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Andre Carter says hit on Talib looked intentional

Carter AP

Patriots coach Bill Belichick isn’t the only member of the organization who thinks former Patriots receiver Wes Welker deliberately targeted cornerback Aqib Talib on Sunday.  Pats defensive end Andre Carter also believes the hit appeared to something other than accidental.

We think.

“Unfortunately, that was nasty,” Carter said, via the Boston Globe, of the contact that some would say was a block and others would say was an illegal pick.  “I’m sure the NFL will review that and see what they can do to rectify those particular plays.  Fortunately, Talib was able to walk, but if it got a lot more serious, who knows what would’ve happened?

“If you step into the wrong place at the wrong time, it can be very devastating.  It looked like it was intentional.  But the NFL will review it and, hopefully, Talib will just heal and get ready for the following season.”

Carter seemed to be trying to measure his words carefully, but he ultimately spilled conflicting statements and opinions all over the place.

“Was [Welker] doing his job? I’m sure he was, to a certain degree,” Carter said.  “Do I think the hit could have been cleaner?  Yes.  People will say it was dirty and people will say it was nasty.  I can’t really say it was uncalled for, but the play was unacceptable.”

Based on the rulebook, the play at worst amount to offensive pass interference.  At best, it was entirely legal.

It was a clean block.  There was no helmet-to-helmet hit, and no one could claim that Welker violated unwritten rules by diving at Talib’s knees.  On passing plays, blocking of defensive players becomes a foul only if the block occurs while the ball is in the air.  In this specific case, it appeared that Welker hit Talib just as the ball was being touched (and ultimately dropped) by the receiver.

If Welker delivered the hit at or after the moment the ball was touched, there’s no foul.  If Welker hit Talib early, it’s offensive pass interference — not unnecessary roughness or any other misconduct that would make Welker eligible for league discipline.

Those realities of the rulebook make Belichick’s comments about Welker even more jarring.  Belichick made strong allegations of dirty play against his former player in a public forum, unprompted by any question.

If anyone hears from the league office on this one, it’s far more likely to be Belichick than Welker.

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50 Responses to “Andre Carter says hit on Talib looked intentional”
  1. nickster31 says: Jan 21, 2014 7:19 AM

    WAH!!!!!!!

    Seriously? One step closer to flag football.

  2. jrebar88 says: Jan 21, 2014 7:23 AM

    Do the Patriots ever stop crying? Hang your “we beat the Broncos in week 12″ banner and move on.

  3. jmblosser82 says: Jan 21, 2014 7:33 AM

    Welker looked almost as surprised as Talib when they collided. The Patriots need to get over themselves and suck it up. They lost 2 straight AFC title games and they are about done with Brady’s run. They got outplayed, couldn’t put points up early, that’s why they lost.

  4. broncobeta says: Jan 21, 2014 7:34 AM

    How would he know? He spent most of his day in the dirt.

  5. jjb0811 says: Jan 21, 2014 7:41 AM

    According to Goodell, its legal. No such thing as a defenseless defender.

  6. floratiotime says: Jan 21, 2014 7:43 AM

    The hit was shoulder to shoulder. Perhaps he could have been flagged for throwing a block while the ball was in the air. But the hit was clean, and was not anywhere near the knees.

  7. mgmac says: Jan 21, 2014 7:44 AM

    For one moment let’s pass on whether the hit was intentional or not. There are 7 referees in an NFL game. The maximum number of receivers on any one play is 5. The referee and umpire don’t rule on pass interference. Therefore there is one official covering each one of the eligible receivers. How in the heck was there no offensive pass interference called on that play? Weller was blocking Downfield which is OPI.

  8. laxer37 says: Jan 21, 2014 7:47 AM

    These guys are looking like cry babies and sore losers . In other words, everything Tom Brady says the Patriots are not.

    After watching the play again and again I do believe the hit was early meaning a PI flag should have probably been thrown. Otherwise that was a text book block.

  9. tellmeaboutitbaby says: Jan 21, 2014 7:59 AM

    And another crybaby whiner member of the Pats organization heard from……

  10. nunan says: Jan 21, 2014 8:00 AM

    Not sure about all this intentional hit talk but the Pats need to resign Talib. I’d rather see them let go of Ridley (trade?) and go with Blount and Vereen. Put money towards Edelman and adding to the D. They’ve been w/o Gronk, Mayo, Wilfork, Kelly, Vollmer (and Talib on Sunday). That’s a strong lineup. Doesn’t get much better than that, if you’re being realistic. Build around that and assume injuries won’t be as devastating next year. They can always make the offense work, especially when healthy. They need that strong D again. That’s what will get them another SB.

