Spinning the Tom Brady case forward

AP

Let’s press pause on the talk regarding Peyton Manning’s retirement for some consideration of the case involving his nemesis, on which the play button was pressed again this past week.

Whatever words are used (and plenty have been) to describe it, a consensus has emerged that the hearing before the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit didn’t go as well for Patriots quarterback Tom Brady as it could have. Still, anyone who claims to know with certainty what will happen in any legal proceeding is either stupid or lying.

It makes much more sense to try to outline the various possible outcomes, especially in a case where it’s not nearly as simple as one side wins and one side loses.

First, if the Second Circuit upholds Judge Berman’s ruling on whether notice of the punishment imposed on Brady was required, it would represent a complete victory for Brady, subject to the NFL exercising further appeal rights. Those rights would consist of a petition for rehearing before the full Second Circuit and, after that process ends, a petition for the acceptance of the case by the U.S. Supreme Court. If the NFL elects to continue to push the issue, it could remain unresolved for months — but Brady would continue to play while it does.

Second, if the Second Circuit reverses Judge Berman’s ruling on the issue of notice but affirms it regarding the lack of fundamental fairness, the case would go back to Judge Berman for a new hearing. Before conducting a new hearing, Judge Berman presumably would resolve issues that he left open, including whether Commissioner Goodell showed “evident partiality” during the first hearing and whether he improperly delegated the original suspension decision to Troy Vincent. Brady’s camp most likely would push to have all remaining legal issues decided before a new hearing is convened.

Third, if the Second Circuit reverses Judge Berman’s ruling on both notice and fundamental fairness, Brady would have to decide whether to exhaust his appeal rights, first by seeking a rehearing before the full Second Circuit and then by trying to persuade the Supreme Court to resolve the case. If that’s the approach taken, Brady would request a stay of the suspension until the appeal is fully resolved. If Brady doesn’t pursue his appeal rights, the case would go back to Judge Berman for consideration of the legal issues that weren’t addressed earlier. A ruling on those issues could spark further appeals.

Fourth, if the Second Circuit reverses Judge Berman’s ruling on both notice and fundamental fairness and the Second Circuit affirmatively resolves the remaining issues pending before Judge Berman (the NFL has asked that the Second Circuit do just that), Brady’s only option would be to pursue appeal rights or drop it and take the suspension. If he decides to appeal, Brady would need to seek a stay of the suspension.

Fifth, it’s possible that the Second Circuit will decide that clarification is needed from Goodell regarding whether and to what extent the four-game suspension applies to the issue of obstruction of the investigation. It’s possible this would result in a new hearing before Goodell, which then would be likely appealed by Brady into the court system, if another suspension is imposed. It’s also possible that Goodell would decide at the second hearing not to suspend Brady at all.

There are surely other potential permutations (including a possible settlement), and there’s a good chance that by attempting to identify all possibilities I’ve missed the one that actually will occur. The broader point is that plenty of things can still happen with this case, and that there’s a very good chance it will continue to linger much longer than it already has.

175 responses to “Spinning the Tom Brady case forward

  1. Who cares. Everyone knows they cheated.
    Why destroy the phone the day before.
    In a year or two they’ll be involved in
    cheating scandal.
    THIS IS TODAY’S NLF AND THE PATS ARE THE
    POSTER BOYS.

  2. I just wish the entire saga would just come to an end already. As far as I’m concerned the damage is already done. No matter how you feel about the case everyone involved has lost. Brady’s reputation is sullied, the Patriots reputation has taken another hit, the NFL as a whole has looked incompetent and Goodell comes off as a liar with, ironically, no integrity at all. The longer this continues the worse it gets for everyone involved. Except the lawyers of course who hope this never ends $$$.

  3. This all could’ve been avoided if the NFL hadn’t gone overboard in the first place and just fined Brady/the Pats for what serious is just a minor violation (if one even occurred in the first place).

  4. “Still, anyone who claims to know with certainty what will happen in any legal proceeding is either stupid or lying.”

    Yet that won’t stop the usual PFT chorus of the uninformed from doing just that in posts to folllow in 5, 4, 3…

  5. This saga could not get any more stupid. To spend $20M because of some air in a football is utterly ridiculous. I know Goodell says its about his “powers”, but its more about the PSI and his ginormous ego then anything.

  6. Brady could have avoided his mess by a good act of contrition and more national level forgiveness…..but his actions mirror that of a real liar and a cheat

  7. Apparently patriot fans get their information from Skip Baylis while non-patriot fans take in the info from different sources and make the obvious conclusion……Brady, Belichick, Kraft you can pick anyone and they are cheaters.

  8. Brady’s going to keep fighting to defend his name and his privacy because he was falsely accused by a pack of liars in the first place

  9. Goodell lied about the data, lied about Brady’s testimony, lied about who suspended the ball guys, falsely accused the Pats of switching k-balls (until it emerged an NFL official was stealing them), and he used a fraudulent report which furthermore dismissed the ref’s testimony about which needle was used. Goodell lied about the independence of the Wells report and it’s unannounced NFL co-author, lied about the Pats denying Wells access to the ball guys (Pats merely said the 5th interrogation would need to be by phone because the guy had a full-time job elsewhere). Goidell denied Brady a fair appeal, made much of Brady “destroying” his phone but then refused to accept Brady’s phone logs offered up at the appeal, oh and he leaked Brady’s generously-given private emails. Then he further exaggerated Wells’ finding into “a scheme” despite no additional evidence. Then he ran to a court of his choice before his victim could even respond. Every step and every breath by Goodell has reeked of lies and destroyed integrity on this case.

  10. “This will all be resolved in 2 0r 3 days”

    – Troy Vincent circa January 2015.

    “Nothing is over until we say it is over. Was it over when the Germans Bombed Pearl Harbor?”

    – Roger Blutarsky Goodell.

  11. Thursday Night Football has a far greater negative effect on the players-ALL THE PLAYERS than 2psi ever did.

    I think deflate gate was much worse than anyone knows, and Goodelle effectively buried it as a favor to Kraft and told Kraft not to get in trouble again. Wait, what?

    So Deflategate came up and Goddell was pissed, apparently he is STILL pissed and here we are.

    George W. Bush invaded a country or two just to impress his daddy; not a stretch to see Goodell’s Deflategate persistence, intransigence and anger as purely personal.

    A Life-long Denver fan, even I can see how petty this is.

    “Free Brady”? Not that far from the truth.

  12. Mar 6, 2016 5:44 PM
    Goodell lied about the data, lied about Brady’s testimony, lied about who suspended the ball guys, falsely accused the Pats of switching k-balls (until it emerged an NFL official was stealing them), and he used a fraudulent report which furthermore dismissed the ref’s testimony about which needle was used. Goodell lied about the independence of the Wells report and it’s unannounced NFL co-author, lied about the Pats denying Wells access to the ball guys (Pats merely said the 5th interrogation would need to be by phone because the guy had a full-time job elsewhere). Goidell denied Brady a fair appeal, made much of Brady “destroying” his phone but then refused to accept Brady’s phone logs offered up at the appeal, oh and he leaked Brady’s generously-given private emails. Then he further exaggerated Wells’ finding into “a scheme” despite no additional evidence. Then he ran to a court of his choice before his victim could even respond. Every step and every breath by Goodell has reeked of lies and destroyed integrity on this case.
    ***************************
    Every point you brought up has been debunked. Did you even pay attention to the whole thing?

  13. Who knew that if I wanted to become a scientist , a professor, a physics major , or a lawyer , all that I had to do was become a Patriots fan ? After all , they know everything about all of those subjects and no one else does !

  14. I’m very anti-Brady and anti-Patriots. However, enough is enough. I wish it would just go away. I’m happy in the knowledge the Patriots, Brady, and Belichick will be forever sullied by Spygate and deflategate. The stench and asterisk will never go away. That’s enough for me.

  15. key2heat says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:26 PM
    4 games for the cheater.

    ————————————–
    You are serving a stupid-for-life sentence.
    You couldn’t have avoided that if you’d not skipped 11th grade when Ideal Gas Law was taught.

  16. Do you know the Dolphins have two playoff appearances in the last 15 years. They lost both games and scored a flaccid 12 point combined.

  17. Goodell has botched this as badly as he has botched anything in his entire tenure. To me, it’s so funny that Goodell and the NFL only cared about PSI inflation of footballs on one day in its history, the day of the Colts/Patriots AFC championship game.

    Otherwise, Goodell has turned a blind eye to PSI inflation. The NFL didn’t bother measuring PSI inflation of any footballs all year, has never measured PSI of footballs during games, and has never even told the NFL players about the PSI rule because it wasn’t a real rule. PSI was a gamesmanship issue. And as Aaron Rodgers admitted when he said he played with over-inflated footballs and thought DeflateGate was a joke, every player in the NFL screws around with the PSI of footballs and the NFL never cared until the Colts and Ravens started whining.

