Seahawks can’t pay many (any) more guys

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Agent Russell Okung has his work cut out for him, if his goal is to keep his client in Seattle.

Peter King of TheMMQB.com has a sobering stat for the week, relating to the Seahawks. He shows that the franchise has nearly $100 million per year tied up in only 10 guys. That leaves roughly $50 million (in 2015) for paying the other 43 guys on the 53-man roster, along with all the other extra players who need to be signed as members of the active roster land on injured reserve.

Five of those players now have eight-figure annual averages, up from three only three days ago. Quarterback Russell Wilson’s average burden increased by an order of magnitude (nerd), from $1.542 million to $17.82 million. Cornerback Richard Sherman remains at $14 million per year, running back Marshawn Lynch moves to $10.8 million for 2015, linebacker Bobby Wagner has increased to $10.75 million (another order-of-magnitude move), and safety Earl Thomas remains at $10 million even.

Behind them are tight end Jimmy Graham ($9 million), defensive end Cliff Avril ($7.13 million), defensive end Michael Bennett ($7.13 million), safety Kam Chancellor ($7 million), and linebacker K.J. Wright ($6.75 million).

Bennett skipped much of the offseason program in an effort to get more money, and Chancellor was a surprise holdout for the start of training camp. Three days in, the holdout continues.

And that’s where team goals and individual needs conflict. Players always should go for every last dollar during careers of limited duration, even if the pursuit of every last dollar could land the player (or some of his teammates, like Tony McDaniel) elsewhere.

You’ve only got so much [cap room],” Sherman said Sunday, via Bob Condotta of the Seattle Times. “If it was like baseball we’d have quite a team.”

They still have quite a team. The challenge will be holding that team all together as guys clamor to get compensation that better reflects their perceived value, commitment, and sacrifice.

“He has taken a stand and I support him,” Sherman said regarding Chancellor. “He’s like a brother to me and when you take a stand like this, you don’t get a lot of support from the fans about honoring contracts. But we understand the things he goes through week in and week out and the trauma he puts his body through and the sacrifices he makes.”

Sherman pointed out that players constantly face very real risk of injury, and that Chancellor played in the Super Bowl with an MCL that was “80 percent torn.”

“It’s a 100 percent injury rate, as they have said so eloquently time after time,” Sherman said. “But that’s what you play for, guys play to win because we obviously play to win. The compensation is just something that comes with it and guys appreciate compensation, guys appreciate being taken care of.

“But there is always more. Kam is making $4.5 million this year. I mean, you can go down the list of guys making more than Kam Chancellor this year that are not better than Kam Chancellor in any way, stretch or form. But that’s unfortunate. So hopefully they can come together on some number.”

If they do, it’ll reduce the number available for the other 43 guys who make the 53-man roster. Which will force the Seahawks to rely on plenty of younger guys with low fixed incomes via the rookie wage scale, who eventually will be in position to earn more money from the Seahawks or someone else after putting in three or four years of high-level performance.

Of course, if/when that happens there’s a chance that the Seahawks will choose the younger stars over some of the 10 players currently accounting for nearly $100 million in cap space.

134 responses to “Seahawks can’t pay many (any) more guys

  1. …and you guys have been so right about Seahawks-related stuff so often before…smh

  2. Concerning yourself over what player x is making is showing you are worried about the wrong things. Concern yourself over your value to your team as priority one, not what some overpaid player on another team that lacks star power has to do to retain grade B talent.

  3. And this makes the NFL verrrrrrrry happy… the whole reason for free agency was to make bad teams more competitive and this is how… Player makes his value so high the cap wont allow a team to keep them… in turn theres no more “Dynasty teams”… just teams who draft really well and are able to win… sad but true

  4. Seahawks fans can brag all they want about “thinking” they are keeping that great team together. We will see how they play when they lose all of their linemen and pass rushers. Okung, Avril, and Bennet are easily gone. Chancellor too. The beginning of the end is when Wilson signed his contract

  5. This is the direction the NFL is going, and it dates back to when the Ravens won the Super Bowl 3 years ago. Teams will now have to load up and give themselves a window of a couple years to run for a title, and then eventually have to dismantle. The Seahawks are just about at that point now, and the Broncos won’t be too far behind.

  6. That’s a big problem for all NFL teams. The teams need about 28 really good players and 25 subs. If they can’t share the pot with the starters plus, then there is a caste system in place. The 43 players remaining for the Hawks must share the remaining $50 million. While nobody is crying a river, the math is easy, and if any of these players feel the need to be paid, play out the contract and FA.

  7. “Of course, if/when that happens there’s a chance that the Seahawks will choose the younger stars over some of the 10 players currently accounting for nearly $100 million in cap space.”

    Of course Lynch will be done be then, his 10+ mil will be free. Irvins 7+ mil will be gone nest season. Mabane probably played his last season this year and his 5.5 will be free. That alone freed up 22+ mils already and with the cap going up 10 mils every year that’s about a total of 32+ mil free to resign guys. New guys come in old guys go out thats how it works.

  8. There is one and only one team that has consistently put competitive squads on the field during the salary cap era. They did that by doing the opposite of what Seattle is doing.

  9. You know, there’s a strong argument in many instances that players should NOT “go for every dollar”. While there would always be at least some added risk, many players would be better off staying on a team with much better surrounding talent or whose scheme is a better fit, and who could even keep a player healthier. Even if the player gets paid less over a given contract, if he can get *another* contract at a good salary, one he otherwise might not get, then it would be worth it.

    Take DeMarco Murray as a potential example. With that Dallas scheme and OL, it’s safe to say that Murray would see his best production in Dallas, and that blocking (that often leaves him untouched for much of a run and rarely allows him to get lined up for a huge hit) would keep him healthier long term. Given that, and the fact that 2+ more strong seasons would leave him as something of a franchise icon, and another lucrative contract would likely wait at the end of the current one…not to mention the endorsements and other plus financial opportunities that comes from sticking with a team. He also would almost certainly avoid being cut early in his first post-FA contract.

