Al Riveron stands by call, declines comment on his predecessors’ criticisms

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NFL head of officiating Al Riveron is standing by his decision to overturn a Jets touchdown and award the ball to the Patriots on Sunday, even as two of his predecessors in the job are saying he got it wrong.

Riveron told reporters today that Jets tight end Austin Seferian-Jenkins fumbled the ball before crossing the goal line, and then failed to control it again until after the ball had traveled across the goal line and out of bounds.

“By rule, he has to re-establish possession. He must regain control of the football again before he hits out of bounds,” Riveron said. “He has not regained control of the football before he hits out of bounds.”

Riveron added that he was relying on the same replays that the TV audience saw.

“Anything that we get in the command center we get directly from the TV feed,” Riveron said. “That’s what we base our decision on.”

Riveron acknowledged that former heads of officiating Dean Blandino and Mike Pereira have said publicly that he got the replay wrong, but he thinks he was correct and they were incorrect.

“I really have no comment on that, that’s really just their judgment,” Riveron said.

That won’t satisfy Jets fans, but Riveron’s mind is made up, and he says he got it right.

126 responses to “Al Riveron stands by call, declines comment on his predecessors’ criticisms

  1. I had no dog in that game but Jets got screwed. That was above the level of the bettis coin toss flop. Jets have every right to cry foul.

  2. All replays go through this NFL Command Center, located in NY, staffed by Jets and Giants fans, and run by a man who has lied about, cheated, and stolen from the Patriots. For the call to be overturned (it was called a TD on the field) Riverton must have truly seen something that the rest of us didn’t.

    I’m a Pats fan BTW. I also feel sorry that this guy is going to lose his job for defying Goodell’s “Always scr%$ NE order.”

    Finally someone in the NFL office with some courage and integrity!

  3. Even as a Pats fan I feel they got the call wrong. The call on the field was TD so I don’t feel there was enough evidence to overturn it. Yes Seferian-Jenkins did briefly lose control but no angle had a clear view of when he regained control so the original call on the field should have stood. I know without a doubt my fellow Pats fans would be screaming from the mountain tops had that been Gronk and the TD overturned.

  4. red says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:15 pm
    Only Pats fans think this was the right call. The fix was in from the start. Truly disgusting
    _______________________
    Wrong! Pats fans also didn’t see anything to overturn the call. However, if you think the NFL would EVER do anything to help the Patriots, you must be new to the NFL.

    Deflategate was 100% fabricated and the NFL lied to our faces and in court.

    Spygate was made “illegal” through a memo, not by an owners’ vote which was required.

    Bill Polian got the NFL to change the PI rules because the Charmin-soft Colts’ offense had ZERO chance of ever beating NE in the playoffs. That’s why DBs can’t touch receivers now

  5. What about the hit on Anderson when the Jets were driving early in the second quarter? The defender clearly made contact with Anderson’s helmet AND the flag was thrown for a hit on a defenseless receiver. Then Corrente picks up the flag and negates the call. Why was that overturned?

  6. It wasn’t indisputable unless Riveron has X-ray vision.

    Why I don’t support the NFL any longer

    Cheaters
    Liars
    Woman and child beaters
    Rapists
    Whiny players
    Greed
    PED use
    Disrespectful of flag
    Incompetence

  7. I’m a Pats fan BTW. I also feel sorry that this guy is going to lose his job for defying Goodell’s “Always scr%$ NE order.”

    Finally someone in the NFL office with some courage and integrity!

    Stop! Just stop with the Patriots pity party. There are calls in every game that you get and shouldn’t and vice versa,but for god sake grow up and deal with reality…..you win some you lose some. Some are bad like ‘this one. Humans are making the calls therefore there will be mistakes….like your pathetic whining…just stop.

  8. To gain possession of a loose ball that has been caught…a player must have complete control of the ball and have both feet or any other part of his body, other than his hands, completely on the ground inbounds.

    When he regained control, he landed OOB. No controversy at all. Not hard to understand. The correct call was made.

  9. As a Pats fan I think it was a dumb call for a bad rule. My biggest complaint is that the ball never really hit the ground. They set the precedent that if the ball is moving at all then it can be overturned.