    This case has never had anything to do with football inflation and has everything to do with Goodell trying to restore his reputation after botching Ray Rice and with other teams and owners trying to get back at the Patriots because they hate them for winning so much. Goodell is very lucky Brady doesn’t sue him for defamation.

  18. The next cheating scandal… not if but when…will be probably dwarf this one. Once a cheater…

  19. Florio left out the proper outcome.

    Brady, Belicheat, Kraft all get 4 game suspensions.

    Spend the duration of those suspensions in a Federal Prison.

    Deflatriots vacate ALL championships 😉

  20. On related news, Tom Brady says he will play another 10 years for the sole purpose of breaking Peyton Manning’s records. Cheap, pathetic and sad!

  21. .
    Question :

    How often does the 20 judge panel overrule three of their sitting brethren?
    .

  22. To the Goodell haters. Roger has done nothing that the 32 owners didn’t want done, do you understand that yet? If the owners said drop Deflategate and be nice, Rog would throw Brady a parade in 10 minutes. It’s the owners that hate the Pats for their serial cheating, not Goodell. He is merely a puppet. You may go now.

  23. dukeearl says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:51 PM
    Every point you brought up has been debunked. Did you even pay attention to the whole thing?
    —————–
    And that, folks, is textbook trolling.

  24. dukeearl says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:51 PM
    Mar 6, 2016 5:44 PM
    Goodell lied about the data, lied about Brady’s testimony, lied about who suspended the ball guys, falsely accused the Pats of switching k-balls (until it emerged an NFL official was stealing them), and he used a fraudulent report which furthermore dismissed the ref’s testimony about which needle was used. Goodell lied about the independence of the Wells report and it’s unannounced NFL co-author, lied about the Pats denying Wells access to the ball guys (Pats merely said the 5th interrogation would need to be by phone because the guy had a full-time job elsewhere). Goidell denied Brady a fair appeal, made much of Brady “destroying” his phone but then refused to accept Brady’s phone logs offered up at the appeal, oh and he leaked Brady’s generously-given private emails. Then he further exaggerated Wells’ finding into “a scheme” despite no additional evidence. Then he ran to a court of his choice before his victim could even respond. Every step and every breath by Goodell has reeked of lies and destroyed integrity on this case.
    ***************************
    Every point you brought up has been debunked. Did you even pay attention to the whole thing?

    Uh NO, every point he brought up DID NOT get “debunked”

    Maybe you need to pay attention and read.

    First they LIED about the air pressure in the balls. Fact.

    Goodell when he released his statement on the appeal hearing in NY before it went to court. He said Brady NEVER mentioned anything about talking to JJ about the psi issue after the AFCCG. Then when Berman ordered the transcripts from that hearing to be released (the NFL did not want it released) the truth came out. Fact.

    Wells chose to believe EVERYTHING the ref said in regards to the game balls for the AFCCG EXCEPT for which gauge he used. Fact.

    I could go on but people like you don’t want the facts.

  25. bartpkelly says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:57 PM
    What happens if it is still in appeals and Brady retires?
    ____________________

    Then Goodell will have won simply by not fully losing.
    This is not about PSI or deflation, if it ever really was. It’s about what 345 Pave Ave has decided is the absolute power of the comi$$ioner’s office. You know, like the power to lie under oath to a federal judge in MN or steal millions in revenue from the pool of funds that’s shared with players.

  26. belicheathater
    Mar 6, 2016, 5:26 PM EST
    Who cares. Everyone knows they cheated.
    Why destroy the phone the day before.
    In a year or two they’ll be involved in
    cheating scandal.
    THIS IS TODAY’S NLF AND THE PATS ARE THE
    POSTER BOYS.

    For the love of God can we all stop with the “I know, everyone knows” routine. Nobody but the Pats and Brady actually knows what happened. While I believe in Brady 95% I’m not dumb enough to come on here and proclaim “I know they didn’t do it”. Chances are we will never know what actually happened or didn’t happen regardless of what the courts say or Brady says or the NFL says or Goodell says or Ted Wells says. Can we all just stick to opinions and stop with all the “I know” what happened routine. If we all knew what really happened I’m sure the NFL and NFLPA would love to interview us all but since that’s not a real possibility lets just keep things to opinions. And to address the phone issue for the millionth time, Ted Wells told Brady he NEVER wanted his phone. So whatever Brady decided to do with it is moot. I admit the optics of the whole thing look bad, but deciding this case doesn’t come down to what he did with a phone after he was told they didn’t want it. Please at least try to keep up with the facts of the case if you’re gonna comment. Otherwise you just come off as an uninformed idiot and you show everyone how much you don’t know.

  27. I say the 2nd Circuit demand to see Ted Wells investigative notes. Because it will clearly show bias and unfairness by Ted Wells.

    For example, Ted Wells claimed Walt Anderson “misremembered” which gauge he used. But one gauge had a much longer needle that was significantly bent. I would think Walt Anderson “was generally aware” which gauge he used based on its physical appearance.

    I would like to see what Walt actually said to Teddy before he spinned his statement into “misremembered.

  28. Is anyone else annoyed how player vs league issues always drag out forever. It puts a damper on the season with them hanging over everyone’s heads. I miss the days of quick resolutions.

  29. I agree with whoever originally said that Brady won’t actually serve one game for this, whatever actually went down.

    His team will never give in, and Goodell’s won’t either.

    Nice work, NFL. Nice work.

  30. jchipwood says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:44 PM
    Apparently patriot fans get their information from Skip Baylis while non-patriot fans take in the info from different sources and make the obvious conclusion……Brady, Belichick, Kraft you can pick anyone and they are cheaters.
    ********************************************************

    I don’t know about you but I get my information from the scientific community. The prevailing opinion (A truly vast majority of experts around the world have weighed in now) is that the balls measured at predictable levels when environmental conditions are factored. End of story. With no demonstrable deflation Occomb’s Razor suggests no conspiracy to deflate footballs. End of story. But feel free to ramble on. There are still those who believe the moon landing was a hoax, the earth is flat, and that climate change is non-existant. You might be able to persuade them to accept your conclusions.

  31. patstipoftheiceberg says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:44 PM
    Brady could have avoided his mess by a good act of contrition and more national level forgiveness…..but his actions mirror that of a real liar and a cheat

    =====

    You are 100% correct. Once Mortenson published the gospel truth from the Jets/NFL front office, TB, Kraft, and the Patriots should have admitted they deflated all 12 game balls to 10.5 PSI before we play the Colts. BTW, we also deflated 3 of the Colts Balls while it was in the Colts procession…

    =====

    .flaccounibrow, you are also right, the Cheating Broncos should have zero rings.

  32. dukeearl
    Mar 6, 2016, 5:51 PM EST
    Mar 6, 2016 5:44 PM
    Goodell lied about the data, lied about Brady’s testimony, lied about who suspended the ball guys, falsely accused the Pats of switching k-balls (until it emerged an NFL official was stealing them), and he used a fraudulent report which furthermore dismissed the ref’s testimony about which needle was used. Goodell lied about the independence of the Wells report and it’s unannounced NFL co-author, lied about the Pats denying Wells access to the ball guys (Pats merely said the 5th interrogation would need to be by phone because the guy had a full-time job elsewhere). Goidell denied Brady a fair appeal, made much of Brady “destroying” his phone but then refused to accept Brady’s phone logs offered up at the appeal, oh and he leaked Brady’s generously-given private emails. Then he further exaggerated Wells’ finding into “a scheme” despite no additional evidence. Then he ran to a court of his choice before his victim could even respond. Every step and every breath by Goodell has reeked of lies and destroyed integrity on this case.
    ***************************
    Every point you brought up has been debunked. Did you even pay attention to the whole thing?

    Ok if that’s what you really believe but can you now go ahead and show us how all those things were debunked. It’s one thing to say that they’ve been debunked, it’s another to actually show that they were. I will keep checking in over the next few days and wait for your response.

  33. fanboyarmy says:
    Mar 6, 2016 6:10 PM
    To the Goodell haters. Roger has done nothing that the 32 owners didn’t want done, do you understand that yet? If the owners said drop Deflategate and be nice, Rog would throw Brady a parade in 10 minutes. It’s the owners that hate the Pats for their serial cheating, not Goodell. He is merely a puppet. You may go now.
    ————————————————–
    31 owners, actually.

    I’m pretty sure Bob Kraft didn’t demand that Goodell fine his own organization $1m, take away their 1st round draft pick this year and their 4th rounder in 2017 and ban his starting QB for 4 games.

    Other than that, yeah, I agree with your premise that this is what the other owners wanted and the Gridiron Godfather is merely carrying out his paymasters wishes.

