Should Hue Jackson have been able to go to Bengals after being fired by Browns?

AP

The decision of former Browns coach Hue Jackson to join the Bengals came after the Browns decided to fire Jackson during the season. And it has sparked a passionate debate in some circles regarding whether Jackson should have been able to jump ship to a rival.

Browns quarterback Baker Mayfield doesn’t think Jackson should have surfaced in Cincinnati. And Mayfield wasn’t bashful about responding to an ESPN video featuring Damien Woody suggesting that Mayfield is being hypocritical because he transferred from Texas Tech to Oklahoma.

Not even comparable,” Mayfield said in a comment posted on Instagram. “I didn’t lose 30+ games be fake and then do that. . . . I wasn’t gonna have a scholarship. Good try though buddy.” (It would have been better if he’d closed with, “Buddy boy.”)

The debate spilled over to PFT Live, where we’ll never contrive a disagreement but will fully unpack one that naturally arises. Peter King believes that coaches who are still being paid by one team should not be able to join another team unless the coach is willing to renounce any rights to financial compensation from his former team. I believe that the current system is fine as it is, and that coaches already sacrifice plenty of rights in an league that has yet to try to prevent a coach or an executive from carrying secrets from one team to another. (In Jackson’s case, the secrets didn’t help the Bengals.)

And here’s the simple reality: Coaches currently can get fired, get paid, and sign with another team because that’s how the industry works. If, as King wants, the Competition Committee were to propose a rule changing this approach, if the rule were adopted by at least 24 owners, if all teams were to incorporate standard contractual language implementing this restriction, coaches would have no choice but to accept, if those coaches want to coach in the NFL.

Coaches already give up enough of their rights to coach in the NFL, however. They have no collective bargaining protection (a union drive would never work because anyone pushing it would have to worry about being blackballed), their First Amendment rights are limited (fines are imposed for criticizing officiating, for example), and they waive the right to a jury trial regarding any legal disputes, agreeing to submit the case to arbitration by the Commissioner, who works for and is paid by each of the teams.

So even if it’s “unfair” at some level for a coach to leave one team and coach a rival in the same season, any further erosion of coaches’ rights could lead to even more erosion of coaches’ rights. Besides, if any team wants to prevent a coach from coaching another team, the simplest solution is this: Don’t fire him.

114 responses to “Should Hue Jackson have been able to go to Bengals after being fired by Browns?

  1. Should he have been allowed? Sure. Should the Bengals not hired him? Yep. Should the Bengals fire Marvin Lewis asap? Of course. Will the Bengals playoff drought continue into the next decade? Probably.

  2. Why is this even a question? If he cant go to the bengals, then no free agents should be able to sign to a team from his prior division, or no player should be traded within their division. its stupid, sometimes baker mayfield is stupid

  3. Where has Hue ever coached and won consistently. He is a shadow. A poser of a coach. Sorry, you just can’t win when Hue Jackson is on your team.

  4. I’ve always agreed with what King says about fired coaches getting paid by more than one team. As far as Baker and Hue go, I think they both have good arguments. Hue goes to Cinci to PO the Browns because he didn’t think he should have been fired. Baker doesn’t like that he went to a division rival. Thing is; winning is all that matters. If anybody wants to tell someone to grow up, Hue is the one that needs to hear that. He started crying on hard knocks and did it in his ‘post firing pressers’. And after the game in Cinci on Sunday, he’s probably still crying…!!!

  5. Meh. It’s an awkward situation when a fired head coach shows up on the opposing sidelines this quickly, but I think that’s a pretty rare case. Could Hue have given the Bengals some useful inside information? Probably. But it evidently didn’t help.

  6. I think the Patriots have done this with McDaniel’s. St. Louis also did it with McDaniel’s when he was let go by Denver.

    If a player gets cut they are free to sign. Why not a coach? Unless there was something written into the contract, then it’s a free market.

  7. The debate centers around the ” morality” behind it. Not legality. Or financial commitments. How MORALE is anybody in life that leaves 1 group of players he has ” supposedly” tried to nurture, mid season, and then jumps on to a completely different team with the blink if an eye. You have to question that persons commitment in the 1st place. What is the job……….flipping hamburgers at McDonslds vs Burger King? Morality here…..

