Officials flagged Lions for lining up with 12, didn’t flag Packers for 13

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It’s been overlooked in the slew of criticism the officials have received for other blown calls, but a key penalty that was called on the Lions early in Monday night’s game was later not called on the Packers.

With the Lions leading 13-0 in the second quarter, the Packers faced fourth-and-5 and sent their field goal team on the field. The Lions, however, had 12 players on the field as the Packers lined up, and the officials immediately blew the whistle, giving the Packers five yards and a first down.

That was the right call: Under NFL rules, lining up with more than 11 players in the defensive formation is a penalty. The officials are supposed to shut down the play before the snap, and that’s what they did. It turned out to be incredibly costly for the Lions, as the Packers scored a touchdown two plays later.

But on the very next possession, the Packers committed the exact same penalty. Only it should have been even more obvious to the officials, because the Packers, in their confusion to make a defensive substitution while the Lions were in no-huddle, actually lined up 13 players on defense. Instead of shutting the play down and giving the Lions five yards, the officials allowed the Packers to call timeout to get the right personnel on the field.

That turned out to be incredibly costly for the Lions as well: Matthew Stafford was sacked after the Packers got the right personnel on the field following the timeout, and the Lions had to punt.

The officiating on Monday night was inexcusable, and most of the mistakes went against the Lions. When a lot of officiating mistakes go against you and you lose by one point, it’s hard to come to any conclusion other than that you got robbed.

188 responses to “Officials flagged Lions for lining up with 12, didn’t flag Packers for 13

  1. Thanks MDS. After the phantom hands to the face x 2, the obvious PI on the deep ball that wasn’t, and the personal foul for sliding to catch the football, this makes me feel so much better.

  2. We can tear apart every game like this.

    Score touchdowns instead of 5 field goals and it’s a blowout.

    That is what the players can do.

  3. Look, it is clear as can be the Officiating crew were throwing this game to the Packers. There is zero doubt it was intentional. Too one sided and too blatant.

  4. The missed holdings and stuff are easy to understand, but not being able to manage the game properly and count players while making up phantom calls and missing the open field PI are not easy to understand. Im not yelling fix, but a casual observer would compare it to WWE.

  5. Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.

  6. Just an utter disgrace how bad the officiating has been. So many game altering calls especially late in so many games! WTF is wrong with them! They’ve killed the golden goose!

  7. the nfl has middle aged men out there chasing 4.5 40 yd athletes around and they cant even count!!
    its time for officials to be trained ATHLETES who can count and who arent blind.
    it shouldnt be that hard, thousands of college athletes dont move forward in their chosen profession, there is a good talent pool to start with.

  8. They didn’t flag the packers for pass interference when defender clotheslines a defenseless receiver in the 4th quarter either. Clearly a fix, when when the Lions have to beat the ref as well.

  9. I can’t stand it. The league is scripted. At least partially.
    Rodgers and the Packers were chosen long ago as a story he NFL wanted played up….and this garbage keeps happening.

    I can’t watch a game that isn’t real.

  10. Can we see the forest through the trees?  Is it right there hiding in plain sight right in front of us?

    Last night’s Lions vs Packers game really solidified my opinion that the NFL is determining the outcome of games. Is it coincidence that the NFL began to lobby for the legalization of sports gambling after being utterly opposed to it for decades?  Is it coincidence that he NFL recently relocated a team to Las Vegas?  Is it coincidence that the NFL has changed the rules on replay which can change the outcome of a game based on a subjective viewpoint?  Is it coincidence that the NFL put Al Riveron in a position to use that subjective view to rule on those plays and give him total autonomy without any checks and balances?

    Why now?  Why all these changes that point to one place?  Las Vegas. Where there is smoke, there is usually fire, and we can’t see the forest through the trees because it’s thick with smoke.

  11. Goodell.

    The media needs to ask Goodell how and why this is happening when these officials are paid so well and never admit to doing anything wrong.

    At least have the guts to pose the question instead of avoiding doing your job.

    Pats fans have been watching Goodell try to swing seeding for years and years, especially when Manning was with the Broncos, so we’ve seen dozens of games where at the end, a series of phantom calls occur or calls that should be called, somehow aren’t in favor of NE.

    NE fans also see a lot of calls come out of the woodwork when NE has big leads in games, as he tries to help the other team for ratings purposes.

    We’ve seen it all.

  12. Horrible officiating and even worse pass defense by the packers who are healthy back there. Stafford passed for 168 yards in two series and Mr Rodnuts hadnt completed one pass. The receiviers the packers so coveted are slow, cant run routes and drop a lot of passes. Sure they would love to have a Stephan Diggs going deep.
    My take based on the play last night is the packers got their present last night and its downhill from here. Its an avg team at best

  13. Gotta keep the Rodgers legend alive. Looked like he was gonna lose the game, so they called a couple obviously bias penalties to help him out a bit. This is the NFL. Garbage.

  14. The officiating was a disgrace. Lions should have won going away but the refs had so many phantom calls on them they couldn’t get in sync.

  15. I dislike both teams.. but what i realize the more i get older football is the WWE! The NFL is a joke! Plan and simple! I’m getting sick of not bad officiating, but obvious favored calls. You have a multi billion dollar business paying part time officials. The NFL uses this excuse to control the so called bad calls. After watching this game and multiple games this season.. I feel like that kid when i found out the WWF was not real. This game was obviously rigged with a predetermined outcome. I’m done spending all my time watching all this lame football. What an embarrassment on the NFL.

  16. As a saints fan i feel the lions fans pain. But all off season 31 other fan bases bashed us and said “get over it”. Yet 31 our 32 owners felt the need to make an adjustment so that their fanbase doesnt get hosed. The nfl and refs just dont care, theu do what they want knowing they dnt need to explain anything to us. At the moment packers fans are going to say get over it, until it happens to them. Sadly this has been a problem wayyyy before the nola no call and it will continue to be an issue.

