Ninkovich says the Patriots dynasty is over


On last night’s Pro Football Talk, we took up a Twitter question from the great Kige Ramsey regarding the media’s habit of still treating the Patriots like they are still a dynasty.

The Pats still get that treatment because, unlike other NFL dynasties, the Pats have yet to slide out of consistent contention.  Instead, they’ve made the playoffs every year since their most recent Super Bowl win, with the exception of the season that began with Tom Brady tearing an ACL.  (Even then, the Pats went 11-5 under Matt Cassel.)  Because the Patriots are always kicking on the door, they still have the aura of a team that periodically kicks it in.

Not everyone agrees with that, including Patriots linebacker Rob Ninkovich.

That whole era is over with.  It’s gone,” Ninkovich told WEEI on Monday.  “So this is a whole new team.  It’s a different bunch of guys.  We all have to experience it and learn for ourselves what it’s like.  Getting in the Super Bowl last year and losing left a bad taste in my mouth.”

The era of winning Super Bowls is indeed over.  But the Pats continue to be regarded elite team, because they are.  They just haven’t won a Super Bowl in eight years.

And counting.

76 responses to “Ninkovich says the Patriots dynasty is over

  1. With Brady they will always have a chance. If Welker would catch the ball when it counts they would have won the Super Bowl last year and be playing in the game this year.

  2. Yes the Dynasty is over. Yes zero championships in 8 years but still a very good team.

    How many other Dynasty teams were still making Superbowl’s and Championship games?

    A good team, just not as good as 8 years ago .

  3. The Patriots are still an elite team as long ad they have Brady at QB. They will always contend. They can’t win them all.

  4. As long as they keep making the playoffs (which they do) they can never be counted out. Dynasty? Maybe not, but a threat to win it every year? Defiantly !

  5. I don’t think any Patriot fan still calls them a Dynasty.

    That being said, they are an elite team or considered an elite team because they are in playoff/SB contention every year.

  6. The cracks show up first as “near misses”.. i.e. Welker drops, etc

    Shortly thereafter – the dam breaks and the walls come tumbling down. Get ready for mediocrity and a nice stretch of 7-9,8-8,9-7 type seasons Patriot fans…you have earned it.

  7. They do not have players that are like the ones they had during the true golden years. Those guys would have done something about guys like Pollard a long time ago.

  8. It’s something that needed to be said by someone on that team. Can’t fault Ninko for putting it out there.

  9. no pats fan calls em a dynasty! that died in 2007.

    it’s a completely different team, but the fact that they have gone 60-20 since 2007 I’d still say they’re a pretty damn good squad. Just not good enough obviously.

  10. The dynasty really ended when Brady married that male model Giselle. Hasn’t won anything since.

    Mickey said it best-“Women weaken legs!”

  11. when it comes to defense, todays game has definitely passed william stephen belichick by. Be wise if robert kraft relieved belichick of his coaching duties. Belichick looks like a fool on the sidelines down on one knee trying to teach his defense. what does his defensive coordinator matt patricia do? time to retire or be fired belichick!!

  12. And counting, Mike? How many other teams have won Super Bowls since the Patriots did?

    Hint: It’s a short list.

    They fell one play short in two of the last five Super Bowls, and made it to the AFC Championship Game with a whole lot of good players on IR this season. Not a bad year’s work.

  13. Well said Ninky.. I must say it will be great TV to watch hoodie and brady fall from grace. Brady not so much because other than being a little bit of sissy he’s a great QB. There’s nothing to like about belicheat.

  14. Very good team, Brady showing rust, some players not mentally tough like Teddy B was, and the coach is starting to make very odd on field decisions during critical times of the game. Good team though in reg season.