  8. The optics dont look good. As if he Jackson was lobbying for a hire because he knew he was getting fired. He shouldn’t have been allowed to coach in training camp. It is what it is, best for all parties involved.

  9. All this does is shine more light on the fact that Mayfield is an arrogant punk and a social turd.

  10. I would think that any employer that has fired an incompetent employee would be happy to see that ex-employee go to a competitor.

  11. What rights are coaches giving up to coach in the NFL? Unlike players, I think most of their contracts are guaranteed and most make several million dollars a year. Makes no sense Florio.

  12. Mayfield, having his own opinion of a man that would stoop to that morale, is far more mature to say whst he said than Hue is himself as a egotistical back stabber. And, a very lousy coach.

  13. This is the business side of the game, regardless if you think Hue deserves another job or not he was offered one and took it. Us regular working folks leave for competitors all the time, not a big deal at all.

  14. It’s not jumping ship if you were fired. He has a right to earn a living, so as long as there’s no rule prohibiting another team from hiring him, I fail to see the issue.

  15. Maybe when they cop had to tackle Mayfield he knocked some brain cells loose; because Baker seems to forget that the NFL is a job and players/coaches that been released/fired have went to play/coach for division rivals for years.

  16. Mayfield needs to remember that he’s still a rookie. In other words, he should shut up.

  17. All depends on the contract. I have a non-compete clause in my agreement with my employer. If I were to quit, I could not go to a competitor within 2 years of leaving. If I am fired, the employer has the option to essentially pay me to not go to a competitor or I am released from the agreement. It sounds, on the surface, like Hue is being paid by the Browns while working for the Bengals but it all comes down to the contract.

  18. nbwalter says: Of course he should. Is this not America? You get fired but are restriced in your employment options moving forward? Ridiculous
    wouldn’t describe it as moving forward…maybe as moving on…

  19. my patriots did this with Josh McDaniels. He was fired by the Rams, and we signed him as an offensive Consultant and associate head coach. When Billy O’Brien took the Penn State job, Josh became the full time Offensive Coordinator.

    And yet conspiracy theorists believe that we rehired josh to “get information on the Broncos.” Not that they sucked because Tebow had NO IDEA what he was doing as QB. and it showed in January in the big Razor.

  20. I think the issue between Baker and Hue is deeper than going to the Bengals. Let’s not forget, Hue refused to give 1st team reps to Baker, embarrassed Baker on TV by suggesting he shows up late for practice, went on TV tour after being fired and essentially said he preferred Watson and Wentz. Now to most adults in the real world these are minor issues and part of everyday life but to a millennial like Baker they are not. Deep down I’m sure Hue understands where Baker is coming from and hopes one day Baker will understand where Hue comes from.

  21. I’ve heard of sour grapes before, but this takes the cake. If Hue Jackson is so incompetent like everyone says he is, wouldn’t you want him in your rival’s locker room?? In fact, wouldn’t you happily pay his salary to go to your rival’s locker room? I mean, how many times have we seen the Patriots sign a guy that had just been cut from a team they’re getting ready to play? I don’t remember Peter King or anyone having an issue with that. The reality is the Bengals are already familiar with Hue and Hue is familiar with them. Oh, and the Bengals are cheap. Also, why should a team like the Browns be let off the hook for Hue’s salary? It was their mistake.

  22. And for those of you too young to understand yet: There is this thing in the business world called a non compete clause. Many powerful important businessmen must sign one. It states that if you leave a business, you cannot under any condition take a job with a competing company for a period of time. It is there to protect company policies, patents, customers, etc. Peter Kings suggesting that the NFL maybe should consider having them

  23. “He shouldn’t have been allowed to coach in training camp.”

    This is true. He definitely shouldn’t have been allowed to coach in training camp. Or at any other point.

  24. If your firing Hue you should encourage him to work for another NFL team. Especially a division rival.
    I understand the hurt feelings too though. These guys are generals and it is inconsistent with our view of the world that generals and switch sides.

  25. factschecker says:
    November 27, 2018 at 4:06 pm
    I think the Patriots have done this with McDaniel’s. St. Louis also did it with McDaniel’s when he was let go by Denver.
    ———————————————
    McDaniels was effectively on the Pats staff for Super Bowl 46 only though, and certainly not against his former team. It was also a case of him basically being rehired to retake his former role of OC as Bill O’Brien was already committed leaving to go to Penn State after the season. I doubt he had any serious input into the game plan against the Giants.