  10. In the above comment, the first sentence is a quote from the rulebook. I forgot to put it in quotation marks. It is not an opinion.

  11. Butler dislodges the ball
    ASJ begins bobbling it
    ASJ crosses, still bobbling ball, into end zone
    ASJ falls out of bounds, secures ball

    The ball was never secured in the end zone, so it cannot be a TD.

    Correct call. Live with it.

  12. He’s never going to admit he made a bad call. I don’t care what two teams were involved, it was a garbage reversal (as pointed out by Pereira, Blandino and many others). The real problem is that there is no repercussions for these guys. They hold the players to certain standards, as they should. The officials, however, are allowed to repeatedly make errors, and there is zero punishment. The Three Blind Mice could do a better done than a bunch of these guys.

  13. damnsureis – the ball wasn’t just moving, it was completely OUT of his hands and floating through the air, albeit briefly.

  14. It was clear and convincing the he fumbled the ball before going into the end zone. Did anyone see anything that was clear and convincing the he regained control before landing out of bounds?

    That’s the only thing I can think of that would support them over-turning the TD.

  15. I have hated the Patriots since before the “Tuck Rule” fiasco and have to admit that they made the right call. The ball was knocked loose and before he could control it and establish himself inbounds, he was out of bounds at that point.
    I’m surprised they changed the call but, it was correct.
    If I’m a Jets fan, I still feel cheated though.

  16. With the NFL sadly the old expression is what applies: never blame on malice that which can be attributed to stupidity – stupid call – stupid league – terrible refs – this sport with it’s part time refs has very little integrity – I saw terrible calls and non calls all over the league yesterday – this is bush-league

  17. The problem with the call is that it was ruled a TD on the field. So in order for him to say it was a touchback instead, he would need irrefutable proof that he did not have possession when he crossed the plane. All the camera angles of this are obscured and when the player turns over again, he has full possession. So Riveron cannot prove that the ball was still loose when he crossed the plane.

    Its not that it doesnt look like a fumble, because it does, but you cant prove from the angles we have that it wasnt recovered in time to be a TD

  18. “He actually never loses possession. ”

    You must be closing your eyes while watching the replays available because there are shots including still photos that show the ball clearly knocked out of his hands and loose in the air.

    Lets be real. If this had been called against the Pats, or against any other team but the one the Pats were playing, all you people crying about the injustice of this call would be praising it.

    The same thing happened the week before in the Seattle game and nobody said boo about it.

  19. To gain possession of a loose ball that has been caught…a player must have complete control of the ball and have both feet or any other part of his body, other than his hands, completely on the ground inbounds.

    When he regained control, he landed OOB. No controversy at all. Not hard to understand. The correct call was made.

    ______________________________________________________________________________________________
    The problem is that calling that loosening of the ball in his hands that never touches the ground a fumble opens up a black hole. By this rule, any time the football is moving in someones hand, its automatically a fumble and would require both feet inbounds to recover. It could also basically eliminate the QB empty hand rule as anything close enough to be questioned as a fumble would automatically be considered a fumble

  20. southbeachnorth says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:19 pm
    He actually never loses possession
    ——————————-
    Which of course explains the pictures of the ball floating in mid air without his hands on it…

  21. The league may never again do anything to help the patriots, with good reason. They were caught red-handed cheating that realistically helped them win a couple of Super Bowls, and to protect the NFL brand, the NFL covered up as much as they could and destroyed the evidence. Then, the patriots had the audacity to cheat again. That’s why deflate gate wasn’t just a slap on the wrist.

    BUT, the officials have always protected the patriots, and the patriots ALWAYS get benefit of the doubt calls. From the “tuck rule” call, to 40 yard phantom pass interference calls, to now “touchdown-touchback”, the patriots get those calls from officials every week. Maybe Robert Kraft gives them green Christmas presents.

  22. Dean Blandino and Mike Pereira never met a call that went against a New York team that they didn’t think was ‘wrong’. I love how these two now have large public forums that let them crap all over the current NFL officials.

  23. southbeachnorth says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:19 pm
    He actually never loses possession. If Riveron considers what happened to be loss of possession, half the league’s catches should be wiped out.

    ————

    FULLY agree sbn!!!