  34. What a waste of judicial resources. No wonder is takes 20 years for death row inmates to exhaust their appeals. They’re behind these dopey cases.

  35. Remember when Brady said….”it’s easy when you know the answers to be test”…. After AFCCG in 2005…..that transcript and video have been scrubbed from Patriot media …..this happened after spygate. Those smart enough to research will find out what I’m saying.

    When the mangenius blew the whistle….it was for the illegal taping and for illegal audio frequencies………take it at face value …..who’s gone to the ends of the earth to defend their actions and come up with a million excuses?

  36. Can’t wait for Deflategate revenge tour 2.0. Nobody can stop us this time around.

  37. boyso3 says:
    Mar 6, 2016 6:24 PM
    dukeearl
    Mar 6, 2016, 5:51 PM EST
    Mar 6, 2016 5:44 PM
    Goodell lied about the data, lied about Brady’s testimony, lied about who suspended the ball guys, falsely accused the Pats of switching k-balls (until it emerged an NFL official was stealing them), and he used a fraudulent report which furthermore dismissed the ref’s testimony about which needle was used. Goodell lied about the independence of the Wells report and it’s unannounced NFL co-author, lied about the Pats denying Wells access to the ball guys (Pats merely said the 5th interrogation would need to be by phone because the guy had a full-time job elsewhere). Goidell denied Brady a fair appeal, made much of Brady “destroying” his phone but then refused to accept Brady’s phone logs offered up at the appeal, oh and he leaked Brady’s generously-given private emails. Then he further exaggerated Wells’ finding into “a scheme” despite no additional evidence. Then he ran to a court of his choice before his victim could even respond. Every step and every breath by Goodell has reeked of lies and destroyed integrity on this case.
    ***************************
    Every point you brought up has been debunked. Did you even pay attention to the whole thing?

    Ok if that’s what you really believe but can you now go ahead and show us how all those things were debunked. It’s one thing to say that they’ve been debunked, it’s another to actually show that they were. I will keep checking in over the next few days and wait for your response.
    **************************
    Everything you wrote is opinion. None of it is fact. You take bits and pieces here and there and try to make a convincing argument. You can’t, because you are repeating lies and misinformation. I can tell you the same thing. Provide links which PROVE any of what you said. It is all SECOND HAND KNOWLEDGE!

  38. Facts say not only did the Patriots cheat, but they even accepted the penalties levied against them further proving the FACT they cheated!

    #facts have a liberal bias
    #know your facts

  39. uke earl: show us the proof, you can’t !
    *****************

    The appellate courts believes that cheating happened, that Brady was aware of it, and approved of it.

    I don’t need to prove it. I’ll honestly admit I can’t, but on the other hand, neither can you or anybody else prove the opposite. It is all opinion.
    The most laughable part are the patriot fans claiming innocence on Brady’s part. By his own actions he has been shown to be hiding something. Sorry I don’t believe that nonsense about it just happened to be due for him to destroy his phone. Transcripts are no substitute for the phone because they could have been altered/redacted.

    You weren’t there and neither was I. All the so-called facts listed in the previous posts aren’t facts. Just calling them facts doesn’t make it so. This whole thing has been a constant mish-mash of misinformation that I am not surprised that people on both sides are posting nonsense.

  40. Patstipoftheiceberg: When Brady did his first press conferences, the only information he had was the information the NFL provided in the Giardi letter, which turned out to be a lie. He couldn’t admit to something that was misrepresented right? So how do you suggest this “contrition” would ever have been possible?

  41. forthegoodofthegame says:
    Mar 6, 2016 6:59 PM
    Patstipoftheiceberg: When Brady did his first press conferences, the only information he had was the information the NFL provided in the Giardi letter, which turned out to be a lie. He couldn’t admit to something that was misrepresented right? So how do you suggest this “contrition” would ever have been possible?
    **********************
    Why would a guilty person admit to knowledge other than what was provided in the letter?

    He could have admitted the truth, that he knew about it and approved of it beforehand.

    Either is a possibility.

  42. You know it didn’t go well for Brady because of the wall of text.

    Brady could kill a guy on TV and not get this high a word count.

    Something something FIRE GOODELL!!

    That’s all they want to hear on this site right?

  43. thisonesforpat says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:51 PM
    Thursday Night Football has a far greater negative effect on the players-ALL THE PLAYERS than 2psi ever did.
    ————–
    Couldn’t agree more on that.
    A much better choice would be a double header on Monday Night. And obviously it can be done–it happens every year–week 1. What is more mysterious is how come the teams haven’t actually suggested TNF is gone.

  44. One way to solve the deflation scientific issue. Have Roger Goodell stand outside 345 Park Ave, when the temperature drops below 32 degrees and see if his head deflates!

  45. So basically this is something that’s going linger on until my great grandchildren’s great grandchildren die of old age. Yay?
    All this for the single most innocuous scandal in the history of the NFL. Nothing that happened that night or season was worthy of anything beyond a fine.

  46. Outcome #5 seems about right.

    I would love an option where somehow Tom’s text messages and the SpyGate tapes were recovered.

    But that’s just me, I like the truth.

  47. forthegoodofthegame says:
    Mar 6, 2016 6:59 PM
    Patstipoftheiceberg: When Brady did his first press conferences, the only information he had was the information the NFL provided in the Giardi letter, which turned out to be a lie. He couldn’t admit to something that was misrepresented right? So how do you suggest this “contrition” would ever have been possible?
    ——-
    After the deflator ball business……it’s pretty damning evidence protocols were broken in purpose…..take it at face value without 15000 reasons for Brady’s innocence.

    When goodell shoved spygate intensity under the rug, he warned NE that more cheating would be met harsher. That has occured as he other 31 made sure he remember his words and not what the other 1 wanted him to do again. Leopards don’t change their spots.

    Belchick goes unpunished again…….everything NE is getting is warranted.

    When Flutie sings……..the franchise will have to be folded and the titles will be vacated.

  48. Brady will be mocked when he retires and mocked when he wrongfully is inducted into the Hall of Fame. All the honor and accolades belong to you Peyton!

  49. Physics proves there was no tampering. The fact that 3/4 of the colts footballs were under 12.5, gets forgotten in most posts.

  50. All you crybabies about Brady destroying his phone….

    A) He gave them the full phone records, from the phone company, with all texts, inbound/outbound they asked of him.

    B) Beyond the above items… what else could the NFL have needed to conduct an investigation… and would YOU be comfortable giving your phone to the leaking, lying NFL front office?

    I’m guessing you’re not nationally famous and married to a worldwide famous supermodel… but if you are, please enlighten the rest of us as to what Brady should have done.

  51. How ridiculous is it that we’re seeing articles discussing the possibility of this going before the Supreme Court?

    Of course, this means Goodell has already won… because more articles about this never-ending charade based on the supposed “integrity of the game” means fewer articles about arrests, player safety, HGH, the Tennessee tea-bagger, etc. Spending millions on this case is cheaper than the cost of PR and lawsuits handling all that other stuff.

    So as this case becomes increasingly about procedural stuff and what the league has power over, etc., let’s not forget one simple thing:

    If you believe the Patriots deflated those footballs, then you are also refuting the science that says those balls were within the range to be expected given the atmospheric conditions. That said, if you’re refuting the Ideal Gas Law, you also need to find an explanation for the four Colts footballs which had also lost pressure.

  52. The NFL didn’t learn its lesson last year. It will continue to be a laughing stock again this year. Let it go.

  53. His nickname was “The Deflator”. That is enough evidence right there to reverse the decision of Judge Berman’s clown court.

  54. If this goes back to Berman the nfl should request a new judge on the grounds of conflict of interest and bias. Berman was seen partying with the Patriots owner days after his ruling to vacate the suspension. Something stinks…

  55. When Flutie sings……..the franchise will have to be folded and the titles will be vacated.

    ——–

    This is the type of jibberish that Pats fans have to continue to listen to.

    Wonderful.

  56. Keep deflecting Pats fans…

    Why have the 2 deflators disappeared like Jimmy Hoffa?

    They could easily exonerate Brady…………………..

    Crickets

  57. I don’t understand how this even got to where it is! The league that Brady plays for suspended him. That’s it! Your suspended. How can u take it to court? Im having a tough time excepting that there’s a “witch hunt”. Brady has helped make the league what it is today. Don’t see why they would witch hunt him of all people unless they truly believed he did something wrong. Yes I understand there’s a Union so bosses just can’t do what they want and punish and fire who they want. I wouldn’t punish one of my best employees just cause.

  58. Tebowslife

    Nickname = deflator
    All the evidence you need

    Is that truly how you would like to be tried in court?

    What a shame this has gone on for so long and totally because there are team owners, not 31, but probably six that want the commissioner to hack the patriots to give their teams a chance.

