NFLPA wants Goodell to testify in Tom Brady appeal

AP

The NFLPA has released the letter that general counsel Tom DePaso sent to NFL executive V.P. of football operations Troy Vincent notifying the league of Tom Brady’s appeal of the four-game suspension that Vincent handed down earlier this week.

In the letter, DePaso outlines several points that will be raised during the process and he starts with the argument that Vincent has no authority to impose discipline under the CBA and that any attempt by NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell to delegate the imposition of discipline is a violation of the CBA. DePaso also informs Vincent that the NFLPA plans to call both Vincent and Goodell, who has appointed himself to hear the appeal, to testify in the appeal hearing regarding “the circumstances surrounding the purported delegation of disciplinary authority” and the details of that delegation.

Because the NFLPA intends to have the credibility and testimony of Goodell and Vincent as fundamental parts of the hearing, they argue “that neither Commissioner Goodell nor anyone with close ties to the NFL can serve as arbitrator in Mr. Brady’s appeal under governing legal standards.” DePaso also warns that the union and Brady “will seek recusal and pursue all available relief to obtain an arbitrator who is not evidently partial” in the event that a neutral arbitrator is not named to hear the appeal.

DePaso’s letter also argues that Brady is not receiving the fair and consistent treatment mandated by the CBA and that the Wells Report is not sufficient evidence to use in support of a suspension.

217 responses to “NFLPA wants Goodell to testify in Tom Brady appeal

  1. Roger can testify while shaving in the mirror prior to driving to the hearing he is presiding over.

    You can’t make this stuff up.

  2. So if the NFLPA intends to question Goodell how can he be the one who hears the appeal. The answer is he can’t and if he does the next stop will be a court hearing.

  3. Lol! NFL successfully took down AP. Then said to themselves let’s go for our biggest score. Let’s take down TB12. They will respect our authoritor.

  4. I hope everyone is prepared for what is about to happen here.

    Brace yourself, haters, because the NFLPA and Brady’s and the Patriots’ lawyers are going to slaughter the NFL in this appeals process.

  5. I am astounded at how many Pats fans think Goodell is out to get the Patriots… What commissioner in his right mind would want this shadow over the league or to have one of it’s best players suspended for the first game? Do you think he wanted to fight his buddy Kraft?

    Obviously there is enough guilt that Goodell felt like this was the very least he could do. I hope you people clamoring for a court case actually get one.

    The NFLs counter-suit will have subpoena power for Tom’s phone records. That’s when the touchdown comes!

  6. In NFL terms, the league has turned the ball over and now it’s first and goal Patriots from the one.
    .

  7. Yes…..and Goodell, Kensil, Wells, Grigson and Harbaugh should turn over all of their electronic information. Then we will see who was conspiring to do what!

  8. Maybe we can call the gym that the Ball handlers use for video evidence of their deflation ?? Maybe call the Fed & ask if deflation is a good thing for the economy ??

  9. Goodell: “Did everyone here read that laughable dumpster fire the Patriots organization called a response to Ted Wells’ report? You did? Then I rest my case.”

  10. What this process is doing is all of a sudden moving the rest of the players around the league to get behind Brady. They were not with him before. but now will be because his interest is their interest (taking down Goodell’s powers with respect to the CBA).

  11. NFLPA is a joke. They fleece the players and should provide them with extensive tools, training, initial and recurrent, to manage the players money, off field training( how to be a good citizen and who to trust to represent them from contracts to investments. They should push setting aside a percentage of earning for out/future years.

  12. hahahahha hot mess. Goodell should wear different wigs depending on which role he’s playing

  13. From the person that is raising money to help pay the Patriots 1M fine:

    “We set up GoFundMe’s all the time under made up names to raise money for ALL kinds of causes! This just so happens to be the one THE MEDIA blew up! We didn’t do anything. We created a page and left it alone. We didn’t know anything happened until the next day when we saw a post about the page and realized it had taken off. The FANS have CHOSEN to donate. We didn’t force anyones hand in anything!

    We understand and accept everyones opinions.. however we wanted to make it known that our intentions are never bad. We have beliefs like everyone else and we go at them head on, whatever happens happens!

    If you don’t like it (media), don’t report on it.
    If you don’t like it (citizens), stop talking about it while posting the link. “

  14. audge86 says: May 15, 2015 11:29 AM

    hahahahha hot mess. Goodell should wear different wigs depending on which role he’s playing

    __________________________________
    This made me spit my coffee out…lol

  15. zachari14 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:26 AM

    I am astounded at how many Pats fans think Goodell is out to get the Patriots… What commissioner in his right mind would want this shadow over the league or to have one of it’s best players suspended for the first game? Do you think he wanted to fight his buddy Kraft?

    Obviously there is enough guilt that Goodell felt like this was the very least he could do. I hope you people clamoring for a court case actually get one.

    The NFLs counter-suit will have subpoena power for Tom’s phone records. That’s when the touchdown comes

    _________

    What do you expect? It’s the majority of Pats fanbase that believe the Boston media when they say that everyone is just jealous of them because they ‘win.’

    Most forums I talk on with level headed Pats fans are reasonable with this and would just rather Brady admit he was wrong and let this thing go away.

  16. Goodell will hear appeal..and say..OK.

    .want me to consider a LIGHTER punishment..come clean now…show your texts..have McNAlly up here and testify under oath ..and we can talk..if not..THERE IS NOTHING TO TALK ABOUT

  17. NFLPA is not representing the players very well, they shuold have rejected the CBA last time. Only one team did.

    that aside if they’re going to use the appeal of the suspension to destroy the NFL and those managing the NFL, then they have committed infractions against the Nfl Franchise by laws. Throw them out of the league, relocate NE to LA with a new owner. NE hasn’t played good pool since KRaft came in. The other owners didn’t do a good job vetting KRaft and his practices> After 15 years, it’s very apparhent now.
    Say NO to NE as a franchise. Al Davis is crying from the crypt.

  18. The Pats’ decision to go nuclear is misguided and should stop even though it appears to late. It’s a no-win situation fueled by arrogance and makes them look worse than spygate and deflategate (which I view as minor infractions that probably did not affect the outcome of games) combined. Their rebuttal to the report, with its ridiculous spin that “deflating” equals weight loss and unsubstantiated allegations against other teams is just embarrassing.

    Stop!!

    Signed,

    Disgusted Pats’ Fan

  19. boltsgrizz says:
    May 15, 2015 11:24 AM
    Brady is making himself look like an ass. You cheated and got caught. Take your medicine and get on with it. loser.

    **********************************************

    Sorry buddy, but the NFL and Goodell are the asses here. That is no proof what so ever that Brady is guilty of anything. Why should he take medicine for something he didn’t do? This is the problem with all the leaks Goodell allowed to go out uncorrected, the court of public opinion had already convicted Brady before the investigation was a week old. Goodell could have nipped this in the bud by announcing the leaked info was incorrect, but no he let it fester and grow out of control. The only one that looks bad in this is Goodell and the investigation.

  20. Everyone who has fought the NFL has lost. Every teams fans crow how they are going to take down Goodell, and every single time they lose. Why?

    It’s simple – the rules for arbitration were agreed upon but 32 owners and 31 teams players – sans Pittsburgh. The rules are set and this is the way it goes down, as the line goes in Unforgiven – “Fairs has got nothing to do with it.”

  21. I’m so over this it’s not even funny.

    The NFL front office is a dumpster fire right now and needs to be overhauled as soon as possible. The amount of investigations they’ve attempted that resulted in just more issues for the league is astounding.

    These are underinflated footballs people. The only real advantage anyone has pointed out this whole time is the fumbling…and that didn’t help Brady. Really people. This whole thing is about Brady getting the balls to a point where they fit his hands better. Nothing more, nothing less. It didn’t help accuracy…didn’t help decision making…the underinflated footballs didn’t tell the DB to jump that route….hell, maybe one of the Pat’s balls got lost in the shuffle and the deflation made it stick to Tyree’s head?

    Goddell uses nukes as warnings to other players/teams and it’s now biting him back. A million dollars, 2 picks and Brady out for 4 games over underinflated footballs that you can’t actually prove? What happens in a case like this that you can prove? Firing line?!

  22. Doctoring equipment (deflated balls, stick ’em, silicon on jerseys) is just a part of the game. In fact, some of my best memories of baseball growing up was pitchers getting caught throwing spitballs and scuffed balls. Trying to cheat by doctor equipment and getting caught was a part of the game.

    If all Brady had done was doctor a few balls, not a big deal. Fine at most, even considering it was Brady and Peyton that lobbied to get the rule changed to make it easier for him to doctor balls. Fine him, tell him not to do it again, and be done.

    The real problem here is that he refused to cooperate with the league investigation. That alone is grounds for a 4 game suspension. In fact, I’m surprised it wasn’t more.

    As for the big Patriots rebuttal piece, that’s just embarrassing. Take it like the Cowboys did in the ridiculous “violating the spirit of the salary cap when there is no salary cap” case. Pursue you’re appeal options as quietly as possible and move on.

  23. He should turn over his personal cellphone and emails too – just like they all wanted Brady to do

    Wells and Kensil should turn theirs over too

    We need to see what conspiracy they all engaged in if there was one

    Why wouldn’t they just hand it over – just like Brady, supposedly they have nothing to hide, right? They have no right to privacy – this is the NFL, right?