  17. That has to be one of the worst officiated games I’ve ever watched. Clearly the script called for a first half Lions blowout and a late Packers comeback for the win, but the refs obviously didn’t get the memo that they were supposed to make it look legit.

    Integrity of the game, my A**….

  18. The only people not appalled by the officiating last night are Packers fans. Anyone feel a spin doctored press release coming from the NFL today just to appease fans for a few days before resuming business as usual? Unfortunately it will only be a distraction for a day or so while the league keeps counting the money. 💰

  19. This is unfortunate. The Packers benefitted from several questionable calls. Historically, they have been on the painful end of these as often as anyone but now, those who want so desperately to believe that there is massive institutional bias keeping their team from glory, have for one more day “proof” that its all one big conspiracy.

  20. I remember the days when I made sure I got everything done early for I could sit and watch football all day. Now I turn it on when I have nothing else to do or watch.

  21. ARod(in his collarbone) like in Seattle cpl times ? GET REAL DUDE Horrible calls every game both sides

  22. One messed up call, it happens, many is blatant cheating. As we saw with Walt and his crew doing everything to make New Orleans lose they were never fired or least suspended. This crew should also be fired. But, it looks more and more like Roger has his favorite teams and like Pro basketball and professional wresting it is all rigged to garner the best TV ratings. If Jerry hand’t to get rid of Roger the Cowboys would win more games.

  23. There were missed calls on both sides for sure. Lions got away with OPI against King in the endzone and not too mention PI against Jones where he was pushed down after 5 yards as well as holding calls on the line. The officiating was horrible and those 2 calls against Flowers were terrible but to think there is a conspiracy is ludicrous!

  24. rogergoodellmyhero says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:48 am
    The fix is in. NFL will give the Patriots their 7th* title cause it creates more revenue when in reality the ratings spoke for themselves, nobody likes the Patriots anymore.

    —————
    Nice try jealous loser. This has nothing to do with the Pats but good to know that you are paying rent to them.

  25. Just another in a loooong list of criminal officiating against the Lions. Detroit vs everyone. We are used to it. But still, just criminal! WWE is alive and well, especially in Lambo where crying and whining are persistent.

  26. rogergoodellmyhero says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:48 am
    The fix is in. NFL will give the Patriots their 7th* title cause it creates more revenue when in reality the ratings spoke for themselves, nobody likes the Patriots anymore.

    \\\\\

    The patriots win because they find ways to beat you. Apparently on this site Roger loves and hates the patriots at the same time?

    Flowers got called because I’m sure the Packers were complaining about his signature move. Good coaching staffs do that. Calls were surely questionable but Detroit had plenty of opportunities to take the game away from the refs.

    The fact that Stafford disappeared after the 1st quarter was Detroit’s biggest issue.

  27. I’m sooooo the Lions whining about the officials. Get over it and learn to beat a team wholeheartedly instead of asking for handouts from the refs.

    What’s Matt Stafford record against teams with a winning record again? Oh right. People attack Kirk Cousins for the same choke show. This victim hood from Lions fans is getting old. Great teams don’t blame the refs, they win despite them. Now go ahead and take your frustrations out on the thumbs down button.

  28. Not mentioned, as Booger explained, is that is not a penalty until the center puts his hands on the ball to start the play (or something similar, he’s hard to understand). The Lions could’ve have called a time-out before that point and not incurred a penalty. I don’t remember at what point the Packers called their time-out but if it was before that same point (that Booger mentioned) then there is nothing to see here. If not, then shame on the refs.

  29. Dublin Demons says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:36 am
    They didn’t flag the packers for pass interference when defender clotheslines a defenseless receiver in the 4th quarter either. Clearly a fix, when when the Lions have to beat the ref as well.

    \\\\

    A clothlesine?

    LOL

    There was more contact on a lot of other pass plays than that one.

    Do we want ticky tack PI, or do we want to let them play. I guarantee if you watch tape on Detroit’s two corners they were just as grabby.

    My god do you people want more refs or less? You can’t get out of your own way just to complain.

  30. Prior to this game, I’m not sure I’d ever seen hands to the face called that wasn’t absolutely blatant, like the guy’s head be pushed back, facemask being pulled on and helmet nearly being taken off. To see too phantom calls against the same guy in that short a period surely can’t be an accident.

  31. I’ve said this about seattle for years. Every game I’ve ever seen with them, the refs gave them very generous calls in key moments. Why is it so bad when another team gets a call and not seattle?

  32. “Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.”

    You mean like the roughing the passer penalty on Clay last year versus the Vikings?

  33. rogergoodellmyhero says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:48 am
    The fix is in. NFL will give the Patriots their 7th* title cause it creates more revenue when in reality the ratings spoke for themselves, nobody likes the Patriots anymore.
    ———
    You do realize that just about every single rule change in the last 20 years has been made in order to keep the Patriots from winning right? When changing the rules didn’t work, Goodell changed a rule after the fact and stole picks. When that didn’t work, he claimed Galileo, Newton, Einstein, and Hawking were frauds and that all the laws of physics didn’t exist. Pay attention man!

  34. Whatever. The refs also gave Detroit a game last year against GB. Called a “muffed” punt that was never actually touched by GB to set up DET on the 1 yard-line. They also granted DET a phantom catch that proved to be a difference maker. What comes around goes around. I didn’t hear all of you revolting last year when Clay Matthews was called time, and time again on fake roughing the passer calls.

  35. Vikings fan here. Lions, we feel your pain. When we played the Packets in week 2, we had four (FOUR!) phantom offensive pass interference calls. I’ve never seen four OPI calls in one game in my life. Not to mention a negated touchdown by Thielen and an official’s review of a touchdown that turned into a offensive PENALTY. I’m usually not one to complain about refs, but it was absolute garbage. The fix in, fans.

