Why didn’t the Panthers trade Josh Norman?

AP

The massive contract given by Washington to former Carolina cornerback Josh Norman shows that, right or wrong, his new team values Norman much more than his old team did. The next question is whether Carolina could have gotten value for Norman in trade.

It’s unknown whether trade talks happened between the Panthers and any other team. The fact that the Panthers let Norman walk suggests that there was no offer ever on the table that would have been better than what the Panthers would get via the compensatory draft process in 2017.

While few fully understand the convoluted formula that determines who gets what and how via the compensatory pick process, losing a key player under the age of 30 loosely translates to a third-round selection the following year. Any trade now would have had to be better than that to get the Panthers to do anything other than let Norman leave, hopeful that he’d sign a new deal before May 12, the deadline for free-agency moves to count toward the compensatory draft-pick formula.

Still, the package that Washington provided to Norman invites speculation as to whether Washington would have coughed up a third-round pick this year, or more, in order to trade for Norman. Dan Snyder and company clearly see something in Norman that the team that had Norman in the building and on the field for four seasons didn’t, and that attitude may have translated to significant 2016 draft-pick compensation for Carolina.

48 responses to “Why didn’t the Panthers trade Josh Norman?

  1. Would they have been able to trade him without him having signed his franchise tag tender?

  2. Dave Gettleman is a pretty shrewd guy. Pretty sure he explored the trade possibilities for this year. However, a 3rd rounder next year will work too.

  3. Good job Detroit Lions for Not paying for this guy. We have bigger needs, and that paycheck would have crippled the team.

  4. Actually Scot McCloughan did the same thing in SF w/ Nate Clemens as did his hero/mentor Ron Wolf w/ Reggie White and Charles Woodson. BTW, Scot’s 1st draft netted the NFL’s leading rookie sack leader and several key contributors to NFC E champs. Norman see’s this team as young & on-the-rise. Time will tell. If Snyder was running things, RGIII w/ still be in DC and Gruden would’ve been fired.

  5. They didn’t do it for compensatory reasons.

    They risked getting nada via compensatory.

    Releasing him this late you can’t be sure what he would of got.

    He luckily got a good deal, but he could of easily been screwed and been offered half as much or less then that.

    At some point Norman could of said he’s going to sign a cheap deal with a contender (not Carolina) and hit free agency next year.

    He really easily could of signed a 1 year 3-5-7 million dollar deal, and if that was the case, Panthers would of probably gotten squat.

    They didn’t not trade him for compensatory reasons, they were just flat out stupid.

    Meanwhile now a guy they had under contract to help them make a Superbowl run, now isn’t… hurting their chances.

    Plus he will now play them week 15 @Redskins and he will be pissed off. Perhaps he picks off a Newton pass or two, and hand Carolina a loss.

    I’m not saying it would knock them from the playoffs, but it might knock them out of home field advantage… and that might be all it takes to ruin a season.

  6. Trade what exactly? Norman was not under contract, he was tagged but did not sign the tender

  7. This seems to be just what Gettleman said. He couldn’t get him under their cap long term. The reports are that they offered $44 mil over 4 years and about $23 mil guaranteed, which is around what Sean Smith got from the Raiders, and in the scheme of things, he was right to have turned down and for them to decide they couldn’t fit him if that’s all they could come up with. Panther fans under delusions that they won’t skip a beat without him need to get a reality check too. He was a poor man’s Richard Sherman in their scheme, so it’s going to hurt them. His work against QBs throwing to his side over the last 2 years speaks for itself, and that’s hard to replace either with a rookie or the players they currently have on their roster.

  8. Norman wasn’t “released”. He will net them the 97th pick in the draft in 2017, due to the contract he garnered in FA.

    Norman’s contract ended and he was franchised. After refusing to sign the tender, his tender was removed.

    Given the contract he wanted, no team would give up the $$$ required and the picks Carolina wanted. So the 97th pick (late 3rd round) is better than anything they could have gotten by trading him (outside of a player someone may not have wanted anymore… if Carolina wanted that).

  9. Gettleman should have told his agent to find a team willing to give up a 2016 3rd plus a vig and he’s theirs.

    Norman would sign the tender to be traded to the team offering the contract.

  10. Some of you are misguided here. The Panters did not cut or release Norman. They rescinded the franchise tender within the required time frame because Norman did not sign it. This made him an immediate free agent. Thus, the Panthers are entitled to the compensatory pick next season.

  11. Lot of misinformed, confused people in here.

    He got the non-exclusive tag which means he could negotiate with other teams and they could make offers. The catch here is that a team doing that would have to table two first round picks that Carolina would be entitled to as compensation if they couldn’t or didn’t want to match the offer. Nobody in this universe or probably several alternate ones would have been willing to do that. That’s a monster price tag and a pretty major disincentive to make that kind of move.