    I can’t believe that more people aren’t correctly even challenging that notion.

    Time for the NFL to go back to pre-replay days. Seems as if it isn’t making much, for sure not enough, of a difference and has taken much of the fun outta watching the game.

    I don’t know if I’ve even watched two games this season. I can think of one. After that, the highlight videos are more entertaining.

  24. Even if the original call for TD stands it would be 24-21, still 3 points behind NE. This is not win or lose call in my opinion. I think the volume of crying is so high is because the reverse benefited Patriots. Any other team and people would just shrug it off. Oh well…

  25. The feedback I get from most Pats fans is that it was a dumb call. Just another example of the NFL trying to over-legislate the game with arcane rules and regulations that can’t possibly be reffed by humans, and rarely affect the actual play itself.

    For example, when did holding by a DLman on a running play become a priority, yet suddenly you get that call. When did touch the facemask become hands to the face. Now the call has become ubiquitous.

    The game is becoming unwatchable with a flag every other play often for an infraction that had no effect on the play itself. Too often this year those calls have gone against the Pats. But that’s not a defense for what happened to the Jets. They got screwed.

    But let’s not make the mistake that if that TD was called correctly the Jets would have one that game. They STILL would have been 3 points down, with about 5 minutes left.

  26. OldTime Football says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:20 pm
    So now a fulble doesn’t have to hit the ground?
    ———————————-
    Well genius, what do you call it when a ball is stripped from a ball carrier up into the air and someone else grabs it before it hits the ground. It’s a f-u-m-b-l-e.

  27. “So now a fulble doesn’t have to hit the ground? The rules are getting more and more confusing!”

    14-2 likes to dislikes for this. Even AFTER this entire discussion has taken place, and we’ve all clarified that, yes, a fumble is when a player loses possession, whether it hits the ground or not, it’s a 7-1 ratio of people at this site who are too dim to keep up.

    “When he regained control, he landed OOB. No controversy at all. Not hard to understand.”

    It’s not hard to understand (unless you’re in the 7 part of that 7-1 ratio), but what Blandino and Pereira are saying is that it’s hard to SEE. The replay isn’t clear, they say, on whether he regains possession and lands in bounds, or not. The rule isn’t in dispute, the ruling is.

  28. I can’t believe anyone thinks this was a TD. This rule is clear and the play is obvious. he lost possession and regained it after he was out of bounds in the end zone. He bobbled it once on the end zone line. I think people need to understand the rules better before criticizing this proper reversal.

    I am so happy this is throwing Jets’ fans into a conniption, it makes it so much better!!!!

  29. a1b24948 says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:24 pm
    It was a TD. Plain and simple. He broke the plane.
    _____________________________________

    Yes he broke the plane but he did it empty handed. Look at the still pic that accompanies this article on PFT yesterday: Austin Seferian-Jenkins: I have to have better ball security. The only reasons anyone would still be calling that a TD at this point is they want it to have been one. When this site was all over the rule after it was applied in the Ravens game last year the posts overwhelmingly reflected that posters felt it was on the ball carrier to hang onto the rock and the rule was good. Strange the opinions are different when the rule worked in the Pats favor…actually it’s not strange at all.

  30. Ok it doesn’t pass the eye test but it passes the rules test. He lost control and he has to reestablish control IN THE FIELD OF PLAY before hitting the pylon or going out of bounds. That did not happen his body was airborne and did not land in the field of play with control once he lost it.

  31. .
    It’s all dependant on one’s definition of possession and control. It’s like a three judge appellate panel. They hear the same evidence but reach different conclusions.
    .

  32. It was a touchdown. Jets outplayed the Pats and deserved to have that call go their way. Hell, they deserved to win the game and I am a lifelong Pats fan.

  33. The only people who seem to see a fumble are the league office and some, but not all, Patriot fans. I guess they think that 99% of us are stupid, blind, or both.

  34. Pats fan here … Correct call. Stupid rule (just like tuck rule). Jets got screwed. Not the first time this has happened so some people need to get a grip. It’s a bad rule. Pure and simple.

    He absolutely lost possession before crossing the plane. Every replay angle showed that conclusively.