  36. And-GB had one or two delay of games that were not called.
    —–
    I love how people just jump in the narrative and ignore the facts. The Lions did too. Our group watching called it out at least twice. One of the times ended in a sack so I was happy they didn’t throw the flag, but let’s stick to reality here…we all saw the same game.

  37. With all the turnovers the Packers gave up a good team would have had the game on ice heading into the fourth.. Every game has calls like that.

  38. This game and the Jets vs Cowboys game were so poorly officiated it’s a disgrace. That game was really a blow out and the Jets put that game away on a few drives where Darnold converted huge 3rd downs but each time it was called back on a holding penalty that nobody saw and that’s leaving out the complete disaster the ending was. The NFL has to get it’s act together or it’ll become unwatchable.

  39. The non call on the pass interference was especially egregious. It’s basically the same call as the Saints vs Rams no call. Except the non call was as violent of a hit, and defender didn’t hit the WR in the head. I thought the new replay system was set up to eliminate those egregious errors in judgement. Lions flip the field if that call is made and good chance they score at least 3 points. The umpire should have explained to Flowers why they made the first hands to the face to prevent the same lame call being made at the end of the game. Sucks we all had to wait several hours for the umpire to “rationalize” why the calls were made. Lion fans I feel for you. Ever watch a Steelers Bengals game? I feel your pain. I don’t trust the NFL any longer. Roger? Roger? Crickets……..

  40. I posted immediately after the game that the official waited until after Rogers was sacked to throw the first flag on Flowers and Flowers never got near Rogers. Terrible call.

    That said, the idea that teams like the Lions, Browns and the Redskins have had losing records over several years is due to officiating is absurd.

    The have had poor records due to weak ownership, horrible front offices and a turnstile at the coaching positions. That looks like it is changing in Detroit but they are not quite there yet.

    The Patriots have won consistently over the last 19 years because ownership, the front office and coaching has been best in class. The also have had unique consistency in the QB position. That’s not an opinion. It’s fact.

    In the first six games the Patriots have been penalized more in three games and less in three games. What hasn’t had an equal distribution is turnovers which the Patriots have dominated. Refs don’t throw interceptions and they don’t fumble the football. Every turnover is reviewed.

    In life, when you are always complaining and explaining it’s time to look in the mirror at the real source of your misfortune.

  41. Also mentioned above is that the Lions in recent years have had some horrible calls go against them in a lot of key moments. I don’t buy the conspiracy things about paid refs but when you have a team thats always on the wrong side of calls no matter who they play it does seem a little suspicious.

  42. ARod(in his collarbone) says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:34 am
    Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.
    ________________________________________________

    Actually, what we see is your useless broken collarbone bragging, becoming more of a laughing joke, with each passing year. Enjoy Kirky-Poo Cousins!

  43. It’s fine. The snap wasn’t imminent. You’re trying to make things worse. You’re sensationalizing.

    The fact is, the ref that could see the ball said NO TD for the Lions and a guy that couldn’t see the ball said TD. That shouldn’t have been a score.

    The Packers have had numerous games taken away from them. I’m fine with it going the other way just one time.

    Also, if the Lions wanted to win, maybe gain more than 58 yards in the second half. That could have helped.

  44. ARod(in his collarbone) says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:34 am
    Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.
    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    That can’t possibly be true, but if that is how it makes you and other Viking trolls feel……..I love it!

  45. I don’t see favoritism. I see horrible officiating in a good 80%+ of all NFL games on a weekly basis. Al Riveron needs to be fired, this week, and the NFL needs to stop over-protecting their officials. Their needs to be consequences when refs screw up, just like there is with players and coaches.

  46. It would hardly displease me that, next game – with the result either way firmly in hand, Matt Patricia trots out 30 guys on defense to induce a ‘too many men on the field’ penalty and maybe even unsportsmanlike conduct. Then he would point at the re and say, ‘Good job!’

    It would be a real-time thumb to the league and wel-deserved.

  47. venomraider says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:33 am

    Look, it is clear as can be the Officiating crew were throwing this game to the Packers.
    ——————————————————-

    I don’t know about all that….. I think the officials are just “Sorry”

  48. I posted immediately after the game that the official waited until after Rogers was sacked to throw the first flag on Flowers and Flowers never got near Rogers.
    —–
    That’s exactly what it looked like. However, some DVR work reveals that at the very end of the play, a second before the ref goes for the flag, Flowers hand slides up and hits Bahk’s helmet. There are screenshots out there proving so. None of the replays they’re showing go far enough to show the infraction unfortunately. It was ticky-tack but it happened.

  49. So…….the Lions didn’t call a timeout to prevent an untimely penalty, but the Packers did. What’s the whiny issue on this one?

  50. Truth is that was just piss poor job of officiating. I do not even know what PI is anymore.

    Hands to the face was a definition thing and according to the rules, “could” have been called. The player was warned. But where it happened in the game was unusual.

    In the end, the officiating has really take a turn for the worse across the league….it aint just a Packers thing. They’ve been hosed as well. Last year and Matthews is a prime example. Cost the team dearly early on. Part of what cost McCarthy his job.

  51. Ugh, this is just WRONG!

    The rules are different for a FG than they are for a regular play. The 12+ men penalty isn’t enforced UNTIL THE SNAP for a regular play. On a FG try, it’s enforced once the center touches the ball… There’s nothing to see here for this play, it’s a NON ISSUE.

    Last night was bad job by the refs, but thinking these two things were the same is just ‘par for the course’ for ProFootballTalk…

  52. S. M. (Smacks) says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:02 am
    “Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.”