    But on a lesser team, Murray could be exposed as not quite as good as he is paid, thereby lowering his future pay and perhaps getting him cut early (perhaps quite early). He might only see a portion of that “bigger” FA contract, perhaps even getting cut after one or two seasons, and the added pounding on his body might leave him injured or in a quicker decline, hurting his next contract, if there even is one. Note that in Murray’s case his higher bidder seems to be an excellent fit too, so this hypothetical might not come to pass for him, but it happens all the time.

    To play with some numbers, let’s say in “A” that a player “takes every dollar” and in “B” a player takes less but stays in a much better situation. The initial contracts might look like:
    A- 4 years, $10M AAV, half guaranteed
    B- 4 years, $6M AAV, half guaranteed

    For contract A, the player might walk away with as little as $20M after an early cut, make a few $M more in future contracts, and retire without receiving much love from any fan base. He might earn $22-$30M if things don’t go well in this lesser situation.

    For contract B, the player is much more likely to finish up the contract, receiving $24M total. He then gets a second 4 year contract, probably for at least a bit more with a steady profile and rising contracts. Assuming he gets at least half of that, he’s now at a total of $36M minimum, with the potential for a lot more, plus the love of a franchise he has stuck with and the extra endorsements that come with that, and a much better shot at *another* contract.

    In many cases, “taking every dollar” only guarantees you 10-50% more sure money, but with a concurrent much greater likelihood that there won’t be much more outside of that. A wise player should sometimes stick with the better fit/talent and the fan base he knows, as that could easily yield more money, plus the accolades of a more highly regarded career. And, right now, that is probably most true of Seattle defenders. Go ahead and take some bonus money from the Bucs or Raiders of the world, but you likely won’t make nearly as much total $ in the end.

  10. 32 mils is a lot. Given they were able to resign Wagner with just 3.9 left and cut McDaniel. Not a problem.

  11. Sounds like the old Bill Polian system. In his 25 years as GM, he was always good at picking players. But, his top heavy teams only won one Super Bowl. A few injuries to key players, and just scrubs to replace them. Maybe he shoulda spent less time whining about the Pats, who manage the cap right.

  12. I’m not a Seahawks fan but its frustrating seeing when a talented team falls apart as they cant pay all the stars

    Happened to the Cowboys in the early 90’s as they were laden with talent, by the mid 90’s they were still good but year by year they were losing players or valuable backups

    Same for Seattle, with so much tied up in those stars they wont be able to keep other talented players year in year out, much alone young backups who give depth.

  13. The road to salary cap hell is paved with top flight contracts for good but not great players.

  14. This is what you pay the scouting department for – to draft players that will make an impact before their extension years. I am not a Seattle Seahawks fan but I can appreciate a team having such a problem.

    Here’s why:

    The team has made great decisions in the draft and has found great talent in the later rounds.
    When you go to two Super Bowls in two years, you need to expect players will want a payday. At least the team is spending money on players that are internal and worth it, not spending on free agents with checkered pasts.

  15. It’s OK to have a compensation philosophy. For the Seahawks, it is pay your top performers extremely well and pay the others at a much lower scale–one that reflects where they are in their careers. And “where they are” could be a rookie or a veteran performer who needs to have a 1-year “prove it” contract. They don’t keep people who are in the middle–quality-wise or compensation-wise.

    It really is unfortunate to have those performers like Tony McDaniel who has done a very good job but who is not a star. They do get released because from a compensation perspective they are in the middle.

    But guess what? The compensation philosophy is working. And it will continue to work.

  16. They should have not thrown that slant to throw their Super Bowl win away. You only have so many chances if you don’t cheat. At this point, they will have to go Ozzie to stay competitive – good luck with that.

  17. No the window isn’t closed. They have a great team this year and in coming years there will be changes but that doesn’t have to mean they will become a bad team.

  18. The real reason the rest of the league hates the Pats is they know how to operate under the cap and the rest of the league just can’t seem to figure it out. The cap limits how much talent you can inventory on any one team. It’s not about spending, its about spending wisely.

  19. This is what you pay the scouting department for – to draft players that will make an impact before their extension years. I am not a Seattle Seahawks fan but I can appreciate a team having such a problem.

    Here’s why:

    The team has made great decisions in the draft and has found great talent in the later rounds. When you go to two Super Bowls in two years, you need to expect players will want a payday. At least the team is spending money on players that are internal and worth it, not spending on free agents with checkered pasts.

  20. But no, no go ahead Seahawks fans, keep telling yourself Wilson is worth Avril and Kam or Bennett and Okung.

    You’re losing your defense or your run game to pay for Wilson. And it’s up to management to decide which has helped Wilson win more. The fact that you’ve thrown the least amount of any team over his 3 years or that he hasn’t won a single game where the defense gave up more than 23 points.

  21. Sorry screamers, I know you thought you were built for long term success, but this will run its course and you’ll be stuck with Flacco 2.0

  22. The Seahawks have $20 million of cap space in 2016, $36 million in 2017, $102 million in 2018 and $158 million in 2019. They won’t have to cut anybody.

    The next guy who they will sign is Russell Okung, the last of the key players on the roster that’s been to 2 straight Super Bowls. This will probably be done before the start of the regular season.

    They will milk the contract years out of Bruce Irvin and J.R. Sweezy, then let somebody else overpay for them like they did this year with James Carpenter and Byron Maxwell. Their replacements are already on the roster. Their names are Kevin Pierre Louis and Kristjan Sokoli.

    The Seahawks won’t miss a beat and will be Super Bowl contenders for years to come. The rest of this is just filler copy by sports writers who don’t have a clue how the actual salary cap works.

