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League office should take close look at aftermath of Bucs-Giants kneel-down play

Tom Coughlin, Greg Schiano AP

The NFL has said that the Buccaneers’ decision to treat the kneel-down play that ended Sunday’s game against the Giants like it was fourth and goal in the Ice Bowl violates no rules.  But the Giants’ reaction may have.

Lost in the threats/promises from guys like guard Chris Snee to retaliate against the Bucs in the future is the fact that the Giants already have retaliated.

When the Bucs lined up and fired off the ball, catching the Giants by surprise, Giants players started hitting and pulling and otherwise assaulting Bucs players after the play.

Zapruder-quality film of the incident shows center David Baas throwing a forearm to the head of linebacker Quincy Black after the play.  Even worse, guard Kevin Boothe rolls defensive end Adrian Clayborn over and drops a knee into his chest.

Last week, Texans defensive end Antonio Smith was fined $21,000 for kicking the head of Dolphins guard Richie Incognito, whom Smith believed was doing something dirty to his leg.  This week, the league office could be taking some money away from the team that believes (mistakenly) that it was victimized by the Bucs.

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57 Responses to “League office should take close look at aftermath of Bucs-Giants kneel-down play”
  1. txxxchief says: Sep 19, 2012 3:56 PM

    The Giants may hope for mercy, but the other team can force you to keep playing the game until time runs out.

  2. sj39 says: Sep 19, 2012 3:57 PM

    Like I said before, if teams quit taking the knee the losing team and their fans will call it “trying to run up the score” but I think some of those G-Men are in for some fines anyway.

  3. natelan69 says: Sep 19, 2012 3:58 PM

    Yup, they earned some fines there.

    Get to it, Roger.

  4. Stupid Raiders Fan says: Sep 19, 2012 4:01 PM

    I like how Eli said the Bucs shouldn’t have done that because the Giants were playing nice and kneeling down.

    No.

    Playing nice and kneeling down is when you are up 2+ scores and you’re showing mercy to the opponent.

    This was more the kneel down so we don’t otherwise screw up play.

    And Coughlin saying it was such a dangerous play that he’s glad nobody got hurt. Please. Every play is a dangerous play. Maybe you shouldn’t run the ball on the goal line because it’s so dangerous.

  5. buckeye044 says: Sep 19, 2012 4:02 PM

    Stop whining and let it go. The rest of us have.

  6. medtxpack says: Sep 19, 2012 4:05 PM

    Giants players, their coach and mostly their fans all are crybabys. Except Eli, but thats more of a ‘I dont really know whats going on’ type of thing.

  7. thetroothhurts says: Sep 19, 2012 4:05 PM

    stay classy new jersey!

  8. eastsideballa says: Sep 19, 2012 4:05 PM

    I’m enjoying the way the replacement refs are officiating, their allowing defensive backs to play the position the way it was meant to be played, if anyone has noticed that no QB with exception of Eli Manning has thrown for a ridiculous amount of yards which were a dime a dozen last year, stay at home refs nobody needs you back, and let us enjoy this style of football that we all grew to love before Marvin Harrison and the colts ruined it for everybody by complaining to the league office that Ty Law was abusing Harrison. #Physicalfootball.

  9. panamon says: Sep 19, 2012 4:05 PM

    Fine those Giant players.

  10. rexranius says: Sep 19, 2012 4:06 PM

    How did the Giants line not see that coming. The Bucs were tensed up and a couple were twitching like they were timing the snap. Their O-line whining just makes me detest the Giants more. Digging a deeper hole under the Cowboys and Packers.

  11. bovice23 says: Sep 19, 2012 4:09 PM

    Looks like the team that claimed to be the victims of dirty play were actually the ones playing dirty. I respect the Bucs for not crying about it and trying to move on.

  12. realitypolice says: Sep 19, 2012 4:10 PM

    Ironic that the Giants were screaming “unsportsmanlike!” at the Bucs for executing a football play while they threw knees and elbows all over the place in retaliation for it.