    You mean like the roughing the passer penalty on Clay last year versus the Vikings?
    ——
    You can thank Aaron Rodgers for that call. When Rodgers got hurt the year prior, roughing the passer was the focus. Then, after that call, Rodgers said there shouldn’t be that much roughing the passer and lo and behold, fewer roughing calls.

    I’m not surprised you don’t remember that league fiasco/favoritism toward Rodgers.

  53. Next up for the refs, remedial 2nd grade math classes to make sure they know the difference between 11, 12 and 13 without having to count on their fingers.

  54. Anyone defending the calls or the game is really defending the indefensible. You either are a Pack fan, don’t like the Lions, or a contrarian.

  55. Man… you would think it was Fail-Mary Part II in here. Penalties are a part of the game whether their called, not called or simply phantom. The human eye makes mistakes… if you choose to believe there is a conspiracy where certain, non-playing individuals are paid to influence the outcome, then stop watching. It is your BRAIN that is corrupt!

  56. At this point the Lions should realize no one is going to let them win the division. Thr best thing for them to do is throw the Vikings game and help the Vikings compete with the Packers.

    BTW, why don’t the Milwaukee Brewers get this kind of darling treatment?

  57. It’s just painful to read these comments from Packer fans that are somehow trying to justify the travesty we saw last night. I guess they’re just used to bad calls going their way so they have a sense of entitlement to them.

    And no, pointing out a couple of examples where a bad call went against the Packers does not make up for last night or the Packers’ history of favorable officiating.

  58. Per Mike Florio the NFL owners voted 32-0 to have an extra judge at games who is responsible for penalties. I’m not sure what the logistics were but it needs to happen.

    There is no reason to not have that extra judge who can curb these bad calls. It really needs to happen because the game is becoming less and less enjoyable to watch. Tainted wins are not fun. Tainted losses are infuriating. The NFL may think that it would hurt the flow of the game to do this but it can’t be worse than having a game stop over and over and over and over…then see your team get called for a phantom penalty.

  59. NE fans also see a lot of calls come out of the woodwork when NE has big leads in games, as he tries to help the other team for ratings purposes.

    We’ve seen it all.

    What channel did you see that on….Oh Homer Vision the Pats edition. Ok now I understand.

    For a team rarely called for offense holding to suggest that Goodall picks on them insults my intelligence. But the commenter suggesting this is a proven fraud so its expected.

  60. There is no use pointing out all the officiating errors in the NFL week in/week out. Fans just need to start treating the games like a scripted TV series. If the product continues to be this bad, stop watching. When Goodell sees viewer ship it down, he’ll tell the refs that this week is the last week he’ll allow them to have “Friends and Family” place bets on the teams he choose to win in games their officiating.

  61. I remember a play a couple years ago where the Packer receiver ran into a Viking defensive back which was called against the Vikings player even thought the packer receiver ran into him. In the replay you could see the ref pulling out the flag BEFORE contact was ever made.

    My other favorite was some game a while ago in the old Dome where the Packer tight end fumbled the ball before breaking the goal line and the Vikings recovered in the end zone. Not only did they say he broke the line of scrimmage scoring a touchdown, when he clearly didn’t even cross the plain and did actually fumble before the knee was down, they flagged the Vikings for defensive holding gave the Packers a touchdown and tacked on fifteen yards on the kickoff so green bay kicked off from the 50. Seriously.

  62. TrubiskyIsGarbageAndTheBearsShouldHaveDraftedMahommes says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:30 am
    Anyone defending the calls or the game is really defending the indefensible. You either are a Pack fan, don’t like the Lions, or a contrarian.

    ——

    So you’re saying that the guy who couldn’t see the ball saying “TD” for the Lions was right? You’re saying that the Lions defender pushing Jones to the ground 8 yards downfield didn’t commit Pass Interference? You’re saying ALL the calls went against the Lions?

    Please, tell me.

  63. “When a lot of officiating mistakes go against you and you lose by one point, it’s hard to come to any conclusion other than that you got robbed.”

    I don’t disagree with the premise of the article…but it might not have been a one point game under different circumstances. Granted, maybe the Packers fail to get in the endzone at the end of the game if they need a TD to win it…or maybe they score a TD and extra point, or 2 point conversion. Calling the officiating bad and in GB’s favor is fair. Saying the ONLY conclusion is the Lions got robbed…not exactly.

  64. I hope this officiating crew its held responsible and dont have any games in the near future, much less primetime games

  65. mogogo1 says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:02 am

    Prior to this game, I’m not sure I’d ever seen hands to the face called that wasn’t absolutely blatant, like the guy’s head be pushed back, facemask being pulled on and helmet nearly being taken off. To see too phantom calls against the same guy in that short a period surely can’t be an accident.
    ___________

    Exactly. And it just so happens those calls were made in the fourth quarter after the Packers failed to convert on third down. Did Flowers just happen to start rushing the passer with his hand high on Bahktiari’s chest in the fourth quarter, or did they have that call in their back pocket for when they needed it?

  66. Did anyone else notice on the last pylon camera view of the Packers’ last touchdown that the receiver’s knee was down before the ball crossed the goal line? They probably would have scored anyway, but Rodgers has a tendency to throw the ball away in goal to go situations so who knows?

  67. When all the screaming and blaming is over the Lions will realize they did not capitalize on turnovers and dropped balls by Packer receivers. The game should have been over in the 4th quarter. Bottom line Green Bay is 5-1 and the Lions 3-2-1. If they don’t come to grips with this the Vikings will rip them to shreds next week.

  68. I know it doesn’t fit the current narrative but a quick FB search will show you the screenshot proving the first hands to the face was a 100% legit call.

  69. Frazier28/7 says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:34 am
    I remember a play a couple years ago where the Packer receiver ran into a Viking defensive back which was called against the Vikings player even thought the packer receiver ran into him. In the replay you could see the ref pulling out the flag BEFORE contact was ever made.