    And of course NO WHERE does Wells address the FACT that someone (Kensil?) was leaking dis-information about the Patriots to make them look bad all along. That alone PROVES someone in the NFL front offices was going OUT OF THEIR WAY to falsely make Brady look bad.

  24. Roger Goodell yawns. Oh its the NFLPA!!! He owns you dopes.

    He will tell De Smith to go home and take is afternoon nap.

    The NFLPA is a sinking row boat.

  25. colv says:
    May 15, 2015 11:28 AM

    NFLPA is a joke. They fleece the players and should provide them with extensive tools, training, initial and recurrent, to manage the players money, off field training( how to be a good citizen and who to trust to represent them from contracts to investments. They should push setting aside a percentage of earning for out/future years.
    __________________________________
    They already do this, and have done this for years and years. The problem is, you cannot force an individual to save / prepare for the future and how to handle their fortune.

    You can lead them to water, but you can’t make the them drink.

  26. Isn’t all of this collectively bargained? NFLPA allowed Goodell this power in the CBA. This is an attempt to bypass a billion labor agreement. Good luck with that.

    Headline should read “Pats Challenge NFL in Misguided Arrogance and Entitlement”

    What a terrible waste of resources.

  27. So the merits of the appeal have nothing to do with the case but rather how the punishment was delivered? #tomshady

  28. whats the point Goodell has already been caught lying on several occasions including by a federal court with respect to the Ray Rice investigation.

    its more probable then not that goodell has already decided what his ruling will be on the appeals case which makes his ability to be an objective arbitrator moot

    don’t worry Roger this will soon all be over and you will never have to deal with any of this ever again as your future wont be working with the NFL

    don’t let the door hit you on the ass on your way out

  29. For the a holes saying Goodell should turn over his phone..FOOLS..hes not on trial here….

    Bottom line..if you are innocent..you say HERE ARE MY CELL PHONE TEXTS, MY CAR KEYS, MY COMPUTER< and GISELES PHONE

    the guy is hiding stuff and deserves to fry

  30. lukedunphysscienceproject says:
    May 15, 2015 11:25 AM
    I hope everyone is prepared for what is about to happen here.

    Brace yourself, haters, because the NFLPA and Brady’s and the Patriots’ lawyers are going to slaughter the NFL in this appeals process.

    __________________

    The Pats are talking a hard game but it will never go to actual court because then Kraft, Brady, and Belichick would have to testify not only on Deflategate but on Spygate and other allegations of cheating as well

  31. zachari14 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:26 AM
    I am astounded at how many Pats fans think Goodell is out to get the Patriots… What commissioner in his right mind would want this shadow over the league or to have one of it’s best players suspended for the first game? Do you think he wanted to fight his buddy Kraft?

    Obviously there is enough guilt that Goodell felt like this was the very least he could do. I hope you people clamoring for a court case actually get one.

    The NFLs counter-suit will have subpoena power for Tom’s phone records. That’s when the touchdown comes!
    _______________
    Answer this question then…why did the NFL, knowing the PSI’s of the football were not 2 PSI’s under as Mortenson reported, allow that rumor to persist for four months? Why did they not come out and say “that’s false”? As we learned the balls were barely a pound under. Why when they NFL sent a letter to the Patriots back in March with the actual PSI readings did they ask the Patriots not to release the PSI findings until the Well’s report?

  32. quagmate says:
    May 15, 2015 11:36 AM
    Everyone who has fought the NFL has lost. Every teams fans crow how they are going to take down Goodell, and every single time they lose. Why?

    It’s simple – the rules for arbitration were agreed upon but 32 owners and 31 teams players – sans Pittsburgh. The rules are set and this is the way it goes down, as the line goes in Unforgiven – “Fairs has got nothing to do with it.”

    *************************************************

    It’s actually the total opposite, the NFL has a terrible record in court. There’s a thing called Google try it out some time.

  33. j0esixpack says:
    May 15, 2015 11:46 AM
    He should turn over his personal cellphone and emails too – just like they all wanted Brady to do

    Wells and Kensil should turn theirs over too

    We need to see what conspiracy they all engaged in if there was one

    Why wouldn’t they just hand it over – just like Brady, supposedly they have nothing to hide, right? They have no right to privacy – this is the NFL, right?

    And of course NO WHERE does Wells address the FACT that someone (Kensil?) was leaking dis-information about the Patriots to make them look bad all along. That alone PROVES someone in the NFL front offices was going OUT OF THEIR WAY to falsely make Brady look bad.

    Joe..have another 6 pack…Goodell is not on trial..BRADY AND PATS are show the supporting evidence of your innocence or shut UP and go home…

  34. While Roger has taken so much heat during his time as Commish, you have to wonder what the conversations amongst some owners might be. There has to be a group conversing about the negative attention he brings to the league ( fair or unfair). He makes a tremendous amount of money. It might be a good time to usher in a fresh face and voice for the league. It would cool the fan temperature as fans aren’t going to stop watching, but fans are getting tired of all the “drama” day in and day out with the NFL, people are starting to really move towards just watching the team they follow and that is it. No more watching all day Sunday, Thursday night games would rather they stop them and Monday Night for east coast, there is no point if your team is not playing, the game ends way to late. You can check your fantasy score at any point in real-time without having to waste time on games you could really careless about, while doing other things not involving spending all day watching football.

  35. jnasty5000akajungguns says: So the merits of the appeal have nothing to do with the case but rather how the punishment was delivered?
    —————————–

    Actually if you take the officials “best recollection” there is no merit to the Wells report

    The “best recollection” of the official PROVES that no deflation took place

    While Wells accepts the “best recollection” of Anderson at other times, on the pivotal question of which guague he used, Wells, in order to find Brady “guilty” had to arbitrarily assume that in that one selective instance the “best recollection” of Anderson… was WRONG

    If he accepts the “best recollection” of an unbiased official, then there is no deflation.

  36. Why isn’t Brady releasing his phone documents? Get real trying to make Goodell testify.

  37. Judge to Goodell : The second half of the AFCCG was PATRIOTS 28 to colts 0. Mr. Goodell, Why did you not exonerate the PATRIOTS at that point ???

    Goodell to Judge : It backfired on us on the first sting attempt.

    Judge to Goodell : Mr. Goodell, you leaked false information for two weeks leading up to the SuperBowl, WHY ???

    Goodell to Judge : That was our second attempt undermine the PATRIOTS.

    Judge to Goodell : Under the highest NFL scrutiny, the PATRIOTS defeated, perhaps, the Best Defense in NFL history – Why did you not exonerate the PATRIOTS at this point.

    Goodell to Judge : I hired Mr. Well$ for our third attempt to discredit the PATRIOTS in hopes that their AFC dominion will come to an end.

  38. He thought he was untouchable, he did the crime and doesn’t have the balls to do the time. I would suspend him indefinitely and virtually end his career. Then I would put a chaperone in the New England front office and team to make sure they play well with others. There has been no bigger scumbag team in the history of the NFL. You can’t be sure they EVER won anything without cheating.

  39. jnasty5000akajungguns says:
    May 15, 2015 11:49 AM

    So the merits of the appeal have nothing to do with the case but rather how the punishment was delivered? #tomshady

    —–

    read all three pages, not just the first

  40. Before the Pats’ response I was pretty much on the fence because I thought it was such a petty issue to begin with. The response, however, was an absolute insult to the intelligence of the average fan.

    Just one example, do you realize the incredible coincidence needed to make the Pats’ claim on the origin of the name “deflator” even make the partially true? You are the only team in the world wrapped up in a massive scandal dubbed “deflate gate” and the investigators have narrowed it down to a few key targets. Amazingly, one of these targets already claimed the name “deflator,” not because he deflates the balls the investigators are examining, but because he’s losing weight ☺. NE is generally good with lies, but that was terrible!

    At this point, it shouldn’t even be about the crime, but rather the cover-up. This has dragged on far longer than it need to. NE has put up barricades every step of the way. It’s an embarrassment some are still falling for their continued lies and even rooting for their success in appealing.

  41. clam says:
    May 15, 2015 11:51 AM
    zachari14 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:26 AM

    Answer this question then…why did the NFL, knowing the PSI’s of the football were not 2 PSI’s under as Mortenson reported, allow that rumor to persist for four months? Why did they not come out and say “that’s false”? As we learned the balls were barely a pound under. Why when they NFL sent a letter to the Patriots back in March with the actual PSI readings did they ask the Patriots not to release the PSI findings until the Well’s report?”

    WELL..because maybe there were rumors but noone actually complained on the record..once someone complains it has to be investigated…SHOULD they have sent a text to BRADY LOL not to do it because he was being watched???? if there were rumors..OBVIOUSLY the PATS heard about them and gave the league the finger..so the league is rightfully so giving finger back to PATS

  42. The irony here is that the Goodell/League/management haters are relying on Brady (arguably one of the least liked/most jealous of/most criticized) players in the league to try to take down Goodell. It is like watching two teams you hate playing the game and being forced to root for one of them–and then hating the outcome regardless of who wins.

  43. For those clamoring for release of electronic data. Have some sense of reality people!

    You honestly think that anything remotely incriminating exists on TB’s, or BB’s, RK’s, or RG’s phone, or PC anymore?