    Sad

    But let’s name the six

    Mara
    Biscotti
    Irsay
    Johnson
    Jones
    McNair

    And such weakness in the other owners who say nothing

    Judge chin who sees compelling reason to say they cheated, could not possibly have read any of the berman decision. Another fool

  59. cornerstone2001 says:
    Mar 6, 2016 7:58 PM
    Keep deflecting Pats fans…

    Why have the 2 deflators disappeared like Jimmy Hoffa?

    They could easily exonerate Brady…………………..

    Crickets

    they are both back with the Patriots actually. “Deflator”looks great. lost like 60 pounds

    and they both already said all they are going to, not sure what your point even is.

  60. And why did Kraft bend over and willingly give up $1M and a first round draft pick??? Not an ounce of resistance and he waived his appeal rights. Hardly the response of an innocent man, yes?

  61. goodellisaclown says:
    Mar 6, 2016 7:46 PM

    If you don’t believe the Patriots deflated those footballs, then you are also realize that the science that says those balls were within the range to be expected given the atmospheric conditions was based on IDEAL conditions, hence the name IDEAL GAS LAW.

    ****************************
    There, fixed it for you.

  62. There are very few people who really believe NE cheated. Anyone who ever tried to play outside in cold weather knows psi decreases. Anyone still hung up about Brady’s phone or the “Deflator” haven’t been paying attention. Like Judge Chin, who doesn’t believe the Ideal Gas Law or the Law of Gravity.

    The NFL admitted in court that they had zero evidence of cheating. Zero evidence. In fact, their $5M Wells Report proves that no cheating occurred! Brady testified under oath. The NFL refused to!

    Like I said, a couple of clowns buried neck deep in horse poop are the only ones dumb enough to buy into these lies.

  63. The NFL has already won. Integrity was never the goal, how else do you explain the numerous violations by other teams without one fraction of the punishment?

    The goal is parity. Five straight AFCCG is too much in their eyes so the remedy is suspend the teams best player and take away the top pick.

    The draft pick is the worst part of this whole mess, it sets a team back for years, which is what the NFL wants. Give some other teams a chance so the NFL can sell a fan base more tickets and merchandise.

    The deflation was just an excuse to carry out the hit.

    Remember, this league changes rules every year to promote scoring, they never gave a rat’s ss about PSI until now

    A deflated ball doesn’t block, run or tackle. The game is still about those things.

  64. patsfiend says:
    Mar 6, 2016 7:43 PM
    All you crybabies about Brady destroying his phone….

    A) He gave them the full phone records, from the phone company, with all texts, inbound/outbound they asked of him.

    B) Beyond the above items… what else could the NFL have needed to conduct an investigation… and would YOU be comfortable giving your phone to the leaking, lying NFL front office?

    I’m guessing you’re not nationally famous and married to a worldwide famous supermodel… but if you are, please enlighten the rest of us as to what Brady should have done.
    ***********************************
    Actually Brady’s team offered a transcript (not the actual texts from the phone company). Transcripts are useless since they could have been tampered with any number of ways.

    Myself, since I haven’t done anything wrong with my phone would have no trouble turning over my phone.

    Brady on the other hand, knew that the phone would be trouble for him so he naturally refused like any other liar would.

    Then destroyed the evidence. The acts of a guilty conscience.

  65. Having the trolls chime in used to be fun. Now they’re all just too stupid.

    For example, “why did Kraft bend over and willingly give up $1M and a first round draft pick??? Not an ounce of resistance…”

    See what I mean? Too stupid.

  66. Lost in all this is the absolute fact that the balls were not deflated by Tom Brady, the ball boys, or anyone else. They were deflated by the air temperature. #facts #science

  67. As I have said all along, the NFL will lose because their rules call for only a fine for tampering with the balls. This is just asinine for the NFL to keep after this at this point. You lose all credibility when you give Brady a 4 game suspension for “maybe” tampering with footballs but only giving 4-6 games for someone who beats the living crap out of their wife/girlfriend!

  68. All you have to do is look at Brady’s personal fumble numbers pre-and post deflation era. Before deflation he was one of the NFL’s all time worst ball handlers, on a pace to be the 6th biggest fumbler of all time, right up there with Dave Kreig and Dan Fouts. Post deflation era he’s not even in the top 75. The reason is obvious: deflated footballs are easier to grip, throw and hang on to.

    CHEATER

  69. youknowiknowitall says:
    Mar 6, 2016 8:35 PM
    Having the trolls chime in used to be fun. Now they’re all just too stupid.

    For example, “why did Kraft bend over and willingly give up $1M and a first round draft pick??? Not an ounce of resistance…”

    See what I mean? Too stupid.

    even worse they dont want to learn. They keep asking the same questions that have been answered thousands of times or keep saying things that aren’t true like “his nickname was the deflator”

    We arent going to change their minds if the objective outlets reporting the facts on this can’t so why even bother? Let them keep showing their ignorance and just laugh at them

  70. When you know everything that has happened, all of the lies from the NFL, the actual facts of the entire charade and then read all of the comments from morons who don’t know the facts, are obviously extremely unintelligent, and state bogus information that anyone who has followed the situation knows is just false, it makes the whole “Deflategate” charade even more pathetic than it was to begin with.

  71. Pats fans are truly laughable. Saying something is a fact doesn’t make it a fact and repeating something over and over doesn’t make it so. Something tells me that Patriots fans probably also believe that Mexico will be paying for 100ft wall LOL.

  72. His nickname was “The Deflator”. That is enough evidence right there to reverse the decision of Judge Berman’s clown court.
    ————————————–

    Actually, Jim McNally’s nickname is “Bird.”

    Do you believe McNally is actually a bird? Or some sort of bird/man hybrid?

    You must because, otherwise, you’d have to acknowledge that words can have more than one meaning or interpretation.

  73. More stupidity from the trolls. “The reason is obvious: deflated footballs are easier to grip, throw and hang on to.” Yeah, because we’re all absolutely convinced that the rule change to specifically allow QBs to tailor the surface texture of the ball to improve their grip had ZERO impact and that instead, it was air pressure.

    See what I mean? There are stupid trolls and then there are REALLY stupid trolls.

  74. If this goes back to Berman the nfl should request a new judge on the grounds of conflict of interest and bias. Berman was seen partying with the Patriots owner days after his ruling to vacate the suspension. Something stinks…
    ———————————————–

    Judge Chin attended Fordham Law School with John Mara. Mara has been pro-deflategate and Chin appeared to be pro-NFL in the hearing on Thursday. The fix must be in, right?

  75. The more clever trolls are sometimes fun. For example, “Brady dragging it out as long as possible” while factually inaccurate (after all it’s the NFL’s appeal that has continued this charade) one can at least recognize that Brady could also just relent to Roger “The Corrupt” and end it for them.

    Unrealistic, but not a TOTALLY stupid comment (like most).

  76. cornerstone2001
    Mar 6, 2016, 7:58 PM EST
    Keep deflecting Pats fans…

    Why have the 2 deflators disappeared like Jimmy Hoffa?

    They could easily exonerate Brady…………………..

    Crickets

    Ya they disappeared right back to Foxboro after Goodell and the NFL reinstated them. Ask yourself this, if Goodell and the NFL knew they were cheating why would they reinstate them. And if you do your homework you would know that they have said from the beginning that there was no scheme to deflate the balls. For the love of God please do some research before you comment.

  77. They’ve already been docked a 1st round pick which is the equivalent of the death penalty in this nfl. So harsh for a what is technically an equipment violation. Such insane overreach I can’t believe this is still going on

  78. beachsidejames
    Mar 6, 2016, 9:11 PM EST
    Brady dragging it out as long as possible

    And you win the contest for dumbest post of the day. Do you even realize that they are in the appellate court because the NFL appealed Berman’s decision. A federal judge already looked at everything and ruled in Brady’s favor and this fiasco is still going on because the NFL won’t let it go. I don’t know why but I’m still surprised at how stupid people can be.

  79. key2heat says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:26 PM

    4 games for the cheater.

    …….

    Nah, didnt you hear? Peyton is announcing retirement on Monday

  80. I should apologize to beachsidejames. I just read the post by johnwaldron8 who stated that the NFL should ask Berman to step down because of a conflict of interest. That is definitely the dumbest post of the day. Do you even realize that by law there is a chance that it is could go back to Berman. That’s how the appellate court works. That’s how the judicial system works. Just because you don’t like how Berman ruled doesn’t mean that you get to rewrite the rules of the justice system. You trolls are getting dumber by the day. Just stick to the simple “cheaters” mantra. Anything more complex than that is just asking way too much of you guys.

  81. dukeearl says:
    Mar 6, 2016 8:18 PM
    goodellisaclown says:
    Mar 6, 2016 7:46 PM

    If you don’t believe the Patriots deflated those footballs, then you are also realize that the science that says those balls were within the range to be expected given the atmospheric conditions was based on IDEAL conditions, hence the name IDEAL GAS LAW.