    As others have pointed out though, if he had signed his tender, the Panthers could have dealt him for pretty much anything. Once he signs, the cap hit is locked in and he’s under contract. He didn’t, so they couldn’t move him. Even if he had signed it, there needs to be a pretty specific set of circumstances for a tag and trade to even work.

    A long term contract would pretty much have to be in place first because nobody is going to send a draft pick out for a one year rental. This means that Norman, the Panthers, and the team trying to get him would all have to be in agreement on the terms. I get the impression people think that an NFL team can slap a tag on a guy and then just ship him out to the Browns and collect their picks and GMs are too stupid to realize it. No, it’s not that easy. Not at all.

  12. Well, many reasons.

    1. You’d want to control him going to an AFC team so you don’t get burned by him in the future.

    2. The above limits your trading partners.

    3. About 65-70% of the NFL is in some version of a cap hell right now due to the Flacco Contract Problem of 2013.

    Translation? Very limited trading partners, mainly because no one wants to even deal a 2nd rder AND pay an overrated CB 15 mil per.

    That’s why.

    The market really wasn’t there and then it meant Carolina just wanted the money off their books, hence the wise move to walk.

    The Jets are now in a similar situation with Mo Wilkerson and the Pats WISELY dealt Chandler Jones or a 2nd.

    Arizona now needs to pay both Calais Campbell somewhere close to Suh money and Chandler Jones Olivier Vernon money, while losing a key 2nd rd pick.

    It’s bad business.

    If you have an in-house base developed from the draft or UDFAs, etc, strategic, cheaper FA signings along the way for backups and STs guys, you can keep your leverage while paying those in-house All Pro types AHEAD OF SCHEDULE.

    Once you let that player go to his FA year, you’re cooked, especially if that player is still in his prime years window (27-30 years old).

  13. The truth is, neither team was dumb. The Panthers have a stacked defense and didn’t want to invest too much into 1 guy with so many good players coming due for extensions.
    The Redskins filled a major need without giving up any picks, which is more important in the short term than the cap space is.

    A trade would have changed the parameters, since cost = salary + draft pick compensation.

  14. Gettleman the idiot does not develop All Pro players for other teams???? That is what he said. Really?? He then goes out and signs scrubs and stiffs to one year contracts to fill huge holes in the secondary??? He gets nothing for developing an All Pro player and Norman laughs all the way to the bank. In Carolina, its in Gettleman we trust. I am not one who believes in Gettleman.. The Norman debacle is one of the reasons why.

  15. For people saying he didn’t sign the tender, they reportedly allowed him to seek a trade when FA started, so that was on the table. Anytime a player hasn’t signed the offer, it’s just a moot point because what are they going to do, hold out? It just gives them leverage to work on a long term deal with whoever the trade partner is. Carolina just came to the conclusion that with the draft right around the corner and the 4 year/$44 mil deal being the best they had, they couldn’t get anything better than the compensatory pick, which they knew they’d get, and they probably were right. I can’t name the last player who wasn’t a QB who was traded for anything higher than a 3 or 4.

  16. Panthers made a good decision. Norman made a good decision. Redskins are back to their idiocy.

  17. Buffalo Bills used the franchise tag on Peerless Price then came to an agreement to trade his rights to Atlanta for their 2003 first round draft pick.

  18. “I can’t name the last player who wasn’t a QB who was traded for anything higher than a 3 or 4”

    I can.

    It was Darrelle Revis.

    And it was for a first round pick.

  19. Still seems strange. The Patriots did a sign and trade with the Chiefs after they tagged MCassell, and they got the 34th pick in the draft. For MCassell! They did throw in MVrabel, but he was at the end of the line then. Even though a limited amount of teams have a ton of cap money this time of yr, it seems Carolina shoulda been able to get a 2nd for him, instead of the 97th-102nd next yr.

  20. Thought they could only trade him if he signed the tag. Otherwise, he isn’t under contract w/ the team. Might be wrong though…

  21. Some of you need to pay attention more. Josh norman did not sign his franhise tag. That means he was basicly a free agent that could not sign with anybody except the panthers. He did not get the non exclusive tag. And because carolina did not sign him to a contract and recended the offer. He became a free agent and and carolina is intilted to a comp pick. And you cant trade a player that has not signed his franchise tag. Because basicly he not yours to trade

  22. What a great move by carolina. Why tie up all that money josh norman would of got with the franchise tag. When they know they cant afford him long term. It basicly saved them 15 million.

  23. The Redskins have a 3rd year option. Only $36.9M is guaranteed. He’ll get $18M in the 1st two years and then Josh ‘ll need to get injured to collect $14 mil in the 3rd if DC wants out.