  15. reasonablemindsays says:
    Jan 22, 2013 10:38 AM
    Ninkovich tells it like it is. The patriots havent been relevent in a decade but the major media outlets keep talking about them like theyre gods gift to football.
    And the winner for most assinine post goes to…..
    Oh yeah…they haven’t been “relevant” for a decade…As the article states (you did read it right?) they have made the playoffs every year except one when Brady was hurt, even then 11-5 wasn’t enough. Not to mention went to two more SBs. Seems like they’re relevant to me.
    By your definition, who HAS been relevant in the last 10 years? I’m guessing your answer will be the last 8 SB winners cause nothing else makes you relevant

  16. Kinda like when ‘Brent Farve’ could take the Packers to the playoffs on a regular basis as a gunslinger, but just could not close the deal! At some point it is over.

    See ya Tommy Boy!

  17. As long as Tom is there they will be competitive but if they want to get back to being a dynasty they will need a better defense. When they won Super Bowls they had one of the best defenses in the league.

  18. They do not have players that are like the ones they had during the true golden years. Those guys would have done something about guys like Pollard a long time ago.

    Tedy B., Ty Law and Seymour used to take over games with turnovers and points off.

  19. The Patriots will be a dynasty as long as Brady is the quarterback and the Jets, Dolphins and Bills keep fielding semi-pro level talent football teams.

    In the pathetic AFC East it is almost impossible for the Patriots NOT to get at least the second seed in the playoffs.

    The nanosecond Brady retires Belichick will go back to being the “Below Average Bill” we knew and loved in Cleveland.

  20. I used to have respect for Ravens fans, but with comments like those from jamaltimore and ravenator you can tell (like their team) they haven’t been there before.

    They make 1 super bowl in 12 years and suddenly the Ravens are god’s gift.

    This is why as a Pats fan I can respect the Steelers and their fans. They have been there before and act like it.

    Is Ray gonna wear that white suit on media day?

  21. Ravens straight bullied the Patriots. I mean they completely took their lunch money from them that 2nd half. It was truly awesome to watch.

  22. It took two amazing games by the Giants to beat the Patriots in those Super Bowls. Pass to David Terrell. Pass to Mario Manningham. The Patriots could’ve easily won those.

    There is no doubt something is different from their winning teams. However, they are a favorite every year with Belichick and Brady. Not my favorite, as you can tell by my name. But I’m stuck up here in Boston with them, so…

    As for Spygate, they proceeded to go undefeated until the Super Bowl the year it was brought up. That is a relative non-issue.

  23. I agree with Ninkovich, this thought occurred to me watching Welker drop that 3rd and 7 pass that hit him right in the hands. The championship teams never did that.

    As for the spygate trolls, you do realize that like 25 other teams also haven’t “won it all” since Spygate, right?

  24. Maybe not a dynasty but they’ve been the most consistent team in the past decade. There’s nothing to argue about that, no other team has had as much success in the last decade as the Pats. And if you guys really think its just Brady, Cassell came in and went 11-5, and hasn’t done crap since. Belichick weather you like him or not, is one of the best coaches in history, and has consistently shown that. You never know about any other team making it to the playoffs, but the Pats are a sure thing every year, not only to make it to the playoffs but more then likely the AFC championship game or the super bowl. And no I’m not a Pats fan, people just hate on winners and they’ve been winners for 10+ yrs now

  25. As is the Celtics’ dynasty, and the Bruins’ and Sox’ semi-dynasties (seminasties?). So America’s new “sports town” for the next decade is???

    New York has a shot between the Knicks, Nets, and Rangers; but the Yanks are going downhill and the G-Men missed the playoffs.

    Maybe the whole state of California? They got the Niners, the Kings, the Giants, and the Clippers; and Golden State is on the upswing. They ditched the Kings (huge plus); but they lose points for the Padres, Chargers, and the turrible Lakers

    Shockingly enough, DC actually may be in the mix. Maybe not right now, but in 3-5 years. I don’t ever want to use the word “youngry”, but the Nats and Redskins are both very young and very dangerous (especially with a healthy Strasburg and Griffin); the Capitals are always in the mix; and if Ernie Grunfeld stops being a fool and David Stern stops rigging the draft, the Wizards will have a new coach and Shabazz Muhammad next year and should be a force as well.