  23. Two very long seasons in a row will wear on the Seahawks. They’ll have a tough time getting back. However, they got where they are through great scouting and drafting. You can’t sign everyone. You just need to make sure you get deals done with the right ones. I agree that Bill Belichick is the best at managing the salary cap, but he’s made mistakes at the defensive back position and has had problems drafting the right wide receivers. For the Seahawks, I really like the Wilson signing and believe that he is underrated and clutch (with the exception of his last pass). I like the Sherman deal too. He’s the beast and probably underpaid.

  24. As a fan of NE Patriots, that’s the reason why they say Pats don’t pay even though they always spend close to the max cap.

    We have to settle for the like of laFell instead of having a Dez. By the way I think laFell was a good as a signing as the great Revis.

    In todays NFL you have to pick your core players wisely. I’m sure NO would have loved to keep JG.

  25. Now I get it… THIS is why the nation hates the Patriots! Your GM can’t make the tough unpopular decisions. I can’t count how many times I have heard people here in Massachusetts mad about how the Patriots didn’t pay a great player. Fifteen years of success in the Salary Cap era! Stuff that in your pipe and smoke it Roger! You want parity, and we give you the Patriots!!!

  26. They should have not thrown that slant to throw their Super Bowl win away. You only have so many chances if you don’t cheat. At this point, they will have to go Ozzie to stay competitive – good luck with that.

    Go Ozzie? You mean like Elam. Easy on the kool-aid statue dude.

  27. Somehow, I can’t see a team with $56 million in cap space over the next two years as having cap problems, but hey I’m sure some of the trolls will figure out a way to make that a bad thing.

    The Seahawks have positioned themselves to be contenders for at least the next 3 years. Get used to it.

  28. “This is the direction the NFL is going, and it dates back to when the Ravens won the Super Bowl 3 years ago”

    What have you only been watching the NFL for 3 years ? This has been going on a lot longer than that. Fifteen years and counting for the Pats.

    Good teams reshuffle the roster and reload every year. Bad teams are always “rebuilding” instead of reloading.

  29. LMAO….. It’s a given Pete Carroll is a great coach, Hawks SB win and USC…… As a GM…. He is way over his head….. Paying most of your cap to a few “great” players will not make you a winner. You need to balance this with 10-15 other good players…..m

  30. Seattle has had a nice run. This will the first year that they will have to compete while paying realistic money to all of their key contributors. Not only realistic money, but top of the market money. If each of those stars leaves 500K to 1M on the table they get to keep McDaniel, and few more McDaniels. That also sets the tone that it is not all about me.

  31. Alot of these posts are filled wit Cap experts projecting their wishes and hopes as facts and analysis; Wilson’s contract is the beginning of the demise! They will experience cap hell just like my team! Oh you sad clowns, do you not realize that they already signed everyone they wanted to long term contracts, and that most of the ’13 – ’15 draft classes haven’t seen the field yet just because this team is ridiculously stacked with talent. Oh, and in case you forgot, the cap will go up every year starting in 2016. Sorry for the sobering news, please continue your envious hatred of the top dog as you should, in the meantime, Seattle will just keep winning.

  32. “Seahawks can’t pay many (any) more guys”
    **********************
    Or so the rest of the league hopes. This “sky is falling” attitude taken by everyone doesn’t seem to faze the Seahawks, as outsiders (including media) are more concerned than they are.

    So far, they’ve done OK without our help.

  33. I love how the Seahawks have built this team for the last 5 years. But, the turning point of weather this team will remain a contender or not was when they signed Wilson.

    I love the kid but I’m sorry, I wouldn’t have gave him that money. For what he does for that offense, you could find someone cheaper.

    Look, if Wilson were a true play making QB (like Rodgers, Brees, Luck, Big Ben or even Phillip Rivers) I could see it.

    But now, you can’t keep a great defense (which is what really carries the team) so Wilson will be forced to try and be something that he’s not: A play making QB who will have to score because the defense isn’t elite anymore.

    It’s over for Seattle now. They will slowly descend back in mediocrity because of this deal.

    Just like how the Ravens immediately took themselves out of real Super Bowl contention giving money to an ordinary QB (Flacco). The Ravens defense allowed Flacco to be in position to win games. Now the Ravens have a secondary that looks like it’s a bunch of high schoolers back there because they can’t afford to get or retain any real good secondary people.

  34. patsfan12 says:
    Aug 3, 2015 8:41 AM

    The window has closed.
    ——————————————————————-
    I disagree with that. I think Seattle has a very good chance to win the Super Bowl this year. After this year, I don’t. But ‘closing’ isn’t ‘closed’.

  35. You are only as good as the 53rd player on your roster in today’s nfl. You have to have quality depth. Not a pats fan but they do it best second are packers but teams like the cowboys, rams, cards are figuring this out. It is a shame you can’t keep great teams together anymore. The best scouts are gonna start to make serious money soon cause the draft is the only way to build the roster from guy 6 to 53 anymore.

  36. bbfe says:
    Aug 3, 2015 9:20 AM
    Now I get it… THIS is why the nation hates the Patriots! Your GM can’t make the tough unpopular decisions. I can’t count how many times I have heard people here in Massachusetts mad about how the Patriots didn’t pay a great player. Fifteen years of success in the Salary Cap era! Stuff that in your pipe and smoke it Roger! You want parity, and we give you the Patriots!!!

    4 4

    ….The nation doesnt hate the Patriots….the nation hates cheaters, thats all

  37. The Seahawks haven’t lost anyone yet that they have wanted to keep. This is not the year that they will feel the impact. In fact, they went out and got a great receiving tight end. I disagree with the post saying that they are ridiculously stacked with talent. They are a great defensive team, but not dominant and they are an above average team on offense that is subject to ridiculous funks (like the fourth quarter in the Super Bowl).