    My other favorite was some game a while ago in the old Dome where the Packer tight end fumbled the ball before breaking the goal line and the Vikings recovered in the end zone. Not only did they say he broke the line of scrimmage scoring a touchdown, when he clearly didn’t even cross the plain and did actually fumble before the knee was down, they flagged the Vikings for defensive holding gave the Packers a touchdown and tacked on fifteen yards on the kickoff so green bay kicked off from the 50. Seriously.

    ————————

    I remember a play last year where Clay Matthews legally contacted Kirk Cousins while he still had the ball, and Cousins ended up throwing a game sealing interception. Then the refs threw a flag on Matthews, gifting the Vikings a tie. So what’s your point?

  70. Wow, Viking fans harbor a lot of resentment. Not unexpected, but a lot just the same.

    It makes me feel extra special being a Packer fan.

  71. This Packers/Lions game was fixed as a number of games are during each NFL season. There is too much money bet on these games to prevent it from happening. The easiest way to fix a games outcome is by way of the games officials. The NFL is becoming a joke in a number of ways which accounts for the high number of empty seats in stadiums each week.

  72. Learn the rules writer. Detroit’s 12 men was the rule, ball ready to snap on a field goal attempt, gets flag. Green bay’s 13 men was in the middle of a drive, the plays is run as normal and if Detroit snaps with 13 men on the field they get the flag and a free play. It’s really not that difficult.

    As for the bad calls, the PI noncall was due to ref line of sight blocked, the 2 hands to the face were his hand was close and bakhtiaris head goes up and back, judgement call. It must be nice have 100 camera views to judge from. Only way to prevent this is every play is subject to review and penalties can come at any point. Welcome to 8 hour games.

  73. If you don’t see the connection with poor officiating and legalized sports betting, then you’re purposefully being ignorant. Since the replacement refs, the referees have been reprehensible. It is only getting worse each week.

    How is it possible that 13 men on the field is missed? It is not possible.

    Make the refs full time. FINE the refs for poor performance. By the time all is said and done, referee salaries will be going to the charities that fines support.

    Or, and this is the right answer, keep the refs part time. Hire 16 full time sky judges. Hold 16 people accountable rather than 100. Force sky judges to have press conferences after games to explain their positions on close calls. Also, allow them to dial back the clock regardless of a hurry up snap. Stop the nonsense of teams rushing to the line to snap a football before a challenge, you should never be able to rush your way into locking in an incorrect call. GET RID of coaching challenges. EVERY play is reviewed in real time by the sky judge.

    I would rather have one king ruling the game than these refs that can’t get easy calls correct. Until they get this fixed, I will consider the games are being fixed and not pay a dime to support this league.

  74. shave them points NFL
    Vegas just around the corner
    it was much harder to fix NBA games than it would be NFL calls
    particularly since they can make insanely bad calls, and nothing happens
    keep shaving NFL
    eventually you’ll cut your own throat

  75. it’s been a fun morning. the nation now knows the packers are in the pockets of the NFL. it’s fun seeing the usual packer trolls try to spin this.

    they know the truth: the green bay packers are a fraud and are cheaters. choke on that, packer fans.

  76. The officiating has been so questionable its reasonable to question if the results are being preordained/fixed or if gambling interests have been able to influence game officials.

    It happened in the NBA, it could happen in the NFL too.

  77. Losing on monday was costly for Detroit as it literally meant going from first to worst in the NFC North. Imagine how harsh its going to be if the Lions lose out on a division title or playoff spot by one game.

  78. even the national news media is covering this blatant cover by the NFL and the packers. you know it’s a scandal of huge proportions when non-sports media talks about it.

    Green Bay Packers: Frauds forever!

  79. This Packer Derangement Syndrome by vikings fans is great… living rent free in your head.

    NFL Championships
    Packers – 13
    Vikings – 0

  80. A&J Grant says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:32 am

    Per Mike Florio the NFL owners voted 32-0 to have an extra judge at games who is responsible for penalties. I’m not sure what the logistics were but it needs to happen.

    There is no reason to not have that extra judge who can curb these bad calls. It really needs to happen because the game is becoming less and less enjoyable to watch. Tainted wins are not fun. Tainted losses are infuriating. The NFL may think that it would hurt the flow of the game to do this but it can’t be worse than having a game stop over and over and over and over…then see your team get called for a phantom penalty.
    ———————–

    But that’s just it. The game is already constantly stopped. What would it hurt to get the call right when the game is already stopped for a call?

  81. In the Vikings game when the packers were on offense the play clock hit 0 several times they let them play on no flag in GB.

  82. Clearly the Lions got jobbed on several calls — certainly many more than the Pack. The cheeser rationalization fest above is hilarious, but honestly, as much as the Lions have improved this year, it was pretty clear from this impartial observer that the better team won.

  83. “Let’s not forget the Packers haven’t been called for holding in Lambeau all year. How is that even possible??”

    This is simply untrue. There was a holding call on Bakhtiari early in the game last night.

  84. It was almost as if they didn’t care what anyone would say about the bad calls, they needed to make sure the Packers won. Were their families being held hostage? Do any of them owe money to the mob? Someone on that crew had a reason to make sure the Packers won.

  85. The NFL: wouldn’t it be groovy, such a great narrative, awesome publicity, If one of the very first teams plays in the SB for the 100th anniversary? We can make money on that narrative. Only prob is we have a mediocre team w a failing QB (QBR if 42 last nite) and so we see they’ll need a little help from our refs. I don’t care what a single, solitary, delusional Cheesehead says, The Fix Is In.