  26. I admire Ninkovich’s candor, but the real question is when Michael Vick will step up to the plate and admit the Eagles’ “dynasty” is over?

  27. The dynasty died when the Broncos knocked them out in 2005, then got the double tap with that epic collapse in the 2006 AFC championship. Pats fans have said this for years. The only people proclaiming it to be alive and well are haters who then turn around and say their team killed it when they best the Patriots.

  28. The Pats have fallen off as the AFC has. Back in the dynasty days, winning the AFC meant winning the Super Bowl. Now their are only a few teams that can contend in the AFC. NE will always be one of them with Brady and BB. That doesn’t necessarily mean winning the AFC title or Super Bowl.

  29. First, of course the dynasty is gone. Been gone for while now. That doesn’t mean their can’t be a second rising but that glory day are behind this team.

    Second, to the 1st overall comment: I didn’t know the Giants had a play for a miracle helmet catch. The Patriots have won 80% of there games since spygate, a better record than pre-spygate. More importantly, stealing signals is not illegal, nor is videotaping them.

  30. I look at the previous 36 comments and realize, if only ones that addressed football issues were posted and all the ones dissing the Pats were deleted, the thread would be very short.

  31. Oh no, the Dynasty is long gone but that does not matter because they are still an elite team. They could win it all any year and start working on a new dynasty.

  32. Pats fans are hilarious – look at them all coming on here stating “OH, we don’t think we’re a dynasty at ALL” and yet all you ever hear from them during the week is how the world is jealous of their success because of their “dynasty”, and how unbeatable they are.

    Chowds crack me up…

  33. The Patriots will be back in the playoffs next year, with a shot at the Super Bowl. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

  34. Funny thing is that no one in New England talks about the dynasty. The only player left from the last SB winning team in 2005 is Tom Brady.

    Just think the Patriots have turned their entire roster over while making the playoffs and 2 Super Bowls while rebuilding the team.

    People like jagsfan1 continue to post about the future 7-9, 8-8 seasons coming soon. HAHA but that would be considered a great season for a team like the Jags.

    Yes the Dynasty has long been over but the Patriots continue to be an elite team which will be back next year.

  35. I’ll give you an interesting statistic: road playoff games for NE between 2001-2006: 5…from 2007-2012: none. NE was built more for the playoffs before a strategic change to a high-powered offense in 2007, which has only gotten them more regular season wins and playoff games at home (where they have slipped up 3 of the last 4 seasons).

  36. The”Dynasty” gets * too right. because it does in my book you know the one where my squad was robbed outta two more appearences in super bowl play. And F*CK the nfl for not taking more and better action because I would stripped their *super bowls and just gave them to the runner ups. so really in my mind the rams eagles and panthers have rings not the cheaters. Now run your mouths or *fingers

  37. Everyone expects the same results from Brady and Belichick even though there are 52 DIFFERENT players on the team than what was there from 2001-2004. 2 guys don’t make a Dynasty.

    At some point you have to say those Super Bowl teams were special and the teams since have not been. This is largely due to the decline in defense over the past 5 years. I didn’t see Bruschi, Harrison, McGinest, Vrabel, Law, or Seymour on the field last Sunday.

    Losing Gronk the past 2 seasons didn’t make things any easier with an average defense.

  38. What a bunch of Anti-Patriots twats we have on this forum.. A bunch of cellar dwelling little know-it-alls who inevitably throw the “Spygate” comments out there because, lets face it, the Pats are a great team.

    For all of you out there that want to run your mouths about Spygate let’s just be honest with ourselves for a minute and remember – EVERY TEAM DID THIS! I know that’s too much to handle for some of you.. No other team is capable of gaining a competitive edge like video taping, right? No one else has EVER done it, right? I cite the following as examples:

    1. Before Super Bowl VII, “friends” of the Washington Redskins would take turns showing up at the Dolphins’ practice. A different friend would show up at each workout, and those who went to more than one did so in disguise.

