Jets want officials to give defense more time to substitute against Pats

AP

Jets linebacker Calvin Pace recently called the Patriots’ no-huddle offense “borderline illegal.”  The Jets apparently believe that it’s the officials, not the Pats, who are failing to follow the rules.

Defensive coordinator Mike Pettine has explained to Manish Mehta of the New York Daily News that the Jets will be emphasizing to officials the provisions that allow defenses to react and adapt to changes made in the offensive lineup.

“It’s going to be a major point of contention before [our] game with the officials to make sure that they know the rule is when they substitute we’re permitted to substitute,” Pettine told Mehta.

“If the officials permit [the Patriots] to do that, then the game is going to become chaos,” Pettine said.  “That’s the problem.  Because we’re going to be running guys on.  We need to make sure that that is enforced for this game, because we found examples on tape where it has not been.  Then it’s impossible.  Now you can’t defend it.”

The rulebook makes it clear that the officials have the responsibility to ensure that the defense has a fair chance to adjust to lineup changes.  Per Mehta, Rule 5, Section 2, Article 10 states that “if a substitution is made by the offense, the offense shall not be permitted to snap the ball until the defense has been permitted to respond with its substitutions. . . . The offense is prohibited from rushing quickly to the line of scrimmage and snapping the ball in an obvious attempt to cause a defensive foul (i.e. — too many men on the field). . . . The umpire will stand over the ball until the Referee deems that the defense has had a reasonable time to complete its substitutions.”

“When they change, that should trigger the ability for us to change,” Pettine said.  “I’m all for the no-huddle and one grouping.  Whoever you put out there, you better be prepared to go through a whole series and be out there for a while.  And that’s fine.  When they change, we need to be given the right to change . . . and we’re going to make sure that right is given to us.”

And that’s the difference between hitting the accelerator with versatile players on the field and shuttling in other players quickly in the hopes of catching the defense with its pants down.

Should the Jets be taking their concerns public?  In a roundabout way, they are complaining about the officiating — not from their own games, but from the games involving other teams.  The comments are, in essence, a more subtle version of Giants offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride’s complaint that 49ers defensive end Justin Smith “gets away with murder.”

And now the question becomes whether Pats coach Bill Belichick will rebuke the Jets, Harbaugh-style, for both criticizing and influencing officiating.  Because, at its core, that’s precisely what the Jets are doing.

If it works on Sunday, it will have been brilliant.

100 responses to “Jets want officials to give defense more time to substitute against Pats

  1. Can’t beat us without help from the refs…a sign of a Jets team that knows they’re going to the guillotine. Commence the execution of the NY Jets.

  2. “In a roundabout way..”

    “The comments are, in essence, a more subtle version..”

    What are you talking about?

    They said they will raise their concerns with the officials before the game. That’s neither roundabout or subtle.

    The word you are searching for is “direct”.

  3. “In a roundabout way, they are complaining about the officiating …. If it works on Sunday, it will have been brilliant.”
    —————————————————
    Because if you don’t specifically ask the refs in advance to enforce the actual rules, they may not do so. They may not anyway.

  4. Wow first the Colts pull this in the early 2000’s trying to limit the pats defense by changing the rules. Now the jets trying to limit the Pats’ offense by having the rules changed. Didn’t work then, won’t work now. You can’t just change the game because you’re not good enough to compete. Stop crying, get better, be grown men. My god.

  5. Only when it’s the Patriots it’s a issue. The media’s double standard with the Pats strikes again.

    Why didn’t anybody call out Peyton Manning all those years ago in Indianapolis for doing this? The Patriots had a heck of a time trying to slow his hurry up offense down in the dome, the Patriots never ever complained about it though.

    Whenever the Patriots are involved with anything people make a huge deal out of it, even though what they are doing is no different than what the Jim Kelly Bill, and Peyton Manning Colts have done.

    What this article fails to mention is that the Patriots don’t substitute very much if at all in their no-huddle offense.

  6. Rule 5, Section 2, Article 10 states that “if a substitution is made by the offense, the offense shall not be permitted to snap the ball until the defense has been permitted to respond with its substitutions. . . . The offense is prohibited from rushing quickly to the line of scrimmage and snapping the ball in an obvious attempt to cause a defensive foul (i.e. — too many men on the field)

    ===============

    Amazing! That’s exactly what Brady does. After all these years, Belichick is still the biggest cheat around, and Goodell has still been turning a blind eye – why am I not surprised??

    Got to wonder if Goodell sleeps in Pats pajamas?