  11. notrelated says: Jan 21, 2014 8:06 AM

    ” I can’t really say it was uncalled for, but the play was unacceptable.”

    Oh, wow.

  12. keepyerstickontheice says: Jan 21, 2014 8:07 AM

    Hey, if you’re not willing to cheat, you’re not willing to win.

    Right, Bill?

  13. randyschwimmer7 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:10 AM

    Just stop already. My god. I rewatched the game last night, and Edelman did the SAME PLAY about four plays before to Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie. Its a pick play. And when you watch the Welker play he tried to get out of the way and was slow to get up. Why would a guy coming off two concussions, having to wear a much larger helmet because of that, and one of the smallest players on the field try and do that play intentional? If the Broncos wanted to take him out of the game, don’t you think they would have used Demaryius Thomas (6’3″ 225lbs) or Julius Thomas (6’5″ 248lbs)? Get a grip Patriots.

  14. iamapatsfan says: Jan 21, 2014 8:12 AM

    A lot of us may not like the fact that Wes moved on to the next best place he could be, but come on. Does anyone believe Wes is the kind of guy to intentionally take another player down with a dirty hit? Nothing in the years I’ve seen him play on the field suggests anything of the sort. I’m more than willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on this one.

    Nasty hit? Yes. Intentional? Extremely unlikely.

  15. blindmansaidwhat says: Jan 21, 2014 8:13 AM

    I don’t get Belicheck and the Patriot’s outrage over the hit…the Patriots run their own share of pick plays…funny how it’s now dirty when done onto you. Not a fan of either team but I didn’t see anything wrong with Welker’s hit. To assume he intentionally tried to hurt the defender is absurd…Welker could just as easily been injured making the hit…it’s called football, brutal hits are a REAL part of the game

  16. tv426 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:13 AM

    Every team in the NFL has these types of pick plays. NE even more than most. In fact, they used the exact same play earlier in this same game.

    Yeah, let’s send out a 175 lb guy with a history of concussions to “take out” a 220 lb CB!

    Absurd!!!

  17. FinFan68 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:18 AM

    I don’t think anybody is arguing that the hit was not intended; the argument is that the injury was not intended

  18. donniev77 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:24 AM

    Just because Talib got hurt doesn’t make it a dirty play

  19. bradyapplaudstheflag says: Jan 21, 2014 8:27 AM

    Belichick could make a career as a political spin doctor. He has very deftly moved the conversation away from his own team’s, and maybe especially his QB’s, playoff performance.

  20. monkeyhateclean says: Jan 21, 2014 8:31 AM

    lots of NFL teams run these so-called “pick” plays, including the patriots. Perhaps its a reaction to defensive players being allowed to grab and hold receivers their entire route.

  21. peymax1693 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:31 AM

    Carter is just following the tone set by his coach. I dislike the Pats, but I always had a lot of respect for Belichick. The man is arguably the best coach in NFL history but the way he answered the question about the play made it seem like sour grapes. I expect hot-heads like Jim Harbaugh to accuse another player of being dirty, but not Belichick.

  22. rockyburnette says: Jan 21, 2014 8:31 AM

    Biggest unforced error by Belichick since his unprofessional departure from the Jets. For whatever reason he hates Welker. His anger ruled the day. Since nothing on the tape supports any discipline, the HC of the NEP looks petty, bitter, and childish.

  23. rockyburnette says: Jan 21, 2014 8:31 AM

    Biggest unforced error by Belichick since his unprofessional departure from the Jets. For whatever reason he hates Welker. His anger ruled the day. Since nothing on the tape supports any discipline the HC of the NEP looks petty, bitter, and childish.

  24. smakhhm says: Jan 21, 2014 8:36 AM

    Geeze let this die already. You chumps lost lick your wounds and hey over it. The ironic thing is these patriots have pulled the same crap for years. Guess they recognize it better than most.

  25. opneon says: Jan 21, 2014 8:36 AM

    Boo Hoo. For once a Receiver hit a DB with force…like everytime a receiver goes up for a pass or once they turn to run. Ahh…was the little big-mouth druggy hurt?

    When that happened during the game, the first thing the announcer said was “that was just like the Edelman hit on Cromartie we just saw”. Inotherwords, the Pats did the same thing FIRST – and now they’re crying the blues about Welker. They’re just upset that they cut such a great part of their old “good” team.

    I like the Broncos and Pats equally, and don’t have the hate for Belichek as others, but he should just keep his mouth shut on this one.