    2. The Patriots caught the Jets filming in the end zone in Foxboro in 2006. The Jets said that the Pats had given them permission, which they clearly hadn’t because Pats asked the cameraman to leave. The league did nothing but to say it was okay and did not confiscate tapes or investigate. The Jets were supposedly filming ‘coaching video’.

    3. The Dolphins bought game tapes of the Patriots to study Tom Brady’s audibles before a MNF game in Dec 2006. Zach Thomas admitted to knowing all Brady’s signals from the tape study. The league ruled that such tape study is okay.

    4. Denver Broncos coach Mike Shanahan admitted in 2002 to hiring lip readers to steal signals. He bragged that his lipreaders could get all the signals by the end of the 1st half, sometimes by the end of the 1st quarter.

    5. The KC Chiefs admitted that they had somehow got hold of a 49ers playbook and memorized it before a game against the niners. KC knew every play that KC called before the snap. This was when Tony Dungy was with KC.

    6. Former Dallas Cowboy coaches Barry Switzer and Jimmy Johnson admitted to doing ‘similar stunts’ (video taping) while they were coaching.

    7. Former KC coach Herm Edwards said that, ‘There isn’t a team in the league that doesn’t try to steal signals [but] I haven’t heard about teams recording footage like the Patriots were,’ said one longtime NFL[..]istant coach. ‘But you can bet everybody is trying to steal in some way. In fact, you can go to any NFL game and you’ll find some coach whose sole job is to look for defensive signals.’

    8. Former Eagles QB Ron Jaworski admitted that when he played, his backup QB would spy on the defense and signal Jaws by dropping red flags to indicate blitzes. He also said that he had no problem with Pats taping the Rams before 2001 SB.

    9. The Raiders, Broncos, Steelers, and 49ers were all caught cheating on salary cap limits and all were fined and lost draft picks.

    The list goes on and on.. Not all of it is surrounded in Video Taping but the cheating/creating competitive edge against NFL rules has always been there and will keep happening by ALL OF YOUR FAVORITE TEAMS IN THE NFL!

    The “How did it actually help any team that video taped” questions answered: Former GM of the Atlanta Falcons said this as well: “”New England realistically may have been able to catch one or two plays from doing that and they could’ve had somebody in the press box getting the same information,” said former Atlanta Falcons general manager Ken Herock, who also worked as an executive in Oakland and Green Bay. “And what you’re actually talking about is one or two plays out of about 60 snaps a game. That really isn’t a great advantage.””

    So Spygate won the Pats a Superbowl (or 3) aye? The Pats kept them winning (above .500 every year) from 2001 through now (which is now 5 full seasons after the Spygate ruling) and the Pats are 146 – 46 in regular season games since 2001, 58 – 22 from 2008 through now: Winning Percentages of:

    –> .760 from 2001 through 2012..
    –> .725 from 2008 through now..

    Seems like his winning pct. is better since 2008.. Sounds like Spygate “Helping” Belichick is actually backwards.. If anything he’s done better since the beginning of 2008 (I’m leaving 2007 off just to keep the whiners from saying “They cheated in 2007 too!”)..

    I know, I know “What about playoffs and Superbowls”.. Ok, the fact they’ve been to 5 Superbowls since 2001 means nothing? Has no one ever heard the former players, coaches, analysts etc. say that getting to a superbowl is the one of the hardest things to do let alone win one.. Now, Granted, their playoff record hasn’t been awesome since 2007 (even though they haven’t won a Superbowl since the 2004 season) but they still get there and compete.. The playoffs are what they are and people have to go home, end of story.. But 5 Superbowls in 12 seasons? The best of the AFC those 5 times? Throw in a couple of AFC Championship losses and you still have to say “They got that far! That, in itself, is very impressive!”..