    The only people that have any incentive to keep any electronic data are the two fired ball handlers.

  44. This is gonna carry us right up until the season… Where once again the Patriots will resume kicking the crap out of people without skipping a beat.

  45. tomtravis76 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:54 AM
    While Roger has taken so much heat during his time as Commish, you have to wonder what the conversations amongst some owners might be. There has to be a group conversing about the negative attention he brings to the league ( fair or unfair). He makes a tremendous amount of money. It might be a good time to usher in a fresh face and voice for the league. It would cool the fan temperature as fans aren’t going to stop watching, but fans are getting tired of all the “drama” day in and day out with the NFL, people are starting to really move towards just watching the team they follow and that is it. No more watching all day Sunday, Thursday night games would rather they stop them and Monday Night for east coast, there is no point if your team is not playing, the game ends way to late. You can check your fantasy score at any point in real-time without having to waste time on games you could really careless about, while doing other things not involving spending all day watching football.”

    THERE would not be as much drama if guys werent beating up women, getting arrested, doing marijauna/DRUGS/PEDS, and teams trying to cheat…why cant everyone just be good guys..and ALL teams..PATS included..play by the rules…????

  46. jf203 says: Joe..have another 6 pack…Goodell is not on trial..BRADY AND PATS are show the supporting evidence of your innocence or shut UP and go home…
    =========================

    I beg to differ – just wait and see

    Again, the only way the actual evidences suggests deflation beyond what the Laws of Physics says there should be is if Wells and Goodell arbitrarily assme that the lead official Anderson is wrong about his “best recollection”

    Why would anyone accept Anderson’s best recollection for EVERYTHING ELSE but then reject it on the pivotal point of the entire investigation unless they had pre-determined what they wanted the outcome to be?

    Goodell is very much “on trial” here (though you realize that this is not a trial, nor does the NFL have supoena power – and thus an order to hand over all cellphone and emails is an “unreasonable request” itself

    Here again, Goodell and Wells make an unreasonable request specifically knowing that Brady would reject it – thus they could find him “guilty” of refusing a request, which they themselves would likely feel is unreasonable

    And of course, you never saw Goodell ask Ray Rice for HIS cellphone either, did you?

    Wonder why?

  47. “I am astounded at how many Pats fans think Goodell is out to get the Patriots… What commissioner in his right mind would want this shadow over the league or to have one of it’s best players suspended for the first game? Do you think he wanted to fight his buddy Kraft?”

    Goodell is not Kraft’s “buddy” contrary to popular myth.

    Goodell is an ex-Jets employee who loathes the Pats and will do anything he can to hurt the franchise.

  48. This is simply a tactic to force Goodell to recuse himself from hearing Brady’s appeal, and forcing the league office to go to a third party independent arbitrator to hear the case.

  49. This is not going to end with Goodell’s ouster. This will end with the league bankrupt if this goes too much farther. It’s going to spiral out of control into all sorts of lawsuits for all sorts of bogus reasons. People who say “Go get him, Tom” really don’t know what they are asking for.

    If you value the game, then you should want Goodell to hear the appeal. If this goes to court and the League loses, the fans lose in the long run. I hate Roger as much as any of you, but this is bad for the game.

  50. Man, there is enough back room dealings going on here on both sides. That is whst happens when you have attorneys running the show. The Wells report is fatally flawed. Emphasis on fatal. Disregarding Walt Anderson’s “best recollection” to support their ‘More Probable than Not’ blows their case apart. The NFL’s lack of accurate measurements with the same gauges along with leaking wrong information about a 10.1 Psi ball that in the end never existed shows they lied too. Bottom line, Wells and the NFL front office cannot suspend the laws of a Physics do they can come to the conclusion they want.

  51. Brady is eventually going to turnover that phone in court with a smile on his face… to a judge that might be trusted… not those half wits at the NFL.

    And when he does all the haters and NFL goons are gonna look like the fools that they are…

    Tom is an intelligent man with very smart representatives… he wouldn’t be playing hardball unless he knew for certain he could bludgeon these fools !

  52. Read the letter!

    If true, this (particularly the part regarding delegation of authority) proves Goodell once and for all to be an absolute moron.

    Screw around with the extra point all you want Roger. It will rustle the fans for sure, but we’re still not taking our eyes off this circus anytime soon.

  53. While we are add it, let’s have Tom Brady testify and submit his phone records relating to this issue.

    The NFLPA also seems to have a bit of a conflict in that there are several players around the league (most notably those playing for the Colts) who believe that what Tom Brady did was prejudicial to their interests.

  54. f203 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:57 AM
    clam says:
    May 15, 2015 11:51 AM
    zachari14 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:26 AM

    Answer this question then…why did the NFL, knowing the PSI’s of the football were not 2 PSI’s under as Mortenson reported, allow that rumor to persist for four months? Why did they not come out and say “that’s false”? As we learned the balls were barely a pound under. Why when they NFL sent a letter to the Patriots back in March with the actual PSI readings did they ask the Patriots not to release the PSI findings until the Well’s report?”

    WELL BRAINIAC..because maybe there were rumors but noone actually complained on the record..once someone complains it has to be investigated…SHOULD they have sent a text to BRADY LOL not to do it because he was being watched???? if there were rumors..OBVIOUSLY the PATS heard about them and gave the league the finger..so the league is rightfully so giving finger back to PATS

    ______________________
    So the NFL would not come refute Mortensons report because of why? What about the integrity of the game? Protect the shield? WHo at the NFL made those false leaks and why did the NFL not want to refute them?

    Read my question then respond next time.

  55. I am astounded at how many Pats fans think Goodell is out to get the Patriots… What commissioner in his right mind would want this shadow over the league or to have one of it’s best players suspended for the first game? Do you think he wanted to fight his buddy Kraft?

    Obviously there is enough guilt that Goodell felt like this was the very least he could do. I hope you people clamoring for a court case actually get one.

    The NFLs counter-suit will have subpoena power for Tom’s phone records. That’s when the touchdown comes!
    _______________________________

    as a pats fans lets start with your confusion, spygate wasn’t about video taping signals nor has the rule changed to ban the videotaping of signals, it was about the location from where the patriots were doing it, this can easily be researched but most fans enjoy being ignorant about it. this camera location was all they had to levy the biggest fine in NFL history.

    second Roger Goodell was an ex eomplyee of the new York jest who have a long history of hatred for the patriots,

    third he put Matt Kensil in charge of the situation on the filed at the AFC championship game who is also an Ex Jets employee and has been very open about his hatred of the patriots included newly released info this week that Kensil told some patriots staff at the AFC champion ship game that you “your guys are F***ing screwed” before any investigation had begun

    third and most important is that there is not one single instance where you can mention that goodell has done any favors or treated the patriots favorably in his entire life. the only thing pats haters will come up with is that Goodell destroyed the tapes in spygate despite having levied the biggest fine in nfl history. pats haters love ingnoring news and facts but also with a little research you can learn that the general consensus of why the tapes were destroyed is that on many of the films you had proof that other teams were doing the same thing

    just because people think Goodell and Kraft are buddies and Goodell will do anything for his pal Kraft doesn’t make it true

    the only thing true here is that most NFL fans believe things based on their desired outcomes which is driven by their hatred of the Pats irrelevant of facts.

    lastly if Goodell felt that he had a strong case, hiring an impartial arbitrator would have been a no brainer, he has chosen himself because he knows they don’t stand a chance with someone with no vested interest. why would Goodell appoint himself knowing that its clear he is incapable of being impartial as he is the one who hired Ted Wells, knowing that the NFLPA would scream about this, knowing that every NFL player and owner despite what they feel would have to agree that he cant be impartial in this case and every fan who chooses to use their brain would know that Roger couldn’t be impartial against himself. there is only one reason to appoint yourself which is because its your only shot at winning. it is so ironic that this will have to be brought to federal court where the NFL has never won against a player and included in that is cases where they had hard evidence such as actual film of Ray Rice punching his fiancée in the face. good luck on a case that doesn’t have a single shred of proof and even concludes its more probable then not which in its very essence says we don’t have proof but we think.

  56. Everybody keeps saying how Brady doesn`t want this to go to court because his phone records will be will be available but by spelling out the problems from Grigson to Vincent to Goodell all their phone records will be open too.How many CBA violations will be uncovered during that process?Even if Brady doesn`t win in court Goodell will be done if it goes.The league office messed this up from jump.

  57. Gentlemen, you are all missing the big picture. By Goodell presiding over this it almost assures that Brady and company takes it to an appeal court. If you think the court system is quick, it isn’t.
    Brady will not be under center till at least week 7. He can’t play until his suspension has been finally dealt with. As a lot of you like to say…Book it!!!

  58. first time that I’m rooting for Goodell… don’t let the patriots win this one i hate em

  59. Judge to Well$ : Mr. Well$, as an “Impartial” attorney, you threw out Scientific Law and evidence that exonerates the Patriots – WHY ???

    Well$ to Judge : Goodell told me to do it.