  38. Reports of the Seahawks demise are greatly exaggerated. Who, exactly, is a better team in their conference?

    Yeah, they’ve paid a few guys, and let a few others go. But they’ve also added a dynamic weapon.

    They’re one of the best run organizations in football. They’ve gotten tremendous value in the draft. The GM and coach are on the same page, the owner has no spending limitations beyond the cap, their stadium situation is rock solid. Key players are locked up with long term deals.

    Furthermore, they beat the second best team in the NFC with perhaps the best QB in the game twice last year. Nobody can match their physicality.

    I wish my team was this “over”.

  39. osiris33 says:
    Aug 3, 2015 9:22 AM

    Somehow, I can’t see a team with $56 million in cap space over the next two years as having cap problems, but hey I’m sure some of the trolls will figure out a way to make that a bad thing.

    The Seahawks have positioned themselves to be contenders for at least the next 3 years. Get used to it.
    ————————————————————-
    I would like to introduce you to a tool that might help you, it’s a site called overthecap. The total space available over the next 2 years according to them for Seattle is a little less then 11m for the top countable 51 assuming a flat cap in ’16. (143m in ’15 and 134m in ’16 earmarked today)

    Anyone can post a comment with disinformation, but someone else can take 1 minute to look it up and discredit that comment.

    Get used to it.

  40. 12th man better say your prayers every night for these 10 players who are your cap. If any of them get hurt could be big trouble as your depth will be the real cap casualty……….but gotta give props to you guys for signing your key players as a fan that’s all you could want. Now JS is going to have to prove he was the brains behind the draft picks, and not Scotty M. should be very interesting to watch over the next few years….

    congrats from your hated rivals….

  41. Okung, Avril, and Bennet are easily gone. Chancellor too.
    ————————————–
    I’ll give you Okung and throw in Bruce Irvin… those other three are under contract for 2-3 more years each.

    The ONLY reason they’d be gone any time soon would be if they stop playing the way that got them that contract in the first place.

  42. Welcome to the big leagues. No more sitting at the kids table for you !!!!!!!
    ————————————–

    If 3 straight playoff appearances, 2 straight SB’s, and 1 SB win means you’re at the kid’s table, maybe you don’t want them in the big leagues… just sayin’

  43. ‘ Just like how the Ravens immediately took themselves out of real Super Bowl contention giving money to an ordinary QB (Flacco). The Ravens defense allowed Flacco to be in position to win games. Now the Ravens have a secondary that looks like it’s a bunch of high schoolers back there because they can’t afford to get or retain any real good secondary people. ‘

    Um. OK. But the Ravens were within a few plays of the AFCCG again last year. And Flacco has the best post season stats of any QB since Montana. And, oh yeah, the Ravens D was ranked 18th in the league in 2012 when Flacco carried them to the SB win.

    And the Ravens will start Jimmy Smith, Ladarius Webb, Will Hill and Kendrick Lewis in the secondary this year, making them a top ten secondary according to PFF. They stunk last year in the secondary because they had 5++ secondary players on IR.

    So yeah, great points. Unless you actually care about reality…

  44. They will still be great this year as long as they stay healthy. Maybe next year a few guys will have to go to make cap room for others. It’s the same story for every team though.

  45. To me it comes down to what will happen when Lynch is either gone or not the same back and Wilson will have to win some games without a stout defense and running game. Then we will see how much of the contract he is really worth.

  46. The road to salary cap hell is paved with top flight contracts for good but not great players.
    ————————————————-
    Kam – best SS in the game
    Thomas – best FS in the game
    Sherman – top 1-2 CB’s in the game
    Lynch – top 3 RB in the game
    Graham – top 2 TE in the game
    Wagner – top 2-3 ILB in the game
    Avril/Bennett – one of the top duo’s in the game
    Wilson – pick your stat and/or expert, easily a top 10 QB if not top 5… besides, starting QB’s get paid in the NFL

    Tell us again how these guys are “good but not great”…

  47. Nice work by FO to have studs in the fold. The trade off will be losing not just Tony McDaniel and maybe Jermaine Kearse type of talent but eventually a Russel Okung or Bruce Irvin. Some day the NFL will have 32 teams between 7-9 and 9-7 and the tiebreaker system will get a real test.
    Seattle having a large percentage of cap on just ten guys is a bit scary to the back end of the roster cause #53 on everyone’s roster its important to have a contributor.But to have 8 guys in the NFL Top100 list ( which isn’t the bible but…..) including 6 in the top 41 is very impressive in a 32 team league. It’s a “problem” every fan base and front office would love to take on I am sure.

  48. I am not at all a Seahawks fan, but I am starting to think that the NFL should have a separate cap for the QB position. Basically, it has become essentially a penalty to pay your Quarterback, at the expense of the depth for the rest of your team. You basically can only pay the QB, one other offensive player, and 2-3 defensive players any more. I do not think that is really a great for the league overall.

  49. I would like to introduce you to a tool that might help you, it’s a site called overthecap. The total space available over the next 2 years according to them for Seattle is a little less then 11m for the top countable 51 assuming a flat cap in ’16. (143m in ’15 and 134m in ’16 earmarked today)

    Anyone can post a comment with disinformation, but someone else can take 1 minute to look it up and discredit that comment.
    —————————————

    It’s also widely assumed that the cap will be going up 10 million a year…

    We can widely assume anything, but John Schneider and Pete Carroll have had a plan from day they started, and so far, it’s worked VERY well.

  50. And it’s all by design to keep more money in the owners pockets. Eleminate the salary cap!! It’s true u purpose is to keep more of the money to owners which is fine. But cut the crap about keeping the playing field even.

