the suspensions will be overturned on appeal by an independent appeals board. Goodell will not be able to hear the appeal of the suspensions if this is the case.

    Finally, if Goodell tries to just re-issue suspensions without having a hearing under 1 or 2 above, this will go straight to Judge Berrigan, who will very likely issue a TRO faster than you can say go to hell, Roger Goodell.

  63. rodgers419 says: Sep 8, 2012 12:07 AM

    Goodell is wrong and he knows it. It’s too late for him to back down now. He has too much capital invested.

  64. rubbernilly says: Sep 8, 2012 12:08 AM

    To those claiming that this doesn’t change the facts of the case, that this is only a technicality over the basis on which Goodell formed his ruling, and that the suspensions will be equally justified once they’re handed down again…

    …you’re right. But…

    …it also doesn’t change the basis for the players’ challenge: that they were never presented with this “mountain” of evidence the NFL claims to have, and thus could never fairly challenge it.

    That might sound like I’m a Saints-sympathizer to those who have staked out positions that the players are guilty, but it’s not at all the same. I am reserving judgment on the coaches’ and players’ relative guilt until I see more evidence than the NFL has been willing to release. Unfortunately for the NFL (and Goodell), that means that I can’t help but come down on them for *not* releasing* the evidence, and for sanctioning the players (and the coaches) without providing the fairness of a full discovery process.

    So, yes. It’s possible to come down on the NFL without claiming the players are innocent… or being scapegoated. It is possible to come down on the NFL while reserving the right to call out the players at a later date when there is more information available.

  65. warrenpeacephotography says: Sep 8, 2012 12:13 AM

    jamiebuf12 says: “good!!!!
    i am tired of players when they get suspended just going to their hometown judge and fighting goodell in court”
    ————–

    You’re tired of players sticking up for themselves? Think about what you’re saying before you say it next time. Or if you truly want a league full of unassertive, lifeless saps, I don’t know what to tell you.

  66. warrenpeacephotography says: Sep 8, 2012 12:14 AM

    conormacleod says: ‘I hope a player gets arrested soon so we can stop reading about this.”
    ——————–

    I have great news for you! You don’t need to wait for anything, you can stop reading about this RIGHT NOW! Isn’t that amazing news?

  67. darrontrask says: Sep 8, 2012 12:22 AM

    I always believed that Goodell didn’t release all the evidence in hopes that the idiots would go to NY and talk to the man. But no, they had to hide behind lawyers and litigation. Goodell has always been fair when the players have talked to him.

    Now I hope much more evidence is released and when he reconsiders, he bans the whole bunch for life. including coaches.

    Damn Idiots!

  68. hoodatnva says: Sep 8, 2012 12:43 AM

    According to “CBA”, players CANNOT be suspended for participating — (if you can prove it!!!!), “bounty” program. No player will be suspended after this ruling. Don’t forget, every player involved swore under federal court oath, penalty of perjury, that the NFL got EVERYTHING wrong. Most of you haters don’t even read much less comprehend.

    I/we accept your myopic hate. The Saints, Saints fans, city of New Orleans, EMBRACE the hate, and will gladly accept the Lombardi for your fume and fuel inspired atrocity. Lies, upon lies, fueled by more lies by the myopic idiots that want to spread more lies. Dip dunks in the free world just want to hate — and that’s ok with me. Been fighting Bin Laden types all my life. So bring us some more untruths to fuel us.

    Love the Saints, and love our country. If not, your NO friend of mine (like you even freakin care).

  69. noblepat12 says: Sep 8, 2012 12:55 AM

    Suspensions

    People look we talk about how these players should serve suspensions for what they did. Tell me this who did they injure? We have players in the league that are repeat offenders of DUIs that don’t even get that type of punishment. Heck the NFL had a player kill a civilian because he was driving while drunk. These players are paid to entertain you all so tell me what did they do wrong and who was injured?

