idk, Saints defense sucks – so even if they were trying to take out players every week, I’d doubt they’d be able to do so…. 3 years and not one cart off … smh, dudes are soft.

Again, if that is true then why is Fujita suspended. Also, the NFL has not yet provided evidence that they had a program after the 2009 season. Even that evidence is suspect.

If they were attempting to injure players over a 3 year period, they would have. Sorry, if you are trying to illegally hurt someone you will. The fact is, it didn’t happen, no matter how hyperbole and grand talk was used.

Can’t do it, because it didn’t happen.

Saints are the scapegoat because of all of the concussion lawsuits, plain and simple.

But a pool for big hits, ints, forced and recovered fumbles is a far cry from cart offs, hitting and affecting the head and targeting ACLs.

A number of years ago the league ordered Green Bay to suspend the program, citing cap rules and as far as anyone knows, they did. Something the Saints refused to do when they had the chance.

Bottom line, your own DC, Greg Williams, swore under oath to the Saints continued use of it’s bounty system and to the fact that bounties were paid for cartoffs and injuries. Why would he do this? Why would he risk his very freedom to lie, knowing the penalties for perjury? It just doesn’t make sense for him to make it up.

I know most of you Saint fans are simply too thick headed, or blinded by loyalty to believe the truth, but I’d thought I’d try one last time.

Also, as much as I hate the Chicago Bears (born and bred that way) what Charles Martin did to Jim Mcmahon rupulsed me. Actions like that have no place in football.

I know there is a video, but the audio was all that heard. The point I was making is you are grossly miss characterizing what was said in the ‘video’. Williams said “we are going test his ACL”. You know, see if he is a 100% and make him use it more, or even hit him on that side, “within the rules of the game”. How is this frowned upon? every single team take the oppositions injuries into account. What, are teams supposed to read the injury report and take it easy on banged up players, or say “don’t hit him on the left side, his knee is hurt”? That would be ridiculous.

I don’t think Charles Martin was actually paid for his hitlist. I think he did it because he thought it was a good idea.

Yeah, I know.

you and everyone else can say until you’re blue in the face that things changed sense 1996. And, that doesn’t make one bit of difference. It was being done and the league ok’d it. Now, for the very same thing, that’s assuming forever reason you don’t chose to believe what butler is saying more than you believe the Saints, we’re being buried by the league. If you’re going to continue to support this injustice at least be brave enough to say what behind it. you don’t like the saints and you like thier fans even less

Show me the game footage where the Saints actually did go after someone’s knee, or their head in that game.

Which is right around the number the Saints had for taking out, Newton, Rodgers, or got paid when it came to Favre.

Thats a bigger chunk of money.

Rules change. If the NFL had just suddenly punished the Saints without warning, then we’d have a problem. The Saints have the right to know if something that was previously tolerated is now going to be strictly enforced. And the NFL complied — they warned the Saints repeatedly. And they didn’t stop.

Now, all that said, I’m not necessarily on the NFL’s side. I just don’t like this argument “Well it was legal then, so how can you punish us now?!?” It was almost 20 years ago. Things have changed, the Saints were warned in advance about it. They thumbed their nose at the NFL’s warning, and now they’re paying the price.

Of course, the NFL is also paying a price with the questionable way they’re handling this thing.

because i seem to remember video re: saints telling players to injure/target injuries. hmmm. it’s been so long, it seems like the video only came out a few months ago. oh wait, it did.

ps i hate the pack, and i’m defending them. ugh.

1) There is no proof that the coaches in GB sanctioned or participated in the program. There is proof that NO coaches did. In fact there is a recording of williams instructing players to exacerbate a player’s existing injury and offering to pay – “FIRST one’s on me”

2) There is a big difference in paying for big hits and offering to pay for “cartoffs”. One doesn’t necessarily result in an injury, The other means that your opponent can’t leave the field under their own power and the NO coach incentivised that plain and simple.

Players were never told by G Williams that the league said to quit the pay for performance program. They didn’t find out until the nfl sent out a letter announcing the coaches suspension

The saints players denial of the bounty is about as much BS as Tony Soprano’s insistence that he made all his money in waste management.

That is a weak argument. 16 years in the NFL is a long time. I’m sure there were tons of things done in the NFL in 1980 that weren’t done in 1996 just as there were things done in 96 that aren’t done now.