  26. jagsfan1 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:40 AM

    Patsies SB window has closed…Brady seems to lack the intensity that he used to have.

    Yes they overcame tremendous injuries to get to Championship game…but some of that has to do with the pathetic division they are in.

    Gronk will not be what he was when he comes back. He will still be a big time player – but all those surgeries will have made him a mere mortal.

    Been 10 years now…it’s over.

  27. fordmandalay says: Jan 21, 2014 8:42 AM

    Pity the Poor Patriots.

  28. bonniebengal says: Jan 21, 2014 8:46 AM

    So far you have input from a Patriots coach and a Patriots player. No bias there.

    I once read an article where Wes Welker said he didn’t think Belichick liked him much, even when he was a Patriot. I guess he was right.

    This team is so ate up with jealousy over Welker going to a Super Bowl that it’s disgusting. Let the man enjoy this.

  29. jpb12 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:48 AM

    Welker can add that to the highlight reel of big hits he showed his team on Saturday. Lead by example. Not afraid to get physical.

    Was a star in NE. Role player in Denver.

  30. tigerlilac says: Jan 21, 2014 8:51 AM

    Florio, you sound more like opposing counsel than an independent third party arbitrator. I will say that Belichick may have wished he kept Brandon Spikes on the roster and let him roam the middle of the field, letting the Broncos receivers know that two can play that game. Alas, since losing Rodney Harrison, and given that the Adrian Wilson signing did not pan out, the Patriots don’t have that ultra physical safety to intimidate guys coming over the middle of the field. The Patriots have to get tougher on both sides of the ball. You can’t let guys take out your players without responding and we have seen it happen in two straight AFC Championship games now.

  31. arnoldziffel says: Jan 21, 2014 8:52 AM

    If there’s one thing we know for sure – it’s that the New England Patriots have NEVER run a pick play and, of course … they never will …

    Because of course, that’s against the rules … so for sure, they’ll never do it.

  32. vbe2 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:55 AM

    Belicheat ought to be fined for sullying the name of a very good player.

  33. ialwayswantedtobeabanker says: Jan 21, 2014 8:59 AM

    Unpopular or not, the Welker hit on Talib – by all appearances – looked intentional as it gets.

    Welker is very likable, and Talib hasn’t always comported himself as as the most sympathetic character.

    But that shot was intentional. The Donks immediately recognized man coverage – and accordingly ran a rub play, where Welk was going to pick off Talib. He did.

    Did Welker intend it to be a game-ending injury? That we don’t know, and I doubt it – but he did intend to lay a kiss on Talib.

    That’s a non-biased assessment: not a Pats fan, not a Donks fan and my team didn’t even make the playoffs – and was rooting for Denver in that game. But, man – the contact was clearly intended, though the possible intent upon the magnitude of the injury remains in doubt.

  34. tigerlilac says: Jan 21, 2014 9:01 AM

    Mike, a couple of more points. I trust Belichick’s instincts and understanding of the game over anyone in the media. Second, the plays that injured both Talib and Gronkowski were both followed up by apologists saying the hits were clean when they were both clear cheap shots. If the hit on Talib was clean than the NFL needs to change to the NBA pick rule, were the picking player needs to stop and be stationary before the hit.

  35. nflgreedleague says: Jan 21, 2014 9:09 AM

    These “picks” or offensive PIs are one of the most inconsistently called plays in the NFL. I’ve continuously seen DBs blocked while the ball is in the air.

  36. ialwayswantedtobeabanker says: Jan 21, 2014 9:11 AM

    Unpopular or not, the Welker hit on Talib – by all appearances – looked intentional as it gets.

    Welker is very likable, and Talib hasn’t always comported himself as as the most sympathetic character.

    But that shot was intentional. The Donks immediately recognized man coverage – and accordingly ran a rub play, where Welk was going to pick off Talib. He did.

    Did Welker intend it to be a game-ending injury? That we don’t know, and I doubt it – but he did intend to lay a kiss on Talib.

    That’s a non-biased assessment: not a Pats fan, not a Donks fan and my team didn’t even make the playoffs – and was rooting for Denver in that game. But, man – the contact was clearly intended, though the possible intent upon the magnitude of the injury remains in doubt.

  37. thestrategyexpert says: Jan 21, 2014 9:14 AM

    Andre Carter with the Discount Double Talk.