  13. hawkforlife says: Sep 19, 2012 4:13 PM

    League office should take close look at aftermath of Bucs-Giants kneel-down play
    —————————-
    So now PFT is the NFL watchdog. I won’t ever root for the Giants but come on, let it go. You continually gripe at Goodell for imposing too harsh a fine but now you call for them?

  14. canesgiants says: Sep 19, 2012 4:13 PM

    why didnt schiano use his last timeout if he was playing till the end

  15. nobby821 says: Sep 19, 2012 4:14 PM

    JTuck: “Now thats Classy”

  16. kevinwi says: Sep 19, 2012 4:17 PM

    Play to the last second. I think victory formation is ridiculous…don’t fumble the damn ball and you will have no worries…play ball.

  17. leeeroooyjeeenkiiins says: Sep 19, 2012 4:19 PM

    Well, there goes their “classless”, “dirty”, “bush league”, and “could have caused injury” arguments. Do they even have any left at this point?

  18. lbijake says: Sep 19, 2012 4:24 PM

    If the Giant players ever watched the movie Rudy, they would know that white knuckles mean they are coming at you. Let’s pay attention in the future.

  19. justintuckrule says: Sep 19, 2012 4:24 PM

    Those of you complaining about the Giants’ “whining” must not see your teams in victory formation as much otherwise you’d understand our beef.

  20. bigbluefan1 says: Sep 19, 2012 4:31 PM

    medtxpack says:Sep 19, 2012 4:05 PM

    Giants players, their coach and mostly their fans all are crybabys. Except Eli, but thats more of a ‘I dont really know whats going on’ type of thing.

    ________________________________
    Yes crybabys dont know what they are doing just winning two Super Bowls in the past five years.
    Which TX team is yours the cowboys or the oilers oh thats right that team left TX so maybe its the orginal named team the texans?
    The only thing big in TX is the ego of Jerry.

    As for fine not a big deal they can use some of the money they got for winning the Super Bowl

  21. geauxjay says: Sep 19, 2012 4:33 PM

    Christ–why did this have to happen in New York City? This is to NFL rules what Linsanity was to NBA superstars.

  22. cooklynn17 says: Sep 19, 2012 4:36 PM

    Um, who really cares?

    They are all making millions of dollars and the organization will privately pay any and all fines anyway. The Giants would rather dish out some dough than to lose a player to injury on a senseless play, as would any team.

    Learn how to lose with some class Bucs. Giving up 25 points in the 4th quarter must have been a real high moment in the franchises history. This isn’t college and Schanios act will get old and wear thin real quick.

  23. fjackiemarlo says: Sep 19, 2012 4:36 PM

    Looks like the Giants and their head muckity muck Mr. Mara are real good at trying to enforce the “unwritten rules” of football. Just ask any Redskin or Cowboy fan about how their salary cap space disappeared this year. The Giants seem to think the world revolves around them.

    This argument is simple. Down by 8 or less you play EVERY play to win – period. If you want to give up before that then tell the ref you quit! Man up boys, this is the NFL!

  24. krank00 says: Sep 19, 2012 4:48 PM

    I think it would have been worth a mention that smith missed 2 days of practice last week after the incident with Incognito.

  25. geniusfan says: Sep 19, 2012 4:58 PM

    The Giants think they are NFL royalty, arrogance and elitist attitudes runs through that team more than the ugly shade of blue they wear.

    They whine about “unwritten” rules (putting a player on waivers means it’s fair game Giants) and dirty play, the Bucs should have played to win they had a chance to make a play at the end. I’m glad Schiano did what he did and I’m guessing a lot of people around the NFL are too.

  26. petarbell says: Sep 19, 2012 5:04 PM

    number 1 the 1978 play the eagles vs giants was not a kneel down play. Having been there if they had knelt down the play would have never happened. They knelt the play before which made the attempted handoff even more unbelievable . So the 1978 has no bearing
    2. bucs play every play??, they didnt do that at the end of the first half when NY knelt down?
    3. going hard is one thing, going at the knees is another. does it open pandora’s box, bottom line yes the bucs can go hard but not dirty.