  51. As a Packer fan, I’m no fan of the Seahawks but I’ve been saying all along that I believe the Seahawks will be just fine. We’re about to find out over the next couple of years but it looks to me like they’re following the script written by Bill Belichick and Ted Thompson. We’ll know for sure soon enough.

    The Patriots and the Packers have been competitive year after year after year. They do this by identifying their core players and paying them accordingly. Guys not identified as core players, when they get expensive, are allowed to leave in free agency or they get cut.

    Sometimes this is a bit painful, but the philosophy is “Better to let a guy go a year too early than a year too late.” And of course, whenever a guy is allowed to walk or gets cut, the haters start foaming at the mouth, hopping up and down with glee, shouting “They’re in decline! The window is closing!” And then the haters are proven woefully wrong, as the Pack and the Pats continue to dominate their respective divisions.

  52. Looks like we are going to see a huge roster dump for the Seahawks after this year. Kinda like the Saints & Eagles had to do this year.

  53. HAHA, this is funny. Yeah, you know, because no teams ever have cap casualties in Camp. The seahawks have a few aging players that have a fairly big number that may get cut, as they have young guys that are taking their playing time anyway. Mcdaniel was first (3 M) and Mebane is probably next (5.5M)

  54. Are you fella’s posting about the seahawks not being able to resign the big players the same ones that post in other hawks threads about the same thing? You guys all realize that nearly EVERY starter on both sides of the ball is signed for 3+ years right? Okung is the only one that isnt, and he misses multiple games a year, which will factor in to how much money he gets. Before you make silly posts regarding the roster, please look up the team on Sportrac and see how the contract and salary cap situation ACTUALLY is.

  55. …and every team in the league would pay them more.

    What team has as many stars as Seattle? As many players in the NFL top 100? None.

    There are already good young players Carroll and Schneider have drafted ready to fill many of the remaining rolls, playing on team friendly contracts.

    And the cap goes up $10 million or so every year.

    Seems to me Schneider has done a better job of figuring this out than the average reporter.

  56. Seahawks had 38 million in cap in 2016 BEFORE Wilson and Wagner cap hits. Now it’s down to 10. ~7 million to sign a rookie class. Leaves you with 3 million and only 35 players currently under contract. 42 with an assumed 7 person rookie class.

    That’s 11 players to sign for 3 million with enough funds to hire others to cover inevitable injuries. 11 players at UDFA money is 2.75. Oh and Kam and Bennett want more money. That’s without Okung or Irvin JR Sweezy Turbin (whoever else I can’t think of) even on the roster.

    Only a Seahawk fan couldn’t see how they aren’t cap-strapped now. You’re the Saints of the future. With no one to thank but an egotistical QB who thinks he’s a prophet.

  57. I’d put the top ten paid players on Seattle’s roster up against any other team’s top ten – the Seahawks are an extremely talented bunch. Most teams would love to have Seattle’s ‘problems’.

  58. Everyone outside of Seattle knows that when they aren’t paying their QB peanuts anymore and instead overpaying him…..it will come at the cost of being able to retain some of the players around him that helped carry him to success.

    I’m not sure why Seahawks fans are even bothering to spin this any other way? It’s a pretty easy concept to understand. But the real problem is that Wilson can’t carry a team like Rodgers, Brady or a Manning.

  59. And it’s all by design to keep more money in the owners pockets. Eleminate the salary cap!! It’s true u purpose is to keep more of the money to owners which is fine. But cut the crap about keeping the playing field even.
    ———————–
    No. It’s designed to keep a level playing field for all teams rather than allowing an owner to just buy a championship by outspending their peers. That concept is why baseball lost so much popularity as “America’s Favorite Pasttime”

  60. Expect Seahawk fan’s frustration to peak when they realize Jimmy Graham is worth only half his salary and have to cut good, proven defensive players to keep him lol

  61. Rival fan here. I think the Seahawks did a great job of locking in the core players who really make a difference on the field. They built the team through the draft with the exception of a couple players like Lynch. This is where the scouts and GM really make their money, and they’ve shown themselves to be pretty competent.

    One problem today’s football market is that QBs take a disproportionate amount of the cap, especially one whose defense is considered top notch. Wilson’s contract doesn’t leave much to pay the guys protecting him or the guys to throw to.

  62. Some of the people on here are acting like the Seahawks are making a huge mistake by retaining their core players. The reason they have ten guys signed to big contracts is because they are the key to winning. John Schneider is so confident in his drafting that he knows he can find players to fill out the remainder of the roster at minimum salaries. If at some time, the Seahawks decide that they need more cap space there will be a list of teams waiting to trade for one of their top 10 guys.

  63. Hawks may have mortgaged their future a little bit but hell, they had a nice run with back to back SBowl appearances (should have had 2 rings). Most teams would find today’s cap hell suitable collateral damage for the Seahawks past success.

  64. I’m not sure why Seahawks fans are even bothering to spin this any other way? It’s a pretty easy concept to understand. But the real problem is that Wilson can’t carry a team like Rodgers, Brady or a Manning.
    ———————————

    First off, we understand the luxury we’ve had over the last few years. Don’t judge an entire fan base but a few that are uneducated or too ‘fanatical’ to see the truth. Each fan base has those people.

    Second, how do you know he can’t carry a team? Just because he isn’t asked to doesn’t mean he can’t. Brady didn’t carry the team his early years… his defense was the main reason he won or first couple of SB’s. Once he got his contract and they started losing players for cap reasons, then he needed to do more. Sound familiar?

    To be honest, I don’t know if he can do it. He does have more 4th quarter/overtimes comebacks than anyone since he’s been in the league… and he has a legit #1 target now. So, I do like his chances, although I still don’t think they’re going to ask him to throw 40 times a game.