  7. It sounds like there’s a good amount of gray area or subject-to-interpretation in the rule. Plus I think NE is aware of it because the way their no-huddle works is when they see a defense on the field that is a mis-match in any way, they start the no-huddle to keep it on the field and exploit, exploit, exploit. It’s simple and impressive. Also, whining to the refs is never a good idea.

  8. You have got to love this the Jets telling the officials how to implement the rules!!!

    Presumably that means no tripping will be allowed on the sidelines this game!

  9. Hey if you’re not competent to face an opponent cry long and loud to the refs beforehand and maybe you’ll get a couple lucky calls.

  10. This is stupid, they’re just trying to influence the refs. Anyone who watches a Pats game know they don’t sub during hurry-up offense.

    There’s always gotta be something when the Jets play the Pats. Whatever motivates you I guess.

  11. “When, and not if, we lose, it will be the officials’ fault.”

    Notice he gives no examples. Announcers have talked about the fact that the Patriots don’t substitute, but force defenses into situations where they want to substitute. That’s the whole point. No team this year has complained. Except the Jets. Who haven’t played the Patriots.

    More Jets fans will be turning into Giants fans as this year goes on.

  12. So in essence, the Jets want the officials to stop the Pat’s “hurry up” offense, because they can’t, right????

  13. Benh999

    That was my thought exactly. How do they get time for subs if the Pats aren’t subbing anybody? Their no huddle is the same guys every play

  14. Waah, Waaah the big mean Patriots aren’t going to let us play the way we want to. We’re going to take our ball and go home if the refs don’t give us what we want.

  15. I ain’t no Jets fan, for sure, and Rex is all about Rex.

    Still, I had the same thoughts recently while watching Patriots ballgames.

    I DO remember in the past where Refs literally stood over the football and waited for the Defense to substitute. Now, it seems the Refs are kowtow-ed into thinking it’s the last minute of a half/game and they go rushing to set the ball down accordingly. If a team doesn’t substitute, that’s one thing – but, when the Pats do sub, they should have to play by the rule.

  16. If you know the pats you would know that this sad attempt by the jets won’t matter. The pats don’t change the offensive personal a lot when they do this. They just use their players versatility to line them up in different spots and the defenses can’t keep up. Their top conditioning also helps them speed it up while winding the defense that can’t get off the field.

  17. Brady doesn’t even need to go no huddle to beat the Jets. But damn, these guys need to stop whining. If anything this is just an indictment of how great Brady is at running the offense.

  18. wow, really?! “we want the refs to help us”?! it’s called the hurry-up for a reason… if you wanna call yourselves “professionals”, then adjust & adapt you bunch of whiny little bitches!!!

  19. And the war has begun! This should be a great game tomorrow; pulling for The Pats but expecting The Jets to play real well.

  20. The big difference is that NE does not sub much in the no-huddle.

    ———–

    you must not watch NE….they sub RB’s almost every other play

  21. I heard the Jets are also asking the officials to call offensive holding everytime Brady completes a pass.
    Then they will ask Goodell to put them in the Super Bowl no matter their record, because Rex is such a genius and so likeable. The Jets think they should be crowned Super Bowl champs because they’re the Jets.

  22. I don’t like either one of these teams but I can’t wait to see the Pats blow the Jets out 62-0 or something.

  23. Just like you can’t touch Brady without it being a penalty and/or fine, do you really think the officials would go against anything that Belichek does?

  24. I love the move! It’s in the rules and it will force the refs. to slow things down if the Pats make changes. IF, they make moves. This is a Belichick move to get the officials inline as soon as possible! I appreciate the gamesmanship that comes from the Pats and their win at all cost attitude. It about time teams use it against them!!! This could be an interesting game.

  25. I am so tired of hearing about the Jets. It is obvious the Rex has a man-crush on Belichek and is obsessed with everything involving the Patriots and the Patriot Way.

    I’m a Phins fan, so I don’t like either of these teams……but I have a lot of respect for the Patriots. They play hard, are well coached and their players typically keep their mouths shut and let their play do the talking.

    With the Jets….everyone from the top down are always flapping their lips and shoving each other out of the way to get in front of a microphone as quickly as they can. They implode internally once or twice during the year and even the media makes fun of them.

    I’m going to be routing for the Pats this week. If they put 50 on the Jets, that will be fine with me.

  26. Well per rule # 187 Section NFL. States the act of playing defense is subject to whatever BS call the refs can get away with to ensure an unbalanced advantage to a passing offense. Didn’t these guys get the memo from God mid season last year?