    ****************************
    There, fixed it for you.
    ****************************
    Thank you for demonstrating you really don’t know what the law is. It’s about Ideal Gas, not ideal conditions.

  82. dukeearl says:
    Mar 6, 2016 8:18 PM
    goodellisaclown says:
    Mar 6, 2016 7:46 PM

    If you don’t believe the Patriots deflated those footballs, then you are also realize that the science that says those balls were within the range to be expected given the atmospheric conditions was based on IDEAL conditions, hence the name IDEAL GAS LAW.

    ****************************
    There, fixed it for you.

    ****************************

    Ummm…. I literally can’t comprehend that line of logic (or lack thereof). Perhaps you should forward your findings to MIT, Carnegie Mellon and other research institutions who have declared the PSI figures fall within the range that the IGL predicts. Good work, Mr. Wizard!

  83. dukeearl says:
    Mar 6, 2016 8:29 PM

    Actually Brady’s team offered a transcript (not the actual texts from the phone company). Transcripts are useless since they could have been tampered with any number of ways.

    Myself, since I haven’t done anything wrong with my phone would have no trouble turning over my phone.
    **********************
    You and your wife don’t get stalked by paparazzi. You also apparently didn’t see the press conference where Ted Wells stated flat out he didn’t want the phone.

  84. Brady never gave the actual texts of the destroyed phone, only an exce file of names and numbers…..for the NFL to go after those others who might be a part…..sounds like obstruction to me

    Day before appeal says phone was destroyed but here is a list of geese to chase

    Innocent men clear themselves on the spot

    Brady, biggest phony of all time

  85. Brady really needs to man up and let the brain dead fans that actually believe he is innocent. Bradys attorneys are the only ones benefitting from this circus. Too, to all you Patriots fans… firing Goodell doesn’t really address any of this…perfect solution; Brady retires and the league gives him a pass.

  86. Patriots led the NFL in fewest fumbles. Again.

    So much for that theory. Next!

    🙂

  87. Brady=GOAT. Without a doubt.

    I wonder how many times President Donald J. Trump will invite him and his Super Bowl winning team to the White House?

    🙂

  88. dukeearl says:
    Mar 6, 2016 5:51 PM

    Mar 6, 2016 5:44 PM
    Goodell lied about the data, lied about Brady’s testimony, lied about who suspended the ball guys, falsely accused the Pats of switching k-balls (until it emerged an NFL official was stealing them), and he used a fraudulent report which furthermore dismissed the ref’s testimony about which needle was used. Goodell lied about the independence of the Wells report and it’s unannounced NFL co-author, lied about the Pats denying Wells access to the ball guys (Pats merely said the 5th interrogation would need to be by phone because the guy had a full-time job elsewhere). Goidell denied Brady a fair appeal, made much of Brady “destroying” his phone but then refused to accept Brady’s phone logs offered up at the appeal, oh and he leaked Brady’s generously-given private emails. Then he further exaggerated Wells’ finding into “a scheme” despite no additional evidence. Then he ran to a court of his choice before his victim could even respond. Every step and every breath by Goodell has reeked of lies and destroyed integrity on this case.
    ***************************
    Every point you brought up has been debunked. Did you even pay attention to the whole thing?
    __________________________________

    Actually everything he said has been validated. Clearly you haven’t been paying attention. And we found a lot of it out because Berman wouldn’t seal the documents like the NFL wanted.

  89. boyso3 says:
    Mar 6, 2016 9:42 PM

    I should apologize to beachsidejames. I just read the post by johnwaldron8 who stated that the NFL should ask Berman to step down because of a conflict of interest.
    ————————————————
    To clarify, that portion of my post that referenced Berman was a quote of florioisaliar4hire’s post at 7:53pm.

    What I wrote came after the “——–“

  90. xxbarklikeadogxx says:
    Mar 6, 2016 8:16 PM

    And why did Kraft bend over and willingly give up $1M and a first round draft pick??? Not an ounce of resistance and he waived his appeal rights. Hardly the response of an innocent man, yes?
    __________________________________

    As has been noted many, many times already the agreement NFL owners gives them next to no recourse in fighting these things. Plus, Kraft probably figured with a full season ahead to study the effect of weather on footballs he’d get his picks back.

    Then in it turned out not to be a study but a deterrent. Yet more Goodel lies.

  91. Every month that this fiasco persists deepens Goodell’s PR disaster. I thought that was the ONE area where he was supposedly competent.

  92. You live a sad one goodell must go …….or elpresidente as you are known…..any new sit ins?

  93. Some guy named Dukeofearl or something says he’d have no problems giving up his cell phone so why should Brady. The problem with that duke is that you are a complete nobody and no one gives a crap about your life . On the other hand Brady is a famous NFL player married to a super model and any texts on his phone would be fair game, unless you can tell me some way to go through all the texts without seeing the ones to his wife. Personal texts of famous people …..hmmmm. Sounds like something the media would love to get copies of

  94. If this whole episode has done anything, it’s convinced me that the people who run the NFL are arrogant, bratty, and ultimately untrustworthy individuals.

  95. “Defending the wall”…….wall of tears…..we non pats fans drink your tears 🙂

  96. Ask any Ravens, Viking, Saints, Steeler, panthers fan what they think of Roger Goodell.

    His wildly arbitrary and inconsistent punishments are known all too well to fans of these and many other teams. His incompetence cost Ray Rice his career. Then the NFL lied and said they never saw the elevator video. Please.

    And some people can’t understand why the NFL would go after Brady and the Pats. NFL execs are human beings. What if they had the same mindset as any of the trolls on this site?

    You have to remember the chain of events leading up to Deflatgate.

    Two playoff games decided by terrible calls. Another one involved questionable trick plays. The league needed a distraction or misdirection.

    How about an embarrassed coach tipping off another coach about some possible PSI shenanigans.

    The league jumped on it right away. They had the perfect fall guy because so many people dislike and distrust the Pats.

    ESPN set the tone with 11 of 12 and then when the tide was turning in Brady’s favor the destroyed cell phone story.

  97. I have no idea what the verdict of the legal system will be, but the verdict of the scientific community is in, and we’re still baffled as to why the NFL didn’t just admit in January 2015 that they hadn’t done the PSI testing properly, and as a result they had no evidence of cheating.

    It’s like the scales on the side of the highway. If they’re not calibrted properly, any results are useless. Why spend millions of dollars trying to decide what the “most likely” meaning of the numbers is? Ted Wells has been reduced to making the following two arguments:
    a) Walt Coleman’s recollection that he used the gauge that measured pressures 0.4 psi higher is likely incorrect.
    b) the balls were deflated by less than 0.4 psi.

    No, really, this really is the argument the NFL is using!!

    And they are backing it up legally with the argument that Goodell is the “finder of fact” and cannot be legally challenged.

    Oh, and some guy sent a dubious text message 8 months earlier. And Tom Brady destroyed his phone rather than waive his privacy rights and turn over months of private text messages to an entity that could only be trusted to leak any and everything.

    The historical verdict here is not going to be kind to the Goodell regime, either.

  98. If you’re a fan of fooyball. all decisions are final. It’s a sport administered by a maniacle c9mmissioner. Nothing he has ever done is valid.

    Law-wise, yeah, maybe Goodell has a point. We have to ask ourselves if Goodell having a point is worth the sacrifice of the game.

    I, for one, say no.

  99. The scientific community doesn’t care , bro . The only ” scientists ” are the ones that constantly show up on message boards whenever this story comes up . And they’re always Patriot fans spouting off about Gas Laws and psi .

  100. Enjoy the science

    McNally in the bathroom with no urinal and both Colts and Pats Balls

    Enterprise of Espionage

  101. No , he didn’t . Another ” poll ” that no one has ever seen or heard of except …. Wait for it … Patriot fans .

  102. So here are a few undeniable facts:

    – The NFL never recorded or tracked ball psi, or even had a reliable and consistent means of checking it.
    – The NFL didn’t record ball psi before the start of the game with the Colts.
    – The NFL didn’t check all of the Colts’ balls at halftime, despite some of them being too low on psi.
    – The NFL disregarded expert witness about which gauge was used to check the balls, and instead purposely chose a lower range of psi measurements than what the referee testified he measured.
    – Someone at the league office leaked fake (low) psi numbers to the media and then the office refused to correct the false information, even when it was widely known to be false.
    – After the game in question, the NFL undertook no consistent recording of psi measurements to help determine whether its conclusions made any kind of scientific sense whatsoever.

    And THIS is the NFL’s open-and-shut case? The NFL does all of the above, but because Brady doesn’t want to give his personal phone to these weirdos, he’s guilty of something? Yeesh.