  26. Funny how this topic really never surfaced before……..because its almost unprecidented. Does that make Hue “smarter” than all the average bears that have ever been fired? Or, just far less moral? I say the latter

  27. This is the stupidest question I’ve ever seen. He got FIRED by the Browns so of course he should be able to go to the Bengals!!

  28. So Baker went to a rival school because he was going to get fired (lose his scholarship)? He has a lot more in common with Hue that I thought

  29. Peter King believes that coaches who are still being paid by one team should not be able to join another team unless the coach is willing to renounce any rights to financial compensation from his former team.

    Good ol’ Pete. Always looking out for fairness. What a swell guy he is.

  30. If you want to keep your loser coach from joining division foes mid-season, then wait til after the season to fire him

    Or can he never again work in the same division he was a head coach in?

  31. If the Browns are still paying him, why would they fire him? Can’t they keep him on staff, but limit his role to essentially nothing? Is there a contractual issue there?

  32. This anti-Mayfield sentiment is just Damien Woody and others drumming stuff up to fill a day or two of sports talk tv and radio. Can’t say I blame him though. It’s got to be tough to fill all that air time.

    And when did all these handshakes evolve into an obligatory hug?What was Mayfield supposed to do? Allow Hue to literally embrace him to make things right with ESPN?

    Also,you now see European soccer where the hug now comes with a kiss.Hue just might be the first NFL type to try to kiss a player. I would like to see Damien Woody invite Hue to First Take and see where thing go.

  33. The NFL does not limit the 1st Amendment Rights of ANY of their employees, and they are not in any way capable of doing so. The 1st Amendment prevents the government from prosecuting someone for their opinion, it does not give someone the right to use the notoriety of their employer as a soap box for their personal views and employers have absolutely zero responsibility under the 1st. As a lawyer, you must know this and choose to ignore it in order to push an anti-authority. anti-NFl narrative.

  34. Who in the hell does Baker Mayfield think he is?? Dude shutup and play. Hue is gone, so move on. You are 23 years old and you have about 8 games on your NFL resume and your saying that a grown ass man shouldn’t go work? 10 years from now when this is brought up he’ll say he was young and stupid yada yada yada…

  35. I mean the analysis here is dead on, so I have no complaints, but the question itself is infuriating. Of course Hue Jackson can take a job with the Cincinnati Bengals mid-season. The Cleveland Browns keep recycling coaches/ GM’s constantly. I love the fanbase in Cleveland– they deserve better than Jimmy Haslam. The answer is simple– if you don’t want your coach going to your rival midseason, don’t fire your coach midseason. Period. The Steelers don’t. Even the Colts with Pagano (my team) waited till the end of the year. I like Baker. I like some of the young players. The organization needs to get their act together.

  36. Mycommentisawaitingmoderation, yes baby Huey was gored by the Browns. But the browns are still paying his contract, 5 mil a year. Are you telling me Hue is as bad a financier as a head coach and can’t budget to live on 5 mil a years ?!?! He has to feed his family, ha ha ha, those must be some grocery eating kids if the eat that much !!

  37. dl101693 says:
    November 27, 2018 at 4:18 pm
    And for those of you too young to understand yet: There is this thing in the business world called a non compete clause. Many powerful important businessmen must sign one. It states that if you leave a business, you cannot under any condition take a job with a competing company for a period of time. It is there to protect company policies, patents, customers, etc. Peter Kings suggesting that the NFL maybe should consider having them

    —-

    And for those to old to realize that things don’t really work this way anymore….they don’t work that way anymore. Almost never. Courts have realized that top execs tend to get jobs in their industries, and to stop someone from getting gainful employment has worse optics than an NCC. I have been a top exec in multiple, multi-billion $ companies and on exit have never had to sign an NCC. I have also never required a VP to sign an NCC.

    And the reason is simple. Sometimes we let someone go for x. Sometimes we let someone go for y. We almost never let someone we care about working for the competition go. Browns shouldn’t care about letting a bad coach to a division rival….you should support it.

    Non-competes? Very rare in the real world. That is like Mad Men kinda stuff.

  38. No brainer. Of course, he should be free to sign anywhere he wants to. Cleveland did fire him, right? They told him to go away. There’s no way they should have any say over what he does next. Nobody put a gun to their head and made them sign him to a long contract. I presume what they pay is reduced by what the Bengals are paying him (if not, that should be the case, right?).