  27. worldchampsbaby says: Sep 19, 2012 5:07 PM

    Computers and the worldwide web is a wonderful thing.Unfortunately,many faceless weasels find a platform to attack without reprecussions.

    The Giants were ill-prepared to deal with a ridiculous attack at their knees.If someone went after your knees ,unless you are a wimp, you would retaliate.

    Just the week before the Bucs kneeled down 3 times against Carolina with the score within 7 points.

    I guess the Panthers were: a) quitters
    b)accepting the game was over
    c)badly coached

    d)just stupid

    Most every team in the NFL understand the game is over.Let’s see how the remaining games for the TB bucs play out.The little mafia coach from joosey will get his come upence.

  28. Mr. Wright 212 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:15 PM

    If the Giants weren’t involved, this wouldn’t even be a discussion. But with the hordes of Giants haters out there, it’s a huge story, led by lead hater, who is now calling for fines with this stupid article.

  29. Mr. Wright 212 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:16 PM

    At any rate, why this has been made from a complete nonstory into a major scandal is beyond me. I didn’t have a problem with what the Bucs did. The players will police themselves if it continues.

  30. j0esixpack says: Sep 19, 2012 5:16 PM

    Taking a knee doesn’t violate any rules either.

    And taking a knee, when the game’s outcome is decided – avoiding unnecessary injuries to BOTH teams, strikes me as an appropriate protocol for teams to follow.

    Until the Buccaneers decided they wanted to get physical with the game decided, no teams seemed to have a problem with that.

  31. Mr. Wright 212 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:18 PM

    The bottom line is the Bucs were salty because their QB threw yet another INT to seal the game, after they blew a lead. That was a move out of frustration, not “trying to win because it’s still a one possession game”. I find it amusing that teams that LOST in Week 2 had just knelt on the ball three times the week before (Dallas, Tampa Bay).

  32. mazblast says: Sep 19, 2012 5:24 PM

    Goodell is a lifelong Giants fan, doesn’t hide that fact. No fines. Nor do I think they’re deserved, although that doesn’t usually stop Goodell.

    The Giants may think they’re entitled to special privileges because of who they are and what they won last year, but that’s not how the football world works. Whether you wear a “NY”, a star, a horseshoe, an arrowhead, orange-and-black stripes, lightning bolts, an aquatic mammal, or whatever, no one has to give you anything.

  33. discohang says: Sep 19, 2012 5:26 PM

    Didn’t teams complain about the Patriots a few years back when the Pats were “running up” the score. Saying that the Pats should just take a knee and finish the game rather than try to score more points.

  34. kev86 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:28 PM

    Worth the fines. Mara should pick up the tab. Glad the G-Men smacked those cheap shot artists around a little. Worth it.

    Go back to sunny Tampa lightweights and take the 600 yards we put up against you with ya.

  35. bigbluefan1 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:30 PM

    geniusfan says:Sep 19, 2012 4:58 PM

    The Giants think they are NFL royalty, arrogance and elitist attitudes runs through that team more than the ugly shade of blue they wear.

    They whine about “unwritten” rules (putting a player on waivers means it’s fair game Giants) and dirty play, the Bucs should have played to win they had a chance to make a play at the end. I’m glad Schiano did what he did and I’m guessing a lot of people around the NFL are too.

    __________________________________
    First off if your a genius you should never have to guess so I guess that says much about you.

    Secondly Giant fans know there team is NFL Royality two SB in 5 years the founders name on every football used every game.

    I would also bet the if not for Wellington Mara your team would not exisit as he was the one who help get the tv split up giving every team the same amount.
    Which was very nice of him as the Giants had the best TV deal of any and all teams at the time and they still would today as they play in the biggest market with the most money

  36. pb420 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:35 PM

    Are they really injured or is this another group injury-faking exercise that NY is known for? Hey PFT, is this comment gonna make it through? Keeping it classy as always right giants fans?