    The ticky tack calls are making the games impossible to watch. Hands to the face on both side of the ball … holding by interior defensive linemen … give me a break already

  35. waldoampere says:
    October 16, 2017 at 1:02 pm
    The only people who seem to see a fumble are the league office and some, but not all, Patriot fans. I guess they think that 99% of us are stupid, blind, or both.
    ========================
    There’s very little doubt it was a fumble. Not sure where that leaves “99%” of you but enjoy it at the very least.

  36. very similar to the contreras blocking of the plate on Saturday night. sure by the letter of the law the right call was made, but maybe the law needs to change.

  37. bradygirl12 says:
    October 16, 2017 at 1:02 pm
    It was a touchdown. Jets outplayed the Pats and deserved to have that call go their way. Hell, they deserved to win the game and I am a lifelong Pats fan.

    How did they “outplay” them?

    The Jets went up 14-0 in the first 10 minuets then got out scored 24-3 after that.

  38. The Golden rule applies to this call. If it happened against the Patriots I would be furious.

    This Pat’s fan thinks it’s a bad call. Period.

  39. TD! You can’t overturn a call on speculation. There must be irrefutable proof. That was not available, as the player’s back was all we could see. By their own rule, it was a score.

  40. Im a jets fan. He lost control before the goal line, but to reverse the call, they would have had to conclusively determine that he did NOT regain possession and establish himself before falling out of bounds. No way that happened. Call should have been upheld.

  41. bradygirl12 says:
    October 16, 2017 at 1:02 pm
    It was a touchdown. Jets outplayed the Pats and deserved to have that call go their way. Hell, they deserved to win the game and I am a lifelong Pats fan.

    ————-

    Did you see the Patriots beat the Jets 17-16 in 2014? The year the Patriots won the Super Bowl. They didn’t deserve to win that game either. It doesn’t matter how you win as long as you win.

    Heck, a 7 point margin of victory is the Patriots best win there since 2012.

    Are Patriots fans so spoiled now that we can’t even appreciate a crazy road win against the Jets?

  42. southbeachnorth says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:19 pm
    He actually never loses possession.
    ————
    There are multiple replay angles that show no part of his body touching the ball so what are you even talking about?

  43. “He actually never loses possession.”

    So just before he gets to the goal line, where the video and pictures clearly show him not touching the ball at all, with it several inches from either of his hands, how, exactly, is he possessing it? Positive thoughts? Good intentions?

  44. upper23 says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:56 pm
    Since when is a ball that moves in your arms a fumble.
    This is just stupid people interpreting stupid rules.

    ————-

    The ball was spinning like a spiral. It was completely free.

  45. Im an Eagles fan, no dog in this fight.

    What am I missing? He fumbles the ball outside the goalline, even if it is in his hands somewhat, then doesn’t regain possession until out of the endzone. That’s a fumble out of the endzone. Textbook.

    Hit those thumbs down, but the guy made the right call. And I LOATHE both teams…

  46. It was clear that he lost control of the ball. But the video does not show if he regained control of the ball before he crossed the goal.

    Thus if the video cannot show 100% when he regained control… THEN the call on the field should STAND.
    It should have been Jets touchdown.

  47. “The problem is that calling that loosening of the ball in his hands that never touches the ground a fumble opens up a black hole.

    Since when is a ball that moves in your arms a fumble.”

    Except it did not just “loosen” or “move in his arms”, still photos clearly show he entirely lost possession and it was floating in mid air. That’s a fumble by the way in any NFL game I’ve ever seen.

  48. “He actually never loses possession.”

    Statements like this are what worry me about our country. By now everyone should have seen the photo clearly showing that ASF lost control of the ball, it’s suspended in mid-air and he’s not touching it all. But folks will see what they want to see, their eyes be damned.

    Pats fan here, loved getting the break but I think the rule is pretty harsh as defined.

  49. “The only people who seem to see a fumble are the league office and some, but not all, Patriot fans. I guess they think that 99% of us are stupid, blind, or both.”

    Look at the photo in yesterday’s PFT article on this. It clearly shows the ball out of his hands and in mid air. That’s called a fumble. So yes you are blind, whether it being a condition of your eyes or that you dislike the Pats so much you can’t look at a clear photo and see what’s in it.