  27. This is the kind of stuff that makes the Jets look mentally weak. If the they had an offense that could run a hyper-no-huddle this wouldn’t even be an issue. They aren’t concerned about NFL rules. They just want the officials to stop the Pats because they know their team can’t. Don’t recall the Seahawks complaining about it and their defense was able to keep up. So it appears the Jets want special treatment. Weak.

  28. I have no horse in this race, but the Jets do have a legitimate complaint. I’m not saying the Pats have been breaking the rules in the past because I honestly have no idea if they have or not. I am also not blaming the Pats because I think its the ref’s responsibility to handle this matter.

    Either way, as long as everything is within the rules then there should be no complaints from either side. The refs should just do their jobs and properly enforce the rules. Period.

  29. I’d label this whining, except it’s the Patriots, who are always looking for new ways to cheat. If they’re finding a way to sub in during the no huddle and not allowing the defense to do the same, then the Jets have a legit beef.

  30. The Patriots rarely sub in the no-huddle, it kinda defeats the purpose of it and slows it down. That’s why they use a base offense with 2 TEs like Gronk and Hernandez, it allows them to run or pass equally well.

  31. Very simple solution…if New England KEEPS the original 11 on the field the no-huddle is legit and the ball can be snapped immediately…IF HOWEVER new England brings NEW guys onto the field and replaces the original eleven THEN New York should have time to replace their guys…what’s the problem?

  32. New England’s super fast no huddle works because they can put either TE out wide or in the backfield, and all their WR can play each position on the field. They go as fast as they do because they don’t sub much at all when they do it.

    LOVE to see the Jets already grasping at straws though and making excuses before the game even starts. They would have been better off just keeping their pie holes shut and only talking to the refs about it. Now you just waived a red flag in front of Belichick and Brady challenging them to get it done with no subs, which they can do in their sleep with Hernandez etc.

  33. Rules are rules that’s it, everyone should have the right to change personal on the feild if the offense does bottomline..u know bill b. saw that it was going unchecked that’s why he employed it into the offense on a consistence basis .. C$W$ go Niners

  34. The Packers do the same thing,in the Seattle game they rushed to the line and cought the chicken hawks a couple times. I havenever seen and official stand over the ball while the defense substitutes but rather rush the ball to the line abd set it.

    That was one of the packers complaints about the replacement offiials, they didnt set the ball fast enough. Maybe they were actually setting the ball like it should be.

  35. I have a feeling we are going to start seeing more of the Jets’ “injuries” when the Pats get on a roll. They’ve done it before, and I’m almost positive we’ll see it again.

  36. neilpountney says:
    Oct 20, 2012 7:33 PM
    You have got to love this the Jets telling the officials how to implement the rules!!!

    Presumably that means no tripping will be allowed on the sidelines this game!
    ———————————————
    I suppose if a Jets’ coach trips someone and the Pats complain about it, you’d tell Belichick to quit whining, too?

  37. it’s cheating, something we all the pats are fond of…good for the jets.

    of course, if the officials don’t call the game by the rules, the jets could just fake injuries on defense, stay on top of the ball carrier, lay on brady and not get up as quickly as he’d like…

    play fair NE, we all know how great you are (at 3-3) just play fair and square and whoever wins, wins

    like LT said….if they aren’t cheating, they aren’t trying

  38. What a tool. Don’t the Jets watch tape? When Pats run the no huddle, the whole idea is to NOT substitute. They run multiple sets with the same personnel.

    It’s a non story……

  39. andrewproughcfe says: Oct 20, 2012 7:28 PM

    Amazing! That’s exactly what Brady does. After all these years, Belichick is still the biggest cheat around, and Goodell has still been turning a blind eye – why am I not surprised??

    Got to wonder if Goodell sleeps in Pats pajamas?
    ———————————————
    Watch them play before grasping for those straws. The Patriots rarely substitute in no huddle.

  40. Wow! Jets and their fans crying once again because their team can’t win. Jets clearly don’t know the actual rules and the Jets fans, by proof of their asinine comments have clearly not watched the Pats games. The Pats don’t sub during the hyper-no-huddle. You would know this if you actually watched the games but clearly you don’t. While you’re all at it why don’t you admit the Jets suck and aren’t a mentally tough team. What’s next crying for your mommies when the Pats score a touchdown?

  41. the Pats no longer have the weapons to run their traditional offense they are trying the “oregon Ducks” method to buy a couple wins…..no biggie

  42. This sounds like the Jets are laying ground work for an excuse if they lose on Sunday. Belichick has had Ryan’s number since becoming the Jets head coach. And he whines, along with his team, every time the Pats beat them.