  86. Ron Jull says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:59 am
    Losing on monday was costly for Detroit as it literally meant going from first to worst in the NFC North. Imagine how harsh its going to be if the Lions lose out on a division title or playoff spot by one game.
    —————————
    Yea, remember a few yes back when the Psckers were screaming because a so-called bad play cost them a fame against Seattle? The Cheeseheads went so ballistic they flew to NYC to protest in front of the NFL. So what did league do? They changed much of the referee core. I think Liobs fans should do the EXACT same thing–make a major stink.

  87. But one thing in particular seemed to have the attention of a lot of folks (myself included) on Twitter Sunday: Aaron Rodgers’ propensity to bring the play clock within a fraction of zero, sometimes beyond, before snapping the ball … and yet not being flagged all day for delay of game. (Screen grab via @joefujinaka).

    Indeed, it appeared that multiple times the play clock had run out on Green Bay, but the only delay penalty called during the game on the Packers came near the very end of the game and was intentional before a punt. So why wasn’t it called on Rodgers and the Packers? Let’s investigate:

    *If you are operating under the assumption that the play clock you see on TV is somehow different than the play clock in the stadium, that is incorrect. Ryan Russell, a former student of mine who now works in broadcasting, confirms what I’ve seen reported elsewhere: the clocks are connected directly into the broadcast, so what you see in the stadium is what you see on TV.
    The back judge’s discretion is the reason they didn’t call it.

  88. “Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.”

    Thats a stupid statement,if your Bears,Vikings or Lions lose to the Packers its because your team wasnt good enough,want to beat them go get better players.officiating has been terrible in all games this year.your Lions are still the same old Lions,just not good enough but they give the fans some hope early every season before they rip your heart out.

  89. Joe Namath was interviewed once and told the story he was with the owners wife and He said he was so upset losing the game. He said the Owners wife leaned over and said, Joe It Entertainment business… Its OK!…

    Its really the WWE

  90. When 99% of America (including many Packer fans) and all of the national talking heads all agree that last night’s game was horribly officiated and the Lions were hosed, I still get a kick out of the 1% of Packer fans who justify the bad calls with their “whataboutisms”. Just admit that last night’s game was gift-wrapped and handed to you on a silver platter. I’m going to Vegas next week and putting a few thousand bucks on the Packers to win it all since it’s clear that the NFL is setting them up to win. And when the do win the Super Bowl, they should create nine extra rings. One for each member of Clete Blakeman’s crew and one for Roger Goodell and Alberto Riveron. Vince McMahon would be proud.

  91. FINALLY the world is seeing what happens at Lambeau field on a weekly basis.

    Hopefully there is swift corrective action by the NFL to make sure games are called fairly at Green Bay from here on out.

  92. commentawaitingdeletion says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:49 am

    Just your typical GB at home officiating//////

    Doesn’t matter Home – Road the packers get the calls.

  93. Liberalsruineverything says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:46 am

    Let’s not forget the Packers haven’t been called for holding in Lambeau all year. How is that even possible??

    ————-

    So what the 2-3 holding calls against them last night what were those. Bakh got called for one and GemoAllison got called for one. A tipped INT on the goal line, a fumbled handed to detroit at the 45 yard line. I agree as a Pack fan there were some horrible calls but the kitty’s could have and did not get up by 30 points like they could have. It sucks it really does week in week out the games are getting so many calls but at the same time the game is so so fast these poor refs have to make calls and are hogtied by the media and the pressure. Often either call is wrong that is how hard it is.

    On that call that everyone wants for the DPI on the long throw I mean go look at it again. He puts his arm across the receivers chest for a millisecond before he puts his arm up and blocks the pass. The arm across his chest did nothing at all he did not hold the guys arms. Do you really want zero contact when a player goes for a ball. Darn I miss the 90’s when hand fighting a bit was allowed.

    The refs would be better off just leaving the flags in their pockets a bit more really is what I would suggest.

  94. Considering all the attention the media is giving this and the way they like to tilt facts I’m starting to think all the calls were correct.

  95. Asking Goodel to investigate or make right the scripted officiating is like asking the Devil to investigate Politicians.

  96. “The refs would be better off just leaving the flags in their pockets a bit more really is what I would suggest.”

    It was mentioned on NBC Sports Boston yesterday that there have been 16% more accepted penalties this year than last year, a significant increase.

    And up something like 25% from just a few years ago.

    The more complicated they make the rules, the more flags. One of the games the other day had 25 flags, or about 1/5 of the total number of plays. The league is changing this to the National Penalty Football League and it sucks

  97. The NFL loves GB because they’re publicly owned. The people’s team. Whatta joke. They’re just an average team, and need the calls to even be competitive.

  98. pkrlvr says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:19 am

    That’s exactly what it looked like. However, some DVR work reveals that at the very end of the play, a second before the ref goes for the flag, Flowers hand slides up and hits Bahk’s helmet. There are screenshots out there proving so. None of the replays they’re showing go far enough to show the infraction unfortunately. It was ticky-tack but it happened.

    Read the rules before you post. It’s not a penalty. Besides, immediately after the snap, Flowers’ face mask was hit in a fashion more likely to be called.

  99. What’s with the weak sauce excuse , well the Lions should of played better and been up by 30 then you wouldn’t have got screwed by the refs lol …. so now teams need to beat teams by 30 just so they don’t get screwed by the refs. You guys are brilliant ! … Redskins fan.

  100. I understand making mistakes, but that wasn’t making mistakes. That was complete and utter incompetence. Refs need to be losing jobs after that kind of performance. Games like that help decide playoff pictures for 4 teams with a division that tight.

  101. ARod(in his collarbone) says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:34 am
    Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.

    Lol, clearly you have never seen a Patriots-Bills game. We go into the game fully aware we will be playing against the Patriots and the refs.

  102. cheeseisfattening says:
    October 15, 2019 at 11:30 am
    Rodgers should be embarrassed smirking about these calls but he won’t be. Is just the way he us. His team won so for last night that makes it alright.