  50. As a Patriots fan and a die hard Jets hater, I can feel for the Jets getting the bad end of a legal and proper call, but it’s an NFL RULE (not the Patriot’s rule) and that rule says that if possession of the football is lost then possession must be reestablished before going out of bounds in order for it to be a TD. Now let me ask, if that had been the Patriots ball and they fumbled it backwards into the end zone and out of bounds, would it not then be a safety regardless if they repossessed it or do you all feel that that is a bad call also? Unfortunately these things will always happen where a rule will hurt at the wrong time. No matter how you change the rule someone at one time or another will get the short end of the stick.

  51. rho1953 says:
    October 16, 2017 at 1:21 pm
    That was the WORST call I have ever seen.
    ==================
    Interesting. Not sure if it even cracks my top 20.

  52. rogobrothers says:
    October 16, 2017 at 1:02 pm
    Three more calls like this and we will call Deflategate even.

    __________________________________

    Not even close.

  53. The 5 Jets fans who begrudgingly agree that the overturn was correct are to be commended, The rest are looking inside Hillary’s new book for the answer. The stills show the ball loose; Malcolm Butler immediately said it was loose. It was loose before the goal line and only in SF control after he contacted ground out of the end zone. This happens a lot on possession issue for onsides kicks. Game, set, match: Jets lose.

  54. OldTime Football says:
    October 16, 2017 at 12:20 pm
    So now a fulble doesn’t have to hit the ground? The rules are getting more and more confusing!
    ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
    Plenty of fumbles never hit the ground.

  55. limakey says:
    October 16, 2017 at 1:13 pm
    Mr Kraft, money well spent. Obviously Riverton was moved by the complaints and whines from Brady and Gronk

    _______________________

    Dude, Gronk was getting mauled most of the game. Is he supposed to just sit there and take it?

  56. Here’s another thing I haven’t seen anyone mention. The replay that shows the ball out of his hands and not back in possession until he’s OOB shows that the call on the field was wrong, it was not a TD.

    I thought we all wanted the refs to get the calls right? So now they properly reversed a bad call through replay, all you people can do is scream that the call on the field was a TD? It wasn’t, he didn’t have possession in bounds and didn’t break the plane.

    But because the overturn benefitted the Pats you just say “the Jets got screwed” and would obviously have been happy if the Jets got awarded a TD they didn’t score because it was against the mean ol’ Pats.

    What is it? Do you want the refs to get the calls right, or only if it doesn’t benefit the Pats? If its the latter that’s called a double standard and invalidates any complaint you have.

  57. If you look at the slow-mo replay on the Boston globe you see that not only did he lose possession before he crossed the goal line, he lost it again going to the ground and did not regain possession until he was rolling out of bounds. Riveron said he lost the ball twice and that video clearly shows he did.

  58. grogantomorgan says:
    October 16, 2017 at 2:01 pm
    Officiating in this game was very inconsistent.

    From the non-interference call on the Jets LB covering Gronk, to the TD call back.

    0 0 Rate This

    —————-

    False.

    One was textbook PI on Gronk and Sefarian-Jenkins fumbled and that is the rule.

    Why did the refs ignore the maul job on Gron, the hold on Cooks’s shoulder pad or Dorsett’s shoulder being jerked on the Skrine pick?

    Funny, if a Pats defender as much breathes on someone, it’s 15 flags coming from all over the field.

  59. Here’s the rule. Because the ball was bobbled again when he hit the ground, he never re-possessed the ball, by rule. Touchback was correct.

    “If a player goes to the ground out-of-bounds (with or without contact by an opponent) in the process of attempting to secure possession of a loose ball at the sideline, he must maintain complete and continuous control of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground, or there is no possession.”

  60. amazing how many snowflake millennials don’t know nfl
    rules

    too busy looking at fantasy stats

    ***

    Or too busy looking at the correct calls, when homers just deny deny deny.

  61. Horrendous call, but even worse rule involved. NFL needs to get rid of the fumble through the end zone is a touchback for the other team. Give it to the team that last had possession at the spot of the fumble. Easy fix.