  43. I will admit, teams that snap the ball only to get a off sides because some fat guy is trying to run of the field is bush league. Hey if you strategy is to say here is are 11 guys match up. Sure that is fine. But if you run your offense on the field and don’t let the D change that is another story. Manning does it all the time and they talk how great he is. Play the game! I say if the player is outside the numbers and heading to the bench no penalty.

  44. Sounds like they are merely reminding the officials of what the rules are. I’m not a Jets fan, but I see nothing wrong with what was said.
    +++++++++++++++++++

    Do you need reminding when you need to go to the bathroom?

    Do we need to remind a police officer that drinking and driving is illegal?

    Thought not!

  45. I suppose if a Jets’ coach trips someone and the Pats complain about it, you’d tell Belichick to quit whining, too?

    +++++++++++++++++

    Patriots are NOT breaking any rules, when they go no huddle they absolutely use the same personnel without substituting. If you knew the laws of the game you would know this is perfectly legal.

  46. the jests are weak…. in the mind and body. They’re already lost the game before it’s been played.

    They have rolled over and showed their yellow belly.

  47. I hear everyone on here complaining about the jets, and how they aren’t as good as the patriots, and that may be true.but at least give them credit for knowing about a rule not alot of teams know about and simply asking the officials to watch it. It doesn’t make them any worse of a team if they ask the officials to simply pay attention because they’re right what new England does with the no huddle is borderline unfair

  48. Let’s examine all the rules, how about those blocks in the back and neck holds by the offensive line, or offensive PI, or for the Jets fans the defensive line faking the snap to draw a false start.

    This is an attempt to manipulate the Refs in the favor of the Jets. The Refs miss calls all the time, but somehow now they in league with the Pats and only the sharp eye, and wisdom of Rex Ryan can catch it.

    Please, there will be calls missed on both sides, I hope they make more bad calls on the Jets, I hope they miss every call on the Pats. I hope the Pats win after which I hope Rex is fired so I won’t have to listen to some BS before every single Pats Jets game.

  49. Hey JimJets,

    Didn’t LT also say the Jets suck? Didn’t he say the team was a bad team, and they had no leaders?

    Just play fair, from a Jets fan. All this is a pre-excuse. Rex is seeding the fans so if they lose they know what excuse to use.

  50. What is most interesting is the Jets are the reason this rule was put in writing.

    Back in 2007 there was no such written rule but there was unwritten agreement between coaches that they wold not abuse substitutions to gain a competitive advantage. Mangini used late substitutions that did not allow the Colts to change players on defense.

    After the game Dungy was outraged and said it was cheating on the part of Mangini. The competition committee called an emergency meeting the next week where the made the above rule.

    Now we come full circle where the Jets want the protection of the rule that their abuse caused to be made. I find it quite ironic and I am a Jets fan.

  51. I seem to remember reading many post about Brady being nothing but a “cry baby”. All the player cry when a call doesn’t go their way. It’s a fact of life for these guys.

  52. I’m surprised nobody talks about player safety in regards to hurry up offense. It leaves less time to observe if a player is injured or has concussion by either the officials, the sidelines or the player himself.

  53. What really happened is Tebow ran the scout team to perfection and copied all this, according to another article on PFT so the D could not stop Tebow when he copied this at 80% speed. Rex and his coaches watched practice tapes and realized… We are in deep s$!t and therfore lets make this another Pats beat us because they bend the rules.

    I have seen D’s substitute if Pats sub in hurry up but coaches and players on other team need to bring their A game to do it.

    Of course this creates an advantage for Pats that is why they do it. No different than any other team taking advantage of their personnel and abilities. I have seen this work for pats and i have seen it flop. Late in games it has not been working to well.

    So all the people saying cheaters and whinning about the Pats way…. You wish you had a coach that was as inventive as BB.

  54. If you know the pats you would know that this sad attempt by the jets won’t matter. The pats don’t change the offensive personal a lot when they do this.

    Oh the Jets know the Pats allright. Especially when they were illegally taped. What is that called now and forever? Spygate?

    How about the Tuck Rule?

    How about illegally practicing with players on the injured list?

    Nah , the Pats are angels.
    Too bad everytime there’s an article mentioning the word “JETS”, it’s a petri dish for these pathetic haters.

  55. Of course the key term here is that if the Patriots aren’t substituting on Offense they can snap the ball as quickly as they want.