    When Baker Mayfield is released he’ll have the same rights.

  39. It’s a business. The current rules allow a coach to be fired, take a new job, and still collect on his old job. Baker Mayfield needs to grow up and get past it. Hue Jackson was out of work, his old friend offered him a job, and he took it. As long as the rules allow it, what’s there to be pissy about?

  40. The only way this works out any better for the Browns is if the Bengals hire Hue as head coach and give him a 10-year contract b/c there’s no way the Bengals will fire him before it’s up and pay him to not coach.

  41. Rookie mistake by Mayfield. He should realize that moving Hue Jackson downstate likely reverses the position of both teams in the standings.

    Browns are clearly better without Jackson, and the Bengals are clearly worse with him.

  42. NFL coaches toe the line in order to keep the million$ of dollar$ coming in to their pockets. End of discussion.

  43. People give up “rights” all the time in exchange for employment. Not all “rights” are equal, but one of the more important “rights” is the “right” to work for whom you choose. In return, you agree to comply with the employer’s constraints. The notion NFL coaches should be unencumbered from basic common sense business practices is “wrong”.

  44. stickyditka says:
    November 27, 2018 at 4:42 pm
    If the Browns are still paying him, why would they fire him? Can’t they keep him on staff, but limit his role to essentially nothing? Is there a contractual issue there?

    —-
    In England they call it gardening leave. They do it a lot in Formula One racing. You remove a key person (engineer, team principal) right now because it isn’t working out. You sit them on the side lines because even if things weren’t going right with them, they know too much. So, you cut them out until the contract expires and they are told to “Go tend your garden”. Some people have sat on the side lines for multiple years, especially car designers. Sometimes a large wad of money changes hands from the future employer to current employer to let the person leave.

  45. This literally is about nothing because it has happened always forever and a day. Also as pointed out, it didn’t make a hill of beans like it never makes a difference unless you were the Raiders in the Super Bowl they lost to Tampa because you were to dumb to change your playbook over a calendar year.

    For the Browns to have been so bad for so long, there sure is a lot of news about them. Also, doesn’t Baker Mayfield have a few too many rabbit ears for a starting QB? He’s always on social media reading what people are saying about him and more crazily trying to respond to everyone. I hope his few good games keep up because ask others who have been bright fleeting shooting stars, the media and fans love to pile on when you start falling, and being in that Brown organization, I’m guessing your likelihood of falling is a whole lot more likely than not.

  46. I think Baker is not really meaning for it to come out this way. I think his frustration is that he was never given a chance to compete for the starting job and that message is just coming out in a different way.

  47. To prevent Hue from going to Cincinnati would be a restraint of trade and he would win BIG in the courts if those preventing him from making a loving were found culpable.

  48. Since Cleveland fired him,Hue Jackson has a right to seek employment elsewhere,even in the same division. Let Baker Mayfield think whatever he wants. What I don’t get is this position that the Bengals invented for him…special assistant to the head coach? God knows that Marvin Lewis doesn’t need any assistance in losing games.

  49. If a player gets cut, he’s free to sign anywhere. If a lawyer, Dr, School teacher ect is let go. Are they free to work anywhere they want? Of course, and they should. If Peter King is fired should he not be able to work at PFT or write for ESPN? Unless there is a contract saying you can’t work for a competitor for a certain time frame (I’ve seen this before) then you should be free to work anywhere, free Enterprise.

  50. So I watched Florio/King and I think they both have points. On the one hand (Florio) no one should be denied employment because of non-competes (and to my previous point, we really don’t use those anymore in business. Optics are bad.) As a Browns fan we should even be happy about letting Hue coach elsewhere. But King does bring up a good point. Should there be a limit? Different than players, coaches can upset the competition in the league. Do you differentiate?

    Excellent one.

  51. If they dont want him to go to another team in the middle of the season, then dont fire him until the end of the season. Seems pretty simple to me.

  52. Waaaaahhhhh it’s unfair…. for crying out loud. Pull up your Garanimals, wipe the snot from your nose, and get into real life. FRAGILE FRAGILE FRAGILE.