  70. bennyb82 says: Sep 8, 2012 1:02 AM

    larryjames836 says:
    Sep 7, 2012 9:57 PM
    Roger Goodell is know good him and
    the others thank they going to pull the
    wool over this woman head. What
    Roger Goodell going to do is make this
    Judge mad and she going to make the
    ruling herself. She looking for a change
    in the suspension if there is know
    change then the players going to go
    back to the Federal court if they goes
    back and if she not satisfied with the
    call then she will make the ruling.
    NFLPA nor Vilma attorney are not going
    for the same suspension its going back
    to the Federal court Roger Goodell
    don’t want to be fair. If Goodell a
    lawyer he is dumb slapnut knows you
    can’t fool these federal judges its on it
    way back to federal court you can take
    it to the bank this time it’s going to be
    final Goodell making right in her hand
    she know Goodell want to be a judge,
    jury, hangman she knows that she
    trying to help these two sides work
    together but the NFL want to be the
    HEAD.

    When I read a post like this I wonder how this person was able to figure out how to obtain a screenname…

  71. stirlingdat says: Sep 8, 2012 2:55 AM

    after a 3 year investigation they came up with no evidence and 50k pages of invisible ink. Now they will do a redo in 2 weeks and magically all the pages will be filled with tons of evidence… then berringer will jump in and throw Goodell in jail for forgery.

  72. sloppydogg says: Sep 8, 2012 7:10 AM

    The truth you and I don’t know the truth, their is 50,000 pages of proof so they say. I say Goodevil had all the time in the world to place the truth on the table he did not so ask you’re self why. And you loser fans from other teams that are making comments about the saint’s I’ve gone to you’re team pages and those who have the drunk’s on their team have not made one comment about them, yet here you are kicking these guys around.
    If he headhunted then an made mistakes you bet your sweet a_ _ he’s going to do it again or just leave this alone and walk away with some pride Goodevil . Hmmmm Coach Sean Payton being reinstated now thats breaking news don’t be surprise if that comes next. So haters stop hating on WHO DAT NATION let’s play some football.

  73. glynners says: Sep 8, 2012 7:11 AM

    as a Saints fan all i want is some evidence. give us that and i for one will hold my hands up & admit ive been wrong all along

    until such moment arrives i will continue to believe this whole thing is a sham made up by a discruntled ex employee

  74. Mike Florio says: Sep 8, 2012 7:36 AM

    You are right on (1), wrong on the rest.

  75. ernie ernie says: Sep 8, 2012 10:09 AM

    Vilma’s victory dance will be short lived. The ruling only says the suspension is suspended pending a review by the commissioner. Apparently the League must decide who has the authority to issue the suspention, the commish or the special adjutant who deals with all monetary issues regarding the CBA.

    My take is suspensions will be re-issued starting week two but they will be lesser. I also see Vilma back in fed court to stop that as well rather than take his medicine.

  76. ernie ernie says: Sep 8, 2012 10:16 AM

    I’m rather pragmatic on this. There are lawyers galore all over the place on both sides. I have to believe after all the testimony they collected, the NFL would NOT have made the suspension decisions without discussing the evidence 50 times with outside legal advisers, just to make sure every I was dotted.
    They did bring in outside experts to just review all the evidence they had and these three, totally independent people, all came to the same conclusion. A bounty was in place. Money exchanged hands, and certain people who were named.
    You can best your patute no one who testified did so without a confidentiality agreement that there testimony (evidence) would not be released to the public.

  77. mjkelly77 says: Sep 8, 2012 10:27 AM

    sfsaintsfan …

    The assertion of “salary cap violations” is what muddied the water as the Commissioner has no authority in that regard. However, the suspensions can and will be re-issued under the “conduct detrimental” assertion. The Commisioner has full authority in that regard as granted by the CBA.