  60. j0esixpack says:
    May 15, 2015 11:59 AM
    jf203 says: Joe..have another 6 pack…Goodell is not on trial..BRADY AND PATS are show the supporting evidence of your innocence or shut UP and go home…
    =========================

    I beg to differ – just wait and see

    Again, the only way the actual evidences suggests deflation beyond what the Laws of Physics says there should be is if Wells and Goodell arbitrarily assme that the lead official Anderson is wrong about his “best recollection”

    Why would anyone accept Anderson’s best recollection for EVERYTHING ELSE but then reject it on the pivotal point of the entire investigation unless they had pre-determined what they wanted the outcome to be?

    Goodell is very much “on trial” here (though you realize that this is not a trial, nor does the NFL have supoena power – and thus an order to hand over all cellphone and emails is an “unreasonable request” itself

    Here again, Goodell and Wells make an unreasonable request specifically knowing that Brady would reject it – thus they could find him “guilty” of refusing a request, which they themselves would likely feel is unreasonable

    And of course, you never saw Goodell ask Ray Rice for HIS cellphone either, did you?

    Wonder why?”

    HEY 12 pack..

    There was video eveidence..cell had nothing to do with Ray rice..and for everyone thinking this is a LEGAL thing it is not..it is an investigation by the NFL..which does not have to go by Legal trail implications…NFl sets the rules….unless it becomes a criminal investigation..

  61. OK, OK, this is tantamount to the Pats going into court and saying, judge you can preside, as a matter of fact, nobody can preside over these proceedings,therefore you have to let my client go home. Nana, boo boo. Let’s call this the “Kitchen sink Defense”.

    Is this Kessler’s great contribution to Eddie Haskell’s Dream Team? Gotta give it to’em. It’s creative, but right in line with the explanation of “deflator”.

    In ‘ And Justice for All’, it was Al Pacino who said, “you’re out of order, you’re out of order, the whole trial is out of order …”? Anybody who reads that and doesn’t think … BIZARRE, doesn’t know the meaning of the word.

  62. hurrrrrrrdurrrrrrrrrhurrrrrdurrrr! hurrrrrrrduurrrrrrr? hurrdurr. hurr. durr. “hurrrdurrrr, hurdur hur dur.” Hurr hurdurrr. go pats!

    -Patriots fan

  63. All Roger has to do, is testify into his cell phone, then refuse to hand the phone over to the NFLPA.

    Quid pro quo as Capt. Kirk would say on Boston Legal.

  64. The league is bigger than any one team. Go ahead, bean-gorging mouth breathers. Have your fun. Your boy is done.

  65. Commentator said: “Before the Pats’ response I was pretty much on the fence because I thought it was such a petty issue to begin with. The response, however, was an absolute insult to the intelligence of the average fan.

    Just one example, do you realize the incredible coincidence needed to make the Pats’ claim on the origin of the name “deflator” even make the partially true? You are the only team in the world wrapped up in a massive scandal dubbed “deflate gate” and the investigators have narrowed it down to a few key targets. Amazingly, one of these targets already claimed the name “deflator,” not because he deflates the balls the investigators are examining, but because he’s losing weight ☺. NE is generally good with lies, but that was terrible!”

    First, you were never on the fence. Second, you obviously did not read the rebuttal. If you had, you would realize that the press is mischaracterizing the “deflator” issue. He called himself the deflator because he deflated balls for a living for Pete’s sake. (All balls must be deflated at least twice just to get to 12.5) The losing weight reference was only a secondary use of the name. Read the rebuttal so that you can comment intelligently please.

  66. I’m thinking how far a party in court usually gets when they try to make the judge testify in the case.

  67. “the Wells Report is not sufficient evidence to use in support of a suspension.”

    The only things missing were Brady’s truthful cooperation and cell phone data.

  68. I never thought that I would say this in a million years, but I agree with Goodell. That just shows how bad the Patriots have made themselves look.

  69. jf203 says: why cant everyone just be good guys..and ALL teams..PATS included..play by the rules…????
    ============================

    You need to include the officials in that too

    According to the Wells report the OFFICIALS were in more serious violation of THEIR OWN RULES going over their own PSI regulations by a whopping 3psi – yet everyone is making a big deal of a 1psi that the Laws of Physics easily explain

    According to the Wells report Brady was not happy that the Officials themselves were using game balls they over inflated to 16 psi

    I honestly would not be shocked if the Patriots and other NFL team equipment personnel took it upon themselves to stop the cheating of officials to deflate the balls to regulation

    That same exchange states that Brady wanted his footballs at 13 psi – right in the middle – and not under 12.5

    If the NFL takes a position that stopping the officials from cheating by returning the footballs to 13 psi is itself, cheating, so be it it

    But let’s just make sure Goodell is honest about that point

  70. this has the makings of a Brave Heart sequel…..

    BRADY GIBSON) on the Table

    Troy Vincent(KANGAROO COURT JUDGE): DO YOU CONFESSS??

    BRADY: FREEDOM!!!!!!

    GOODELL (LONGSHANKS): DYING FROM A FAR OF FAILED STING: COUGH COUGH GAG…

    GIZZEL(QUEEN) TO GOODELL: A SON NOT OF YOUR LOINS GROWS IN MY WOMB & YOU WILL NOT SIT ON THE THROWN FOR VERY MUCH LONGER, I SWEAR IT!!!

    JUST AWESOME!!!!

  71. “NFL FAN 18 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:28 AM
    Can the suspension be increased to 8 games on appeal?”

    ***********************

    It can become 16 games after a hit on the field.

  72. xavier179 says:
    May 15, 2015 12:07 PM

    Gentlemen, you are all missing the big picture. By Goodell presiding over this it almost assures that Brady and company takes it to an appeal court. If you think the court system is quick, it isn’t.
    Brady will not be under center till at least week 7. He can’t play until his suspension has been finally dealt with. As a lot of you like to say…Book it!!!

    ————

    Lawyers will file a motion to delay suspension until after his day in court.

    He can play until court decides. Unlike Rice, Peterson, Hardy, he is not on the commissioner’s exempt list and will not be placed there by the team. His issues are not criminal

  73. You know, I think Brady is guilty as sin in this case … but I would happily have him reinstated immediately if it would just stop this story from being THE ONLY THING DISCUSSED IN THE SPORTS MEDIA FOR THE LAST MONTH.

    Enough already.

  74. No proof????

    Ballboys texts and emails. Multiple calls back and forth from Brady to them after the scandal.? Brady lying, denying refusing to turn over his emails/phone? If you’re innocent, turn them over to make the NFL look stupid……….

    This was haunting when the story broke. Reporter: “Tom, are you a cheater”? Tom: “Well I dont believe I am”

    What??? If you were innocent would you respond that way?
    Heck no, you’d say ” No and I resent that question!”

    Implied in his answer was…well yes you all think its cheating, but I dont”…

    Its just the Patriot way….

  75. Tom Shady really screwed himself. He should of just manned up and admitted his wrong doings. He will lose his appeal and his suspension will be upheld. He’s going to look like a big idiot after all this. I hope he has good earplugs because fans are going to give him an earful about his cheating habits on the road this season. In the end, pats dont even make the playoffs. Book it.

  76. xavier179 says:
    May 15, 2015 12:07 PM
    Gentlemen, you are all missing the big picture. By Goodell presiding over this it almost assures that Brady and company takes it to an appeal court. If you think the court system is quick, it isn’t.
    Brady will not be under center till at least week 7. He can’t play until his suspension has been finally dealt with. As a lot of you like to say…Book it!!!

    ===

    You have it exactly backwards. The suspension can’t go into effect until the appeals are dealt with. If it gets close to the start of the season and this thing is still being litigated, Brady would be able to get an injunction to prevent the suspension from going into effect until the court case is settled.

  77. I think Goddell should be forced to hand over his cell phone to the NFLPA attorneys. And if he does not, then all of you are going to conclude that Goddell is guilty of misconduct.

    Right?

  78. At the end of the day, it’s a little shady that the NFLPA agreed to this system in the CBA and then is spending all of their time picking and choosing favorable judges to try and overturn something they agreed to.

  79. quagmate says:
    May 15, 2015 11:36 AM
    Everyone who has fought the NFL has lost. Every teams fans crow how they are going to take down Goodell, and every single time they lose.

    _______________________________________

    Actually, NO. Everyone that has fought the NFL in court has won. Adrain Peterson, Ray Rice, all the suspended Saints, the Williamses who play for the Viking in 2008, the USFL, and Al Davis won TWICE!

  80. as a pats fan , if the league wants to give the pats some small punishment for the guy going to the bathroom with the balls fine , but to fake a report like thet is beyond embarassing . this isn’t over with this appeal the pats and tom should sue the league for hurting their reputation . its laughable that goodell thinks he can get away with overseeing the appeal . #GoodellMustGo #FREEBRADY

  81. He did nothing wrong and there is no evidence any air was removed from the balls.

    Brady and his team are gonna take the nfl to the woodshed

  82. One year from now:

    Goodell has gone down in flames in a vote of no confidence, initiated by Bob Kraft. The Patriots meanwhile finish their undefeated Season, garnering a 5th Superbowl championship while Bill and Tom ride off into the sunset of retirement.

  83. If Walt Anderson used the gauge he says he used the the Patriots should be 100 percent exonerated because the halftime measurements with that gauge were right were they were supposed to be.

    If Walt Anderson used the other gauge that means the balls were about .4 to .5 psi lower than would be predicted. That would mean the balls were approximately 4% less pressure than ideal gas would predict.