  37. magicbucs says: Sep 19, 2012 5:36 PM

    Going hard on the half time play wouldn’t of benefited the bucs at that time. They just had a pick 6. Then they allowed the giants to score that last TD because time would of run out on them if the kept giants from scoring, It’s called STRATEGY. There was nothing dirty the bucs did. ITS FOOTBALL. Just because the giants wanted to end the game on a kneel down. The bucs wanted to cause a fumble on the snap.

    Phillip rivers fumbled the snap on a kneel down against the chiefs last year.

    Rutgers caused 2 kneel down fumbles in 2010 under schiano.

  38. kev86 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:37 PM

    geniusfan says:
    Sep 19, 2012 4:58 PM
    The Giants think they are NFL royalty, arrogance and elitist attitudes runs through that team more than the ugly shade of blue they wear

    Wrong. The Giants know they are NFL royalty.

  39. bullcharger says: Sep 19, 2012 5:43 PM

    This issue should be dead. Just go by the rules of the game. Coaches can get all whiny about unwritten rules, but that’s just a waste of time. As you hear every year in the preseason… there’s only one speed to play at and if you don’t someone can get hurt. That’s full speed. Play to the whistle and it solves the problem.

  40. bearflagfan says: Sep 19, 2012 5:44 PM

    Doesn’t PFT or anyone else actually READ the NFL Rules? They are online (well, the 2011 version, but that’s good enough.)

    Under Rule 7-2-1c, when a quarterback immediately drops to his knee (or simulates dropping to his knee) behind the line of scrimmage, the ball is dead.

    Shooting the gap to grab a QBs ankle to trip him up won’t matter (as it would in college) because the ball would be dead the moment his knee hit, whether he holds onto the ball or not.

    The comparison with Herm Edwards’ Miracle at the Meadowlands run is Edwards picked up a fumbled handoff. In the Giants-Bucs game there never would have been a TD because the ball would be dead, period, whether it was called by the on field refs (who likely don’t know the rule) or by the replay officials, who do know the rules.

  41. bullcharger says: Sep 19, 2012 5:46 PM

    worldchampsbaby says:Sep 19, 2012 5:07 PM

    The Giants were ill-prepared to deal with a ridiculous attack at their knees.If someone went after your knees ,unless you are a wimp, you would retaliate.

    ———————

    If they really went at their knees then there should be penalties and or post game fines, just like any other illegal hits that occur in the game. Otherwise it it ws just another football play and the Giants should have been ready.

  42. cooklynn17 says: Sep 19, 2012 5:54 PM

    medtxpack says: Sep 19, 2012 4:05 PM

    Giants players, their coach and mostly their fans all are crybabys. Except Eli, but thats more of a ‘I dont really know whats going on’ type of thing.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Here’s what’s going on, Eli Manning just raised another Vince Lombardi trophy above his head for the second time in five years, that’s what’s going on.

  43. thewizardofbs says: Sep 19, 2012 6:04 PM

    Has everyone forgotten about the fake spike Dan Marino used to throw a pass when everyone thought he was stopping the clock? He beat the jets with that play because the jets did not play 100% to the end.

    Also, they were dumb enough to fall for it.

  44. gobigblue310 says: Sep 19, 2012 6:12 PM

    AWESOME! This makes me feel better about the whole thing. Only thing better would have been if some bucs had been seriously injured during the play. Was a gutless cheap play by a gutless cheap team with a gutless cheap coach. Very proud of Baas and Boothe. Enjoy your time schiano, you might get to come back next year but after that you’ll be searching for a college gig, you chump.

  45. mackie66 says: Sep 19, 2012 6:14 PM

    You play till the last whistle. I’m not a Bucs fan but I found nothing wrong with their play. How dare the Bucs treat the SB champs like that ?? I’m surprised Eli didn’t whine for Daddy.