  62. It is a dumb rule ,just like the tuck rule and as a loyal Pats fan I am glad that they were applied for the benefits of the flying Elvi.However,since the rule was used to benefit the Pats I am sure that the rule will be changed .If I were a Jets or Falcons fan I would be more upset about their team failing to maintain a lead .A comeback let alone an epic comeback (see last years Super Bowl) can only be started by the winning team failure to compete for the full 60 and then some.My biggest beef as a fan still remains the
    pass interference calls . Make the penalty a 15 yard from the line of scrimmage –either plus -minus.If you are inside the fifteen make it half the distance to the goal line on the defensive call and add the like amount if the call is on the offense.BTW a camera in the Pylon a la Belicheck would have helped –would’nt it?

  63. gisellichek says:
    October 16, 2017 at 1:57 pm
    It was a touchdown!! Jets got screwed!…And Yes the Player is on my fantasy team.
    Pats Fan

    ———-

    You can draft Jets players, but you still have to cheer against them when they play the Patriots in the real world!

  64. Its amazing that so many football fans that are big enough fans they visit sites like this one don’t know the actual rules concerning TDs. Even funnier they are acting like this is the first and only time a TD got called back under these circumstances. Funnier yet I’ve seen several “how can it be a fumble, it never hit the ground!”

    oh my lol

    I guess these rules dont come up in your fantasy leagues

  65. This call will propel the Pats to 14-2 and another SUper bowl championship, awesome to see the rest of the country lose their collective minds

  66. “Dorsett’s shoulder being jerked on the Skrine pick”

    That one infuriated me, and the announcers never even mentioned it. Why did Skrine catch hte ball and not Dorsett? Because Skrine pushed Dorsett out of the way, re-routed him, while the ball was in the air. Textbook pass interference. Ridiculous…

  67. Although it was probably the right call…it is never truly clear when possession was regained…therefore it can’t be determined “conclusively” enough to overturn the call on the field…IMO

  68. Of course he’s standing by the call. And if his predecessors were still in the job, they’d be standing by the call, too. The NFL always stands by the call no matter how obviously screwed up it was.

  69. Serious question (Pats fan by the way)…They say they need indisputable evidence to overturn a call. I’m guessing most people assume that means if the play resulted in a TD that you need to prove beyond the shadow of a doubt if the end result of the play is NOT a TD. Is it possible that once video evidence shows that ASJ clearly (at least momentarily) loses control of the ball that they burden of proof then becomes finding indisputable evidence that he got it back before going out of bounds?

    Obviously there is no video evidence that can clearly show that he DIDN’T recover inbounds, but there is also no clear evidence that he DID recover inbounds.

    If it’s as simple as “the call on the field was TD, they need to prove for sure that there was no TD” then the refs are idiots

    If it’s more complicated than that (once the ball was dislodged, they need proof that the ball was recovered before ASJ went out of bounds) they made the right call.

    I don’t know what the rule states on this one.

  70. “I’m guessing that guy had money riding on NE to make up a call like that.”

    So were you posting on the Seattle threads last week that the refs must have had money on Seattle? Because they made the same call last week in that game.

    Oh that’s right, it wasn’t the Pats so you don’t care either way, but you’ll post allegations with absolutely nothing to support them since it was the Pats.

    SMH

  71. @goingoppo

    I was thinking the same thing in my post above. Upon reviewing, once they see a fumble happened, the I assume they must see the who/if the fumble was recovered. I don’t know that there’s an angle that shows he definitively regains control/possession of the ball. That’s the only argument against overturning the TD that I can even begin to accept.

  72. I took a legal studies class in college and the professor said that execution of the law is similar to a baseball umpire calling balls and strike:

    1. Some call them as they are;

    2. Some call them as they see them; and

    3. Some call them as they want them to be.

    By my reading, virtually 100% of PFT readers, when it comes to the NFL, “call them as they want them to be” but are totally convinced they “call them as they are”.

  73. You can’t fault Riverton. If you’re going to make a rule like this you’re going to invite someone to apply it and there will be a range of interpretations. He thought he was doing his diligence and diagnosing something. Kudos to the Patriot who disrupted the ball security and made all this possible.

  74. The Jets had the ball at the 1. They fumbled it before crossing the goal line. The ball was recovered (by the same Jet) while OB. That’s a touchback. It’s damn simple. Dan Fouts is to blame for people not understanding this. It’s not controversial.