    ————

    Will Vikings fans ever stop complaining about the refs?

  103. A-aron got his team to the SB once, almost a decade ago but he is the best ever! Russell Wilson went to two bowls and has a better playoff record.

  104. The more complicated they make the rules, the more flags. One of the games the other day had 25 flags, or about 1/5 of the total number of plays. The league is changing this to the National Penalty Football League and it sucks

    It’s the coaching and the players trying to get an edge by daring the refs to call penalties. Watch Pats D backs hold on every play or their O line holding and you will….oh wait you watch your games on Homer Vision Pats version. The NFL is fighting a battle that the NBA gave up on by letting the players write unwritten rule to prevent the refs from informing the rules or lose the fans.

  105. In the first half, the refs awarded the Lions a phantom touchdown (one ref indicating touchdown while the other indicating a stop was comical and reminiscent of the Seattle Fail Mary) and they ignored a Lions helmet-to-helmet tackle. They then spent the rest of the game trying to make up for their errors. Blown calls tend to even out. Blame the loss on scoring FGs instead of TDs.

  106. Eat that anti-conspirators. It’s now beyond obvious the NFL favors certain teams when it comes to particular matchups.

  107. Packers fans are the biggest hypocrites in the entirety of the NFL fanbase.

    You claim that Lions fans need to “get over it”, yet you still refuse to get over a week 3 game that happened seven years ago.

    I’ve even seen multiple Packers fans claiming that last night’s game was payback for the Fail Mary, which goes to show all you need to know about them.

  108. Rule #1 of officiating…if you don’t see it, don’t call it. Same official twice called what he thought was hands to the face. What he actually saw was Baktiari holding his head up as if the hand was under his helmet. That official ought to be suspended or fired. C

  109. Someone needs to create an algorithm that tracks the correlation between the bad calls to the changes in the sports betting lines. I bet it would be very interesting. Has anyone noticed the number of bad calls and poor officiating increased after the NFL leadership embraced sports betting?

  110. That is allowable. It was no huddle. Until the ball is snapped it’s ok to have more as long as they didn’t huddle.
    The lions penalty was during a field goal try, 100% different

  111. I stopped watching the NFL all together years ago when the officiating favoritism was so blatant I got fed up. Then years later they finally instituted the relay review and cleaned the game up so I decided to give it another try. Fast-forward 13 years to today and I’m almost ready to abandon it again.

    The NFL doesn’t care the game is blatantly fixed, they don’t even try to hide it. Instead, they give the world the middle finger, secure in the belief the fans and their money will always be there. And so, they think they are free to accommodate the gambling interests to reap those profits as well.

  112. S. M. (Smacks) says:
    October 15, 2019 at 11:01 am

    This Packer Derangement Syndrome by vikings fans is great… living rent free in your head.

    NFL Championships
    Packers – 13
    Vikings – 0/// 1

    Vikings 1969 NFL Champs

    Your packers “won” the first 2 world championships without winning a playoff game.

  113. Schmokes
    I remember a play last year where Clay Matthews legally contacted Kirk Cousins while he still had the ball, and Cousins ended up throwing a game sealing interception.////

    Because of the Rodgers rule when Fabio lifted him up and drove him into the ground it was a penalty under the Rodgers rule.Your teams whining and the NFL’s wanted to protect Rodgers created the call.

  114. While NFL network showed the 1st hands to face penalty, there is also an obvious holding call missed as Ashawn Robinson closed in on Rodgers.

    Lions get called for phantom call, while Packers get away with actual penalty.

    Should have been 4th down.
    Could have been 3rd down if offsetting penalties.

  115. So Crates says:
    October 15, 2019 at 11:05 am
    A&J Grant says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:32 am

    Per Mike Florio the NFL owners voted 32-0 to have an extra judge at games who is responsible for penalties. I’m not sure what the logistics were but it needs to happen.

    There is no reason to not have that extra judge who can curb these bad calls. It really needs to happen because the game is becoming less and less enjoyable to watch. Tainted wins are not fun. Tainted losses are infuriating. The NFL may think that it would hurt the flow of the game to do this but it can’t be worse than having a game stop over and over and over and over…then see your team get called for a phantom penalty.
    ———————–

    But that’s just it. The game is already constantly stopped. What would it hurt to get the call right when the game is already stopped for a call?

    \\\\

    your what’s wrong with all of this.

    Everytime you create more complexity with more rules, you make the game less enjoyable.

    But you somehow think this is going to help?

  116. onebillioncigarettes says:
    October 15, 2019 at 11:51 am
    ARod(in his collarbone) says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:34 am
    Now fans across the country are seeing what fans of the other 3 NFC North teams have seen for years. That being Packer favoritism.

    Lol, clearly you have never seen a Patriots-Bills game. We go into the game fully aware we will be playing against the Patriots and the refs.

    \\\\

    Jordan rule…..

  117. cheeseisfattening says:
    October 15, 2019 at 11:30 am
    Rodgers should be embarrassed smirking about these calls but he won’t be. Is just the way he us. His team won so for last night that makes it alright.
    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    Would you like a glass of water?

  118. The 2 extra defenders were leaving the field. Props to the Packers for calling timeout quickly enough.

  119. The thing to do is blame the refs everytime you lose now. The officiating is no different than it was 5 or 10 years ago we just scrutinize everything a lot closer. Losers make up excuses and winners just move on. If you play better you will win games.

  120. As much as the Packers had been @#@# by bad officiating in the past, I am not sorry one bit for last night. I will say the same thing that has been said to Packer fans in the past when they lost because of bad officiating. Suck it up buttercup.

  121. I thought this was well explained during the game, this particular penalty is officiated differently on special teams (snap eminent once snappers hands are on the ball) during typical plays the D has until the ball is snapped…or a time out gets called. All these comments about refs are funny to Packer fans who watched the refs appear to give one to Philly a few weeks back.