  103. My guess is that the court will side with NFL in totality, leaving Brady to appeal as his only option to have any chance to overturn. Based on the written opinion, it will be obvious that his chances will be very slim of prevailing. He will then try to work out a deal with the NFL and offer to settle. The NFL will only agree to a settlement under these circumstances that: (1) the NFLPA agree to the current CBA penalty/discipline clause giving Commissioner authority..(2) The penalty is reduced to not less than 2 games and Tom formally apologizes to the team, League and Fans. The wording will be crafted to show that while he may not take full responsibility, he knew and took actions contrary to the best interests of the league and rules. (3) NFLPA pays for 1/2 of the Attorney Fees incurred by NFL.

    Never happen, but that would be my starting point for negotiations if I was the NFL and I get the favorable ruling.

  104. It’s funny everyone wants to refer to the deflator nickname but no one wants to talk about the text about how the refs pumped the balls up to 16psi

  105. ProFootballTalk Poll

    Has a single person been convinced to switch sides of this argument since the day after the AFC Title Game when it started?

    A: Not one.

    B: No need for a B because A was the right answer.

  106. Tom Bradys actions are contemptible, cowardly, cruel and a clear demonstration of his inhumane instincts. Clearly a degenerate who needs to be punished to the maximum extent of the law. Ban Kraft, Belichick and Brady for life. They made the NFL dirty like 30’s boxing.

  107. Inhumane. Exactly what I was going to say. I’m glad someone is providing the appropriate perspective to common equipment violations in an athletic event.

  108. boytrin says:
    Mar 7, 2016 6:53 AM

    It’s funny everyone wants to refer to the deflator nickname but no one wants to talk about the text about how the refs pumped the balls up to 16psi

    —-
    That’s what makes this whole thing a laughable farce. It proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the league couldn’t give two chipmunk farts about air in footballs until this.

    It really is indisputable.

  109. a story jan 2015 in the WP about the Spygate punishments and what would happen if NE is involved with such stuff going forward – rehashed from 2008:
    ——
    People are upset that the owners are making sure Goodell handles NE cheating scandals as it was stated for the record in 2008……this is why DG is rolling on. It’s reality not a sham.

    But one of those people with knowledge of the NFL’s deliberations said last week that league officials viewed the Patriots’ potential violation as, if willful, “very serious.” And NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell perhaps provided a bit of a clue in a March 2008 memo that he wrote to the league’s competition committee in the aftermath of the “Spygate” scandal.

    Goodell vowed then to impose tougher penalties on future violators of the league’s competitive rules.

    “Too often, competitive violations have gone unpunished because conclusive proof of the violation was lacking,” Goodell wrote in that memo. “I believe we should reconsider the standard of proof to be applied in such cases, and make it easier for a competitive violation to be established. And where a violation is shown, I intend to impose more stringent penalties on both the club and the responsible individual(s). I will also be prepared to make greater use of draft choice forfeiture in appropriate cases. I believe this will have the effect of deterring violations and making people more willing to report violations on a timely basis.”

    In April 2008, the owners endorsed Goodell’s so-called anti-cheating measures.

    “As the Commissioner and Competition Committee, we must take every appropriate step to safeguard the integrity of the NFL,” Goodell wrote in the 2008 memo. “We have already taken some positive and significant actions this past season, but we must go further to ensure fair competition amongst our 32 teams and maintain public confidence in our game.”

  110. boytrin says:
    Mar 7, 2016 6:53 AM

    It’s funny everyone wants to refer to the deflator nickname but no one wants to talk about the text about how the refs pumped the balls up to 16psi
    _____________________________________

    Exactly. The “Proof? I don’t need to stinkin’ proof!” crowd prefers to ignore texts they can’t spin to fit their agenda.

    With respect to the Jets game where the balls were later determined to be at 16 psi, why blame the refs? If JM was supposed to release air from footballs after they had been approved by the officials, then he should have been the one blamed, shouldn’t he?

    How about the text JM sent to JJ at half time in Green Bay which read “Deflate and give somebody that jkt.” Since the Pats’ footballs that day were being handled by a ball attendant employed by Green Bay, JM’s use of “deflate” clearly can have nothing to do with footballs. Of course, that undermines the argument that “The Deflator” (used in a text which includes no reference to footballs) can only be about footballs, doesn’t it?

    Then there’s JJ’s text after the Jets game where he says “I just measured some of the balls. They supposed to be 13 lbs… They were like 16.” If Brady supposedly wants his footballs below 12.5 psi, why does JJ say they are supposed to be 13 lbs?

    The reason the anti-Brady crowd doesn’t want to talk about these texts seems pretty obvious, doesn’t it?

  111. firing Goodell doesn’t really address any of this


    Oh but it DOES my friend. 🙂 Firing Goodell would be a ray of light parting the dark gloomy clouds hanging around the sport I love.

    There is absolutely no leadership at the top. A real commissioner has integrity, something Goodell does not have – hence his lies again and again on just about everything – and certainly would never pound his chest and egomaniacally use matters of discipline to show the world he’s a big tough commissioner dude 😉

    A real commissioner does not make an concerted effort to make a “villain” out of one or two teams and get fans questioning the result each and every single time they win a football game. That’s a lot of things but it sure isn’t “integrity”.

    After Brady beats Goodell like a drum yet again in this court case, any “power” this commissioner has will be permanently neutered and thank gawd for THAT.

    🙂

  112. Oh brother . Patriot fans and their nonsensical drivel . I think I’ll go work out and ” deflate .” I have to go find my ball , though . I left it outside and it was a little chilly last night . I’ll probably need to put some air back in it . You see , the Gas Laws say that it should be lighter by 2 pounds or more of air because of the cold after a few hours , so I better go find it quick .

  113. tfarr45 says:
    Mar 6, 2016 11:41 PM
    The scientific community doesn’t care , bro . The only ” scientists ” are the ones that constantly show up on message boards whenever this story comes up . And they’re always Patriot fans spouting off about Gas Laws and psi .

    The only true believers …
    The true believers , only
    The believers , only true
    The believers true , only

    The Science of double talk enables the lazy broun dog to swiftly sleep over the pointless fox .
    One might consider that an educated , non evangelical , sort of individual with something to say , might find the incline to a consensus of educated thought as bearing ‘good’ fruit from the logic tree .
    Saying , claiming , that educated people don’t care , wow , bro …

  114. GoodellMustGo says:
    Mar 7, 2016 10:54 AM
    firing Goodell doesn’t really address any of this


    Oh but it DOES my friend. 🙂 Firing Goodell would be a ray of light parting the dark gloomy clouds hanging around the sport I love.

    There is absolutely no leadership at the top. A real commissioner has integrity, something Goodell does not have – hence his lies again and again on just about everything – and certainly would never pound his chest and egomaniacally use matters of discipline to show the world he’s a big tough commissioner dude 😉

    A real commissioner does not make an concerted effort to make a “villain” out of one or two teams and get fans questioning the result each and every single time they win a football game. That’s a lot of things but it sure isn’t “integrity”.

    After Brady beats Goodell like a drum yet again in this court case, any “power” this commissioner has will be permanently neutered and thank gawd for THAT.
    🙂
    ===============
    Goodell’s only job is to reel in rogue nonsense that limits max revenue streams….Having a rouge team cuts that down over time, no matter how much Kraft has influenced max revenue…his motives are 2 sided. His allegence to Roger over the years has been steeped in compromising the entire NFL position to make him richer. Parity blah blah. Stop CHEATING darn it!!

    Keep defending the wall El Presidente 🙂 🙂 🙂
    It’s WWE entertainment after all

  115. How Goodell can make a distinction between Favre and Brady not providing their phones says all you need to know about this mess and the future of the NFL.

  116. More troll stupidity. “If he doesn’t accept his punishment an opposing defense will.” So, you’re saying that if Brady relents to Roger The Corrupt, nobody will try to tackle him? I’ve seen absolute stupidity on here before (and much of it from you), but this is ULTRA stupid.

    See what I mean? There are stupid trolls and then there are ULTRA stupid trolls. But, hey, you posted it.

  117. And then there is EMBARRASSINGLY stupid. Like this gem: “the Gas Laws say that it should be lighter by 2 pounds or more of air because of the cold after a few hours , so I better go find it quick.”

    This troll can’t even comprehend the concept. Go back to grade school, junior, and start over.

  118. LOL ! Now I’m a troll and a junior .. Ok , lil Patriot ! You must be one of those ” ahem ” , scientists from New England sitting with your science book with your number 12 jersey on looking for anybody saying anything bad about ” poor misunderstood Tommy .” LOL!

  119. Goodell vowed then to impose tougher penalties on future violators of the league’s competitive rules.
    ———————–

    I think what everyone would like is Goodell applied those penalties evenly, to all teams.