  53. It’s not a millennial thing, it’s the fact that a shady dude who made everyone around him miserable and failed at his job decided to show up at the competition’s front door. If anything, the Bengals or any team who hires, should have to pay that contract. Never heard of a FA or released player getting to keep his original contract when signing with a team so coaches have it good. They still get that contract paid out by the team. As pointed out, it obviously didn’t help but to see your former head coach on the opposing sideline two weeks later probably doesn’t make people happy. It wasn’t a coordinator or trainer, it was the head coach. He wasn’t doing it because he needed to pay bills, he did it to get some kind of revenge.

  54. How is this even an issue. The man was fired by one team and gets employed by another. Am I missing something. This happens with players all the time.

  55. First of all… We are talking about a contract here and contract law. So, if the Brown’s didn’t want him to do this, they could just put it in the contract.

    Second of all… The first amendment pertains to the government passing laws to abridge our rights to free speech. The first amendment does not mean you can say whatever you want whenever you want without consequences.

    Of course, a Lawyer doesn’t comprehend this fact of law… wow.

  56. Never heard of a FA or released player getting to keep his original contract when signing with a team so coaches have it good.
    **********************

    So, you’ve never heard of a guaranteed contract? A player’s signing bonus is their guaranteed part of the contract – a coach actually has a contract that stipulates his term and value and it’s binding.

    Oh, and Baker, when u get cut in the future, let’s see what you have to say about a divisional rival wanting to possibly sign you and see what you do.

  57. Wait. Did they also interview a white guy before they hired Hue? Or was he simply the best candidate for the job based on his stellar work history?

  58. People talk like Hue is the head coach. Let me tell you, if the Bengals wouldn’t of been so banged up, the Bengals would of won the Brown game and then the comments would be pro Hue. Let the man earn a living. The Browns were a bad team before Hue, so lets not try to access blame on him. That being said, hopefully the Bengals start fresh with someone else next year.

  59. Mayfield’s anger was manufactured and his argument was strange, for a split second I wondered if Jackson was his best friend and started dating his ex….Watching Will Cain defend it provided some comic relief. If ESPN fired Cain and Fox came through with an offer I have no doubt that Cain would at least listen.

  60. But heaven forbid if you hire someone before interviewing someone of minority… It’s like basing someone’s worth on skin color not them as a person

  61. Bob says:
    November 27, 2018 at 4:33 pm
    Peter King believes that coaches who are still being paid by one team should not be able to join another team unless the coach is willing to renounce any rights to financial compensation from his former team.

    Good ol’ Pete. Always looking out for fairness. What a swell guy he is.

    —————————————————————————————

    I totally disagree with Peter King because if it isn’t in the coach’s contract (that he can’t go to work for another team for a specified term) then he has the right to be go to any other team who wants to hire him. If he’s still being paid by the team which fired him, well too bad for them. They should hire better lawyers when they make out these contracts.

  62. As a Browns’ fan and big fan of the NFL my take is as follows: I think the league should not allow a coach to go to team in the same league year if the team the coach is going to has games left with the team from which he was fired. If he wants to join the Bengals after the season… fine. But (theoretically) it gives the receiving team a major advantage …. I would prefer if Mayfield had just said, “No comment” …. but I agree with him in his disagreement of Hue going to Cincy.

  63. Why not, he should be able to go wherever he is offered a job, if the Browns are complaining about where he’s working then maybe they should not have fired him… or written a contract more favorable to their organization when they initially hired him.

  64. All of these Browns “fans” complaining because their team fired their coach and a division rival hired him… once you fire him you can’t tell him where he can or cannot work… make up your mind Cleveland fans.

  65. I think its funny that people think a coach being fired still needs to be able to make a living.
    The fired coach IS making a living. In this case the Browns were still paying him. Its not like he needed to find a job and the Bengals rescued him from needing to load up on Roman Noodles and Mac n Cheese.

    Why isn’t the solution instead of firing the coach, reassign him to a position in the consulting department and have him “work from home?”

  66. Often a team will still provide a dismissed coach with a title, such as consultant, to simply not show up to work. This is done for the very reason of maintaining control as related to this exact situation. If the coach wants to coach elsewhere it is worked out so that the new team is paying part of a single compensation, the former team benefits financially in such an arrangement.

    So is it possible that the Cleveland Browns failed to dot a few i’s and cross a few t’s? An organization that is among the worst in pro sports since day one of the this owner taking control? Maybe it isn’t Jackson or Cincinnati that should be put under the microscope for this embarrassment.