  65. This is what happens when you overpay mediocre quarterbacks. There are a lot of teams going through this problem.
    ———————————-

    I’d take Rodgers or Luck under contract instead of Wilson, but those are the only two. Manning and Brady careers are waning… Brees isn’t far behind. Rivers has great half seasons…

    Bottom line, a QB isn’t great because of stat line… although RW’s isn’t bad… made even better when you add in his rushing yards. But it’s everything else he does that makes him great.

    But, Hawk fans really don’t care that much that you think he’s mediocre… we’re extremely happy that he’s our quarterback and not yours.

  66. frankfortschooldropout says:

    osiris33 says:

    Somehow, I can’t see a team with $56 million in cap space over the next two years as having cap problems, but hey I’m sure some of the trolls will figure out a way to make that a bad thing.

    The Seahawks have positioned themselves to be contenders for at least the next 3 years. Get used to it.
    ————————————————————-
    I would like to introduce you to a tool that might help you, it’s a site called overthecap. The total space available over the next 2 years according to them for Seattle is a little less then 11m for the top countable 51 assuming a flat cap in ’16. (143m in ’15 and 134m in ’16 earmarked today)

    Anyone can post a comment with disinformation, but someone else can take 1 minute to look it up and discredit that comment.

    Get used to it.
    ——————————————————–
    His numbers COME from overthecap.com. He’s talking about 2016-2017, not 2015, which is irrelevant. They have $56 million to spend in those next 2 years and only Okung left to sign. Irvin will get milked for his contract year and then they’ll let somebody else overpay for him, like they did with Carpenter and Maxwell. Irvin’s replacement was drafted last year.

    So the total space available for the NEXT 2 years is $56 million, just like he said.

    PS – The cap will not be “flat,” as you hope. It will expand by $10 million a year as it has been the last 2 years.

    The Seahawks will be Super Bowl contenders for the next 3-5 years.

    Get used to it.

  67. Lifecycle of the anti-Seahawks fan…

    “…it will never happen…”

    “…it will never happen back-to-back….”

    “…the window is closed…”

    But you won’t get any sleep when the week comes that your team is matched up with the Seahawks and when the game is over, you’ll be left asking “what? how? why? where to go from here?!?…”

    …but one thing you’ll be sure of is that the Seahawks won’t be good again next year, so you’ll jump on the bandwagon with all the other anti-fans just hoping again…

    (maniacal laugh)

  68. I agree Wilson couldnt carry a team like Rogers,Manning or others. But he doesn’t have to apologize for having Lynch to hand the ball off to and a stout defense to tilt field position for him. He can just thank JS/PC for that. Not a lot of QBs would succeed behind that makeshift line and Russell can’t keep running for his life.That has to change cause when Lynch does leave- the offense will need to shift……

  69. Anti seahawks fans that compare wilson to rodgers and brady, do us a favor and post a list of each of those QB’s Wide Receiver Options over the years. After you type those out, pull up each QB’s statistics (including rushing and rushing TD’s, as last i checked, those matter in total yards) and go ahead and type those out, then re-post.

  70. As a Seahawks fan, I can’t even bear to watch this season. It’s gonna get ugly. Like Patsfan12 said, the window is closed, and all that is left is pain and regret for us fans. Meanwhile, the Patriots are in great shape, as always.

    I give up.

  71. This is the thing that gets on my nerves about how ignorant people are about the Ravens cap situation.

    The Ravens and Flacco agreed that a contract that would be for 3 years with a 6 year deal and will be extended after the 2015 season.

    People always talk about, “Look at all of the players the Ravens lost due to Flacco”

    Ray Lewis-Retired

    Ed Reed-Let go but eventually retired

    Matt Birk- Retired

    Paul Kruger- Replaced by Elvis Dumervil

    Michael Oher- Replaced by a better RT Ricky Wagner

    Cary Williams- Left for the Eagles was nothing special

    Bernard Pollard- Released was a coaches decision

    Anquan Boldin- Boldin had 1 year deal left with 6 million against the cap for the Ravens in 2013 offseason while Flacco had around 6.8 million dollars against the cap that year.

    So Flacco’s 6.8 million stopped the Ravens from keeping Boldin with one year left on his deal? No it didn’t.

    If Flacco’s contract has stalled the Ravens, how did the Ravens manage to sign Dumervil to a 5 year deal worth 35 million in 2013?

    How did the Ravens manage to spend over 50 million dollars in free agency during the 2014 offseason?

    Quality over quantity. But people these days don’t like facts. They are just sheep.

  72. Does everybody forget that Seattle was a sub .500 team before Wilson with Sherman, Beastmode and most of the defense? Yeah, he’s way overpaid for appearing in back-to-back super bowls with a previously sub .500 team without him. Wilson and the core of the team are signed until 2017, the Seahawks will be contenders at least until then.

  73. …… As a GM…. He is way over his head…..

    Please at least know your facts, Carroll is not the Seattle GM. And no he doesn’t tell the best GM in the league right now what to do. It’s a partnership for sure and that’s why it’s successful.

    And for you other haters that talk about injuries stopping the Hawks because they pay their stars don’t look now but you can say that about 20 teams. The others are so bad that injuries won’t make a difference. They’ll still suck with no injuries.

  74. It can easily be argued that Seattle has too much good talent. Other teams continue to pick up their castoffs. This is a nice problem to have. Seattle’s latest draft just brought in two more. Tyler Lockett and Frank Clark are both destined for greatness.

  75. Whats not being talked about is the fact that seattle hasnt drafted well since Scott Mclougan left the building. They drafted excellent for about the 3 years he was there. Now he is off to Washington and Seattle is left with Schneider to do the evaluations.

    This will make those late round gems they had almost non existent.