    Instead, the Falcons and Broncos get off lightly while the Saints get hammered. Or the Jets and Steelers get small fines while the Patriots lose high draft picks.

  120. @dukeearl:

    Actually Brady’s team offered a transcript (not the actual texts from the phone company). Transcripts are useless since they could have been tampered with any number of ways.

    Myself, since I haven’t done anything wrong with my phone would have no trouble turning over my phone.

    Brady on the other hand, knew that the phone would be trouble for him so he naturally refused like any other liar would.

    Then destroyed the evidence. The acts of a guilty conscience.
    _______________________________

    The transcripts and texts came from the phone company. It’s in the NFLPA appeal, and the NFL (Goodell), refused to read them!

    And, you are saying that if your boss asked for your PERSONAL cell phone you would give it up?! If it was an NFL or TEAM phone he would have had to give it up just like McNally and Jastremski did…not his private phone, which by the way the NFL leaked texts and emails about Brady complaining about the price of a Pool Cover! These facts are so easy to check out, but you’d rather go with misinformation so you can be a TROLL!

  121. xxbarklikeadogxx says:
    Mar 6, 2016 8:16 PM

    And why did Kraft bend over and willingly give up $1M and a first round draft pick??? Not an ounce of resistance and he waived his appeal rights. Hardly the response of an innocent man, yes?
    ________________________________

    Kraft or any owner can not sue the NFL. If you took the time to do some research you’d see that it’s in the bylaws about owners suing the league!

    Someone posted about the NFL bylaws a few weeks back…I’ll see if I can find it for you and I’ll repost it.

  122. @xxbarklikeadogxx:

    I found this for you. Looks to me like this person did some homework:

    eddievortex says:
    Feb 22, 2016 2:18 PM

    Here’s the best reason I’ve found for why Kraft and New England can’t go after the NFL:

    The Patriots are members of a franchise of leagues and are contractually bound to follow the NFL’s constitution and other legal instruments. The NFL’s constitution makes clear teams can’t take their grievances to court and that any attempt to do so would likely be futile. Like the other 31 NFL ownership groups, Kraft has agreed to abide by the Constitution and assented to not sue the league or other owners.

    If Kraft determines that he has exhausted any internal appeals, he could attempt to take the matter to court. If a lawsuit advanced past a motion to dismiss, Kraft could force Goodell, Vincent and others to testify under oath. The same, though, would be true for Kraft, Brady(who already has testified Under Oath), and Bill Belichick, among other Patriots employees.”

    At this point, it is very clear that Kraft regrets the path he took in May.

    I am not a Patriots fan, but I don’t see how the NFL can keep those draft picks and money after the NFL and Goodell have been lying not only to the media but even to the court itself…IMO, it’s just wrong what the NFL has done and is still doing.

    53

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  123. “After the hearing and after the submission of post-hearing briefs, Mr. Brady’s certified agents offered to provide a spreadsheet that would identify all of the individuals with whom Mr. Brady had exchanged text messages during [the relevant time] period; the agents suggested that the League could contact those individuals and request production of any relevant text messages that they retained. Aside from the fact that, under Article 46, Section 2(f) of the CBA, such information could and should have been provided long before the hearing, the approach suggested in the agents’ letter — which would require tracking down numerous individuals and seeking consent from each to retrieve from their cellphones detailed information about their text message communications during the relevant period — is simply not practical.”

    In English, here’s what the footnote means: Although the text messages couldn’t be retrieved directly from Brady’s phone, his agents provided all of the phone numbers with which Brady exchanged text messages. His agents also said that the league could attempt to get the actual text messages from the phones of the people with whom Brady communicated, but the league refused to attempt to try, claiming that it would be too hard to track down the various people and to persuade them to cooperate.

  124. Roger Goodell prior to the appeal hearing …

    As I have said publicly, I very much look forward to hearing from Mr. Brady and to considering any new information or evidence that he may bring to my attention. My mind is open; there has been no “prejudgment” and no bias that warrants recusal.

    It’s a good thing Brady took the time to provide the phone records as “new information”.

  125. Ok, let’s start at Spygate. Memo comes out from NFL at beginning of season restricting where all teams can film from. Patriots film from same location that the used the previous seasons. NFL fines Patriots/takes draft picks/etc. A couple of months later the NFL rules are amended to what the memo stated. Patriot tapes are shown at press conference that the NFL called. Some of the tapes are then destroyed. Some, not all. Look up Jay Glazer of Fox Sports. He has a copy of at least one of the tapes.
    Onto Deflategate. Any trolls actually read the Wells Report? In it, the NFL (who paid for it) agrees that the ideal gas law exists and affects all footballs. So, if you’re against believing in that law, you disagree with the Patriots AND the NFL. The report states that the pressure drop should have been within a narrow range. Most of the Patriots footballs fell into that range when measured by the NFL at the playoff game. This means that the majority of Patriot footballs were not deflated by anyone in any location, bathroom or otherwise. A minority of the dozen footballs were a small amount lower than the calculated ideal gas law range. There was no testing of or mention of what happens to a football when it gets rained on. Basically, the leather gets softer the wetter it gets. Soften the football and it grows a little. That lowers the pressure in the football a little. That explains all the measured pressures for the Patriots footballs in that game. If the “deflator” or anyone else lowered the ball pressure after inspection, the measured pressures at halftime would have been lower than the measured.
    Phone destruction? Brady stated that he had accidently dropped his phone (in the Boston papers). Millions of people do that every year. He’s got personal stuff on the memory of that phone. How does he ensure that no one will be able to pick it out of the trash, get it to an electronics guru, and see stuff about him and/or his wife on TMZ? His assistant smashed the phone which broke the memory chips to ensure that nothing was left on it. Brady went publicly shopping for a new phone (bought an Apple) Evidence on the phone? Trolls want to view everything on it in hopes of finding an incriminating text or email. The NFL would have to get a subpoena to do that. A judge would have to be given the reason for getting to see the phone contents. The NFL didn’t know what was on it and didn’t try for a subpoena. Assuming that we are dealing with intelligent people, why would anyone email or text incriminating stuff. Meet in person and talk or phone call and talk. No records to be found.
    None of this matters. The courts are reviewing if Berman did his job correctly. Union/Management issues go to court all the time, but trolls don’t want that to be allowed in this case. There are federal rules covering union/management agreement. They overrule what is agreed to between a union and the NFL. The NFL is fighting this. It’s going to be months before I’d expect the results at this level. The testimony/questions in the first day does not determine the outcome. They want to make a ruling that will survive an appeal to the current process.
    I can’t help those who don’t believe what they read. TV reports can be biased as well. I recommend those who won’t try to learn more about this mess, just turn your computer and TV off. By next season, you can turn it back on after the fourth Patriots game 😉

  126. Tunnel Gate,
    Samboni Gate,
    Spy Gate,
    Deflate Gate,
    Phone Gate,

    One consistent, New England doesn’t have an honest employee.

    Enough! Ban Kraft, Belichick and Brady for life.

  127. the very best this could possibly go for *Tommy girl who eats cheaties for breakfast is to just have his suspension upheld but,because he’s such a giant smug, pouty, moron he’ll likely be facing obstruction charges and most likely be doing time once convicted..ahhh, if only he’d have told the truth and asked for forgiveness but no, mr giant ego who thinks he’s so much better than everyone else did exactly what a vain, conceited,low iq idiot does….try’s to lie and smile his way out of it…..lock him up and throw away the key…*Brady has cheated his last opponent once and for all….ALL HAIL ROGER GOODELL his legacy will forever be know as the comish who restored integrity to the game by taking down the most corrupt,cheating,dishonest HC/QB /owner,and team in all of professional sports *The Patriots winners of 4 asterisks

  128. johnwaldron8 says:
    Mar 8, 2016 1:00 AM
    Goodell vowed then to impose tougher penalties on future violators of the league’s competitive rules.
    ———————–

    I think what everyone would like is Goodell applied those penalties evenly, to all teams.

    Instead, the Falcons and Broncos get off lightly while the Saints get hammered. Or the Jets and Steelers get small fines while the Patriots lose high draft picks.
    ——-
    lets break this down. Each team has been forthcoming in admitting their guilt, they took their punishments, suspensions and fines and fell back in line. I didn’t see these above teams file lawsuits because they were sore in the bum. NE is ALL HUBRIS ALL THE TIME, act like they are gods gift to football…..they are just serial cheaters from Kraft all the way down to the Deflator.
    🙂 🙂 🙂

  129. lets break this down. Each team has been forthcoming in admitting their guilt, they took their punishments, suspensions and fines and fell back in line. I didn’t see these above teams file lawsuits because they were sore in the bum. NE is ALL HUBRIS ALL THE TIME, act like they are gods gift to football…..they are just serial cheaters from Kraft all the way down to the Deflator. 🙂 🙂 🙂
    ===============================
    Last time I checked the Patriots fully owned spygate. It’s widely known that Belichick thought the practice was completely legal, admitted guilt from day 1 and accepted the punishment. No lawsuit. No hubris. It’s fine to claim the Patriots weren’t forthcoming in spygate so long as you understand it’s 100% incorrect.