    The Skins secondary has given up 65 passing TDs in two seasons–the most in the NFL. Nobody lets a 1st Team All Pro CB walk in their prime. No brainier to sign statistically the 3rd best NFL corner to division where Dez & OBJ lurk.

    McCloughan is a Ted Thompson/Ron Wolf protege. Wolf/Thompson signed Reggie White & Charles Woodon under similar circumstances. McCloughan signed Nate Clemens as his 1st move in rebuilding in SF. They build from the edges. To think that this is Redskin business-as-usual is intellectually lazy and predictable hate. Only time will tell. “Nobody knows nothing”

  24. toorude86 says:
    Apr 23, 2016 2:36 PM
    Some of you need to pay attention more. Josh norman did not sign his franhise tag. That means he was basicly a free agent that could not sign with anybody except the panthers. He did not get the non exclusive tag. And because carolina did not sign him to a contract and recended the offer. He became a free agent and and carolina is intilted to a comp pick. And you cant trade a player that has not signed his franchise tag. Because basicly he not yours to trade
    _____________________

    Speaking of paying more attention, you are half right. Norman was in fact hit with the non exclusive tag that you claim wasn’t used. But had a team negotiated a deal with Norman by rule it would have cost them 2 1sts as compensation and that doesn’t constitute a trade. It also doesn’t constitute something any sane GM would contemplate, particularly with the rookie wage scale minimizing the cost of those picks.

  25. Absolutely key move by Carolina. They now have cleared up cap space so they can give Camera Newton more money. He has been pressing them stating that without him, there is no team. Go get ya sum Camera!!

  26. descendency says:
    Apr 23, 2016 11:45 AM
    Norman wasn’t “released”. He will net them the 97th pick in the draft in 2017, due to the contract he garnered in FA.

    Norman’s contract ended and he was franchised. After refusing to sign the tender, his tender was removed.

    Given the contract he wanted, no team would give up the $$$ required and the picks Carolina wanted. So the 97th pick (late 3rd round) is better than anything they could have gotten by trading him (outside of a player someone may not have wanted anymore… if Carolina wanted that).

    28 4
    ————————————————————-

    Just a hunch, but I’m thinking with the contracts given to Osweiler and Malik Jackson, the Broncos will have pick 97, the Panthers will have to “settle” for pick 98.

  27. Carolina could only trade Norman if he signed the tag, but if someone has a multi year deal on the table, as opposed to 1 yr guarantee, of course he gonna sign the tender. Then the new team, after completeing the trade, rips that up, and signs him to the new deal. That’s what Cassell did. It’s not rocket science. Carolina absolutely shoulda got something better than a pk in the high 90’s next yr. Several teams expressed interest.

  28. badbabyjane says:
    Apr 23, 2016 3:20 PM
    Absolutely key move by Carolina. They now have cleared up cap space so they can give Camera Newton more money. He has been pressing them stating that without him, there is no team. Go get ya sum Camera!!

    ———-
    Cam showed his true colors in the SB. He’s a choker and a coward. The Panthers need to find someone else to step up as the leader of the team. No chance the other players look to Cam in the future.

  29. There have been plenty of reliable beat guys in Charlotte reporting that they did attempt to find a sign and trade partner, but couldn’t find one so they rescinded the tag before he signed it and locked them into paying more than they really wanted to for a corner, even for one year.

  30. A stout front 7 will ALWAYS make your corners look better.

    If you want to get better against the pass, get at the passer, not the receiver.

    Norman is good but he’s also benefiting from a good front 7, Panthers knew this and they also know that Norman’s play alone wasn’t what gets them back to a SB.

    Panthers did the right thing.

    Norman will be invisible starting week 4 or so. Sure the talking heads will mention his name about FA signings but he’s not even the start of a pimple on Charles Woodson or Revis when it comes to CB play in the league.

  31. “Dan Snyder and company clearly see something in Norman that the team that had Norman in the building and on the field for four seasons didn’t, and that attitude may have translated to significant 2016 draft-pick compensation for Carolina.”

    I disagree. I imagine the Panthers have the same high opinion of Norman that the Redskins do. They just didn’t want to tie up that much money in a corner with the need to extend both starting DTs on the horizon. Our front 7 will be totally healthy at the start of the season, with some added depth, plus our other starting CB will be back. Losing Norman hurts, but it doesn’t cripple.

  32. They should have let him sign the franchise tag (something he said he was about to do). You can then trade him for 1st on draft day. I gotta think someone would trade a 1st for him. The only thing that makes sense is if they are considering looking up players now, but that hasn’t happened so leaving him walk without max compensation was a mistake IMO.

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