    BTW – For all of you haters; Just remember that you didn’t care about them before, when they were the DOORMAT of the NFL.. Outside of 3 or 4 good seasons (pre 2001) the Pats were the laughingstock of the NFL.. Now that they are on top the fact that there are and will always be Patriots haters is just laughable.. Really.. You call yourself fans of the sport and you have no real clue.. Most of you still just watch the ball when the game is on and don’t know much about watching the real game.. It’s a shame because you will always miss out because you’re being ignorant..

  39. How bout ur def actually play def n stop Sumone.

    Brady can only do so much welker can only do so much

    Brady seems to be scared of the ravens Gronk was out

  40. They haven’t won a Super Bowl since 2004 but just getting to five Super Bowls in an 11-year span is pretty darn impressive.

    But you have to wonder how much longer they will be a dynasty. Brady looks like he’s past his prime at this point.

  41. ampats says:
    Jan 22, 2013 11:44 AM
    Funny thing is that no one in New England talks about the dynasty. The only player left from the last SB winning team in 2005 is Tom Brady.


    Don’t forget about Vince.

  42. rpmcanes says: Jan 22, 2013 10:56 AM

    They do not have players that are like the ones they had during the true golden years. Those guys would have done something about guys like Pollard a long time ago.

    Tedy B., Ty Law and Seymour used to take over games with turnovers and points off.

    I love how Barney is responsible for torpedoing several Patriots fans’ hopes and dreams. Not a single one of those guys would shoot the fair one with Pollard. It’s fun trying to live vicariously through those players in order to avenge your angst, huh?

  43. Someone needs to tell the Dallas Cowboys and their fans that their aura has been gone for a while also, Haven’t won a playoff game in the HDTV era, but still treated as an elite team.

    Secede or at least look at a map and move out of the NFC East.

    *Disclaimer NYG fan since 1967

  44. patriotsdefense:

    Apparently videotaping signs is illegal if they were penalized for it with the heaviest fines ever seen in the sport and a loss of a 1st round pick.

    The spygate theory still holds true. Yes, they have won 75% of their regular season games in the last 5 years or so. But what is their winning percentage in the playoffs is recent years? The playoffs are when the teams are all good and so evenly matched often games are decided by who has better coaching. Hard to outcoach everyone in the playoffs like he did before because he has no illegal videotapes to help him.

  45. The Patriot dynasty was over a while back really. They have always been a very good team since Tom Brady, but the era of a team winning a Super Bowl with an elite QB and passing game but not much else is over. It’s not just the Patriots. The Packers and Saints have fallen too. As it should be.

    I’m neither a Ravens or a 49ers fan, but they are two of the most complete teams in the league. Solid defense, running game, and good passing game as well.

    They used to say a good running game and solid defense wins championships. Maybe that’s still true after all, even in this pass-happy flag football league.

  46. Wasn’t josh mcdaniels, the Belicheat protege, caught videotaping opponents as the broncos head coach? I guess he learned from the master.

  47. It’s funny people talk about Spygate and they ALL do it they just haven’t gotten caught. All the people hating on the Patriots are the people that their team hasn’t even sniffed a SB over the last 10 yrs. Jets, Ravens, Dolphins. It will be great to see Ray Lewis crying in 2 weeks but it will be because of a SB loss and retirement not a win.

  48. I don’t think New England ever was a dynasty. There, I said it. Now if you think they still are a dynasty because they have gone to a couple of Superbowls since the 2004 season you must be thinking the Bills had one hell of a dynasty losing 4 superbowls in a row.

  49. The Pats Dynasty has been over for some time. The Dynasty team won three Super Bowls in four years, went undefeated in 2007 and lost by a hair in Super Bowl XLII. That ended the Patriots Dynasty. Franchises can remain competitive for years, but Dynasties are short-lived. For the most part, only Brady and Belichick remain from those teams. Today’s Pats are a completely different entity. Trying to pretend they are in any way connected to the Dynasty is like pretending today’s Steelers are part of the 70s Dynasty.