  46. justintuckrule says: Sep 19, 2012 6:29 PM

    People don’t get that there is a difference between playing til the gun and playing dirty. There are plenty of “legal” plays that teams don’t make simply because doing so is dirt. (Off the top of my head, any player can take out another team’s kicker on a kickoff in the name of “play to the whistle”.)

    Schiano’s motive was not to instill a new attitude into his team. Instead, his sole motive was to cheaply steal a win on a one in a billion play at the risk of a bunch of unsuspecting players’ livelihoods. If he manned up and admitted his motive, then I’d say fine. But to call that bush league move in the name of “playing to the gun” is Schiano just being a dirty weasel.

  47. Nic says: Sep 19, 2012 6:37 PM

    3. going hard is one thing, going at the knees is another. does it open pandora’s box, bottom line yes the bucs can go hard but not dirty.
    ———————————————————-
    Watch the video instead of taking the Giants’ O-Lineman gripes to heart. Not one defender hit below chest level. Anyone else see that dude hammer fisting G. McCoy in the back of the head like a six year old?

  48. thelastpieceofcheese says: Sep 19, 2012 6:44 PM

    If anybody should be fine it should be the Bucs for their cheap shots at the end of the game.

  49. goldrush36 says: Sep 19, 2012 6:48 PM

    @bearflagfan….. you are right in theory. Provided they don’t botch the snap and that wouldn’t be the first time. Especially if Eli seen a swarm suddenly coming and panicked.

  50. replica33981 says: Sep 19, 2012 7:42 PM

    This should not be hard to comprehend. The Bucs tried to cause a fumble BEFORE Eli took a knee. It was a good play. If it worked it would have been a brilliant play. Now the Giants players who attacked the Bucs after the play? They deserve to be punished. It’s not a Jersey style free for all is it? Strange I didn’t hear the Buccaneer men whine & cry about being attacked after the play..just the New Jersey Giant boys.

  51. nomoreseasontix says: Sep 19, 2012 8:37 PM

    It kind of looked like the problem was bring handled. Old school.
    But, that’s not politically correct.
    Can’t have violence during a football game. Good lord….

  52. mrknowitallmtl says: Sep 19, 2012 10:32 PM

    If it would of cost the giants the game. He would have been a football GOD till next Sunday. At least he tried n didn’t call it quits.

  53. tpabucfan says: Sep 19, 2012 11:36 PM

    Marcellus Wiley Who is an analyst for ESPN stated it best. Saying that when a offense at the end of a game is trying to do a hook and ladder play or a hail mary or some other kind of trick play they are exhausting all options within rules to win a game. This play should be looked at no differently. With time left on the clock, you should act accordingly

  54. thatchrisguy says: Sep 19, 2012 11:42 PM

    This isn’t Pop Warner, it’s professional football. Play the game to the end. Run up the score. These guys are being paid to win. If it’s not against the rules then go for it.

  55. judsonjr says: Sep 20, 2012 1:08 AM

    For those of you saying it’s impossible to cause a fumble on a kneel down, read this. From Green Bay Press Gazette, Dec. 2002.

    “On the next play, Walker decided to try the near impossible — anticipate quarterback Jim Miller’s cadence and steal the snap. It worked.

    Walker submarined Bears center Olin Kreutz, hit the ball before it got to Miller’s hands, and grabbed it before it fell to the ground.

    Walker said he had a teammate at Milton (Fla.) High School who did that several times. ”

    I saw the play. While it wasn’t a kneel down play, what Walker did is what the Bucs were trying to do.

  56. jfinn5 says: Sep 20, 2012 2:50 AM

    The Giants and Cowboys don’t run the NFL. Or do they?

  57. andrewproughcfe says: Sep 21, 2012 6:17 PM

    Got to love it when 350 pound guys wearing full-body pads are fined for doing things to other 350 pound guys wearing fully-body pads that couldn’t possibly hurt either of them.

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