    It is therefore the hypothesis of the haters that Brady instructed McNally to remove 0.4ish psi or 4% of the pressure from the footballs and that he was able to do so in 90 seconds in a bathroom with precision (all balls were roughly the same).

    To me the first hypothesis is much simpler and more plausible than the second hypothesis which basically involves an elaborate plan and strains credulity. Who would even care about 4% difference in pressure?????

  84. clam says:
    May 15, 2015 11:51 AM

    zachari14 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:26 AM
    I am astounded at how many Pats fans think Goodell is out to get the Patriots… What commissioner in his right mind would want this shadow over the league or to have one of it’s best players suspended for the first game? Do you think he wanted to fight his buddy Kraft?

    Obviously there is enough guilt that Goodell felt like this was the very least he could do. I hope you people clamoring for a court case actually get one.

    The NFLs counter-suit will have subpoena power for Tom’s phone records. That’s when the touchdown comes!
    _______________
    Answer this question then…why did the NFL, knowing the PSI’s of the football were not 2 PSI’s under as Mortenson reported, allow that rumor to persist for four months? Why did they not come out and say “that’s false”? As we learned the balls were barely a pound under. Why when they NFL sent a letter to the Patriots back in March with the actual PSI readings did they ask the Patriots not to release the PSI findings until the Well’s report?

    ——–

    they had to sign a confidentiality agreement before they could get a copy of the actual halftime PSI readings.

    yet, it’s no problem leaking wrong info to the press.

  85. If this goes to court, I’d be really interested to find out why the Wells team decided to find fault with the Patriots despite a total lack of evidence.

    My best guess is that they figured that they had to find something after 3 months and however many millions of dollars, and they didn’t want to ignore a “deflator” text, so rather than come back with the right conclusion (it’s inconclusive), they went with the one that they thought they would get slammed the least for. Notice how they are definitive in every judgement.

    1. The balls were absolutely deflated (99.6% chance according to the report, even though the evidence that they were deflated at all is extremely weak and inconclusive – well below 50%)
    2. The Patriots more likely than not did it. (If you can prove #1, I’d give you #2 because of means/motive/opportunity and a lack of anyone else having access…but they didn’t prove #1. Not even close)
    3. Brady more likely than not was aware of it, despite no evidence suggesting that he asked them to deflate balls illegally or had a preference below the legal limit.
    4. Belichick and Kraft had no evidence to indicate they were involved.

    All of those are definitive findings of fact. They were too afraid to admit that their investigation didn’t have solid conclusions, so they made them up.

  86. I wish the haters would stop and analyze things honestly. The issue of Brady’s cell phone is misleading. He failed to give up his personal cell information but the texts in question to Jastremski and McNally are already on their phones…..there will be no new revelations here.

    I am not a lawyer but find t difficult to understand how Goodell can hear the appeal when he announced when the punishment was announced that he was part of the decision.

    Wells found no evidence to suggest Brady ordered anything and the suppositions regarding McNally’s texts to Jastremski are arguably vague when related to Brady’s actual involvement.

    The entire pressure argument is without merit since their is no baseline and there still exists a difference of opinion on what gauges were used.

    I know the haters want Brady and the Pats to be crucified but the NFL has no real case just conjecture. This would never happen under adult supervision…The NFL is a mess.

  87. One thing I haven’t heard mentioned. Why were the footballs inflated to 13 psi at halftime when 12.5 is legal and Brady’s preference?

  88. baddegg says:
    May 15, 2015 12:31 PM

    I think Goddell should be forced to hand over his cell phone to the NFLPA attorneys. And if he does not, then all of you are going to conclude that Goddell is guilty of misconduct.

    Right?

    —————————————–

    You do know that Roger turn over his phone in the Ray Rice appeal, Right?

  89. I get this sinking feeling that Brady is a sociopath. His glib affect regarding wrongdoing (even if he was innocent, it would have been different). His single minded focus on personal success (treatment of backup qb and young qb’s asking for advice). When he does show ‘good boy’ traits, it’s for personal gain (one of the guys with the o’line who protects his ass). One doesn’t even need to dig into his personal life, and how he’s burned people there.

  90. What’s the definition of cooperating with the league’s investigation? McNally was interviewed 4 times. The last one, by Wells, lasted 7 hours and included 4 lawyers who were aggressively questioning “the deflator.” According to their own rules, they had no grounds for another interview. Pats offered to help arrange something via phone. Somehow, that’s not cooperation? Re: Brady’s phone — is handing over your phone really cooperation? Is that a rule? What about his financial records which could be used to prove payments to the ball guys? How about his wife’s phone and financials because it’s a commonly used tactic by criminals to hide behind their wife or family member’s identities? Wells just kept asking and fishing until someone said ‘no’ and then made it an issue of cooperation. Wells included private messages about McNally’s mother in his report for no other reason than to make McNally look bad. You really think Brady’s privacy would be respected? What if he’s having an affair? What if his hair replacement doctor is on speed dial? You don’t think that would be front and center in the Wells report?

  91. zachari14 says:

    May 15, 2015 11:26 AM

    I am astounded at how many Pats fans think Goodell is out to get the Patriots… What commissioner in his right mind would want this shadow over the league or to have one of it’s best players suspended for the first game?
    ————————-
    …The same guy who allowed the game to be played with “allegedy” under inflated balls.

  92. all of the dirty bottom dwellers of pats nations deserve all of this. stained and tainted franchise year after year is a skidmark on the league.

  93. During the November 30th game between the Packers and the Patriots, the @patriots twitter account at 5:56 pm tweeted: “After review, Jordy Nelson’s 45-yard touchdown stands & the Packers make it 23-14 with 14 seconds to go in the half.” According the the Wells Report (page 87), McNally sent the following text to Jastremski approximately 5 minutes later (6:01:08pm): “Deflate and give somebody that jkt”. This was a road game. McNally does not travel with the Patriots. It strains credulity that McNally was not watching the game at the time.

  94. This whole thing is just part of the NFL’s quest to be relevant in the news for 52 weeks/year. Notice how the whole thing came out right in between the draft and minicamps. Last year, it was domestic violence charges, the year before that it was locker room bullying. Next year it will be something else, maybe at the expense of YOUR team.

  95. cornerstone2001 says:
    May 15, 2015 12:28 PM
    No proof????

    Ballboys texts and emails. Multiple calls back and forth from Brady to them after the scandal.? Brady lying, denying refusing to turn over his emails/phone? If you’re innocent, turn them over to make the NFL look stupid……….

    This was haunting when the story broke. Reporter: “Tom, are you a cheater”? Tom: “Well I dont believe I am”

    What??? If you were innocent would you respond that way?
    Heck no, you’d say ” No and I resent that question!”

    Implied in his answer was…well yes you all think its cheating, but I dont”…

    Its just the Patriot way….

    *******************

    You conveniently forgot the part where he says he never altered the balls in any way nor did he have anyone else do it for him…

    Same press conference… Like Ted Wells – you grasp at straws… shameful.

  96. Goodell has gone down in flames in a vote of no confidence, initiated by Bob Kraft. The Patriots meanwhile finish their undefeated Season, garnering a 5th Superbowl championship while Bill and Tom ride off into the sunset of retirement.
    ———————–

    This final part assumes 3 things:
    1. Your Daddy (Giants) aren’t in the SB.
    2. The NFC Championship doesn’t contain a meltdown by the superior team, and 50% of the winning’s team strongest unit is barely able to play.
    3. The Patriot’s don’t return to their pre-deflation fumble statistics.

    Other than that, it will be a cakewalk

  97. What does JKT stand for? According to allacronyms. com/ JKT, one meaning is “Just Kill Time”. Interpretation: “Deflate [the balls] and give somebody that [the balls]. [Just Kill Time].” In other words, McNally suggested to Jastremski he should tamper with the balls during halftime to enable a fumble-resistant running strategy by the Patriots to keep the ball out of Aaron Rodgers hands in the second half.

  98. Of this halftime text message, the Patriot rebuttal on May 14th claimed: “This banter, and Mr. McNally’s goal of losing weight, meant Mr. McNally was the “deflator.” However, the syntax of McNally’s text shows him directing Jastremski to deflate, not himself. This is an illogical conclusion.

  99. cmsfl says:
    May 15, 2015 12:47 PM
    baddegg says:
    May 15, 2015 12:31 PM

    I think Goddell should be forced to hand over his cell phone to the NFLPA attorneys. And if he does not, then all of you are going to conclude that Goddell is guilty of misconduct.

    Right?

    —————————————–

    You do know that Roger turn over his phone in the Ray Rice appeal, Right?

    —————–

    Yeah, and Rice won the appeal!

  100. An inference that McNally was refering to his weight loss during a game where the 9-2 Patriots, in the midst of a 7 game win streak, are losing to the 8-3 Packers, is implausible.

    An inference that McNally actually disclosed by this text what Warren Sharpe suggested was a “revolutionary in-house way to protect the ball” from fumbles is plausible.

  101. Well this just made Goodell’s job harder. Brady just laid down the cards that Goodell is going to need to appoint an independent arbiter or they are off to court.

    It is kinda hard to testify in a hearing that you are presiding over.