  50. Brady will be 36 next year. At some point there will be a decline in arm strength and accuracy.

    The team around him will need to be better equipped to win in the playoffs if he has any chance of pulling an Elway and winning Super Bowls at 37 and 38.

    They have the 2 tight ends locked up for the rest of Brady’s career and have some good pieces on defense like Mayo, Wilfork, Spikes, McCourty, Jones, and Hightower. They aren’t that far away from putting it all together. We’ll see. PS – sign Talib.

  51. So following this theory, Baltimore, who has been to 3 AFCC’s in the past 5 years (like the Pats) but has no SB wins in that stretch (like the Pats) and has not missed the playoffs in that stretch AND has won at least 1 playoff game every year since 08…doesn’t that make Baltimore an elite team as well??


  52. Caveat: I’m not a Patriots fan, at all. In fact, I’m from NYC.

    That said, are you guys really going to continue this “since spygate, not one SB win”? Um, since Spygate they have CONSISTENTLY been in the playoffs, made the Super Bowl several times, been in the AFC Championships, went 16-0… the list goes on and on.

    What exactly is the argument? That they could do all that without “Spygate” but somehow can never win a super bowl? That makes no sense.

    Sheesh, rivalries are fine and all that, but be logical.

  53. One of the best ways to find out which team(s) are considered strong contenders are the sportsbooks. The Pats are usually the top 2 or 3. The Pats have been strong contenders for the past decade. That may be considered a dynasty. Wish my team could be strong contenders for more than more a couple years. Yes I’m envious of the Pats.

  54. I have never liked the Pats but they’ve been good for a quite a few years. It was always touch and go that they could win it all. I was always tense watching them in the playoffs since I thought they are good enough to win it all.

    However, this time around, against the Ravens, I felt that the Pats looked old. I was almost sure that the Pats would lose.

    I feel that the run is over, much like all runs come to an end.

  55. The Spygate trolls’ goalposts always move. First it was the Patriots couldn’t win a playoff game. Then they couldn’t win an AFC championship. Now they can’t win a SB. Next it’ll be they can’t win 3 SBs in 4 years.

    “Irrational hatred” isn’t a phrase for nothing.

  56. They became the Colts once Brady started eating up Cap Space….

    Leaky Defense – Fancy Stats QB – one and dones instead of Championship Runs.

  57. footballfan80 says: “The spygate theory still holds true. Yes, they have won 75% of their regular season games in the last 5 years or so. But what is their winning percentage in the playoffs is recent years? The playoffs are when the teams are all good and so evenly matched often games are decided by who has better coaching. Hard to outcoach everyone in the playoffs like he did before because he has no illegal videotapes to help him.”

    videotaping for the sidelines was the infarction, 8 yards back and in the stands not off limits. it’s really that simple. the pats have a .792 winning %, better than pre-spygate. also prespygate they had a better defense. they’re defense has sucked since 2007. the Giants were the better team. Also, the Giants don’t have a signal for a helmet catch. The other teams are good too.

    Okay, so why haven’t the Cowboys been successful? The Chargers, the Ravens before this year? Because it’s hard to win.

  58. Everybody forgets how hard it is to make it to the playoffs, though. The pats are still the best overall team of the past decade and even the last 5 years. Just my opinion.

  59. wgray981 says: Jan 22, 2013 3:43 PM

    Everybody forgets how hard it is to make it to the playoffs, though. The pats are still the best overall team of the past decade and even the last 5 years. Just my opinion.

    Why don’t we look at it this way – since the Patriots last won the Super Bowl in 2004, they’ve been there twice since and lost both times.

    The Steelers, in that same time period, have been to the Super Bowl 3 times and won it twice.

    So why isn’t anyone saying the Steelers are the dynasty here?

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