  130. Belichick didn’t fully own it. When he promised to give a better explanation as to why it occured he slacked off and didn’t reply on it. The Armen Kitean sit down was just not even worth the time. BB knew it was illegal as he was told about it many times.

    This is another lie by Pats fans to spin how minimal it was

  131. patstipoftheiceberg says:
    Mar 9, 2016 11:04 AM
    Belichick didn’t fully own it. When he promised to give a better explanation as to why it occured he slacked off and didn’t reply on it. The Armen Kitean sit down was just not even worth the time. BB knew it was illegal as he was told about it many times.

    This is another lie by Pats fans to spin how minimal it was
    ====================================
    Rubbish. But don’t take my word for it. You can see if from the Kitaen interview directly …

    “Belichick acknowledged when the rule was clarified by the league in September, 2006 – outlawing “videotaping of any type” during a game, he stepped over the line.”

    Here’s another “spin” …

    “We weren’t trying to be discreet about it. Again, in all honesty, we felt like what we were doing was OK.”

    BTW, it’s not just Pats fans that are supposedly spinning how minimal spygate was …

    We consider the tapes of our coaching staff during our games against the New England Patriots to be a non-issue. In our opinion, they had no impact on the results of those games. -Pittsburgh Steelers Chairman, Dan Rooney. Source: NFL.com

  132. lets break this down. Each team has been forthcoming in admitting their guilt, they took their punishments, suspensions and fines and fell back in line. I didn’t see these above teams file lawsuits because they were sore in the bum. NE is ALL HUBRIS ALL THE TIME, act like they are gods gift to football
    —————

    I get your act, but why would a team receiving a minimal punishment or having their infraction ignored complain about it? Look at the Jets and Chiefs tampering penalties. The Jets received a much lighter penalty compared to other teams, so why should they complain? Meanwhile, the Chiefs a significantly harsher penalty and aren’t happy about it.

    Also, no team, including the Patriots, has filed any lawsuits about league penalties.

    Finally, if you want to see football “hubris,” go watch a Rex Ryan or Cam Newton press conference.

  133. Can any Hateroid explain the D’Well Jackson lie that actually started this whole affair? You remember, right? This all started when D’Qwell intercepted a Brady pass and told a coach it was soft. You remember that, right?

    Except it never happened. Forget everything else and jusat consider that one FACT. They lied to get this going. Then they duped Mort into his tweet. Of course he was prevented from correcting it. He knew his job was on the line so he lock stepped and avoided answering questions anywhere but in Arizona when he thought no one was listening.

    So from the very first moment of this escapade, we have been fed lies. Lies about 11 of 12, lieas about not having enough time to test the colts balls (how convenient). Then there were the inconsistencies (another word for lies). 3 of 4 Colts balls were underinflated. Why no fine, loss of pick or suspension? Colts had been cheating previously, pumping in crowd noise when opponents were on offense.

    Can any Hateroid answer these questions, or will they just continue to lie along with Goodell et al and claim these are deflections?

  134. Everybody pretty much agrees the NFL lies. Unfortunately for Pats fans, the detractors feel the Pats lie more.

    This is really what all of these arguments back and forth boil down to.

  135. What a gong show. If Goodall keeps this up, Brady will have appealed this until he leaves the league.
    All because not one moron in the NFL league office has a grade 11 science education on the Ideal Gas Law. Surreal.

  136. svduran1 says:
    Mar 8, 2016 9:22 PM
    Tunnel Gate, What was that? There is no record anywhere of this. Making this up are we?

    Samboni Gate, You mean snowplowgate of 82 ? HC Shula was also offered the snow plow. He refused thinking he could then catch the Pats cheating Commish Rozelle wasn’t buying that

    Spy Gate, haters mantra

    Deflate Gate, still very much debatable as both sides have facts that can counter their case. Maybe more so the NFL side

    Phone Gate, see tunnel gate

    One consistent, New England doesn’t have an honest employee.

    Enough! Ban Kraft, Belichick and Brady for life.

    2 6

  137. Tunnel Gate: Yea when the Pats would open the tunnel to prevent the other team from kicking a field goal. Well documented.
    Samboni Gate: What are you a Patriots fan? Cheating is cheating and only a Patriots fan doesn’t think it is.
    Spy Gate: If no advantage was to be had, then why did they do it? To disgrace the franchise for infamy?
    Deflate Gate: Bottom line, off the charts lack of fumbles. Statistically never matched and very unlikely it ever will.
    Deflator Gate: Really? Losing weight, you would have to have an IQ lower than a soccer score to believe that.
    Phone Gate: Destroying evidence is an admission of guilt.
    Changing Brady contract: Now his contract is for only one million a year? Really, just another dodge. Another instance of the inability of the Patriots to have an ounce of integrity or honor. They have cheated and always will cheat.

    Enough: Get Kraft, Belichick and Brady out of the NFL.

  138. Tunnelgate? no site I see even knows what that is where is it documented? in your head? Were the Pats even punished for it?

    Snowplowgate HC Shula was offered the snowplow even Commish Rozelle would not call it cheating. Oh and Sambonis are for cleaning ice in ice rinks so I presume you means snowplows

    spygate I give you that but keep in mind one year earlier Manginin was caught spying that is why new commish Goodell cracked down on it the Jets only got a slap on the wrist

    deflategate will not further comment

    phonegate was not an offense as Wells said in his report that he did need the phone just what was on it and he got that

    I agree TB and Coach B should be gone so other teams can win. But answer me this all teams cheat yes? Why don’t the other teams win the even similar consistency

    As for my fan devotion I’ll let you guess that what I am is a fan who takes the time to educate himself as much as he can before he states his point I don’t make garbage up

  139. And this is how you show appreciation to the NFL after the tuck rule game! Lol Does anybody remember The deflate game? Indy playoff game. Indy lets Blount do his best Jim Briwn impersonation. Brady had nothing to do with it. If anything they should investigate the Colts run defense! What a joke with everything going on in this world….

  140. The tuck rule game? The rule was on the books for months before that game. It had been called in another game before the Patriots one. It was not a Patriot’s suggested rule that the NFL agreed to.

    Snowplowgate? A work release inmate on a John Deere lawn tractor with a rotating brush on the front was sweeping off the snow that was falling, exposing the field lines to benefit both teams. He swept where the Patriots were going to try to make a field goal. He did that on his own initiative. Patriots offered to have him do the same when Dolphins would try a field goal. The NFL reviewed it with no findings, no existing rule was broken.

  141. It was the Jets Pats game 9/23 with the Jets getting the call winning the game and the division that year

    Yes Commish Rozelle said not rules were broken

  142. Wind Tunnel Gate:
    Samboni Gate:
    Spy Gate:
    Deflate Gate:
    Deflator Gate:
    Phone Gate:

    We get it…the Patriots and all there fans are ridiculous cheaters. We can’t stand it…it has been nothing but a continuous string of absurd excuses for less than honorable behaviour. It would be better for the NFL if the New England franchise was pulled and relocated to another area with a new owner. We get it, you and all New England fans will always cheat and sling hash to cover it up.

    Go away, please just go away.

  143. Who needs to go away are the haters who try and try but well

    wind tunnel gate no one I have asked yet has answered were the Pats punished?

    samboni gate I am sick of this one it is snowplow gate sambonis are for ice my god #stupiity Oh and Rozelle said not cheating as HC Shula was also offered the SNOWPLOW and declined

    deflategate really? must I? It is so very easy to poke holes in the NFL’s case and the NFL lied in court recently

    Phonegate Wells said he did not need the phone just what was on it and he got that. Ho many times an how many ways can this be stated

    you forgot formationgate and tuckgate both of which were within the rules until the rule change after the incidents

    #haterstiringgoaway
    #rationalpeopletiredofyou

  144. svduran1 says:
    Mar 11, 2016 5:24 PM
    Tunnel Gate: Yea when the Pats would open the tunnel to prevent the other team from kicking a field goal. Well documented

    That was the Giants under Parcels that would
    (allegedly) do that. There is no such tunnel in Foxboro

  145. It was a mind game. Some opponents over the years believed that the Giants and Jets would open the stadium’s outer doors to create a sudden and strategic burst of wind through the tunnels leading to the field. (Wind and fluids, generally incompressible, squeeze through tighter channels at higher velocity, something called the Venturi effect, which is why wind whips between buildings in places like Manhattan.)

    The home teams routinely denied such gamesmanship, but did not mind the speculation. Now the lore is buried in the parking lot, perhaps alongside Jimmy Hoffa.

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