    It is an interesting point though. The CBA says that Goodell can appoint someone to hear the appeal not deliver the punishment.

  102. If the suspension is upheld, which it will, Brady will more than likely take it to court to get an injunction, so he can play. The NFL will not stand for that, so they will appeal. On and on. Remember the Starcaps and Williams thing? This time it won’t be what you put in your body, but what you put in your phone. The NFL will not back down. If you think they will, you’re naive. Eventually, it will get to that last court case where the phone will be played.

    All this is moot more than likely, as it looks like Brady cannot let the phone contents to be revealed. He is making it too difficult for himself. He’s not Sir Thomas.

  103. swineflooo says:
    May 15, 2015 12:43 PM
    Roger goodell is gonna be bagging groceries at a local 7/11 soon

    ——————————————————————–
    That’s not true, they usually don’t bag the groceries at the 7/11, but you may find him bagging at Publix soon.

  104. The commissioner’s office has to be changed. The NFLPA should have counseled Brady from the get go, they too need changing, the owners need a new credo that does not involve money. The whole entire system is corrupted.

  105. All of these long winded posts…it’s wishful thinking that this will turn out good for Brady. It’s hope your holding on too! Brady, McNally & Jastremski will be requested testify during the Goodell presided arbitration…once that happens the ship will sink. This attack on a “technicality” is a life jacket for Brady’s hopes.

  106. Rule 2 clearly states that the Head Referee is the sole judge of compliance for the footballs. Yet, at halftime, he did not participate is the ball measurement in any way. Alternate refs and some guy from the NFL office tested the balls and added air to just the Patriot balls. So, we can be ticky-tacky about following the letter of the law or not. In the NFL’s case, they get to choose which aspect of the rules they follow and which they don’t. Everyone wants to hang Brady for .3-.4 PSI in the worst case scenario (depending on which gauge is used) even though there’s no evidence. That’s ticky-tack. But following the actual protocols for measuring the balls — meh, we do whatever we want.

  107. Anderson says the Patriots balls were at 12.5 and the Colts at 13.0. Wells Report accepts this as fact without any record.

    Anderson says he used the gauge with the higher PSI reading for his pre-game inspection. Wells Report disregards this? WHY???

    If he used the higher testing gauge, then you can throw out all the lower of the two numbers at the halftime inspection.

    When you do, the Patriots PSI readings are right in line with the predicted range of natural deflation.

  108. Hell yes.
    Drag this travesty into the light of day so all sides of the story are known.

    I’m tired of the willfully ignorant parroting nonsense.

    In fact the ideal result will be the league, in a court of actual freaking law, defending their use of the Wells report to assassinate a man’s character.

    You can guess how I think that will turn out.
    Even if people disagree with me about what results to expect, I hope they would appreciate a chance to have their suspicions proven beyond a reasonable doubt.

  109. Wells Report says that fat boy locker room attendant Jim McNally went into a bathroom and deflated all the Patriots balls in an astonishing 1:40.

    Yet, the report fails to produce a comparable sample size of Patriots footballs to Colts footballs. They tested every Patriots football but only 4 Colts balls?

    Why? because the “ran out of time”, funny how fat slob McNally can deflate 12 balls in 1:40, but they couldn’t spare what 45-55 seconds to provide us with the most important piece of information in knowing if the balls were even deflated or if both sets of balls naturally deflated at about the same rate due to weather conditions.

  110. Brady can sue, win, get his suspension overturned and the draft picks returned to his team. He will still be viewed as a cheat and liar. His legacy is ruined. He is the Lance Armstrong of football.

  111. Report comment
    markprzyb says:
    May 15, 2015 1:00 PM
    swineflooo says:
    May 15, 2015 12:43 PM
    Roger goodell is gonna be bagging groceries at a local 7/11 soon

    ——————————————————————–
    That’s not true, they usually don’t bag the groceries at the 7/11, but you may find him bagging at Publix soon.

    Roger GOODELL made more money last year than anyone on this board in their lifetime…he will be fine no matter what

  112. Kingmj4891 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:51 AM

    The Pats are talking a hard game but it will never go to actual court because then Kraft, Brady, and Belichick would have to testify not only on Deflategate but on Spygate and other allegations of cheating as well
    =====

    Why on earth would they have to do that?

  113. nflpoker says:
    May 15, 2015 1:08 PM
    Welcome to the WWF.

    NO THE PCL..PATRIOTS CHEATING LEAGUE

  114. Wells Report says that fat boy locker room attendant Jim McNally went into a bathroom and deflated all the Patriots balls in an astonishing 1:40.

    Yet, the report fails to produce a comparable sample size of Patriots footballs to Colts footballs. They tested every Patriots football but only 4 Colts balls?

    Why? because the “ran out of time”, funny how fat slob McNally can deflate 12 balls in 1:40, but they couldn’t spare what 45-55 seconds to provide us with the most important piece of information in knowing if the balls were even deflated or if both sets of balls naturally deflated at about the same rate due to weather conditions.
    ———————

    Umm, because one thing takes a considerably longer amount of time to do than the other?!!

  115. Do you really think Goodell will testify? He doesn’t have to. Goodell has ’em by the b@lls. They won’t be able to squirm free. Otherwise,

    OOOOOOOOOOOOUUUUUUUUUCCCCCHHHH!!!

  116. It is astonishing to see and hear the bluster emanating from the NFLPA, Patriots, and Brady. In another context, one might say squealing. The arrogant response to the “deflategate” investigation is the primary reason the penalty was so significant. And, of course, the Patriots’ history of cheating under Kraft/Belichik. Caught red-handed again.

  117. If you read the Pats’ report, which included a breakdown from Nobel Prize winning chemist Roderick MacKinnon,
    or the recent article, by Drew Fustin, who has a Ph.D is Physics from the University of Chicago and wrote his dissertation on air pressure, then you understand the truth about this whole mess. You’re aware of the science.

    Basically, that the conclusions drawn in the Wells report were INCORRECT. That, even though we don’t have all the evidence, the evidence we have supports the Patriots claim that there was NO DEFLATION AT ALL.

    That the changes in the Patriots’ football, even as compared to the changes in the Colts footballs, were entirely consistent with the Ideal Gas Law.

    In other words, that Jim McNally didn’t deflate the balls in that bathroom.

  118. The real Brady punishment will come when he faces..

    WILKERSON
    RICHARDSON
    HARRISON
    WILLIAMS
    DAVIS
    HARRIS
    REVIS
    CROMARTIE
    PRYOR
    MAULDIN
    SKRINE
    GILCREST
    COPLES
    PACE

  119. After reading the NFLPA’s Appeal Letter

    The NFLPA clearly has Rodger on his inability under the CBA to have delegated punishment decisions to Troy Vincent. So NFLPA have the ability to have him and Vincent testify as to his breach of the terms of the CBA.

    Either Rodger has #1-an I am GOD complex,or #2 -he has knowingly set it up to be forced to accept an independent judge and being not responsible if Brady wins.

    I vote for # 1 with #2 happening as unintended consequences.

    If Brady sues as with other players he gets to play while his case is open. The question is if he looses games at what point will his suspension begin?

  120. alpha150 says:

    “Of this halftime text message, the Patriot rebuttal on May 14th claimed: “This banter, and Mr. McNally’s goal of losing weight, meant Mr. McNally was the “deflator.” However, the syntax of McNally’s text shows him directing Jastremski to deflate, not himself. This is an illogical conclusion”

    First, you purposely only refer to part of the text and not the whole text… but back to your charge…

    So the part-time guy, back in New Hampshire, texted Jastremski, the full-time guy, and ordered him to deflate the balls during the game on the road? Now, that’s illogical. The Patriot haters have now become enveloped in some kind of mass psychosis.

  121. Just read it… loved this footnote from the appeal letter to Troy Vincent:

    “1 We also note that one arbitrator has previously found that you, in particular, are unfamiliar with proper NFL discipline procedures and have no role in imposing discipline. Peterson Art. 46 Appeal
    at 7.”

    Ouch, Baby. Ouch.

  122. jnasty5000akajungguns says: May 15, 2015 11:49 AM

    So the merits of the appeal have nothing to do with the case but rather how the punishment was delivered? #tomshady
    ****
    If this is the main point of the letter. Then it is just more of the same.

    Cheat
    Lie
    Obstruct

    The pats way.

  123. 6ball says:
    May 15, 2015 11:26 AM

    In NFL terms, the league has turned the ball over and now it’s first and goal Patriots from the one

    Yes! But for God’s sake don’t pass the ball.

  124. alpha150 says:

    “Of this halftime text message, the Patriot rebuttal on May 14th claimed: “This banter, and Mr. McNally’s goal of losing weight, meant Mr. McNally was the “deflator.” However, the syntax of McNally’s text shows him directing Jastremski to deflate, not himself. This is an illogical conclusion”

    First, you purposely only refer to part of the text and not the whole text… but back to your charge…

    So the part-time guy, back in New Hampshire, texted Jastremski, the full-time guy, and ordered him to deflate the balls during the game on the road? Now, that’s illogical. The Patriot haters have now become enveloped in some kind of mass psychosis.
    —————————————-
    The Data doesn’t even prove deflation ever occured outside of natural deflation caused by Ideal Gas Law, so the texts are irrelevant.