  38. ytsejamer1 says: Jan 21, 2014 9:25 AM

    I agreed with BB up to where he said it was dirty (let alone the worst he’s seen…he drafted B.Merriweather). I don’t think it was. It was evident Welker had zero plans going for the ball or was even aware of where the play was ultimately going. He was out there to lay a hit on someone and it happened to be Talib – who happened to get hurt…AGAIN.

    I don’t think Welker intended to hurt him, but I think Welker was perhaps a bit more enthusiastic on his hit. Welker is a smart player and knew for a fact that Edelman launched himself into DRC’s chest on the Pats previous possession on a similar type of play. I think there were a couple layers at work here: 1. A bit of payback and 2. Hey…a free shot on their best defender.

    So again…as for BB…I think he would have been best to not offer his opinion. I think it’s less about the loss of the game, less about the loss of Talib, and MORE about the fact that Welker did it. He let the negotiations and contract talks get personal (just like he did with Richard Seymour) and he ended up with the short end of the stick. It sounds a bit like sour grapes to me…and I LOVE BB and the Pats.

  39. munny10 says: Jan 21, 2014 10:03 AM

    Belicheat is like school on Saturday – No Class. NE runs rub plays all day long. Your CB got laid out, happens. Are you going to run to Goodell’s house and hope to get the TALIB rule installed like you did with Brady? Good riddance, shut the pie hole and lose with a little dignity.

  40. doctorrustbelt says: Jan 21, 2014 10:15 AM

    Wes Welker did the same thing for SIX SEASONS in new england.

    Keep the tears comin’, new england.

  41. 6ball says: Jan 21, 2014 10:44 AM

    .

    The question is not about what happened in Sunday’s game which is a final. The question is whether plays such as the Talib and Gronkowski hits should be more closely regulated by the league.

    At the moment both appear to be within the confines of the rulebook. However, a review by the league / competition committee will result in clearer interpretations of existing rules or changes where needed.

    Reducing the number of injuries in the NFL benefits all franchises.

    .

  42. BringBackTheFlex says: Jan 21, 2014 11:51 AM

    The league needs to get rid of the pick play. It’s bush league and allows lesser talent to flourish. Walsh made it popular because he had lesser talent and needed an edge.

    When I see team using it I think, “These guys don’t have talented receivers and so they have to do these types of things to get open.”

  43. jbellsup says: Jan 21, 2014 1:02 PM

    Here we go again. Just what you expect to hear from an entitled NE team and their fans. Good grief, get over it. You lost because your team isn’t as good as the Broncos. Good coaching only gets you so far, your lack of talent showed.

  44. neatz says: Jan 21, 2014 1:31 PM

    I really love the hypocrisy of everyone here..broncos have suddenly become relevant because the Media created GOAT decided that denver has all the positions filled and have cap space too…

    if it happens to any other team its illegal and they cry about Refs and Goodell
    but if it happens to Pats..its Karma and payback.

    Good luck with your team.. Donkey wont be relevant in 2 years when they GOAT retires or injures himself and all the rookies need to be paid.. thats what makes BB great he has been able to do it for last 13 years

  45. harveyredman says: Jan 21, 2014 1:38 PM

    I am concerned that offensive players can basically do anything they want to the defense, i.e. cut blocks, crack-back blocks, etc.

    I am more concerned that the Patriot O-line never gets called for holding. I noticed it last year when they got behind SF and had to throw every play. Over 60 pass plays and not a single call, and there were plenty of holds…

    Since then I have watched them hold and hold and hold, and get away with it every play, game in and game out.

    So, really the Patriots have been on the receiving end of plenty of homecooking from the refs (going back to the tuck rule), so need to relax with this sh!t.

  46. coloneldukelacross says: Jan 21, 2014 2:12 PM

    I believe Carter. Based on those glasses he seems pretty smart.

  47. dualprime says: Jan 21, 2014 2:58 PM

    Don’t get rid of pick plays. Just allow the DB to hit the pick full force, like shedding a block.

  48. melikefootball says: Jan 21, 2014 5:27 PM

    What a bunch of poor losers. The pats of all teams should never say a word about pick plays. there big TE has no problem running the play. A lot of sour grapes coming from New England.

  49. doe22us says: Jan 21, 2014 7:58 PM

    Hines Ward laughs at the hit, what would they have said if Welker went for the knees instead??

  50. tovar176 says: Jan 21, 2014 8:34 PM

    Yes, Wes Welker did use his body to stop Talib, from covering the other receiver. Did Wes intentionally injure Talib? No it was a clean hit, no clothesline, no low knee block. As is Talib was already crippled before the play, and he was not doing a very good job as a defender anyways…

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