  76. A lot of haters around. I guess you guys click on every Seahawks article you see and immediately go to the comments section to spout off. Sorry if your teams are irrelevant or haven’t been able to make it to the playoffs (Superbowl) lately. Seahawks are going to continue to be competitive and keep a solid team. Let the hate begin in 3…2…1…

  77. A lot of jealous fans of Seattle on here. A dynasty is like winning 2 of 3 and yes, PC screwed up or we’d really be gloating going back to back with a trifecta on the horizon.

    I grew up in the Dave Krieg era. This era is Football Heaven.

    The Hawks have had the #1 Defense 3 consecutive years. It’s almost been 50 years since the Vikings did it. Even the 70’s Stealers didn’t.

    Most fans can’t imaging what it’s like to get ready for Thurs, Sun or Monday knowing you’ll be watching your all-time D knock the snot of of these weak NFL teams. All this fantasy football offensive game is GARBAGE for guys that grew up watching the 80’s/90’s.

    There are really only 2 great NFC teams. GB & Seattle. There are teams and fans that want to reach our level but aren’t there and never have been there before.

    Hence, the jealousy.

  78. Just think one stupid play by the Packers and we wouldn’t have been able to watch the seachicken fans cry after the SB or talk about how great of a dynasty they are. NFC teams with better talent: Green Bay, Dallas and Arizona.

  79. i Was starting to think The Seahawks had a different cap space, even wishing my team have theirs.
    No jokes they have great talent and had to pay them, It never works to pay all big bucks in the long run but who knows.
    Good Luck with that.

  80. They may have over 50 mil in cap room but that 50 plus mill is for 43 players. that means they cant pay much more than 1 mill for any other position. thats where depth becomes an issue

    also you get hold outs wanting more like Chancellor and Bennet.

    Seattle will still be good but they will not be as dominant as they were. Also if they cant replace lynch in the next year or so that will be their biggest down fall.

  81. I can understand a guy holding out if he’s been playing really great football and he’s on a minimum rookie salary. When you are already making 7 million and you know you’re team can’t pay out that much more, and hold out anyway, that makes you a d-bag.

  82. That’s what the draft is for. And in case you didn’t notice, Pete Carroll and Jon Schneider draft better than anybody and still find ways to trade for guys like Jimmy Graham.

  83. Schneider has a great thing going, just hope he doesn’t get busted St.Louis Cardinal style, for stealing Ted Thompsons files , because TT is a cap genius and it’s where JS was schooled in this.

  84. This is where we find out how good of a GM Schneider is. Life is easy when your quarterback is making chump change.
    =============================
    BINGO…..We have a winner!

  85. aps110 says:
    Aug 3, 2015 12:23 PM

    Whats not being talked about is the fact that seattle hasnt drafted well since Scott Mclougan left the building. They drafted excellent for about the 3 years he was there. Now he is off to Washington and Seattle is left with Schneider to do the evaluations
    ====================

    And you know this because rookies aren’t unseating young All Pro’s every year?

    Brilliant analysis.

  86. randy8123 says:
    Aug 3, 2015 9:00 AM
    The road to salary cap hell is paved with top flight contracts for good but not great players.

    Luckily seattle is re-signing Pro Bowlers and All Pro’s.

  87. This is what happens when you have a bunch of “good” players who as a group play very well & win. Then, after winning as a group, they perceive themselves as “Great” individually and are willing to sacrifice success for income. We all understand the reasons, Football is a short lived endeavor for most & getting paid when you can is important. But no matter how they justify it…the Seahawks are firmly in decline from here. NFC West leader is now up in the air.

  88. Points already made, but in the new NFL it is more important to have a great GM, and coaching staff that can relate to young players, and build and teach groups of young players.

    Also a dynasty is now a team that can win back to back titles or 2 in 3 years, after 3-4 years teams will need to retool and/or do a complete rebuild.

  89. “Whats not being talked about is the fact that Seattle hasn’t drafted well since Scott Mclougan left the building.”

    McCloughan, has only been gone for one draft (Feb, 2015). That draft netted Schneider Jimmy Graham, Frank Clark and Tyler Lockette along with several replacements for the offensive line. Certainly the acquisition of Graham by itself, makes this a successful off season.

  90. Historically, teams that have lost the Super Bowl have come back to play in the big game the next year only 5 times with just 2 of those teams finally winning it all. This suggests that teams that have lost the Super Bowl only have a 1 in 23 chance of coming back the next season to win it all compared to 1 in 6 chance of winners.

    Good luck, Seattle. History is against you.

  91. Certainly the acquisition of Graham by itself, makes this a successful off season.
    =========================
    Saints got the better end of the deal:

    Saints = 1st round pick (Starting caliber MLB), probowl Center Max Unger

    Seahawks = TE Graham a product of Brees that must be taken out on run downs (1 Dimensional) and have to overpay $10,000,000.00 per year lol

  92. redsoxu571 says:
    Aug 3, 2015 8:58 AM
    You know, there’s a strong argument in many instances that players should NOT “go for every dollar”….

    ——————————
    You make great points but a player has a finite number of years to make your money with your athletic abilities. It’s not like like being a high-powered attorney or some other white-collar occupation where you can make millions for decades. Granted, your stats could suffer by going to a team with less surrounding talent; like Eric Dickerson when he went from the Rams to the Colts. I don’t blame NFL players for chasing a payday because the time to make the money is limited and the contracts aren’t guaranteed. But I do get annoyed with players that want to renegotiate after a year or two into a long-term contract. If you know you’re gonna constantly ask for more money (like D. Revis was prone to do) the just sign two year deals and bet on yourself to stay healthy. That way, a new payday is always right around the corner.

  93. As of this minute the Seahawks STILL have 5.8 Million in cap space, but need about 6 to cover IR, P Squad and player 52/53. Mebane is a 5.5 million dollar hit, so he may be gone, which really frees the team up. Plus whatever cap you dont use rolls over to the next year. Seattle had 148 to play with this year (cap is 143) due to 5 Million rollover from 2014 season.