  67. I wish to add…Unlike coaches, players must go through wavers process. If coaches are still being compensated by their former teams it does not seem right that they can be getting compensated to work against the team that is already compensating them.

  68. I think people are getting lost in the idea of sharing secrets that obviously didnt work. If there is an issue, then the commissioner needs to be the one to address it. We are talking about 2 teams that, yes are in the same division, however they were both created, and founded by a man that would be pretty upset about all of us not even recognizing the love for the game and trying to complicate things and make it a legal matter. Is it seriously a discussion given that the browns stomped the bengals? God help us because what would have happened if the bengals won? This kind of mind set is exactly what is leading many things down the toilet bowl..

  69. FYI to all the experts here. Most of corporate America will sue you if you go to work for a competitor within 12 months of leaving. Let alone, continue to pay you $4.6M.

  70. As a computer contractor working through a contracting company, I commonly have to sign a non-compete agreement which prevents me from taking an in-house job or another contracting gig at a client I was introduced to by the company I worked for for some period of time, generally 18 months to two years. If the Browns didn’t have such an agreement in place (and, knowing the Browns, I would not be in any way surprised to learn they didn’t) then that’s their problem. OK, Hue Jackson may arguably be the worst head coach in NFL history – I don’t have numbers to prove or refute that – but frankly if I was the owner of the Browns and Jackson wanted to go to work for one of my competitors I’d say “Go to it, and good luck”. It appears that the new offensive coordinator for the Browns has changed the offense around a great deal in only a few weeks, so Jackson’s familiarity with the Browns old offense is probably not particularly helpful.

  71. If he is allowed to join another team in season, and a division rival no less, then the team that fired him should no longer have to pay him.

  72. I equally have to sign a non-compete agreement in my profession which is why I am terribly confused, especially at Timpiker’s expert comment of getting sued in corporate america for leaving and joining elsewhere within 12 mos. It’s called a contract which is a legally binding agreement that I’m sure everyone signed off on which makes this a matter of opinion and moral value rather than a legal issue.. since when did corporate anything hold values or be concerned with what’s right, as opposed to making money??simply put, get over it. Maybe corporate of said organization will plan ahead and make a better contract to avoid this even being a discussion in the future..

  73. I expect these paragons of business who own these teams to be able to write a contract that prevents this sort of thing. I expect these smart entrepreneurs to use “relief of duties” or “reassignment” or “relocation” or other concepts not so hard to think up to prevent this problem. That they don’t tells me they don’t care. Oh, well: It ain’t my money or my team.

    As for Mayfield, I don’t blame the young man. This wasn’t just any coaching staff member, this was the HC. Mayfield was expected to buy into his HC’s system and commit himself to his team and his teammates and his coaches. Jackson didn’t even have the decency to wait out the rest of the season WHILE BEING PAID WELL before jumping to an in-division rival, and using everything he knew about his old team against them.

    Sure, Jackson had every right to do what he did. But he ought to have waited until after the season.

  74. Hue was in the drivers seat when he signed the deal. The Browns were terrible and he was a hot OC with some head coaching experience. I honestly thought it was a great hire. I was hoping that he would be Belichick or Pete Carroll as they failed in their early coaching gigs and then became successful. What we got was a joke. A guy who made us worse and threw everyone under the bus. It’s actually shocking as he comes off as a nice guy. What is amazing is that the contract has no offset, but again the Browns were bad and nobody wanted to coach them.

  75. Didn’t Baker Mayfield transfer from a Texas school to Oklahoma? Nothing like stabbing Texas in the Back, Baker. Your Hypocrisy knows no bounds.

  76. History is making it very clearly that Boomer Esaison must have been really really good. Too young to know, but hard to dispute these days

  77. What’s wrong with Mayfield? Hue’s a loser, if it were me I’d be rooting for one of my division foe’s to hire him!

  78. This is the good old USA and the answer is h### yes. If the morons running the Browns didn’t want Hue in Cinci then they should have held on to him. Mayfield just needs to shut up and play because he is known for saying and doing stupid things.

  79. Baker Mayfield is exposing his stupidity. So the brilliant plan by the front office to tank year after year had nothing to do with losing all those games? Why is everyone listening to some self absorbed rookie?

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