  125. lukedunphysscienceproject says:
    May 15, 2015 1:12 PM
    Kingmj4891 says:
    May 15, 2015 11:51 AM

    The Pats are talking a hard game but it will never go to actual court because then Kraft, Brady, and Belichick would have to testify not only on Deflategate but on Spygate and other allegations of cheating as well
    =====

    Why on earth would they have to do that?

    ______________________________

    Because it shows the culture and history of cheating by the Patriots. Which is relevant to the case because if they cheated once the are more likely to do it again. And it can only help the NFL by discrediting the Patriots and making their weak excuses even weaker.

  126. I have a very simple question. In the letter where does it say brady is in fact innocent and had nothing to do with deflategate? It doesn’t say it. I find that very telling.

  127. NFLPA needs to do a much better job itself in taking care of players.

    it’s easy to embrace a superstar who is worried about his football reputation and future marketability. It’s another thing to take care of the lesser known and unknown players who face real problems and hardship.

    The NFLPA is a joke of a union

  128. 70 percent of NFL fans believe Brady is a cheater. Look it up and stay in denial pats fans smh

  129. “That the changes in the Patriots’ football, even as compared to the changes in the Colts footballs, were entirely consistent with the Ideal Gas Law. ”
    ****
    Which breaks that very law. I find it incredulous that anyone of prominence would even suggest such a thing.

  130. Two things…

    1. the other owners can’t be happy – that because of Goodell’s incompetence – he is giving the players and union more leverage/power. A bad legal precedent to set.

    2. The best part of the appeal letter is the footnote to referring to Troy Vincent:

    “We also note that one arbitrator had perviously found that you in particular, are unfamiliar with proper NFL discipline procedures and have no role in imposing discipline.”

  131. Walt Anderson says he used the higher testing gauge for pre-game measurements. For some reason Well’s wants us to discount this. You shouldn’t discount this while accepting his recollection of the undocumented pre-game PSI levels.

    Anyway, here are the only true Patriots ball PSI level you can use for comparison, assuming that they all started at exactly 12.5.

    11.8
    11.2
    11.5
    11
    11.45
    11.95
    12.3
    11.55
    11.35
    10.9
    11.35

    Exponent, the NFL hired consultant says that based on Ideal Gas Law, Patriots balls starting at 12.5 should be between 11.52 and 11.32.

    Well 8 of 11 are right in that range, and the average of all 11 is 11.49.

    That is indisputable evidence that deflation was natural.

    This would be even further proven if we had a comparable Colts sample size, but the league only tested 4 Colts balls.

    Why? because they “ran out of time”.

    So McNally deflated all the Patriots balls in a bathroom in 1:40, but the NFL could spare like 45-55 seconds to test the rest of the Colts balls?

    Case closed, Pats win the appeal easily.

  132. mikermiker says:
    May 15, 2015 1:39 PM

    70 percent of NFL fans believe Brady is a cheater.

    ——
    too bad only 30% of NFL fans are right

  133. holeinone09 says:
    May 15, 2015 1:36 PM
    I have a very simple question. In the letter where does it say brady is in fact innocent and had nothing to do with deflategate? It doesn’t say it. I find that very telling.

    ____________________________
    maybe with the texts showing Brady instructed anyone to deflate footballs below 12.5 PSI’s or after the Refs inspect the balls make sure they are not over 12.5 PSI’s.

  134. This whole thing could have been over with before it began if indeed the Patriots deflated footballs. Once the NFL heard prior to the AFC Championship that the Patriots might have deflated footballs, Roger could have said ” Hey guys, we heard that you might have deflated footballs. We have the right to check the game balls at any point during the game. If they check under the spec’s, you will be disciplined accordingly” I bet all balls would have checked out just fine for that game and future ones and this whole mess would be a non-issue.

  135. mikermiker says:
    May 15, 2015 1:39 PM

    70 percent of NFL fans believe Brady is a cheater. Look it up and stay in denial pats fans smh
    ————————-
    Oh Ok, so if the public hates the Patriots we should just ignore the science that exonerates the Patriots?

  136. holeinone09 says:
    May 15, 2015 1:38 PM

    The letter doesn’t say brady is innocent. why not?

    You have to read the whole letter not skim it.

    Read bottom of page 2 Large footnote #2

  137. mrmcdougle says:
    May 15, 2015 1:19 PM

    Wells Report says that fat boy locker room attendant Jim McNally went into a bathroom and deflated all the Patriots balls in an astonishing 1:40.

    Yet, the report fails to produce a comparable sample size of Patriots footballs to Colts footballs. They tested every Patriots football but only 4 Colts balls?

    Why? because the “ran out of time”, funny how fat slob McNally can deflate 12 balls in 1:40, but they couldn’t spare what 45-55 seconds to provide us with the most important piece of information in knowing if the balls were even deflated or if both sets of balls naturally deflated at about the same rate due to weather conditions.
    ———————

    Umm, because one thing takes a considerably longer amount of time to do than the other?!!
    _________________________________

    Actually it doesn’t take much time at all to gauge the pressure in a ball. There was no excuse for not measuring the levels of all the footballs.

  138. rob471773 says:
    May 15, 2015 1:43 PM

    Walt Anderson says he used the higher testing gauge for pre-game measurements. For some reason Well’s wants us to discount this. You shouldn’t discount this while accepting his recollection of the undocumented pre-game PSI levels.

    Anyway, here are the only true Patriots ball PSI level you can use for comparison, assuming that they all started at exactly 12.5.

    11.8
    11.2
    11.5
    11
    11.45
    11.95
    12.3
    11.55
    11.35
    10.9
    11.35

    Exponent, the NFL hired consultant says that based on Ideal Gas Law, Patriots balls starting at 12.5 should be between 11.52 and 11.32.

    Well 8 of 11 are right in that range, and the average of all 11 is 11.49.

    That is indisputable evidence that deflation was natural.

    This would be even further proven if we had a comparable Colts sample size, but the league only tested 4 Colts balls.

    Why? because they “ran out of time”.

    So McNally deflated all the Patriots balls in a bathroom in 1:40, but the NFL could spare like 45-55 seconds to test the rest of the Colts balls?

    Case closed, Pats win the appeal easily.

    ———–

    actually, only 5 of the Patriots balls were within that range. However 3 of them are ABOVE that range. So that cancels out the 3 that were below, Unless Wells/Exponent think McNally ADDED air to those balls while in the bathroom. But they didn’t run any simulations on that.

  139. mototax says:
    May 15, 2015 1:10 PM
    Brady can sue, win, get his suspension overturned and the draft picks returned to his team. He will still be viewed as a cheat and liar. His legacy is ruined. He is the Lance Armstrong of football.
    _______________

    Once this is all overturned, it will be, at most, a footnote in some loser’s jealous memory in 2 years.

  140. mikermiker says:
    May 15, 2015 1:39 PM

    70 percent of NFL fans believe Brady is a cheater. Look it up and stay in denial pats fans smh
    _______________________________

    And once upon a time even more than 70% of the world thought the world was flat. And then there was evidence found to the contrary.

    And Exponent would tell you today that the world is flat if that’s what their client wanted top prove.

  141. I would like the texts of Goddell, Grigson and Kensil made public. Also, the ref that overinflated the ball in the Jets game to 16PSI. We need to know why that was done. its cheating.

  142. Okay Patriots* fans, just quit already with excuses. Everyone knows they cheated except delusional fans, there is nothing you can say, it’s over, move on, nobody is buying anything you or the team is selling. Just pretend nothing ever happened, you’ll be fine, the excuses are embarrassing, a guy calls himself the deflator for losing weight who is also texting about air pressure and just happens to be involved in something dubbed #Deflategate, that is priceless that any fan would buy that. At some point you have to look at your team and go,Man, I love my team but even I can’t get on board with that nonsense.

  143. kevincowboy says:
    May 15, 2015 11:45 AM

    The real problem here is that he refused to cooperate with the league investigation. That alone is grounds for a 4 game suspension. In fact, I’m surprised it wasn’t more.
    __________________________________

    If not turning over a personal cell phone is grounds for 4 games how come the Chargers were only fined $20k for not handing over the “Stickum towel” when directed to by league officials?

  144. mikecpeterson says:
    May 15, 2015 1:50 PM
    This whole thing could have been over with before it began if indeed the Patriots deflated footballs. Once the NFL heard prior to the AFC Championship that the Patriots might have deflated footballs, Roger could have said ” Hey guys, we heard that you might have deflated footballs. We have the right to check the game balls at any point during the game. If they check under the spec’s, you will be disciplined accordingly” I bet all balls would have checked out just fine for that game and future ones and this whole mess would be a non-issue.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++

    Good point. The real issue here is the lack of procedural control over something that appears to be very important to the NFL. Using certified gauges and documenting results is very simple to implement.

    The truth is the NFL runs a sloppy ship and should step up and say “we havent done a good job of enforcing this in the past, its important, this is what we are going to do different going forward.”

    Instead they grandstand and shoot themselves in the foot by going after an owner that has no plans to back down.