  122. Has anyone else noticed that they should have called defensive holding on Flowers on both of those plays? He had a vice grip on Bakhtiari’s shoulder pads at the neck. Same net effect (5 yards and a first down), but with less complaints. Also, there’s a reason Bakhtiari was complaining to the ref before the call…

  123. rogergoodellmyhero says:
    October 15, 2019 at 9:48 am
    The fix is in. NFL will give the Patriots their 7th* title cause it creates more revenue when in reality the ratings spoke for themselves, nobody likes the Patriots anymore
    ———————————————-

    Aren’t you the same one that always says Pats fans try to make every story about the Pats??? Not to mention your statement makes zero sense.

  124. I’m a Packers fan. The two calls against Flowers were bad and it sounds like the one mentioned in this article is as bad or worse. Those calls certainly made it a lot easier for the Packers to win at a minimum. But the idea that there is some NFL/referee conspiracy in favor of the Packers is ridiculous.

    Setting aside how difficult it would be to keep such a conspiracy under wraps, let’s just look at the last five full seasons. As for net count of penalties (i.e. for and against) the Packers rank 15th best in the NFL. As for net penalty yardage the Packers rank 13th best in the NFL. So the Packers are slightly above average over the last five full seasons.

    Full disclosure, for 2019 the Packers rank 7th and 2nd respectively. But guess what? Over the same six game span our six opponents average rank 18th and 22nd respectively. In other words, we’ve played a bunch of teams that have committed a lot of penalties relative to all of their opponents this year.

    Every team in the league gets hurt by some horrible calls and benefits from some horrible calls. There is some bad officiating going on this year for sure and it certainly showed up last night. So Lions fans have a right to be pissed today but please spare me the conspiracy theories about how the officials are out to help Rodgers and the Packers. It’s complete BS.

  125. harrisonhits2 says:
    October 15, 2019 at 11:38 am
    “The refs would be better off just leaving the flags in their pockets a bit more really is what I would suggest.”

    It was mentioned on NBC Sports Boston yesterday that there have been 16% more accepted penalties this year than last year, a significant increase.

    And up something like 25% from just a few years ago.

    The more complicated they make the rules, the more flags. One of the games the other day had 25 flags, or about 1/5 of the total number of plays. The league is changing this to the National Penalty Football League and it sucks

    \\\\\

    Exactly.

    The same people on here saying Flowers call was ticky tack are also calling for the refs to call the PI that could also be construed as “ticky tack”.

    I’m all for letting them play, simplify the rules and make the game enjoyable. I also agree the calls last night sucked and it’s no fun when your team wins or loses this way.

    Most of the people on here just want their agenda for more complexity because they think it helps their team. It won’t help any team and just makes the product poor. The good organizations will keep winning.

  126. realnflfacts says:
    October 15, 2019 at 10:02 am
    I’ve said this about seattle for years. Every game I’ve ever seen with them, the refs gave them very generous calls in key moments. Why is it so bad when another team gets a call and not seattle?
    —————-
    Obviously you never watched Super Bowl XL

  127. I guess we won’t mention the Lions’ one TD wasn’t a TD. The referee with thee clear view said short of the goal on 4th and goal. The referee on the other side of all of the bodies with no view of the ball calls TD. That’s 7 points! And don’t forget the second hands to the face call only cost time, not points. Crosby still kicks the FG.

  128. Wow,some upset people here. And yes the hands to the face call were not justified. In slow motion it is easy to see, in game time speed where a individual looks as if his head is being pushed back well then I guess all the arm chair quarterbacks watching on tv would know better. They made a judgement call based off what they though they saw. Honestly if you put a camera on every matchup with every player every game guaranteed each player would have a penalty.

    Packers have had many of the bogus calls go against them as well. Yet its rigged in Packers favored because they have lost 4 straight to the lions and they have not been in the playoffs the last 2 years? Yep sounds rigged in the packers favor to me

    Hey lions, perhaps if coleman did not get chased down from his INT return that could have been 7 points there or the 1st play of game that Alexander hustled down to stop galloday from walking in end zone could have been another 7 points. There were some other issues why lions did not win as they had opportunities.

  129. The Packers have had plenty of bad play calls over the years. Just like every other team. There are certain teams always looking for an excuse for being losers because they didn’t play hard enough again. Aaron Rodgers would never say “we lost this game because of a bad play call!” He would say “we should of played better.” And that my friends is the difference between an awesome player and a sore loser.

  130. fmc651 says:
    October 15, 2019 at 1:00 pm
    S. M. (Smacks) says:
    October 15, 2019 at 11:01 am

    This Packer Derangement Syndrome by vikings fans is great… living rent free in your head.

    NFL Championships
    Packers – 13
    Vikings – 0/// 1

    Vikings 1969 NFL Champs

    Your packers “won” the first 2 world championships without winning a playoff game.
    ———————————————–
    1. Those were the rules at the time. What did you want them to do?
    2. It counts as a championship no matter how you feel about it.
    3. Congratulations. You’re one of the first Viking fans I’ve ever met that knows the Vikings do have an NFL championship. But they did “lose” the Super Bowl, so I’m sure it’s a hollow victory to most. 🙂

  131. The league needs to open an investigation about corruption among officials. If they don’t they are going to lose credibility. And, don’t Congress should. This game was obviously being thrown by the refs.

  132. Packers favoritism? HA!!!!! So what about all the roughing the passer phantom calls from last year that went against the Packers? What about the FAIL MARY play? Bottom line is that the Lions should have scored TD’s and not FG’s. Bottom line is we are seeing everything on high def TV’s and in slow motion. The officials do not and never have. You don’t think there were bad calls in the 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and 90’s?? Of course, we just didn’t arm chair QB every play! This is just hilarious!!!

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