  78. 49erstim says: Sep 8, 2012 10:53 AM

    The reason the league and Commish act as judge and jury is because they ARE the judge and jury. I know that sucks for the leagues criminal element, but the law-abiding players don’t seem to mind.

  79. larryjames836 says: Sep 8, 2012 1:04 PM

    Roger Goodell can’t not go back with the same suspension this is why they overturned it. You Saints haters can say what you want see the Federal Court was trying to give the two side a change to work this out but if the NFL commissioner Roger Goodell goes back with the same suspension the Judge are going to make her rulings. Then it will be over with then Goodell will lose his job and the suppose to be bounty program will be over.

  80. rmdz7 says: Sep 8, 2012 1:20 PM

    @mjkelly77

    Yes, Goodell can do that. Unfortunately for Goodell, this time around, he is going to have to actually prove it; he is going to have to define what was pay-for -performance and what is pay-to-injure. As per CBA he is going to have to turn over all of his alleged “evidence” to arbitrators for the salary cap violations, which in turn will make all of this “evidence” available to the NFLPA, Vilma, Gingsber, and the public.

    And that is all Saints fans want to see. The actual proof.
    - Don’t give us “transcriptions” of alleged ledger entries and re-leak them twice because your story didn’t jive the first time around.
    - Don’t show us video and tell us someone yelled this, then when the video is debunked, tell us “it doesn’t matter.
    -Don’t bring up locker room bravado as proof of action. (side note, would love to hear the speeches of all other 31 DCs in the league)
    - Don’t just tell us “someone told us you offered $10,000 to hurt Farve” , tell us who the hell was, when he heard it, etc.
    - Don’t tell us “they were warned many times” without showing us the warnings. Oh, like something like that would not have been put in writing? Yeah, riiiight.
    - Don’t tell us “bounty program for 3 years” then change it to “events that occurred during the 2009 season”.
    - Don’t tell us “intent to injure” then change it to “in the course of legal play if someone was removed from the game”

  81. hoodatnva says: Sep 9, 2012 12:39 AM

    @mjkelly77

    Yes, Goodell can do that. Unfortunately for Goodell, this time around, he is going to have to actually prove it; he is going to have to define what was pay-for -performance and what is pay-to-injure. As per CBA he is going to have to turn over all of his alleged “evidence” to arbitrators for the salary cap violations, which in turn will make all of this “evidence” available to the NFLPA, Vilma, Gingsber, and the public.

    And that is all Saints fans want to see. The actual proof.
    - Don’t give us “transcriptions” of alleged ledger entries and re-leak them twice because your story didn’t jive the first time around.
    - Don’t show us video and tell us someone yelled this, then when the video is debunked, tell us “it doesn’t matter.
    -Don’t bring up locker room bravado as proof of action. (side note, would love to hear the speeches of all other 31 DCs in the league)
    - Don’t just tell us “someone told us you offered $10,000 to hurt Farve” , tell us who the hell was, when he heard it, etc.
    - Don’t tell us “they were warned many times” without showing us the warnings. Oh, like something like that would not have been put in writing? Yeah, riiiight.
    - Don’t tell us “bounty program for 3 years” then change it to “events that occurred during the 2009 season”.
    - Don’t tell us “intent to injure” then change it to “in the course of legal play if someone was removed from the game”

    B R A V O ! !

  82. artisan3m says: Sep 10, 2012 1:02 AM

    This thing will ultimately wind up before a federal judge. Hide and watch. There is more at play here than “conduct detrimental.” There are professional careers, reputations, and character under assault. Goodell should be forced to offer up evidence of his “investigation” and I’m not sure that will pass the smell test. So long as it remains an internal matter, Goodell can prevail. It will not remain internal and the accused is entitled to be confronted with the evidence which to date has not been done. I don’t see how the NFL can prevail if the case is pursued externally and I do believe that will ultimately occur. Now, with an arbitrator’s reversal favoring the players, the matter is more ripe for external review.

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