  75. Serious question (Pats fan by the way)…They say they need indisputable evidence to overturn a call. I’m guessing most people assume that means if the play resulted in a TD that you need to prove beyond the shadow of a doubt if the end result of the play is NOT a TD. Is it possible that once video evidence shows that ASJ clearly (at least momentarily) loses control of the ball that they burden of proof then becomes finding indisputable evidence that he got it back before going out of bounds?

    Obviously there is no video evidence that can clearly show that he DIDN’T recover inbounds, but there is also no clear evidence that he DID recover inbounds.
    ———-
    Lower Sideline View. Indisputably does not regain control in bounds.

  76. Some people on this sight said, this was the worst call they have ever seen. I guess you missed Franco Harris call the “IMMACULATE DECEPTION” between the Raiders and the Stealers!!!

  77. Very few objective people posting here today most blind homers who being told the sun is hot would say only if Belichek says so…

    The call was right but where was the irrefutable evidence they was mysteriously not shown? It’s done the milks spilled the Patriot cats licked it up….over done time to let karma have its day…always does.

  78. It took the guys in NY about 30 secs to come to a decision on this call. When they came back from the commercial break, the Pats were already lined up for a play. They vehemently defend their decision. It is what it is. No conspiracy theories, no grey areas or bending the rules, no what FB fans decide should be the outcome because they watch a lot of FB on tv. Rules are rules.

  79. A dumb rule that unfortunately was called correctly. I definitely understand why the Jets are mad wouldn’t blame them for lobbying to get rid of that rule.

  80. this call is made all the time. why are people acting like it’s some deep dark secret. How does anyone call themsleves a football fan and not know this very basic rule?

  81. This has been one of the worst years I can remember for replay. It just so happens to coincide with Riveron taking over. This stupid experiment should end. He’s god awful.

  82. There are tough calls in every game and this wasn’t the only one in this game. To their credit, the Jets were all business. They played hard and smart.

    So, why was this call such a big deal? Thirty-one teams and their fans want to see the Patriots knocked from their 15 year plus perch as the NFL’s dominant franchise. Alas, a call that favors one team, like air pressures change in a football on a cold damp night, takes on a twisted logic and perception when it favors the Patriots.

  83. Get rid of the rule and be prepared for a very different game. Ever fumble anywhere near the end zone will mean if the team that had the ball can kick, bat or throw the ball through the end zone they keep it.

  84. FINALLY the Pats catch a break. I guess everyone deserves one once in a blue moon, even the Pats. Still, one break is not enough to get NE back to even, after being screwed so many, many times in the past by ticky tack b.s. calls that went against them that should not have.

  85. If Butler didn’t rip the ball loose in the first place we wouldn’t even be having this discussion. He might get burned here and there, but the kid is scrappy all the way up to the whistle.

    Oh, those famous words from SB 49 still ring fresh: “Malcolm Go”!
    Great memories.

  86. Anybody whose argument is based on “he actually never lost possession” is in a fantasy world. There are clear photos of ASJ in mid-air with the football hovering between his hands.

    He lost possession.

    The only question is whether he got it back before landing out of bounds. If you want to argue, argue about that. Don’t rewrite history to try to make your argument stronger.

  87. Oh, and Dan Fouts was dreadful, as always. CBS didn’t even bother to broadcast the official explanation for the call. Why did CBS continue to show the same useless replay angle when better angles were available? You’d have to ask them.

  88. 24601jvj says:
    October 16, 2017 at 2:39 pm
    Packers and Patriots always get the calls. I am still steaming over the bad call in the Ice Bowl! Cowboys forever!
    —————————————
    Hey, Kramer wasn’t off-sides. He timed the snap perfectly and made the block…Get over it! 😉

  89. Wow. There sure are a lot of “fans” who seemingly don’t understand the simplest rules. “How is it a fumble if it never hits the ground!!??” I mean…are you people serious with this stuff? “This opens a black hole blah blah blah!!” Its been the same rule for decades, there’s no black hole only a black and white rule.

    I honestly cannot believe what I’m reading from 90% of the people on this site. You should all feel embarrassed.

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