  94. revelation123 says:
    Aug 3, 2015 3:33 PM
    They overpaid Wilson. Now they’ve got to deal with the consequences.
    —–
    17.8 Million per year average over the next 5 years is hardly an overpay.

  95. they actually overpaid for sherman and lynch more so than wilson…granted wilson is overpaid in my opinion but not on the qb market. lynch is the offense but 10.8 for a rb is stupid no matter how good he is. 10.8 could’ve got you a few upgrades along the 0-line that would make a lesser rb better. if I’m the seahawks i would just trade down in every draft for multiple mid round picks or future picks the next few years and let your free agents walk so you get comp picks. sign troubled players that get cut from teams that still have to pay them so they will sign for vet min. draft o-line and d-line high and skilled positions low. its a simple process. seahawks hand cuffed themselves a bit but they can still manage..their window is open for another 3-5 years on this current team.

  96. As most NFL fans know, the Seahawks are owned by Paul Allen, who is the richest owner in the league. I am a lifelong Seahawk fan (’76), but I am glad there is a salary cap and that the NFL isn’t like MLB where the teams with the most bread can assemble All-Star teams via Free Agency. That said, I do think a tweak should be made where teams are allowed a “one player exemption” (which would usually be the QB like a previous poster said, but could also be a JJ Watt, Megatron, etc.). Or better yet, players that are drafted by a team should be able to re-sign at a reduced rate towards the cap. I get the whole parity thing, but penalizing teams for drafting well is kind of lame.
    Thumb me down if you must, but if your team ends up in this predicament someday, you’ll likely agree. Under the seahawksbmx model, the Lions could have retained Suh.
    Older fans will remember when superstar players usually remained with one team for their entire careers and there is something special about that.

  97. 17.58 is a huge overpay for Wilson. Belichick put the blueprint out on what to do in the 2nd half against Wilson and with 1 RB and a decent TE there’s not much else Wilson can do!! Even back up cornerbacks can shut down those WR’s!!

  98. whenever a guy is allowed to walk or gets cut, the haters start foaming at the mouth, hopping up and down with glee

    Welker to Denver, where he’ll be on the best offense ever and win the first of several Super Bowls.

    Oops.

  99. Trade Kam to the Vikes!!! I would love to see him and Harrison Smith at safety with Rhodes and soon to be Waynes. Plenty o cap room here too! Teddy on rookie scale and with J.Allen gone paying AP isn’t as damning. Let’s do this Vikes!!!

  100. As long as they can keep Thomas and Chancellor, those two can keep putting in All-Pro level years and keep Irvin around; they won’t have to worry about sinking too much more money on defense. They might even be in better shape if they find a young pass rusher and they can toss Michael Bennett’s overrated behind and his loud mouth out the door.

  101. I would rather have Russell Wilson then have Geno Smith or be like Buffalo not knowing whose your week 1 quarterback, is Wilson overpaid? well yeah but to have a quarterback of his quality or better you would be paying someone that money anyway. People can say whatever they want, ever since Wilson was drafted they have been winning. The least amount of Wins in his 3 year career in one season was 11. I mean come on guys that’s putting you averagely at a first round bye. If the “great defense” holds Atlanta for 32 seconds after Wilson put up a freak game and comeback and the defense coughing up 2 4th quarter Tds to Tom Brady we could be look at 3 possible superbowl appearances and victories. The fact of the matter is Wilson can get the job done with mediocre wide receiver talent. And now hes looking at Jimmy Graham, Chris Matthews, Doug Baldwin, Tyler Lockett, Jermaine Kearse and Paul Richardson. Its really hard not to see Wilson turning into a 35 Td a year quarterback i mean we dont realize the guy is in his third year. Where was Drew Brees at in his third year? they are both pretty similar in fact the two shortest quarterbacks in football. What does Wilson do better than Brees? Win playoff games yearly and the ability to run around in the pocket and take off. Russell Wilson is indeed worth the money. And they now have the defensive studs all locked up. Seattle is looking at 5-7 superbowl appearances overall in the Pete Carroll/ John Schneider era.

  102. As a Cardinals fan, I was all for Wilson getting as much money as he could. After back to back Super Bowl appearances you would think thy would understand it takes a team ti get get to that level. They are probably still the best team in the NFC West this year, But after that it will be fun to watch them slip in to a obscurity again because of a couple of players who care more about their bank account than building a team.

  103. Where was Drew Brees at in his third year?
    ======================
    Apples and oranges… Brees is only a 1st Ballot HOFer and the most accurate QB in NFL history… Wilson had the best D EVER at his disposal…Can you even imagine what Brees would do with that defense giving him the ball back every 2 seconds…..TRUTH

  104. Fantasy and video games have skewed perception for so many people. Actual fans of watching football, we appreciate stats and we pore over them to immerse ourselves in the experience, but we don’t need our guys’ stats to be the best for us to root for OUR GUYS. Seahawks fans love these guys, they love watching them go out and compete their tails off, every play every day, from August to January. Russel Wilson, and any of the others getting paid now, are worth exactly what it takes to keep them on the team. Same as Flacco to the Ravens, their fans didn’t start cutting themselves when he signed his big deal, they just felt a lot more secure in loving the guy and investing in home/road/alternate jerseys.

  105. Sherman = $14million? GOLLY! amazing how opening your mouth gets you money in this insane thing called a league.

    And so the decline begins. Players are upset at not being paid. They start looking at clowns like Sherman and darlings like Wilson sideways. Arguments happen. Players stop supporting each other on and off the field. Down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down, down.

    But hey – thanks for throwing the superbowl!

  106. jmethane says:
    Aug 3, 2015 1:46 PM
    Reading this comment section has been kind of funny. When you’re on top people really hate you.

    ————————————————

    Now try 15 years of it. Welcome to the party.

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