  145. mikecpeterson says:
    May 15, 2015 1:50 PM

    This whole thing could have been over with before it began if indeed the Patriots deflated footballs. Once the NFL heard prior to the AFC Championship that the Patriots might have deflated footballs, Roger could have said ” Hey guys, we heard that you might have deflated footballs. We have the right to check the game balls at any point during the game. If they check under the spec’s, you will be disciplined accordingly” I bet all balls would have checked out just fine for that game and future ones and this whole mess would be a non-issue.
    _______________________________

    If they started at 12.5 they would have been under if checked during the game. That point has been made clear regardless of whether you believe Exponent or MacKinnon. You’re obviously not paying attention.

  146. Through all of this I can’t stop thinking about the Hoody. I get the sense he no longer has the same feelings over deflategate he once did.

    Brady humiliated him, the team and cast doubt on his legacy.

    He’s going to make Jimmy G work and Brady will suffer the same fate as Bledsoe.

  147. There is little doubt the bulk of the punishment surrounds the failure to cooperate requirements. I think way too much emphasis is on Balls, science, etc.

    While this matter and evidence proof requirement is similar to civil law cases, the NFL does not have subpoena power as you would have in civil court. In court, if people have records that can be pertinent to the case, a subpoena is issued. That does not exist here, hence, the NFL requirement to be cooperative in investigations is all the more important. I am guessing that is why they ask this of all the teams and all the players that are part of their proprietary enterprise called the NFL.

    So Tom Brady’s failure to cooperate (provide phone records) in a venue that he does not have to worry about subpoena’s really does limit the investigation. And given the other records from McNally and Jastremski, like it or not, phone records are relevant. So whether those of you pro-Patriot people want to admit it or not, with the other text messages obtained, and the somewhat obtuse meaning of a few, Brady’s information was essential to the investigation. So not cooperating this was huge impairment to the investigation.

    So fast forward to those of you wanting Goodell out of hearing an appeal. Remember this is not a court of law. This is a proprietary business with owners and a labor agreement that defines the rules. NOT A COURT. That’s what’s funny about those of you complaining about Goodell presiding over this. Yes, if it was a court proceeding Gooddell would have a conflict. But then again, if it was a court proceeding, Mr. Brady would be compelled by subpoena to have his phone, text, and email records provided. Be careful what you all ask for here.

    If I were Gooddell, I’d offer to recuse myself on THE absolute condition that Brady turns over all records. The prior deal to provide prior reviewed transcripts would be off the table.

  148. jf203 says:
    May 15, 2015 1:25 PM
    The real Brady punishment will come when he faces..

    WILKERSON
    RICHARDSON
    HARRISON
    WILLIAMS
    DAVIS
    HARRIS
    REVIS
    CROMARTIE
    PRYOR
    MAULDIN
    SKRINE
    GILCREST
    COPLES
    PACE

    ************

    How could you not laugh at this one… ?

    These guys have such a great history of winning… Oh no, how is anyone going to beat them.

  149. Someone on here just commented something wrong (ok dont laugh). The Wells report even concedes the balls would have dropped around 1.1 or so PSI due to Gas Behavior in atmospheric conditions (so called ideal gas law).

    The other .4 or so in the second measurements would be what would have to have been removed by McNally.

    This small amount as my previous post indicated is about 4% of the pressure difference and could eaisly be accounted for my measurement error the likely culprit in this case being differently calibrated gauges.

    Another question may be if the Colts balls started around 13 psi, ( a big if given numbers not recorded). Why were they around 12.4 at halftime instead of 11.9. The answer is the same: MORE MEASUREMENT ERROR.

    In this case the culprit would be the timing of measurements. Again the Wells Report even acknowledges that a few minutes difference would raise pressure in balls about 0.7 psi. This explains the difference. Pesky old Measurment error.

  150. its embarassing that the wells report bad science that there is missing air from the balls then goes on to base every text for months before intrepreted thru faulty science . not only did the patriots prove it was bad a nobel prize winner proved it was bad . if goodell bases any patriots or brady punishment on this report it will be the biggest railroad job in the history of sports .

  151. cmsfl says:
    May 15, 2015 12:47 PM
    baddegg says:
    May 15, 2015 12:31 PM

    I think Goddell should be forced to hand over his cell phone to the NFLPA attorneys. And if he does not, then all of you are going to conclude that Goddell is guilty of misconduct.

    Right?

    —————————————–

    You do know that Roger turn over his phone in the Ray Rice appeal, Right?
    ————————————————-
    Yes, the one supplied by the NFL, NOT his personal cell phone.

  152. May 15, 2015 12:54 PM
    cornerstone2001 says:
    May 15, 2015 12:28 PM
    No proof????

    Ballboys texts and emails. Multiple calls back and forth from Brady to them after the scandal.? Brady lying, denying refusing to turn over his emails/phone? If you’re innocent, turn them over to make the NFL look stupid……….

    This was haunting when the story broke. Reporter: “Tom, are you a cheater”? Tom: “Well I dont believe I am”

    What??? If you were innocent would you respond that way?
    Heck no, you’d say ” No and I resent that question!”

    Implied in his answer was…well yes you all think its cheating, but I dont”…

    Its just the Patriot way….

    *******************

    You conveniently forgot the part where he says he never altered the balls in any way nor did he have anyone else do it for him…

    Same press conference… Like Ted Wells – you grasp at straws… shameful.

    …You are a shameful homer. Brady lied clear as day. Give him a lie detector test. I bet a billion dollars he fails

  153. Goodell Is an agent of chaos. In any situation, he will make the choice that generates the most controversy. We have all seen this, time and again. If he were a CEO the shareholders would have already revolted.

  154. Brady is guilty and lied. Not saying other teams dont cheat, but the Pats got caught

  155. The Patriots are claiming the term “Deflator” was used to reference Jim McNally losing weight, not deflate footballs.

    Lies upon lies….

  156. alpha150 says:
    May 15, 2015 12:55 PM
    What does JKT stand for? According to allacronyms. com/ JKT, one meaning is “Just Kill Time”. Interpretation: “Deflate [the balls] and give somebody that [the balls]. [Just Kill Time].” In other words, McNally suggested to Jastremski he should tamper with the balls during halftime to enable a fumble-resistant running strategy by the Patriots to keep the ball out of Aaron Rodgers hands in the second half.
    ——————————————————-
    Wow, you read all that from that text.I wonder what we would be able to say about you if we had some of your texts? What could be infer about you with partial texts?

    Basically, you can read into most texts whatever you want.

  157. colorinfusion says:
    May 15, 2015 3:31 PM
    alpha150 says:
    May 15, 2015 12:55 PM
    What does JKT stand for? According to allacronyms. com/ JKT, one meaning is “Just Kill Time”. Interpretation: “Deflate [the balls] and give somebody that [the balls]. [Just Kill Time].” In other words, McNally suggested to Jastremski he should tamper with the balls during halftime to enable a fumble-resistant running strategy by the Patriots to keep the ball out of Aaron Rodgers hands in the second half.
    ——————————————————-
    Wow, you read all that from that text.I wonder what we would be able to say about you if we had some of your texts? What could be infer about you with partial texts?

    Basically, you can read into most texts whatever you want.

    *****************

    I add… so this “… give somebody else that JKT” becomes “… give somebody else that just killing time.” Where do you loonies come up with this stuff?

  158. I hope Goodell has to testify. As much as I despise the man for what he has done, and continues to do, to the game, I do appreciate his ability to lie. It goes beyond compulsion. It’s like a superpower, along with his ability to sleep – through the suicides, through the destruction of an American institution, through the owing of everything he has to Sirhan Sirhan. It’s like watching the master at work.

  159. We are fighting over if there was a chance that there was a difference in 4% BALL PRESSURE. Think about this. Just plain laughable and pathetic. How did this happen???

    Thanks Sheriff Goodell!

    0.4 PSI HAHAHAHAHA the joke is on us

  160. This is going to be an example of how sometimes you can win but still lose. This argument of Brady’s has truth to it. But the only thing people hate more than a cheater is an unrepentant one and his image will not be helped by him arguing technicalities as opposed to apologizing, accepting his punishment and moving on.

  161. NE fans talking big again. Fact is Tom’s not beating anybody in any court without showing whats on that phone. Bench time Tom…deal with it.

  162. “Bottom line..if you are innocent..you say HERE ARE MY CELL PHONE TEXTS, MY CAR KEYS, MY COMPUTER< and GISELES PHONE"

    An enticing thought, but sadly I doubt she would take your, or my, call.

  163. The NFLPA has nobody but themselves to blame for this situation. During the last negotiation they should have addressed who hears appeals. The NFLPA was all about money in the negotiations from DeMaurice Smith to Drew Brees they were too busy trying to squeeze every last dollar out of the owners. If they had been willing to sacrifice a few dollars for things like who hears appeals, who levies suspensions, etc. they wouldn’t be here right now.

  164. No one cares what the NFLPA wants here. The Commissioner’s authority to hear and decide the arbitration was granted to him via collectively bargained terms. Just because the NFLPA wishes that it had not granted that is no reason to let that slimy organization weasel out of its own obligations. If the union wants to wrest away Goodell’s power next time around, it will have to make MAJOR concessions elsewhere…such as in free agency or franchise tagging rights.

  165. “Here are my cell phone texts!!”

    Who said that? I don’t know but I do know that Hillary C. didn’t say it.

    ‘The Strange Case of the Deflated Balls’

    BTW – The Pats won that game and they won the Super-Duper Bowl.

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