    The Jets will still whine though

  56. Awww look at all the Pats haters looking for excuses if the Jets lose. Don’t recall the Seahawks or the Broncos crying like a bunch of girls about this? Rex & Calvin have just basically admitted that they know they can’t stop the Pats offense and since their offense isn’t going to be able to run the ball against the Pats #6 run defense they are going to need as much help from the refs as they can get. The fact that the Jets & their fans are whining about a college football strategy is weak sauce. Just like the Jets. Maybe they can go back to tripping players on the sidelines?

  57. Will some of you Patriots’ fans stop whining and read the article more carefully?

    The Jets want the current rules enforced, and apparently are claiming in some situations the rules aren’t being enforced properly. They aren’t looking for special treatment. And no, I am not a Jet fan. I am a Charger fan, the Chargers have their own set of different problems.

  58. I can’t believe the Jets are making excuses for losing before the game starts?

    But they have a point….if in fact the refs no not let them substitute, then I believe there should be something done.

    I hate to say it…..but the replacement refs don’t look so bad anymore. Seems like the long vacation is still lingering. Do they have a quota of penalties the have to fill every week? Just seems like all the late games and Monday games get waaay more called.

  59. The Jets are just sore about getting beat up by the same style of play that the Buffalo Bills took to them in the early 90’s. Jim Kelly/Keith Mckeller’s K-gun no huddle Offense.

  60. If the Jets just sent the bearded lady to approach the refs with their concerns then great.

    Nope they dump it on the media, a true circus performance.

    This is going to backfire, the crowd is normally quiet in Foxboro compared to other NFL venues. Today the crowd wakes up and will be noisy.

  61. This should be a good Rivalry game. I’m not a fan of either, but love to watch these two compete against each other. Too bad the Jets Offense never lived up to the talent on it’s roster or this would be a little more evenly matched game. I fully expect to see Tebow play a lot. Not just because the Jets will be punting a ton, but because Rex will try to pull out all the stops against Bill. Pats will run a ton in this game and they should since they have a very good ground game. But I expect the Jets special teams and defense to come up with some big plays in this game. This will be the week Hernandez and Gronk put up some big numbers as the Pats find a way to hold off the Jets ……….Pats 31 Jets 23

    Not a fan of either, personally I hope the tie!

  62. If the rule states just what he quoted then he is correct in asking the refs to abide by that rule,if the offense keeps the same 11 on the field during the no huddle then there is no enforcement of the rule needed but if they sub then the defense must have the time to also get a sub in,thats the rules of the game and the Pats are not above the rules,yet.

  63. @andrewproughecfe:

    Warning!!
    You are one strike away from violating the “whine about a specific team more than 99,999 times on PFT” rule.
    You are in danger of losing your PFT membership.

    Not only are you wrong in your strikingly female whinyness, bitchin, complaining assertions, the “humor” at the end of your post wouldn’t cause a 3rd grader to crack a smile.

    New material please.

  64. the Pats DO substitute some of the time while in the no huddle. go watch your games. why is this so hard for you to understand. if they do sub on no huddle there’s a rule that governs how that needs to be handled.
    the pats will most likely destroy my jets. fine if it goes that way. seems reasonable that they’re not allowed to exploit aspects of the rules that have received little attention in past games.
    see how simple that is? f o l l o w t h e r u l e s.

  65. Infectorman, amen. That dude is obsessed and it’s pathetic. His own team is 2-3 so I’m not sure what his deal is. I guess he cares more about the mediocre Pats than he does about his sub-mediocre Steelers (recordwise, I mean). 😀

    As a Pats fan I don’t mind that the Jets coaches are making this public. Would I want BB to do it? No, I’d want him simply to mention it before the game to the refs, not publicly. That said, the NYJ are different, and handle everything differently from the Pats. Whether it works or not, that’s not a crime.It worked for them with the ST wall play when non decisive footage somehow showed up via Glazer of the Pats supposedly doing the same thing the Jets actually did. Why not try it again?

  66. This method of public complaining worked for the bills when facing the bengals no-huddle in 88. I guess the stakes were a little higher in the playoffs than they are here, but Rex is probably hoping for the same result. Sadly after crying to the league, levy made the Sam wyche no huddle famous with Jim Kelly and the k-gun. If history repeats, Rex will be installing this offense in ny next year.

  67. The Jets should use the no-huddle on the Pat.Practice it with Jim Tebow. A no -huddle wildcat.

    Go Jets

  68. The comments are, in essence, a more subtle version of Giants offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride’s complaint that 49ers defensive end Justin Smith “gets away with murder.”
    ============================
    Oh the 49ers cheating, no not the 9ers(Eddie Debartelo)

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